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$ 14 MILLION?

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noeynox said:
What if the espn offer comes in at 8 million? None of UConn RU or UL could afford to take so much less. If the big east is in fact looking at that type of money when it comes time to negotiate the contract, espn will know of the GOR thing and initiate another round of expansion to further weaken the big east negotiating leverage.
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If the offers are 8 million from ESPN and 14 million with a GOR from NBC, question is what is the NBC offer without the GOR.
 
People want to stay with ESPN, even though ESPN has virtually ignored (and actually crapped on) BE football? With all of the college football media rights that ESPN has locked up, what would the BE get for time slots or stations? Wednesday or Friday nights? ESPN3? When was the last time you watched College Gameday and actually saw highlights of BE football games? In other words, how can BE football improve when your media partner ignores or craps on you?

Remember when BE basketball went to ESPN (as a pioneer), people said you needed to be on the major networks. Remember that? In Boston, the most popular sports channels today are NESN and ComcastSportsNet, not ESPN. Why? They have most of the Red Sox, Bruins, and Celtics games. The first rule of media investing: Content is king!

As for the NBC sports channels, people need to get a grip. Wouldn't you want BE football games on NBC, still a major network? NBCSP is way better than ESPN3, Wednesday and Friday night games on ESPN2, BE Game of the Week,... By the way, Comcast owns and runs NBC now (for only 18 months), not GE. GE was a horrible parent for NBC and NBC sports. I remember GE's CEO Jeff Immelt infamously saying that they would not pay up for NFL football and lost it to Fox. GE had to crawl back to the NFL for content and has only been able to get scraps. For those that aren't golf fans, Comcast owns Golf Channel, which is one of the best sports channels out there. When ABC or ESPN does golf, golf fans cringe as the coverage is horrible, even for major events. When Comcast ran Versus and had NHL hockey, they had no other sports channels, so the NHL was lost.
 
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whaler11 said:
Combining a bunch of responses:

A. Its a huge gamble that NBCS is relevant. NBC is a horribly run network from top to bottom. Maybe they will slay an absolute giant by slinging rocks at it, but let's not pretend there is no risk.

B. The SEC and ESPN deal is hardly the CBS scraps. It's huge money and ESPN has a vested interest in the league.

C. I'd completely lose it if UConn signed a GOR. I can't see any way that Louisville or Rutgers would sign anyway. If 14 million from NBC requires a GOR forget it.

D. If you can't see a negative impact on BE basketball I guess I can't help. The average casual fan watches what's on ESPN and thinks what the Wilbon's and Mike and Mike's tell them to think. The impact to recruiting would be almost immediate. Kids want to be on ESPN and have their highlights on Sportscenter. The NHL knows full well what happens when they decide to
ignore you.
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Big East Basketball is destination television. Being on NBC won't hurt us in the least. Cross promotion on the network will be a net plus in brand recognition for us particularly for football. The Big East wasn't well promoted on ESPN. That's not going to change on that network. They are too invested in it.

I love that the #whineharder crowd was certain that we'd never approach this type of money. As that notion is being debunked, the new whine is well we will be come irrelevant by being apart of the premier product of a broadcast network who is determined to invest and promote college sports.

There's a reason why ESPN has worked so hard to kill the Big East before they could partner with NBC. Things are about change. Back at the formation of the Big East, I'm sure that people complained that it was getting promoted on a cable network instead of broadcast, but riding the wave of that change was good for the ESPN and for the Big East. UConn parlayed the visability we gained into its status as a national basketball power. We are about to see another shift in this industry. UConn is positioned to parlay this new national exposure to build our football brand. Until that happens, people will complain every step of the way. Change can be scary but those who look at it as an opportunity profit from it. I suspect that Manual and Herbst are taking this long term view.
 
UConnJim said:
People want to stay with ESPN, even though ESPN has virtually ignored (and actually crapped on) BE football? With all of the college football media rights that ESPN has locked up, what would the BE get for time slots or stations? Wednesday or Friday nights? ESPN3? When was the last time you watched College Gameday and actually saw highlights of BE football games? In other words, how can BE football improve when your media partner ignores or craps on you?

Remember when BE basketball went to ESPN (as a pioneer), people said you needed to be on the major networks. Remember that? In Boston, the most popular sports channels today are NESN and ComcastSportsNet, not ESPN. Why? They have most of the Red Sox, Bruins, and Celtics games. The first rule of media investing: Content is king!

As for the NBC sports channels, people need to get a grip. Wouldn't you want BE football games on NBC, still a major network? NBCSP is way better than ESPN3, Wednesday and Friday night games on ESPN2, BE Game of the Week,... By the way, Comcast owns and runs NBC now (for only 18 months), not GE. GE was a horrible parent for NBC and NBC sports. I remember GE's CEO Jeff Immelt infamously saying that they would not pay up for NFL football and lost it to Fox. GE had to crawl back to the NFL for content and has only been able to get scraps. For those that aren't golf fans, Comcast owns Golf Channel, which is one of the best sports channels out there. When ABC or ESPN does golf, golf fans cringe as the coverage is horrible, even for major events. When Comcast ran Versus and had NHL hockey, they had no other sports channels, so the NHL was lost.
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Exactly.
 
Whaler may have a point when it comes to promotion in football, as perception has a lot more weight in the sport than results. But I don't think that promotion is nearly as important in basketball. A lot more games, a lot more cross over in out of conference play and a real tournament.
 
The other aspect of this is that the $14 mn may not include Tier 3 rights. As a premier brand those rights could be big for UConn. The ACC's $17 mn and some of the other conferences' $20 mn+ do include Tier 3. With SNY, if UConn football becomes a big regional draw as a ranked program, there could be good money here.

We'll see how real this is and the non-monetary rights are important (GoR? Tier 3?). But look, no one should be doubting it's a huge edge to be NBC's premier content instead of ESPN's bottom content. HUGE.
 
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Santini35 said:
Whaler may have a point when it comes to promotion in football, as perception has a lot more weight in the sport than results. But I don't think that promotion is nearly as important in basketball. A lot more games, a lot more cross over in out of conference play and a real tournament.
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I sorta agree with both you and him, but if ESPN is going to slot us into sh!tty time slots, and knock the league at every opportunity, while hyping up our closest competitor (ACC), even though we have outperformed them on the field, then it may be time to try and be a pioneer with NBC.

One thing is certain, the Big East needs to step on the field and have one or two teams really make noise these last two years of the BCS agreement. If fact, if we could get a year like 2006, in the Big East it would be like hitting the lottery. I am optimistic we are headed for a great year and thus a part of the equation to solving the Big East's perception problem.
 
CL82 said:
Big East Basketball is destination television. Being on NBC won't hurt us in the least. Cross promotion on the network will be a net plus in brand recognition for us particularly for football. The Big East wasn't well promoted on ESPN. That's not going to change on that network. They are too invested in it.

I love that the #whineharder crowd was certain that we'd never approach this type of money. As that notion is being debunked, the new whine is well we will be come irrelevant by being apart of the premier product of a broadcast network who is determined to invest and promote college sports.

There's a reason why ESPN has worked so hard to kill the Big East before they could partner with NBC. Things are about change. Back at the formation of the Big East, I'm sure that people complained that it was getting promoted on a cable network instead of broadcast, but riding the wave of that change was good for the ESPN and for the Big East. UConn parlayed the visability we gained into its status as a national basketball power. We are about to see another shift in this industry. UConn is positioned to parlay this new national exposure to build our football brand. Until that happens, people will complain every step of the way. Change can be scary but those who look at it as an opportunity profit from it. I suspect that Manual and Herbst are taking this long term view.
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I wouldn't act like $14 is a real number yet. It's all still speculation. I don't know if I qualify as whine harder but I predicted 12-13 million the last time we went around on this.

I am also not hell bent on staying with ESPN - I'm all for the best deal - I just recognize there is a price to pay moving away from ESPN because of the way they dominate the national discussion on sports.

If you don't want to recognize the risk in getting in bed with a new player that is fine - I guarantee you that the people who make the decision will.

You mention that ESPN tried to harm the Big East on the threat of NBC. What do you think they would do after the league moved? Stop trying to damage it? They would have no reason to pull any punches at all.

NBC may want to grow on college sports but they won't have the SEC, Big 10, Big 12, Pac 12 or ACC... can you really not agree that makes it pretty difficult.

I'm all for listening and considering NBC, but you really have to consider everything and we won't even know any real details.

Being on NBC would certainly damage Big East basketball. It's already been damaged by the loss of Syracuse, Pitt and West Virginia. There aren't a whole lot of schools left who qualify as 'destination viewing'. UConn, Louisville are the only two who qualify. Memphis could move in that direction and Georgetown, Villanova, Marquette and St John's when good will draw. The majority of the 19 schools going forward don't generate any national interest. PC, SMU, UCF, USF, DePaul, Seton Hall, Rutgers... don't exactly send people running to their TVs.
 
whaler11 said:
I wouldn't act like $14 is a real number yet. It's all still speculation. I don't know if I qualify as whine harder but I predicted 12-13 million the last time we went around on this.

I am also not hell bent on staying with ESPN - I'm all for the best deal - I just recognize there is a price to pay moving away from ESPN because of the way they dominate the national discussion on sports.

If you don't want to recognize the risk in getting in bed with a new player that is fine - I guarantee you that the people who make the decision will.

You mention that ESPN tried to harm the Big East on the threat of NBC. What do you think they would do after the league moved? Stop trying to damage it? They would have no reason to pull any punches at all.

NBC may want to grow on college sports but they won't have the SEC, Big 10, Big 12, Pac 12 or ACC... can you really not agree that makes it pretty difficult.

I'm all for listening and considering NBC, but you really have to consider everything and we won't even know any real details.

Being on NBC would certainly damage Big East basketball. It's already been damaged by the loss of Syracuse, Pitt and West Virginia. There aren't a whole lot of schools left who qualify as 'destination viewing'. UConn, Louisville are the only two who qualify. Memphis could move in that direction and Georgetown, Villanova, Marquette and St John's when good will draw. The majority of the 19 schools going forward don't generate any national interest. PC, SMU, UCF, USF, DePaul, Seton Hall, Rutgers... don't exactly send people running to their TVs.
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I don't what to tell you if you think Pitt and WVU are considered destination viewing for basketball, but Georgetown, Villanova and Notre Dame are not.

SU is the only "brand" name we lost in basketball.
 
whaler11 said:
I wouldn't act like $14 is a real number yet. It's all still speculation. I don't know if I qualify as whine harder but I predicted 12-13 million the last time we went around on this.

I am also not hell bent on staying with ESPN - I'm all for the best deal - I just recognize there is a price to pay moving away from ESPN because of the way they dominate the national discussion on sports. -today that's about to change.

If you don't want to recognize the risk in getting in bed with a new player that is fine - I guarantee you that the people who make the decision will. NBC is hardly a new partner. This isn't a start up. This is one of the premier players in the broadcast industry. They've made a huge investment in competing with ESPN. ESPN is right to be concerned.

You mention that ESPN tried to harm the Big East on the threat of NBC. What do you think they would do after the league moved? Stop trying to damage it? They would have no reason to pull any punches at all. There is no scenario when EPSN isn't going to treat us as an also ran. We can stay on ESPN and have them be the sole voice on the subject matter or go to a broadcast network that will promote us vigorously. To me that's a pretty easy choice. I'm not sure why you don't see it that way.

NBC may want to grow on college sports but they won't have the SEC, Big 10, Big 12, Pac 12 or ACC... can you really not agree that makes it pretty difficult. No they won't. What they will have is empty timeslots and the Big East package. That means we will be promoted. If they had the SEC. Big 10 Big 12, PAC 12 or the ACC we'd be competing against them for the broadcast slots. The move to NBC is more valuable to us because we will be their companion programming to Notre Dame.

I'm all for listening and considering NBC, but you really have to consider everything and we won't even know any real details. Agree. I think you place too much weight on how things are today, rather than how things will be after the deal.

Being on NBC would certainly damage Big East basketball. It's already been damaged by the loss of Syracuse, Pitt and West Virginia. There aren't a whole lot of schools left who qualify as 'destination viewing'. UConn, Louisville are the only two who qualify. I'd have to take a look at the ratings but, minimally I'd add Georgetown and Louisville to that list. Memphis could move in that direction and Georgetown, Villanova, Marquette and St John's when good will draw. The majority of the 19 schools going forward don't generate any national interest. PC, SMU, UCF, USF, DePaul, Seton Hall, Rutgers... don't exactly send people running to their TVs. SMU, UCF, DePaul were brought on because there markets. UConn being on TV there benefits our brand and allows an entry to some sweet recruiting markets.
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whaler11 said:
D. If you can't see a negative impact on BE basketball I guess I can't help. The average casual fan watches what's on ESPN and thinks what the Wilbon's and Mike and Mike's tell them to think. The impact to recruiting would be almost immediate. Kids want to be on ESPN and have their highlights on Sportscenter. The NHL knows full well what happens when they decide to
ignore you.
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Understanding this point is the prerequisite for participants in this discussion.

It's not that the BE shouldn't move to NBC, but realize the added value the ESPN brings even if the BE is not their.favorite. Win enough games and you become their favorite pretty quickly.

Sent from my MB860 using Tapatalk 2
 
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If whaler11 were right, Notre Dame football would have dropped to FCS by now, and started begging for time on ESPN.

If NBC is good enough for Notre Dame, why is it not good enough for UConn, Rutgers, Temple, Navy, UCF, USF, Houston, SMU, Louisville, Cincy, Memphis, Boise, and San Diego State?
 
whaler11 said:
There are 16 basketball schools? Aren't there 19 i honesty would need think about it but 11 all sport football members and 8 basketball only?
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Let's see.... In football as of 2015 (when Navy joins), there will be 13 football members. Navy, Boise State, and San Diego State are football-only and will not play basketball. Then there are the 8 basket-ball only schools, so there will be 18 basketball schools. So you're both wrong. Remember, Navy will be FOOTBALL ONLY.
 
SubbaBub said:
It's not that the BE shouldn't move to NBC, but realize the added value the ESPN brings even if the BE is not their.favorite. Win enough games and you become their favorite pretty quickly.

Sent from my MB860 using Tapatalk 2
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That hasn't been the case so far but I'm sure you are right. If we accept a below market deal from them, they'll suddenly respect us.:confused: You remind me of the girl who is sure that her serial phlandering boyfriend won't cheat on her again because "this time it will be different."
 
pj said:
If whaler11 were right, Notre Dame football would have dropped to FCS by now, and started begging for time on ESPN.

If NBC is good enough for Notre Dame, why is it not good enough for UConn, Rutgers, Temple, Navy, UCF, USF, Houston, SMU, Louisville, Cincy, Memphis, Boise, and San Diego State?
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Uhh...you don't see a difference in national following from Notre Dame to San Diego State football?
 
ConnHuskBask said:
Uhh...you don't see a difference in national following from Notre Dame to San Diego State football?
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That's not what at issue. What's at issue is whether NBC drags down or elevates the schools they broadcast.
 
pj said:
That's not what at issue. What's at issue is whether NBC drags down or elevates the schools they broadcast.
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Notre Dame is the biggest brand/name in college sports. They would draw big ratings even if they played on the Food Network.

It's a whole different story for small brands like San Diego State, UCF and SMU, etc. where they need the exposure and to be in the mainstream media and casual sport's fan conscious.
 
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pj said:
If whaler11 were right, Notre Dame football would have dropped to FCS by now, and started begging for time on ESPN.

If NBC is good enough for Notre Dame, why is it not good enough for UConn, Rutgers, Temple, Navy, UCF, USF, Houston, SMU, Louisville, Cincy, Memphis, Boise, and San Diego State?
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For one it's a bit different when your entire home schedule is available on broadcast NBC as opposed to cable NBC Sports and maybe a game or two over the air. Notre Dame has the second highest revenues and their play has certainly lagged behind that level. It's impossible to tease out of their results why they have been so mediocre, but they have been for a long time even with the exposure.

For NBC to actually draw viewers for Big East football, they would have to change the perception of the Big East from chicken**** to chicken salad. They would need to do this while ESPN television, ESPN radio and ESPN.com are telling the masses the exact opposite. Can it be done? Sure, but you guys pretend like there is no risk. No risk that the second the Big East moves to NBC all of a sudden Louisville is in the Big 12? How about Louisville and Cincinnati? How about Louisville and Boise State or Houston? How about Notre Dame making a pact with the ACC to play a number of football games and moving their other sports to the ACC? How about recruiting falling off in the short term if it turns out kids want to play on ESPN and be covered on Sportscenter?

NBC can potentially bring some good things to the table. Ignoring the whole picture is silly.

NBC might be the greatest thing to ever happen to the league. West Virginia, Syracuse, Pittsburgh and TCU didn't think enough of it to stick around and find out. Louisville, Connecticut and Rutgers have certainly made it clear they would walk away with another invite. If the potential of NBC is so great, why did 4 teams walk away after the rumors started and why would the remaining valuable properties do the exact same thing if invited somewhere?
 
ConnHuskBask said:
Notre Dame is the biggest brand/name in college sports. They would draw big ratings even if they played on the Food Network.

It's a whole different story for small brands like San Diego State, UCF and SMU, etc. where they need the exposure and to be in the mainstream media and casual sport's fan conscious.
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as long as NBC runs Big East games on their main network before or after ND games, I don't think there is a risk of the Big East falling off the map. If anything we'll be promoted more than we ever have.

The Big East now has more fans than ever because we now have 14 teams. We now have fans in Texas and the west coast. If we get BYU we'll probably have more fans then the ACC.
 
whaler11 said:
The NBA has been promoting the WNBA for over a decade. Not sure how this is relevant, but um, okay

Promotion does not equal success, it only equals promotion. True but promotion is greater than no promotion and it certainly greater than actively sabotaging.

NBC promotes plenty of stuff today. Some of it is successful and some (most) of it isn't. um, okay

In NBC's core function.. you know being a TV network, they are fourth out of four. um, okay. Just curious, how does NBCs total viewership compare to cable broadcasters?
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So the question remains, all things being equal, does it make more sense to go to a major network who has a mutual interest in successful college sports program or stay with a cable company who has actively tried to sabotage us at every turn. Again, not a hard question, from my perspective. It becomes somewhat easier when you consider that the one who isn't instructing other leagues to poach our teams is apparently willing to pay us substantially more money.
 
Big fish in a small pond, versus small fish in a big pond... no real right answer.
 
CL82 said:
Big East Basketball is destination television. Being on NBC won't hurt us in the least. Cross promotion on the network will be a net plus in brand recognition for us particularly for football. The Big East wasn't well promoted on ESPN. That's not going to change on that network. They are too invested in it.
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This. 1000x this. If there is anybody on this thread that believes that the likes of UConn, Ville, GTown, ND, Marquette, Nova, Cincy, Temple, Memphis, and the Johnnies are going to be marginalized in the national basketball debate, even though we are unarguably one of the top three conferences in the nation (and arguably higher), you're out of your minds. If you think they are going to be marginalized by getting some of their games on one of the "big 3" basic channels, you're REALLY out of your minds...
 
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I love the folks who think ESPN is out to destroy the Big East.

Every fan, analyst, columnist, radio host etc. outside the conference and outside of ESPN thinks it's a joke. A total joke. But yeah, it's ESPN that killed it...not the fact that these are commuter schools with minimal football histories, small stadiums, small footprints and NOTHING in common. The country should stand up and respect the greatness of Memphis-Houston. That'll surely turn NBC around! I guess the good thing is that their horrific internet video "service" won't have to worry about more than 200 people trying to watch this crap.

If NBC wants to pay the Big East $14 million, the Big East should absolutely take the money and run. But it's also the typical stupid type of buy by NBC that continues to ensure their ongoing irrelevance in the sports landscape.
 
zls44 said:
I love the folks who think ESPN is out to destroy the Big East.
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Good. It means you love me. You really love me!

http://www.thebiglead.com/index.php...expansion-and-his-school-blocked-connecticut/

It's amazing how many times people on the Boneyard have to have a story re-hashed and re-linked for them as if they don't have the ability to absorb a story for themselves the first time around.

Oh, by the way, which media outlet was the one driving home the term "Big 5 conferences" for multiple months, only to stop in the past two weeks to go back to the original term of "Big 6", surprisingly close to the period where they are to begin a 60-day exclusive negotiation with the Big East? Oh yeah, now I remember which media outlet it was...

http://insider.espn.go.com/mens-col...best-2012-13-non-big-six-conference-teams-ncb

Look, people; business is business. There are no friends when money is on the line. ESPN is looking out for ESPN. But to talk as if they have not tried to lower the value of the Big East (either to prevent other suitors, to prop up their ACC portfolio, or to lower their next bid) is just asinine, so wake up.
 
zls44 said:
I love the folks who think ESPN is out to destroy the Big East.

Every fan, analyst, columnist, radio host etc. outside the conference and outside of ESPN thinks it's a joke. A total joke. But yeah, it's ESPN that killed it...not the fact that these are commuter schools with minimal football histories, small stadiums, small footprints and NOTHING in common. The country should stand up and respect the greatness of Memphis-Houston. That'll surely turn NBC around! I guess the good thing is that their horrific internet video "service" won't have to worry about more than 200 people trying to watch this crap.

If NBC wants to pay the Big East $14 million, the Big East should absolutely take the money and run. But it's also the typical stupid type of buy by NBC that continues to ensure their ongoing irrelevance in the sports landscape.
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So...yea for us!
 
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