A Nova proposal for UConn to the Big East

[dayooper]

2016-17 Sagarin AAC
Tulsa #29
USF #32
JMU (as FCS) #33
Temple #43
Memphis #50
Houston #56
Navy #61
UCF #86
SMU #92
Nova (as FCS) #106
Tulane #109
Cincinnati #117
E Carolina #118
UConn #154

Yup, and you never mention who their only loss was to. JMU lost their only FBS game to an 8-5 UNC 56-28. Want to guess their Sagarin rating? 31. I'm not sure that Sagarin is the best indicator of FCS power.

 

[Zissou]

I'm not sure that Sagarin is the best indicator of FCS power.

What is the best indicator?

 

[dayooper]

What is the best indicator?

I don't know. I understand that it's a small sample size, but in their only FBS game, they got whipped pretty hard by a middling, 8-5 team. If they would have played in FBS with that team, my guess is they wouldn't have been 14-1 and been the 33rd ranked team in all of college football. The win prediction element on Sagarin seems a bit off. Was JMU a great FCS team? Yes. Would they be ranked as high if they were in FBS? My guess is not even close.

 

[billybud]

FCS does not do well against FBS on average...

From 2005-2016:

62 FBS teams have played FCS teams without a loss....they have 100% win rate. 702 games played against FCS without a loss.

Where you see multiple losses are in the very bottom of FBS (Charlotte, Ball State, Texas San Antonio, Western Kentucky, Army...and Massachusetts (who has lost 25 games to FCS but still won 68%) and Texas State San Marcos (who has lost 30 but still won 62.5%).

UConn is 10-1 in that time period against FCS (losing to Towson)...a 3-9 UConn lost to 13-3 Towson...but UConn still has won 90% of their ganes against FCS,

 

[RyanCT7]

Our D Coordinator was from Nova guys...

 

[Zissou]

From 2005-2016:

62 FBS teams have played FCS teams without a loss....they have 100% win rate. 702 games played against FCS without a loss.

That is misleading at best. I already mentioned 2 of the biggest FCS - FBS upsets, and they were both more recent than 2005. App State beat #5 Michigan in the Big House. JMU beat #13 VT at VT.

FCS is a huge disadvantage. FCS is a losing financial proposition compared to FBS. But top FCS teams aren't far off from G5 programs. Give JMU the extra scholarships over the last 4 years and last year they would have been very competitive with the AAC. They may have beat UConn straight up last year just as FCS.

 

[Ldandy]

That is misleading at best. I already mentioned 2 of the biggest FCS - FBS upsets, and they were both more recent than 2005. App State beat #5 Michigan in the Big House. JMU beat #13 VT at VT.

FCS is a huge disadvantage. FCS is a losing financial proposition compared to FBS. But top FCS teams aren't far off from G5 programs. Give JMU the extra scholarships over the last 4 years and last year they would have been very competitive with the AAC. They may have beat UConn straight up last year just as FCS.

I've got news for you. Outside of the very top tier of FBS Football it is a losing proposition for most schools. So much so that some teams have come to the conclusion that they cannot compete and are exploring dropping back down to FCS.

Pointing to a handful of wins by FCS Teams playing in what amounts to their program's Super Bowl is proof of very little. Is joining The AAC, MAC or some other G5 really going to generate so much return on the investments needed to be made in additional scholarships, facilities, and coaches.?

If Nova draws 25,000 fans in The AAC instead of 17-18,000 in FCS I'm not sure they break even on their increased level of costs. Nova had their shot. They blew it. All of your imagined "alliances" are pure fantasy. Time to move on.

 

[Zissou]

I've got news for you. Outside of the very top tier of FBS Football it is a losing proposition for most schools. So much so that some teams have come to the conclusion that they cannot compete and are exploring dropping back down to FCS.

Pointing to a handful of wins by FCS Teams playing it what amounts to their program's Super Bowl is proof of very little. Is joining The AAC, MAC or some other G5 really going to generate so much return on the investments needed to be made in additional scholarships, facilities, and coaches.? If Nova draws 25,000 fans in The AAC instead of 17-18,000 in FCS I'm not even sure they break even. Nova had their shot. They blew it. All of your imagined "alliances" are pure fantasy. Time to move on.

I like that your motto is Haters Gonna Hate.

The handful of FCS is rather meaningless, other than to counter the perception expressed by Billy that FBS was undefeated since 2005.

We could also say that UConn had its shot in CR, blew it, and it's time to move on. I think there is better opportunity than the AAC for UConn. If you are not successful in your current alignment it's natural to seek an improvement. I bet that is why the Boneyard has a whole forum dedicated to CR.

 

[billybud]

Zissou...you can't read well, can ya?

I said that 62 FBS teams played 700 plus games against FCS without a loss...the other half (there are more than 62 FBS teams) did have at least one loss.

Michigan did lose one to Appalachian State....who is now FBS...

And VT did lose to JMU...but also beat Appalachian State, and nine more FCS in that period to give VT a 90% win rate over FCS.

 

[Zissou]

Zissou...you can't read well, can ya?

I said that 62 FBS teams played 700 plus games against FCS without a loss...the other half (there are more than 62 FBS teams) did have at least one loss.

Michigan did lose one to Appalachian State....who is now FBS...

And VT did lose to JMU...but also beat Appalachian State, and nine more FCS in that period to give VT a 90% win rate over FCS.

Bud, I can read. That is why I said that your comment was misleading, instead of factually incorrect.

Of the 21 teams that have won a Div 1 FCS National Championship, 6 have already moved to FBS, including App State (sometime after it beat ranked Michigan). JMU and Nova are champs that have not yet moved to FBS.

The point remains, the jump from a top level FCS to average G5 isn't a huge jump. It's probably less than the jump from the AAC to the SEC West.

 

[SubZero]

Our D Coordinator was from Nova guys...

He knew it was best to leave that sinking ship to join UCONN.

 

[Zissou]

2017 FCS vs. FBS: CAA Football | FOX Sports

James Madison at East Carolina (Sept. 2). Upset? OK, the reigning FCS national champion Dukes might be the favorite when they begin their title defense. Coach Mike Houston returns 12 starters, including quarterback and 2016 CAA offensive player of the year Bryan Schor. East Carolina finished a mere 2-9 last season.

 

[Zissou]

He knew it was best to leave that sinking ship to join UConn.

G5 >> FCS. UConn is a much better gig.

 

[The Funster]

Jeebus, this is what its come down too...billybud and Zissou arguing?

 

[Ldandy]

I like that your motto is Haters Gonna Hate.

The handful of FCS is rather meaningless, other than to counter the perception expressed by Billy that FBS was undefeated since 2005.

We could also say that UConn had its shot in CR, blew it, and it's time to move on. I think there is better opportunity than the AAC for UConn. If you are not successful in your current alignment it's natural to seek an improvement. I bet that is why the Boneyard has a whole forum dedicated to CR.

Uconn is not in control of selecting the conference that they want to join otherwise they would be in The B1G or ACC right now. Sure they can lobby and campaign for inclusion somewhere else, but ultimately other parties will make the decision. You can't blow an opportunity if you don't actually have one. Nova on the other hand was offered a chance to upgrade its program to FBS. They chose not to. Opportunity given, opportunity blown.

 

[Zissou]

UConn is not in control of selecting the conference that they want to join otherwise they would be in The B1G or ACC right now. Sure they can lobby and campaign for inclusion somewhere else, but ultimately other parties will make the decision. You can't blow an opportunity if you don't actually have one. Nova on the other hand was offered a chance to upgrade its program to FBS. They chose not to. Opportunity given, opportunity blown.

When Nova was ready to accept their invite, Pitt, Rutgers, and WVU blocked them. Even so, Nova has to own that they blew the process. They were trying to be careful and thoughtful, but they were just inept.

I agree UConn is more a victim of the process. They showed more loyalty than most, and were back stabbed by their partners. They still have to own their circumstance. They did shape the new AAC more than most.

 

[buddy]

After the initial backstabbing by Pitt and Cuse, then BC and FSU stepped in to finish the job.

 

[billybud]

Louisville was a good decision...whether FSU influenced that choice or not.

 

[The Funster]

Louisville was a geat decision. They got hit with a major recruiting scandal and the state dissolved their board of regents. The financing for the Yum! Center is being scrutinized finally and their financial house of cards is about to collapse. Who cares about all that stuff when you can win some FB and BB games? Education and integrity be damned!

 

[SubZero]

After the initial backstabbing by Pitt and Cuse, then BC and FSU stepped in to finish the job.

Which backstabbing job was this? The ACC teams have abused us so many times I lost count.

 

[Zissou]

Louisville was a good decision...whether FSU influenced that choice or not.

FSU and Ville are certainly kindred spirits. The ACC killed their myth of academic excellence by including both.

UConn is a better fit than either institutionally to the old guard ACC. It is a much better state school than FSU or Ville. UConn would be similar to a Clemson in the old ACC - state school, similar size, similar academic rating. Ville and FSU set the low bar academically for the ACC, and set it much lower than the old ACC.

UNC has shown that it has embraced the new standards set by newer members Ville and FSU.

 

[billybud]

Louisville was a geat decision. They got hit with a major recruiting scandal and the state dissolved their board of regents. The financing for the Yum! Center is being scrutinized finally and their financial house of cards is about to collapse. Who cares about all that stuff when you can win some FB and BB games? Education and integrity be damned!

The result of the decision speaks for itself....

The ACC..in 2012

.....was seen as endangered
.....no GOR, no network
.....programs defecting or threatening to do so
.....opinions rampant that the conference would never see a playoff
.....even more opinions that the SEC, B1G, and Big 12 would raid them.

The ACC now...

...2 of the last 4 football NC's
...2 of the last 3 basketball NC's
...baseball NC year before last
...long term GOR, media contract and stability
...setting records for NCAA tourney credits and future payouts
...upcoming network

and, with the taking of Louisville off of the Big 12's board, a monkey wrench was thrown into the Big 12's cogs. There is no talk about the Big 12 pushing anyone around now...only talk of their possible continued survival.

The ACC emerged from that fight for existence, red of tooth and claw, but alive to fight another day.

 

[Zissou]

The results of the decision speak for themselves...

Ville to the ACC was a great move for athletics. It just crumbled the facade of like-minded high level academic institutions.

With more weighting at the bottom, at least adding Ville brought FSU closer to the average.

 

[billybud]

Louisville is not a school with an academic reputation, true....but it is an athletic conference, athletic events being sold, and business decisions revolving around athletic income....and Virginia and Duke are thrilled...especially that they aren't being shuffled off in a conference break up.

And Louisville's add has done absolutely nothing to impact the academic ratings of Duke, Virginia, UNC, Wake, Miami, Clemson, et al.

It really only provides a rock for users of internet trebuchets to lob in the the fan wars.

 

[Zissou]

Louisville is not a school with an academic reputation, true....but it is an athletic conference

Agreed. And I agree it was a good add. The reality of CR is Money, Athletics, and Money.

As I said, it just crumbles the facade of "academic excellence". The ACC is just like the Big 12 or the AAC when it comes to putting academics first. Athletics and Money are definitely the priority. UNC's fake classes for athletes are just another tug on that veil.