2020 Recruiting Thread

-
Joined
Aug 26, 2011
Messages
5,001
Likes
5,905
Jalon Ferrell
Keyhawn Paul
Messiah Turner
Malik Dixon
Myles Bell


Except Bell, I see a consistent theme: we don't get the top desired kids; we get good solid (FAST) kids with perceived upside. As we always have - frankly. Solid. Use good evaluative tools. Justin Perkins was this; Howard & Butler. Terry Richardson (IMHO) is a loss. But, I think we still have the relationships and we work towards 2020 & 2021 in the same way.
 
Joined
Sep 4, 2011
Messages
667
Likes
892
Of course we should be recruiting Florida. If the Athletic department is going to let our Volleyball coaches recruit in Texas and Florida, it makes zero sense for our Football coaches not to.
 

Exit 4

This space for rent
Joined
Feb 3, 2012
Messages
6,509
Likes
8,961
Disagree with your thinking. Edsall 1.0 recruited undersized or not developed athletes that he could project. They required a redshirt year and time to develop. Most P5 program recruits are highly developed football players that can hit the field almost immediately.

What is different today is that there seem to be fewer quality football recruits in the Northeast today. Look at NY, NJ, and PA:

NY: FBS recruits 2004 = 19, P5 recruits 2019 = 7

NJ: FBS recruits 2004 = 47, P5 recruits 2019 = 40

PA: FBS recruits 2004 = 58, P5 recruits 2019 = 31

So the 3 big Northeastern states went from 124 recruits to 78 recruits. This is why the Northeastern schools are looking South for recruits. In Florida, there are a ton of speedy 160 lb to 170 lb defensive backs and WRs that need to develop, but most P5 programs are not going to take them or take many of them. That is the opportunity for a school like UConn.

Edsall's recruiting strategy is one of the reasons we are all frustrated with the results. His recruits typically aren't ready to contribute during their first year, but they have been forced to play his first 2 years.

As for Lutrus, articles at the time said he could have gone Ivy and Maryland, BC, Rutgers, and West Virginia expressed interest, but they didn't offer. He didn't get his UConn offer until November his senior year. He seems to be overlooked because he played RB in HS. UConn switched him to LB where he had success.
Good stuff....something I would like to wade deeper into if I had the time when looking at PA/NY/NJ.

I did a run down on CT using 247. Yes, I realize 247 is mistake prone, but its a quick and dirty anyways.
CT FBS recruits by year / number that went to UConn. These are just the kids they took the time to rank.

Broadly speaking 247 went from 2100 kids in their database in the 2000s to 4000 kids last year. Therefore the expansion of the database probably partially explains the CT story below.

2002 - 6 (1) <--notable that Deon Anderson was #2 as a three star
2003 - 11 (2)
2004 - 14 (7) <--notables Lou Allen as a two star at #4 and DJ Hernandez as a two star at #11
2005 - 12 (3)
2006 - 14 (2) <--notable that Scott Lutrus was a two star and rank#8
2007 - 5 (1)
2008 - 10 (2)
2009 - 12 (3) <--notable that Trevardo Williams was a three star and rank#10
2010 - 12 (2) <--notable that Byron Jones was a three star and rank#11
2011 - 8 (2)
2012 - 6 (2)
2013 - 9 (2) <--got Cochran ranked #1
2014 - 15 (6) <--got Boyle ranked #2 and Noel Thomas #5
2015 - 15 (4) <--got Newsome ranked #2
2016 - 16 (4) <--Herring at #6, Rose at #11, Coyle at #14, Dixon at #16
2017 - 17 (3) <--Fortt at #14, Gardner at #15 and Fitton at #19
2018 - 16 (5) <--Robinson at #7, Travis Jones at #8, Lucien at #12, Gillespie at #15 and Kevon Jones at #18
2019 - 22 (2) <--highest ranked kid was Jackson Mitchell at #18 and Winston Jules at #26,
 

Exit 4

This space for rent
Joined
Feb 3, 2012
Messages
6,509
Likes
8,961
Disagree with your thinking. Edsall 1.0 recruited undersized or not developed athletes that he could project. They required a redshirt year and time to develop. Most P5 program recruits are highly developed football players that can hit the field almost immediately.
Jim, there is one aspect of this POV that is difficult to judge. Just how much development did Randy 1.0 recruits need vs the same kids he is recruiting today. Since there is so little HS video on the Randy 1.0 era recruits, we really can't do much to compare the two eras very well.

Are the Randy 2.0 kids equal, behind or ahead of the typical Randy 1.0 kid? I worry it is the latter. It seems like Randy 1.0 was unable to find more speed. It seems like Randy 1.0 didn't have a dog fight over every single recruit he pursued. Everyone we look at in the 2.0 era is a recruiting battle royale. Nothing is easy. There are fewer secret players.

Anyways, I still believe in Randy, I just worry alot....
 
Joined
Sep 18, 2011
Messages
2,692
Likes
3,363
Jim, there is one aspect of this POV that is difficult to judge. Just how much development did Randy 1.0 recruits need vs the same kids he is recruiting today. Since there is so little HS video on the Randy 1.0 era recruits, we really can't do much to compare the two eras very well.

Are the Randy 2.0 kids equal, behind or ahead of the typical Randy 1.0 kid? I worry it is the latter. It seems like Randy 1.0 was unable to find more speed. It seems like Randy 1.0 didn't have a dog fight over every single recruit he pursued. Everyone we look at in the 2.0 era is a recruiting battle royale. Nothing is easy. There are fewer secret players.

Anyways, I still believe in Randy, I just worry alot....
Kids went to camps and many sent films to schools before the internet. Recruiting services had newsletters and published magazines with recruiting ranks. The difference now is fans can see the recruiting profiles and highlights on-line. Also, the recruiting services in the old days rarely listed all of the offers so kids looked under recruited.

In 2012, the average P5 school made ~125 scholarship offers. In 2019, the average P5 school made ~240 scholarship offers. Obviously, no school is taking 240 kids in a give year, but the increased number of scholarship offers makes it look like more kids have recruiting battles.
 

Exit 4

This space for rent
Joined
Feb 3, 2012
Messages
6,509
Likes
8,961
Kids went to camps and many sent films to schools before the internet. Recruiting services had newsletters and published magazines with recruiting ranks. The difference now is fans can see the recruiting profiles and highlights on-line. Also, the recruiting services in the old days rarely listed all of the offers so kids looked under recruited.

In 2012, the average P5 school made ~125 scholarship offers. In 2019, the average P5 school made ~240 scholarship offers. Obviously, no school is taking 240 kids in a give year, but the increased number of scholarship offers makes it look like more kids have recruiting battles.
<--And isn't this what it boils down too? Far more stones overturned by every program = fewer dirty diamonds in hiding. So bingo, Randy in the 2.0 era has to battle for every single kid...except for the couple he gets from his camps.

As for the film, that film is much more quickly and widely disseminated today. Much more than in the past. Coaches (like all of us) can watch it on our smart phones while sitting on the can in some airport. That just wasnt the case back when we had dumb phones, DSL and clumsy/slow means to transfer large digital video files on CDs/etc. There is just no way staffs in the 2000s could look at as many kids than as they do today. No way its comparable. And more eyes is not good for Randy 2.0. Today there is instant tape on virtually every kid at every program nationwide.

What we cant do very well here is really compare that Randy 1.0 HS recruiting film to todays kids to gauge where Randy 2.0 is really at relative to 1.0. Are we ahead, behind or the same, difficult to tell.
 
Joined
Aug 26, 2011
Messages
1,962
Likes
1,239
Jim, there is one aspect of this POV that is difficult to judge. Just how much development did Randy 1.0 recruits need vs the same kids he is recruiting today. Since there is so little HS video on the Randy 1.0 era recruits, we really can't do much to compare the two eras very well.

Are the Randy 2.0 kids equal, behind or ahead of the typical Randy 1.0 kid? I worry it is the latter. It seems like Randy 1.0 was unable to find more speed. It seems like Randy 1.0 didn't have a dog fight over every single recruit he pursued. Everyone we look at in the 2.0 era is a recruiting battle royale. Nothing is easy. There are fewer secret players.

Anyways, I still believe in Randy, I just worry alot....
For a believer, what number of wins in 2019 are required to remain a believer; or is there another metric that you will use to continue to believe into 2020 (if so let me know what it is).

I originally thought word of hiring former HCREDreamJob1.0 as HCRE2.0 was a joke, then convince myself there was method to the madness for the rehire, then made excuses for 2017 (almost 5 wins) and finally saw the 2018 HCRE2.0 "same ol' excuse making wizard behind the curtain as HCRE1.0" and now am in the "he can't execute" camp.

Win no FBS games in 2019 he should be fired immediately. Win less games than 2017 he should be fired immediately. Win same number of games as 2017 he is on hot seat for 2020. However many games UConn wins in 2019 do not pull an Ollie or Diaco and give him an extension.
 
Joined
Aug 26, 2011
Messages
5,001
Likes
5,905
I’ve been converted. Methinks 85% of offers or known information gets on social media - mostly twitter. Ok. I accept that.

One thing different on HCRE 2.0, he’s not bringing in 5-7 to 5-9 corners. All his DBs are over 5-11. Most are 6-0 to 6-2.

Then. I think Jackson Mitchell is gonna surprise. It’s speed & skill & body type. But #18? I see someone that Edsall sought and locked up. LB will be a new world for him ... like Lutrus. But you can’t measure the desire to be excellent.
 
Joined
Sep 18, 2011
Messages
2,692
Likes
3,363
<--And isn't this what it boils down too? Far more stones overturned by every program = fewer dirty diamonds in hiding. So bingo, Randy in the 2.0 era has to battle for every single kid...except for the couple he gets from his camps.

As for the film, that film is much more quickly and widely disseminated today. Much more than in the past. Coaches (like all of us) can watch it on our smart phones while sitting on the can in some airport. That just wasnt the case back when we had dumb phones, DSL and clumsy/slow means to transfer large digital video files on CDs/etc. There is just no way staffs in the 2000s could look at as many kids than as they do today. No way its comparable. And more eyes is not good for Randy 2.0. Today there is instant tape on virtually every kid at every program nationwide.

What we cant do very well here is really compare that Randy 1.0 HS recruiting film to todays kids to gauge where Randy 2.0 is really at relative to 1.0. Are we ahead, behind or the same, difficult to tell.
The under the radar kids are overlooked because they are underdeveloped, late bloomers, playing out of position, late to playing football, local colleges are full at their position, etc. In the Northeast, the best athlete on a high school team may play QB or RB, but they don't project as FBS players at their positions. But, they could be moved to WR, DB, LB, TE, etc. and be very good FBS players.

Look at a player like Jordan Todman. He was under the radar despite being 2x all-state, Boston Globe player of the year as a senior, 2nd all-time rusher in Massachusetts history, had teammates commit to Georgia, BC, and UNH. Why? Most thought he was better suited to play defense or he was too small to play RB. And, BC had a good recruiting class of RBs that year which included Montel Harris, BC's 2nd leading all-time rusher. UConn offered him to play RB and the rest is history. RE 1.0 is full of stories like this.
 

Exit 4

This space for rent
Joined
Feb 3, 2012
Messages
6,509
Likes
8,961
Look at a player like Jordan Todman. He was under the radar despite being 2x all-state, Boston Globe player of the year as a senior, 2nd all-time rusher in Massachusetts history, had teammates commit to Georgia, BC, and UNH. Why? Most thought he was better suited to play defense or he was too small to play RB. And, BC had a good recruiting class of RBs that year which included Montel Harris, BC's 2nd leading all-time rusher. UConn offered him to play RB and the rest is history. RE 1.0 is full of stories like this.
<--Wait, Jordan Todman qualifies as an "under the radar guy?"

He's one of the few kids who had public HS tape out there back in 2007. I remember it, it was electric.

He played on a team that was 12-1. He racked up over 6k yards in high school and finished as the second leading rusher all time in MA. He also took gold in the 100 meters at track with a 10.92 time.

According to Rivals, he was offered by BC and Purdue along with UConn. They also note Penn St took some interest as well.

Todman was no secret.

I think Bryon Jones and Blidi Wreh-Wilson are two players that I would say meet the definition of "under the radar" types, not Jordan Todman.
 
Joined
Sep 18, 2011
Messages
2,692
Likes
3,363
<--Wait, Jordan Todman qualifies as an "under the radar guy?"

He's one of the few kids who had public HS tape out there back in 2007. I remember it, it was electric.

He played on a team that was 12-1. He racked up over 6k yards in high school and finished as the second leading rusher all time in MA. He also took gold in the 100 meters at track with a 10.92 time.

According to Rivals, he was offered by BC and Purdue along with UConn. They also note Penn St took some interest as well.

Todman was no secret.

I think Bryon Jones and Blidi Wreh-Wilson are two players that I would say meet the definition of "under the radar" types, not Jordan Todman.
The other schools offered Todman to play defense. He was an under the radar RB.
 
Joined
Aug 26, 2011
Messages
50,575
Likes
73,646

Charles Finley is a 6-4 215lb WR/TE from DePaul Catholic in Wayne, New Jersey. Other offers from Howard, Maryland, Morgan State, Pitt, Rutgers and UMass.

Highlights
 

Exit 4

This space for rent
Joined
Feb 3, 2012
Messages
6,509
Likes
8,961
NY: FBS recruits 2004 = 19, P5 recruits 2019 = 7

NJ: FBS recruits 2004 = 47, P5 recruits 2019 = 40

PA: FBS recruits 2004 = 58, P5 recruits 2019 = 31
Something else to consider. Since 2000, FL has added whopping 6.8 million people and Texas has added a stunning 8.7 million people. Over that same time period CT has added a mere 250k to bring us up to 3.5 million. Meanwhile locally NJ added 700k, PA 1 million and NY about 2 million people.

I don't disagree with the premise that there are fewer D1 prospects in PA/NY/NJ than in the past, but that might not be the entire story. Part of the reduction may have to do with the shear growth in football states like TX and FL (and other southern states) which just dwarfs anything north. It maybe many of those bottom kids in NY/NJ and PA are losing their seats to influx of football talent in those southern states.
 
Last edited:
Joined
Aug 27, 2011
Messages
12,686
Likes
16,701
Ironically he's a university professor, you knew that right? Lecturing is just normal discourse for him. Yes, he has taken upon himself to remind of us of the 1999 to 2011 era every two weeks or 2 pages on this thread. His thesis is that nothing has changed, dirty undiscovered diamonds remain abundant. He also stridently believes that its not possible for anyone not practiced at university level scouting to have an opinion on recruiting.

Time will tell. My thesis; 1/2 of RE 1.0 era dirty diamonds would have been plucked by other teams if they had resources and instant networking we have today. There are far fewer dirty diamonds because every staff is tirelessly turning over every rock. What hasn't changed? Video still tells you nothing about a kid's character, desire and coachability and whether or not they have more growing to do. Randy will have to outfox people on the intangibles because the pure athletes are getting found no matter where they are hiding these days. He will also have to bet (ie gamble) more on the late bloomers.

The Scott Lutrus' of the world get pulled into the ACC in todays football.
I agree it’s like any business, if you don’t keep up with technological change, you fall behind. Look at all the grad assistants we have on our staff,as do other schools, to sit at a computer and review HS videos of prospects.
 
Joined
Aug 27, 2011
Messages
12,686
Likes
16,701
Something else to consider. Since 2000, FL has added whopping 6.8 million people and Texas has added a stunning 8.7 million people. Over that same time period CT has added a mere 250k to bring us up to 3.5 million. Meanwhile locally NJ added 700k, PA 1 million and NY about 2 million people.

I don't disagree with the premise that there are fewer D1 prospects in PA/NY/NJ than in the past, but that might not be the entire story. Part of the reduction may have to do with the shear growth in football states like TX and FL (and other southern states) which just dwarfs anything north. It maybe many of those bottom kids in NY/NJ and PA are losing their seats to influx of football talent in those southern states.
Interesting data. Of course, you need to sort out demographics down a level, is FL growth due to baby boomers retiring there?
Is TX due to the migration from Mexico where the primary sport is soccer? Having said that, it’s no doubt we are falling behind in CT when it comes to growth.
 
Joined
Aug 26, 2011
Messages
1,962
Likes
1,239
I lived in San Diego when Marshall Faulk was there. Went to game against Miami when he was there but unfortunately he was hurt and didn't play and Miami killed. That award winning QB on the Miami team wasn't even in the top ten best players on his own team that year, boy Miami was good.
Reason bringing up was lot of colleges wanted Marshall, but as DB, but San Diego State got him as told him he could try out as RB. Rest is history.
Seems to be similar to the Todman story.
 
Joined
Aug 26, 2011
Messages
5,001
Likes
5,905
I’m not going to dispute the Exit 4 narrative of Jordan Todman. However, I seem to remember that he had scant film or stats his Junior year. So his recruiting wasn’t too hot pre Senior as he was rising. As he blew up, we were there early. But yes ... Purdue, BC and others arrived.

The other thing I remember is his Home situation was not standard. I thought I read that he lived with a teammate or something; he had work to do on academics.
 

Exit 4

This space for rent
Joined
Feb 3, 2012
Messages
6,509
Likes
8,961
I’m not going to dispute the Exit 4 narrative of Jordan Todman. However, I seem to remember that he had scant film or stats his Junior year. So his recruiting wasn’t too hot pre Senior as he was rising. As he blew up, we were there early. But yes ... Purdue, BC and others arrived.

The other thing I remember is his Home situation was not standard. I thought I read that he lived with a teammate or something; he had work to do on academics.
I don’t think he racked up all those yards his senior year alone (second all time rusher in MA history), he had to very productive as a junior.

And you are correct, he did not have a standard home life. He moved in with another family in high school to find stability.
 
Joined
Aug 26, 2011
Messages
50,575
Likes
73,646

Reyan Blake is a 6-0 185lb DB from Seminole Ridge High School in Loxahatchee Florida.

Highlights


As an aside for the seeming angst about TR moving on - Coach Perkins has been recruiting Central/Southern Florida for a long time.
 
Joined
Aug 26, 2011
Messages
5,001
Likes
5,905
It was Perkins who brought in a handful of Georgia kids early in his first term. He’s a good recruiting coach.
 
Joined
Aug 26, 2011
Messages
50,575
Likes
73,646

Nick Schwitzgebel is a 6-3 285lb OL from St Ignatius in Cleveland Ohio. Other offers from Akron, BGSU, CMU, Colorado State, Kent State, Louisville, Princeton, Toledo, Yale and Youngstown State.
 
Joined
Aug 26, 2011
Messages
50,575
Likes
73,646

James Mitchell is a 6-1 270lb DL from Duncanville High School in Duncanville Texas. Other offers from Alabama A&M, Arkansas, Colorado, Colorado State, Grambling, Kansas, Louisiana-Lafayette, Minnesota, New Mexico, North Texas, Tennessee State, Texas State, Tulane, Southern University, Vanderbilt and BC

Highlights
 

Top