A Dovian Take on KO

[upstater]

Calhoun didn't throw in the towel with kids. You know nothing about that. For a self-proclaimed poster of facts, that just an opinion. And an amazingly ill-informed one at that.

He definitely threw in the towel on Oriakhi. We all saw it. 2012 was not pretty. We all know it.

 

[superjohn]

LOL, it's because he's handsome. ! Look, don't respond to my posts and I won't respond to yours. You are out to lunch. Your idea of conversation is to ascribe the most absurd things to the person you're talking with. Enough.

You calling me "out to lunch" is something I'll where as a badge of honor. McHale is better than Bird and Paterno is a saint! Later gator.

 

[8893]

Wow, this is quite the melt. You've now brought up my hate for Eli (I like him) in several non Giants threads, I try and disengage with humor which seems like a foreign concept to you and now you're attacking me personally. Not a good look.

Melt? Personal attacks? I made passing mention of your Eli issues in this thread as an analogy to prove a point, and you have come through splendidly on that score.

Please show me the "several non Giants threads" in which I have done so.

Sheesh, snowflake, go back to the gym and work out your issues--whatever they are.

There is a lot of humor here, but not where you're looking.

It's been nice trolling you, but it's drinking time for me, stupendous juan.

 

[BigErnMcCracken]

It's been nice trolling you, but it's drinking time for me, stupendous juan.

I'm jealous. duck____ time zones.

 

[superjohn]

Melt? Personal attacks? I made passing mention of your Eli issues in this thread as an analogy to prove a point, and you have come through splendidly on that score.

Please show me the "several non Giants threads" in which I have done so.

Sheesh, snowflake, go back to the gym and work out your issues--whatever they are.

There is a lot of humor here, but not where you're looking.

It's been nice trolling you, but it's drinking time for me, stupendous juan.

Bwahaha, the melt continues! Better than anything I've seen on the cesspool. Drinking started early for someone today.

 

[8893]

Guess I should have linked definitions of "melt," "trolling" and "drinking" too.

I gather you have "homoerotic" covered.

Oh, and "hyperbole."

 

[jibsey]

Actually, Ollie needs to dip into the best basketball talent pool in the country.
Geno's staff. He should hire Geno's future successor now: Shea Ralph. Let her handle the recruiting of players and fundamentals. Often, times the best man for the job is a good woman.

Do you know her? Because when she played for Geno she was as hard a competitor as they ever had. Would have gone through a brick wall if he asked, unfortunately her knees paid a price. Is recruiting what she does?

 

[superjohn]

I'm jealous. duck____ time zones.

At least it's not 8 degrees where you are. Good weather to work your issues out at the gym!

 

[superjohn]

Guess I should have linked definitions of "melt," "trolling" and "drinking" too.

I gather you have "homoerotic" covered.

Oh, and "hyperbole."

You're struggling, it's okay.

 

[Sonova]

This board is full of result merchants.

Two years ago everyone was saying Ollie is a great player developer and game coach but a poor recruiter because he had improved Shabazz, Boat, Deandre, Niels, etc and brought in a national championship, yet recruiting was going poorly with several years in a row of weak classes.

Now we've had two years in a row of excellent recruiting classes but poor results on the court, and people are saying Ollie is a great recruiter but a poor coach.

A sensible person would conclude:
- Ollie proved he is an excellent coach in his first two years.
- Ollie proved he is an excellent recruiter in the last two years.
- The losing this year doesn't prove he has lost his ability to coach, it proves that injuries, a short bench, and multiple years of poor recruiting leaving you with freshman talent and upperclass weakness is a recipe for a failed season.

Only once Ollie has had 4 years of solid recruiting classes in a row, and has had time to coach up his talented classes for 4 years, can we judge his coaching ability. That's still 2-3 years away.

I for one have no doubt he'll be regarded as one of the NCAA's top coaches at that time. There isn't anyone I would trade for as our head coach - very happy to have KO.

To begin with, it's the highest level of college sports...it's kind of a results-driven thing. Quality and culture and representing dear old UConn matter certainly, but not above winning. They matter as a part of, and in addition to winning. That's what Jim Calhoun built over 30 years ago and what all of us want to continue, no?

Since you spoke for the entire board above, I'll excuse myself and speak just for me and my thoughts 2 years ago. I though KO did an amazing job taking the reins from JC. He took his players and his system and produced a terrific 1st year and a good 2nd year (regular season) with obviously, an incredible NCAA run. The questions that I recall asking and hearing (perhaps not solely on this forum) were, "how would KO do with HIS players and HIS program?" Those are the questions being answered now and over the coming year(s). And count me as someone who is really, really concerned by what I'm seeing and have been seeing over the last 2.5 years and what I see next year and beyond.

 

[UCweCONN]

No, his coaching record at UCONN and inability to win close games and beat low D1 programs is why we think KO is inept. It has nothing to do with KO except that I haven't experienced a year like this since JC's first season here. We may lose 20 games.

 

[Waquoit]

He should hire Geno's future successor now: Shea Ralph.

What makes you think she would accept a demotion?

 

[upstater]

You calling me "out to lunch" is something I'll where as a badge of honor. McHale is better than Bird and Paterno is a saint! Later gator.

See you did it again. McHale being better for a stretch of the 1985 season is now McHale was better for all time. Ridiculous. As for Penn State, what part of "It should get the death penalty" don't you understand. Something in you makes you converse with people as though it is a battle to derange everything the other person says. I don't know if it's a poor attention span or what; maybe reading more slowly would help--but obviously I'm not the only one that has this problem with your posts.

 

[upstater]

To begin with, it's the highest level of college sports...it's kind of a results-driven thing. Quality and culture and representing dear old UConn matter certainly, but not above winning. They matter as a part of, and in addition to winning. That's what Jim Calhoun built over 30 years ago and what all of us want to continue, no?

Since you spoke for the entire board above, I'll excuse myself and speak just for me and my thoughts 2 years ago. I though KO did an amazing job taking the reins from JC. He took his players and his system and produced a terrific 1st year and a good 2nd year (regular season) with obviously, an incredible NCAA run. The questions that I recall asking and hearing (perhaps not solely on this forum) were, "how would KO do with HIS players and HIS program?" Those are the questions being answered now and over the coming year(s). And count me as someone who is really, really concerned by what I'm seeing and have been seeing over the last 2.5 years and what I see next year and beyond.

KO took players who were sophs and frosh under Calhoun, players who experienced a really tough frustrating season with a couple of kids in open rebellion against Calhoun on the bench, and on social media, and he made helped these players improve. Almost all of them did. Giffey, Daniels, Napier, Boatright. These were not the same players they were under Calhoun. And, oh by the way, this recruiting class under Calhoun, which was universally derided as being horrifically awful in 2011 and 2012, ended up winning a national championship, with a run through top coaches like Donovan, Izzo, Jay Wright, Calipari, Hoiberg.

 

[Sonova]

He definitely threw in the towel on Oriakhi. We all saw it. 2012 was not pretty. We all know it.

"We all know it?" What are you a middle schooler? He played Andre Drummond and Oriaki and his father threw a temper tantrum b/c their pipe dreams of a long NBA career were coming to an end. Hardly throwing in the towel.

 

[upstater]

"We all know it?" What are you a middle schooler? He played Andre Drummond and Oriaki and his father threw a temper tantrum b/c their pipe dreams of a long NBA career were coming to an end. Hardly throwing in the towel.

Sigh. Go back and read what I wrote. I said "with some players." I didn't say Calhoun gave up on life. Or on basketball. Or on the team. I said he gave up on some players. He did give up on Oriakhi. I don't blame him for doing it. There were times when Oriakhi was mouthing off at him on the bench and where you'd think in the past Calhoun would lay into him, he just turned around and let it go, which is a much worse sign--if you ask me--then if he were going back at the kid.

 

[Sonova]

KO took players who were sophs and frosh under Calhoun, players who experienced a really tough frustrating season with a couple of kids in open rebellion against Calhoun on the bench, and on social media, and he made helped these players improve. Almost all of them did. Giffey, Daniels, Napier, Boatright. These were not the same players they were under Calhoun. And, oh by the way, this recruiting class under Calhoun, which was universally derided as being horrifically awful in 2011 and 2012, ended up winning a national championship, with a run through top coaches like Donovan, Izzo, Jay Wright, Calipari, Hoiberg.

Who were the couple of kids you are referring to (I'll give you Oriaki)? You make it sound like a mutiny. It wasn't. It was a difficult balance of veterans who wanted the limelight and talented freshman and sophomores who didn't know how to lead. And coming off a championship can create a different (sometimes individual) type of motivation. But if you're suggesting that Kevin Ollie fixed some dysfunctional situation, you're just wrong. No really. You don't know what you're talking about. And just because you've filed in your scrapbook that some blowhard fan boys on the Boneyard "universally derided" a couple of classes that featured Daniels (ranked #19), Boatwright (#34), Drummond (top 3) and Shabazz, means what again? That Kevin Ollie is a terrific coach or developer of talent? Or better than Jim Calhoun because they weren't universally derided on Ollie's watch? Got it.

 

[Sonova]

Sigh. Go back and read what I wrote. I said "with some players." I didn't say Calhoun gave up on life. Or on basketball. Or on the team. I said he gave up on some players. He did give up on Oriakhi. I don't blame him for doing it. There were times when Oriakhi was mouthing off at him on the bench and where you'd think in the past Calhoun would lay into him, he just turned around and let it go, which is a much worse sign--if you ask me--then if he were going back at the kid.

I did read your post again. You mentioned some/more than one kid. Who were the other players? And it reads like Calhoun quit on them ("wasn't the master motivator") - which I completely disagree with. Oriaki's minutes diminished because he stunk his junior year. He was a shell of the player that he was during the 2011 season (especially in the post season) and yet he still averaged 21 mins/game. Oh, and he was the team captain - which ain't voted on by the players. If that's throwing in the towel, we should all be so lucky.[/QUOTE]

 

[Doctor Hoop]

It's like you don't see the danger signs. Read Fishy's posts. I am very afraid that this banging on the drum for Ollie's head will start resulting in one thing: recruiting misses from kids scared to go to a place with a coach on a hot seat. The next guy--please you name him, Northeastern's coach?--is going to have a much tougher time recruiting in the AAC.

I like Ollie, and want him to succeed, but in response ...

I think I recall another Northeastern coach who came to UConn and did okay.

 

[upstater]

I like Ollie, and want him to succeed, but in response ...

I think I recall another Northeastern coach who came to UConn and did okay.

Came to the Big East. There's a difference.

 

[Doctor Hoop]

Came to the Big East. There's a difference.

As if we don't have a storied history and four national championships ...

You're right, the AAC isn't the OBE. But when Calhoun came he sold the conference because he couldn't sell the tradition. Ollie doesn't have that limitation.

 

[Mr. French]

This board is full of result merchants.

Two years ago everyone was saying Ollie is a great player developer and game coach but a poor recruiter because he had improved Shabazz, Boat, Deandre, Niels, etc and brought in a national championship, yet recruiting was going poorly with several years in a row of weak classes.

Now we've had two years in a row of excellent recruiting classes but poor results on the court, and people are saying Ollie is a great recruiter but a poor coach.

A sensible person would conclude:
- Ollie proved he is an excellent coach in his first two years.
- Ollie proved he is an excellent recruiter in the last two years.
- The losing this year doesn't prove he has lost his ability to coach, it proves that injuries, a short bench, and multiple years of poor recruiting leaving you with freshman talent and upperclass weakness is a recipe for a failed season.

Only once Ollie has had 4 years of solid recruiting classes in a row, and has had time to coach up his talented classes for 4 years, can we judge his coaching ability. That's still 2-3 years away.

I for one have no doubt he'll be regarded as one of the NCAA's top coaches at that time. There isn't anyone I would trade for as our head coach - very happy to have KO.

Someone who can concisely and intelligently put together a solid, rational point of view.

Well done.

 

[BLUEDOGHOUSE]

No, his coaching record at UCONN and inability to win close games and beat low D1 programs is why we think KO is inept. It has nothing to do with KO except that I haven't experienced a year like this since JC's first season here. We may lose 20 games.

Connecticut is (-165 on the Under)...Over/Under @ +20 losses (20 or more) for the regular season per a "DM'ed" Vegas generated Season Loss Totals Line.

 

[upstater]

As if we don't have a storied history and four national championships ...

You're right, the AAC isn't the OBE. But when Calhoun came he sold the conference because he couldn't sell the tradition. Ollie doesn't have that limitation.

I don't think he has it either. It's why I don't want him to be fired. But we are talking about the next guy, not Ollie. The next guy will have more difficulty recruiting here than Ollie, unless they somehow make a major splash, which is hard to see how that would happen. I think someone can make the case though that schools like Pitt may be easier to recruit to now than a school like UConn.

 

[Kitaman]

Ollie's like a teenager who finally owns the car he always wanted (i.e. his players). Lets see how he maintains/services/upgrades the car and how well it runs when he reaches adulthood in 4-5 years.

Then we will know what kind of driver we have not just by the performance but the destination he takes it.

Until then our ride with him will be adventurous, fun and at times unsettling. But this fan will find a way to enjoy it, even with my 'backseat driving' on the Board and Chatroom.