2017 Gold Cup | Page 8 | The Boneyard

2017 Gold Cup

I used to live in 2nd Division city in Germany. Kaiserslautern. What are your questions?

I'm laughing at donkey zardes and some bad Jamaican goalkeeping. The MLSUSMNT is going to get murdered in Russia. But you Garber suckboys will still claim progress.


This team isn't going anywhere in Russia. You think there isn't going to be a lot of money invested in questionable referee decisions?

Let's be honest here about the prospects of the US getting a fair shake.

I'm curious if the team will get hit head on travel as well like they did in Brazil. Do they out them in Moscow or St. Petersburg, or do they send they out into the hinterlands?

I think advancing is not going to be determined on the pitch.
 
Don't forget his team also lost to Costa Rica 4-0 last time too.

But Zoo doesn't see any difference in the teams under JK and BA.

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Not apples to apples. I really should not have to explain it to you.
 
I'm not sure I follow the arguments. So the USA absolutely dominates Jamaica, start to finish, allowing them almost no possession and only a couple of chances, but the US squad isn't any good. Doesn't matter, I suppose that Jamaica just beat Mexico and that we just beat Costa Rica handily. Was CR at full strength? No. But they were closer to it than the USA was.

Has a U.S. team ever rolled through a Gold Cup as easily as this one did? With a B-level roster? I suspect that people are nostalgic for favorite players of the past. Yes, a young Reyna would be great and would let us move Pulisic to the wing. But at many other spots this squad is improved over many of the past. Gonzales has really improved playing without Brooks, and has taken on more responsibility. Besler has been good. Nagbe is legit. Morris is one of the most potentially effective attacking subs I can recall, and he even plays defense, so you can plug him in a tied game without adding risk.

I really can't recall any U.S. team playing as aggressively, with as much pressure as this one does. Maybe it will backfire in Russia, maybe it won't. Goakeeper is the spot that concerns me most. They look cohesive, and play pretty well as a team out there, except Zardes. I would like to see somebody besides Acosta in the sub center mid role. I think Nagbe got an audition because Acosta did little besides commit fouls.

This was a B list Gold Cup and the US brought in their A- team. Not winning the cup would have been a calamity.

Let's be honest, the standard of play was perhaps the worst ever seen in this tournament.

This was a missed opportunity. Instead of blooding youth, we brought in MLS USMNT fringe players. There should have been more Miazgas...
 
I don't see the big improvement expected in the USA either. The talent pool is small still and the dedication is not what it could be.

Claudio Reyna played for the USA 20 years ago. Have we had a field general like Claudio ever since then? No. I acknowledge that Pulisic is going to play at a higher level than Reyna, but we don't have people at key positions like the #6. Bradley is playing better. But compare Bradley to some of the guys from the past like Reyna. There is a night and day difference. Heck, Bradley is not anywhere near John O'Brien's level either.

Bradley spent many of his prime years playing out of position for Jurgen. From a European club standpoint, he was far better than O'Brien. Reyna is probably still the best mid to play for the U.S.
 
Right -- Jurgen lost to Jamaica with his A squad . . .

And then the next summer he crushed everyone not named Argentina and Colombia in the Copa.

We had no business beating those two top 5 teams anyways.

You guys crack me up. Remind me again about the 2006 World Cup.
 
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Bradley spent many of his prime years playing out of position for Jurgen. From a European club standpoint, he was far better than O'Brien. Reyna is probably still the best mid to play for the U.S.

Bradley is synonymous with overrated. He's just not what he was in his early twenties.
 
This was a B list Gold Cup and the US brought in their A- team. Not winning the cup would have been a calamity.

Let's be honest, the standard of play was perhaps the worst ever seen in this tournament.

This was a missed opportunity. Instead of blooding youth, we brought in MLS USMNT fringe players. There should have been more Miazgas...

This was the US's A-team? Really?

You don't think that Pulisic, Cameron, Johnson, Brooks, Yedlin, Wood, or Bedoya would have anything to say about that? When more than half of your projected starters for WC Qualifying are not on the roster that wins it, that is the definition of a B-side.

Could we have seen more playing time for folks like Miazga? Yes, and I've argued as much in this thread. But my God, man. You work so very hard to hurl nonsense at Arena in order to defend your stance on Klinsmann. It's beyond tired at this point. The players are playing better under Arena than they were under Klinsmann, no matter how you try to slice it. Players like Nagbe didn't even get a sniff under Klinsmann, and he now looks to be one of our key players going forward. But I guess you should continue to hold out hope that Aron Johannson and Julian Green will eventually turn the corner so that you can fulfill your anti-Arena anti-MLS fetish. Don't get me wrong, I hope they turn the corner because they are Americans, but I also am aware that they aren't our best options right now and I don't care where our best options come from...
 
This was a B list Gold Cup and the US brought in their A- team. Not winning the cup would have been a calamity.

Let's be honest, the standard of play was perhaps the worst ever seen in this tournament.

This was a missed opportunity. Instead of blooding youth, we brought in MLS USMNT fringe players. There should have been more Miazgas...

Costa Rica had more normal starters than we did. Morris isn't one of the youth? Villafana? Acosta? Arriola?
Could we have left Zusi at home? Sure. Other than Miazga and Jesse Gonzalez, they played the rest of the youngest guys they had.

CCV was playing for the Spurs in the Champions Cup against Roma Tuesday, isn't that even better experience? We do need to cap him soon. I don't know why Miazga didn't get a look on the back line.
 
Costa Rica had more normal starters than we did. Morris isn't one of the youth? Villafana? Acosta? Arriola?
Could we have left Zusi at home? Sure. Other than Miazga and Jesse Gonzalez, they played the rest of the youngest guys they had.

CCV was playing for the Spurs in the Champions Cup against Roma Tuesday, isn't that even better experience? We do need to cap him soon. I don't know why Miazga didn't get a look on the back line.

Morris is not youth. He spent too much time in college. He's not as young as you think.

Acosta I can sort of see because the alternative was Jermaine Jones. But in reality Emerson Hyndman may be a better player. If you don't think he would play in MLS like Acosta then you are nuts.
 
CCV was playing for the Spurs in the Champions Cup against Roma Tuesday, isn't that even better experience? We do need to cap him soon. I don't know why Miazga didn't get a look on the back line.

There was a legitimate reason to leave CCV out, but given how bad the back line was during this tournament I can't understand why Miazga was left off the field.
 
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Acosta I can sort of see because the alternative was Jermaine Jones. But in reality Emerson Hyndman may be a better player. If you don't think he would play in MLS like Acosta then you are nuts.

He may be. His injury complicated things.

I also think Acosta will take a turn in Europe at some point.
 
22 is still youth to you? At 22 you are an established pro. Only in the US do we consider that age "youth".

You're ridiculous. If you don't think that 22 is considered "youth" when you are considering national team call-ups, then I don't know what else to tell you. Brazil's current 23-man national team roster contains nobody under the age of 23. Italy's current 23-man roster contains 2 players (Donnarumma, Pellegrini), neither of which will see the field. Argentina contains 2 players out of 23 that are below 23 (Mammana, Correa), and the same deal there.

Yeah....only in the US do we consider 22 as "youth"...insufferable...
 
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You're ridiculous. If you don't think that 22 is considered "youth" when you are considering national team call-ups, then I don't know what else to tell you. Brazil's current 23-man national team roster contains nobody under the age of 23. Italy's current 23-man roster contains 2 players (Donnarumma, Pellegrini), neither of which will see the field. Argentina contains 2 players out of 23 that are below 23 (Mammana, Correa), and the same deal there.

Yeah....only in the US do we consider 22 as "youth"...insufferable...

Zoo is just being contrarian for the sake of it on some of these points.

The Coach: I didn't want Arena back. Yet I admit the team is much better than under JK in his last year. Is it as good as it could have been under somebody else? We will never know. What is the point of harping on this?

On MLS: I don't watch much but the Revs really. Is it a great league? No. Is it utter garbage? No. Can players develop in MLS? Of course. But the best of them should move overseas. It's true in Mexico, Argentina, Brazil, and frankly every country on earth aside from England, Spain, Germany and Italy. That's not an embarrassment.

Has the U.S. traditionally over utilized older, experienced players at the expense of younger ones? Yes. But I think that attitude is changing. Still, old guys like Dempsey can get it done. Miroslav Klose sure did in his final WC run.
 
I'll talk about 2006 if you talk about 2002.

What's funny is that most of the people you're arguing with (including me) don't really like Arena as a long-term solution. He was brought in in the middle of qualifying. There weren't a lot of options.

Bingo. I'm with you on that. Not who I wanted, but we needed to stabilize.
 
Did someone really say Jordan Morris will play in England? Which tier?
 
22 is still youth to you? At 22 you are an established pro. Only in the US do we consider that age "youth".
We're talking National Team here. Not club. 22 is young for the NT.
 
I'll talk about 2006 if you talk about 2002.

What's funny is that most of the people you're arguing with (including me) don't really like Arena as a long-term solution. He was brought in in the middle of qualifying. There weren't a lot of options.
Exactly.

But we DEFINITELY needed a change from Klinsmann.
 
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Did someone really say Jordan Morris will play in England? Which tier?

I did. Not at a top club. But I think he'll improve and could play for lower level EPL teams, or 2nd division teams working for promotion. I just think his style suits the English game. He wouldn't work in Spain or Italy.
 
And then the next summer he crushed everyone not named Argentina and Colombia in the Copa.

We had no business beating those two top 5 teams anyways.

You guys crack me up. Remind me again about the 2006 World Cup.

I can remind you about every World Cup since the U.S. first qualified, and the results are easily categorized having nothing to do with who the coach is. When the World Cup is in Europe, we don't get out of pool play. When the World Cup is anywhere else in the world, and we don't have half the field having the advantage of playing within their federation, we get out of the first round every time.

So yes, tell me about how that is about Arena and Jurgen?
 
This team got better as the tournament progressed, and got the result they should have gotten given the teams/rosters present. It is a good result.
I think a lot was either learned, or validated, over the 6 matches... serious depth issues across the back, identified who plays/works better with who, and identifying depth for the rest of WCQ and Russia '18.
Say what you will about Arena (I am not his biggest supporter) but the guy is getting results when they've mattered.
Those calling out that the issue was talent not manager are mostly correct, in my opinion, and partially incorrect. The talent pool is not the strongest and the USMNT is in this transitional phase of top players in their twilight, and upcoming players a year or three away. Jurgen (who I was a fan/apologist for, and believe he's done a lot to set up USMNT for success going forward) had lost the locker room and had to go. His was not the right persona/skill set to lead them thru the transition.

Let's revisit how we're feeling about the coach, the team, etc... after the next 2 qualifying matches in early September. Anything less than 6 points from the 2 matches will be disappointing, barring some unforeseen injuries.
 
This team got better as the tournament progressed, and got the result they should have gotten given the teams/rosters present. It is a good result.
I think a lot was either learned, or validated, over the 6 matches... serious depth issues across the back, identified who plays/works better with who, and identifying depth for the rest of WCQ and Russia '18.
Say what you will about Arena (I am not his biggest supporter) but the guy is getting results when they've mattered.
Those calling out that the issue was talent not manager are mostly correct, in my opinion, and partially incorrect. The talent pool is not the strongest and the USMNT is in this transitional phase of top players in their twilight, and upcoming players a year or three away. Jurgen (who I was a fan/apologist for, and believe he's done a lot to set up USMNT for success going forward) had lost the locker room and had to go. His was not the right persona/skill set to lead them thru the transition.

Let's revisit how we're feeling about the coach, the team, etc... after the next 2 qualifying matches in early September. Anything less than 6 points from the 2 matches will be disappointing, barring some unforeseen injuries.

I've never wanted to watch my team play and not win. But in any two game qualifying weekend, with home and road games, 4 points is almost always fine.

Was the quality of play any good this World Cup? No, it was as bad as the time we broke Beckerman, Robbie Rodgers, Logan Pause and Holden in as our midfield and got obliterated by Mexico in the finals. But we had two goals this fortnight: win the tournament, and evaluate as much of our second level and slightly out of the limelight talent as we could before the next European season starts up. We accomplished both goals. So for any rational mind, it was overall every successful.

The irrational ones who can't be pleased I can't help. And I don't understand why I have to think that proving we're not good enough to make a serious run at the World Cup -- which I never thought -- needs to make me less glad that we won a tournament that we hadn't won in four years.
 
Yugggggeeee 2-1 win over FIFA #76 ranked team

You know what is not as Yugggggeeee (you need to emphasize the u genius, not the ggg and eee) as a 2-1 win over the FIFA #76 ranked team? Think really hard, even you can come up with the answer. If you can't, I'd tell you to ask a Mexican friend, but the odds that you have a Mexican friend are laughable.
 
you paint with a broad brush when I am talking about a particular tactic but that's ok - you and zoo continue to think you know what you are talking about - Ive forgotten more soccer than you will ever come to know. Continue bashing Jozy - at 41 minutes of today's final he was laughing at you
Dubious, but indeed we all appreciated the Dozer nailing his free kick. Kudos!
 
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