Sick and tired

[upstater]

Sure, on some level, but they had some good runs in them before with Wright: from 2005-2009 Villanova was in the S16 every year but 1, with 1 Final Four and another E8. In 2005 they should have beaten UNC (horrific call in the S16) and in 2006, 2008, and 2009 they lost to eventual champs (Florida, Kansas, UNC). They had a downswing, for sure, but that downswing was really only about 3 seasons (2010-2013) bracketed by underperforming 2-seeds. Even those 5 years you list included a 2 seed and a 1 seed.

I'd like to get back to that level of success, but, like you, I suspect we're more in a 2010-2013 funk rather than, to keep the analogy going, the Steve Lappas years.

Well, just like Ollie's success earlier no? The point is, you can have several down years in a row (I hope it's not several, but only 3).

That being said, last year is being called a down year when UConn won the conference tourney and beat a higher seeded Colorado in the NCAAs.

 

[tzznandrew]

Well, just like Ollie's success earlier no? The point is, you can have several down years in a row (I hope it's not several, but only 3).

That being said, last year is being called a down year when UConn won the conference tourney and beat a higher seeded Colorado in the NCAAs.

TBF, a 9 seed in the NCAAs is a down year for UConn, at least it should be. That team underperformed and probably should have been a 3-4 seed based on talent.

 

[ctchamps]

If you don't think KO is taking responsibility and is not happy then you live in another world
A game like this brings out all the KO bashers like you and the ones who like your posts
If you can't see whats going on and place it in a rational bin then theres no hope for you and your type
I've been season ticket holder since 1965 and can tell you I am not happy but I've seen worse from a few more UConn teams that were fully healthy and senior laden
This team as is are not what UConn had at the start of the season and, yes, they lost those 2 stupid games at the start, but if AG and Larrier were available, this game and a few of the others are wins
You can't pull a rabbit out of a hat
You see guards and wings do not 1 solid thing all game??? You are plain crazy
Lack of confidence comes from lack of experience and/or lack of talent

Nice write up. Confidence can be related to experience and talent. It could also be the difference between two equally talented and experienced players. Some people are just more confident than others. I'd say the same about poise and ability to handle pressure.

 

[ctchamps]

We've been saying "wait until next year" for a few years now.

And fans from most programs have been saying it their entire lives. Loved the Cubs winning it this year BTW.

Sometimes the problem is with players and coaches. But there is also a problem with fans who just don't know how to handle adversity. The cleverest amongst them pc things with their statements such as THIS IS UCONN, people should insist on excellence, there is no excuse for failure. That is they turn the subjective, the difficulty or inability to handle something going wrong, into the objective - a player, a team, coaches and/or the fans who defend them. In some cases these posters need to have something outside themselves change because they are unable to fix the discomfort within themselves.

Certainly this is not a problem for everyone who assesses things and make critiques or recommends changes which provides convenient cover for those with the type of problem I describe.

I seldom have a problem distinguishing rational critiquing from emotional outburst. On the other hand I can never be absolutely certain from a poster's negative emotional response if it is therapeutic, that is by expressing it they let it out and can move on, as opposed to the poster who struggles with adversity. But there are some posters who default to negativity, and more telling have a need to blame. I would suggest that those who do this more frequently and more adamantly than the rest of us might want to consider focusing on themselves and less on the outcomes of games, players and so on.

I would further suggest that a rational discourse with anyone responding emotionally is irrational. As is using logic with someone who is in a default emotional mode. Which of course means it's illogical that I'm posting this to you. Just kidding. Well maybe there is a little seriousness.

Nevertheless married to someone for more than forty years who is far and away more intelligent than myself and most of the people in these forums, who has elevated the emotional/rational game to an elite status (yes @August_West, the tau of wife) such that it reduces the most extreme debates in these forums to the facile, I felt like enjoying some easier pickings to start off the new year.

 

[HuskyHawk]

No. I am saying if you take two of the best players off that team plus a third, throw in the equivalent of Adam ' s injury, then we would not be worse.
I'm also thinking you probably cherry picked Perno's best BE year. For Ollie, that would be a NC. 2013 was, imho, another impressive year

That was one of his worst years. He won 20, 20 and 17 his first three years in the Big East.

 

[huskymagic]

Adams was hacked across the arm on what would have been the game winning layup. I don't normally blame the refs but it's gotten ridiculous. It was a blatant foul and the game should be over.

Here is what Adams thought of that play:
"I thought it was going in," said Adams, who, cleared to play Saturday morning, was on the floor all 45 minutes and scored 18 points. "I really didn't have it contested on that, so I think that's a shot I've got to make.

 

[QDOG5]

Going to be a long year Yarders. I suggest watching it all recorded. Much less antacid needed.

 

[BigErnMcCracken]

We've been saying "wait until next year" for a few years now.

I'm as down on this team as the next (rational) person but there have been two seasons since they won a national championship.

 

[HuskyHawk]

I'm as down on this team as the next (rational) person but there have been two seasons since they won a national championship.

I'd gladly trade our last four seasons, NC included, for what Kansas has done in the last four. Consistent excellence is what I enjoy most.

 

[Tenspro2002]

I'd gladly trade our last four seasons, NC included, for what Kansas has done in the last four. Consistent excellence is what I enjoy most.

I wouldn't go that far, but looking to the future I'd much rather be in Kansas's position than ours -- they are much more likely to win a championship in the foreseeable future than we are.

People whose fallback defense of KO is "we just won a NC 3 years ago" need to remember the adage about financial products: "past performance is no guarantee of future results".

 

[BigErnMcCracken]

I'd gladly trade our last four seasons, NC included, for what Kansas has done in the last four. Consistent excellence is what I enjoy most.

I mean, cool, I guess. The rings are nice too.

 

[ctchamps]

I'd gladly trade our last four seasons, NC included, for what Kansas has done in the last four. Consistent excellence is what I enjoy most.

It's a preference. But if you google consistent excellence Kansas doesn't appear. Google "This is what happens when you ban us" you get UConn and Bazz. Many of us will die smiling thinking about that. Might put it on my gravestone just to make people from North Carolina google it. Poetic justice. The path to win that NC is something I'd not change for a lot of things.

 

[upstater]

I'd gladly trade our last four seasons, NC included, for what Kansas has done in the last four. Consistent excellence is what I enjoy most.

Wow. Unreal. This is incredibly hard for me to fathom.

 

[champs99and04]

Patience is important. Look at Jay Wright, he's in the middle of a run right now that may elevate Villanova's status for good. One more NC, and he's number one ranked right now. But he had a decade of NITs and NCAA tourney experiences in the 2000-2010 period, and it didn't yield much. Then as the BE was breaking up, he had 5 years that should have had Villanova fans questioning his future.

2010–11 Villanova 21–12 9–9 T–9th NCAA First Round
2011–12 Villanova 13–19 5–13 T–13th
2012–13 Villanova 20–14 10–8 T–7th NCAA Round of 64
2013–14 Villanova 29–5 16–2 1st NCAA Round of 32
2014–15 Villanova 33–3 16–2 1st NCAA Round of 32

One losing season in 2012, and he couldn't get out of the NCAAs first weekend. They were looking like Pitt.

Then, wham!, it finally all came together.

Took 15 years.

29-5 and 33-3 should have had Villanova fans questioning his future?

 

[tzznandrew]

29-5 and 33-3 should have had Villanova fans questioning his future?

They had the two early exits as a 1 and a 2 seed. After that second loss fans and outsiders were wondering if Villanova had peaked. Most people picked them to lose early last year too, because it had become a (short term) trend. From 2005-2009 they meet or exceeded their PASE, but three times they lost as a 1 or 2 in the second round, starting in 2010, and when that happens people begin to wonder if you're Pitt.

 

[champs99and04]

They had the two early exits as a 1 and a 2 seed. After that second loss fans and outsiders were wondering if Villanova had peaked. Most people picked them to lose early last year too, because it had become a (short term) trend. From 2005-2009 they meet or exceeded their PASE, but three times they lost as a 1 or 2 in the second round, starting in 2010, and when that happens people begin to wonder if your Pitt.

It definitely had some Pitt vibes, but I never bought it for a couple reasons:

Villanova, unlike Pitt, didn't have a history of underachieving in the tournament, and in fact, often overachieved. They (should have) beat a UNC team that they had no business beating in '05, and then they beat consecutive behemoths - Duke and Pitt - on their way to the final four as a three seed in 2009. I've probably talked about this with you before, but Nova actually had some terrible luck. They lost to the eventual national champ in '05, '06, '09, and '14. N.C. State in 2015 was the only true WTF loss.

Plus, I think if you asked Pitt fans now, they'd sign up for a return to the glory years of early Dixon flame-outs compared to what they've had lately. There is a luck component involved.

 

[tzznandrew]

I've probably talked about this with you before, but Nova actually had some terrible luck. They lost to the eventual national champ in '05, '06, '09, and '14.

I didn't add our heros, but definitely pointed it out above. It's a great point, and I'm actual in complete agreement with you.

Sure, on some level, but they had some good runs in them before with Wright: from 2005-2009 Villanova was in the S16 every year but 1, with 1 Final Four and another E8. In 2005 they should have beaten UNC (horrific call in the S16) and in 2006, 2008, and 2009 they lost to eventual champs (Florida, Kansas, UNC).

 

[whaler11]

They had the two early exits as a 1 and a 2 seed. After that second loss fans and outsiders were wondering if Villanova had peaked. Most people picked them to lose early last year too, because it had become a (short term) trend. From 2005-2009 they meet or exceeded their PASE, but three times they lost as a 1 or 2 in the second round, starting in 2010, and when that happens people begin to wonder if your Pitt.

Nova was out of gas that second big seed. I feel like I was at the noon 1-8 game they dumped to PC in the BET.

 

[David 76]

That was one of his worst years. He won 20, 20 and 17 his first three years in the Big East.

They never got invited to the NCAA tourney while he coached in the Big East. Perno's teams would win 3,4,5 games in the BE (out of 16). The rest were mostly cupcakes.
Sorry. Nice guy but not a good coach.
One tournament in nine years (via the ECAC). I sure everyone would defend Ollie if he did that.

 

[upstater]

I didn't add our heros, but definitely pointed it out above. It's a great point, and I'm actual in complete agreement with you.

This kinda also mimics what happened to Calhoun. Losses to UNC, UCLA, Duke, Maryland. UConn also ran into hot teams over the years.

 

[whaler11]

This kinda also mimics what happened to Calhoun. Losses to UNC, UCLA, Duke, Maryland. UConn also ran into hot teams over the years.

With bad locations including Texas.

 

[HuskyHawk]

I mean, cool, I guess. The rings are nice too.

It's an old debate. I love the tournament. I used to love the league tournament. Any year we aren't in the NCAAs is almost equally miserable for me to offset the joy from winning it all. Two years out would be. I consider winning a title only marginally better than getting to a final four...it's the journey I enjoy most, more than the ultimate result.

 

[HuskyHawk]

They never got invited to the NCAA tourney while he coached in the Big East. Perno's teams would win 3,4,5 games in the BE (out of 16). The rest were mostly cupcakes.
Sorry. Nice guy but not a good coach.
One tournament in nine years (via the ECAC). I sure everyone would defend Ollie if he did that.

How many teams made the NCAA tournament in those days? Both the 79-80 and 80-81 teams would have been tournament teams in a 64 team field.
Dom Perno Coaching Record | College Basketball at Sports-Reference.com

In any event, the teams from 78-81 would clobber this team.

 

[upstater]

29-5 and 33-3 should have had Villanova fans questioning his future?

In retrospect, those 2 years were better than winning a national championship and then sucking the year after one.

 

[ctchamps]

29-5 and 33-3 should have had Villanova fans questioning his future?

After that senior Dyson season, fans in this forum questioned JC. Some felt it was time to move on. Fans now jumping over Boeheim.

Les Miles gone from LSU.

One day you're in and the next day your out.

Too many people are addicted to winning.