Discouraging, But you Never Can Tell...

[Fishy]

There were two P5 conferences that offered the partial football. And they went to the P5 conference where they could still play in those cities that I referenced. The ACC was not the only option.

The ACC was the only option.

Notre Dame can play anyone anywhere anytime. They're Notre Dame - they don't need the help of pissants like Syracuse, Boston College or Pittsburgh to arrange a local football game.

The fact that you think otherwise is one of your more delusional efforts.

 

[huskymedic]

... and only could be chosen to play in one bowl game a year.

I should have said play in the same bowl game every year rather than saying one bowl game a year. That's what I meant.

Except "YOU" didn't say it - UPitt did.

Hmmm...

 

[btstimpy]

The ACC was the only option.

Notre Dame can play anyone anywhere anytime. They're Notre Dame - they don't need the help of pissants like Syracuse, Boston College or Pittsburgh to arrange a local football game.

The fact that you think otherwise is one of your more delusional efforts.

According to many sources Notre Dame had the exact same offer of partial football from the Big XII.

And now Notre Dame doesn't have to arrange those local games. They will happen naturally because they are playing those teams with the ACC making the arrangements.

 

[specialisthusky]

According to many sources Notre Dame had the exact same offer of partial football from the Big XII.

And now Notre Dame doesn't have to arrange those local games. They will happen naturally because they are playing those teams with the ACC making the arrangements.

Do you have a link for that?

 

[Fishy]

This cat is bat s--- crazy.

 

[Pudge]

Do you despise Notre Dame?

I personally think Notre Dame did many positive things for the Big East. They helped secure better bowls, and only could be chosen to play in one bowl game a year. They brought a competetive mens and womens bbasketball program into the conference.

I think it is far fetched to blame Notre Dame for the Big East collapse. When the power conference model changed and the Big East model no longer aligned with it, the Big East was dead in the water. What the Big East lacked most of all was not having a "blue blood" or "cornerstone" football school or two. Miami and VT were competetive programs, but they are likely middle of pack ACC schools for carrying the weight of that conference. Pitt, SU, RU, BC, and WVU were required to shoulder much of the Big East load and most would agree that they are middle to lower of the pack in their respective P5 conferences. Asking though seven schools, along with Big East new comers Ville, UC, and UConn (football) to field a product as valuable as the other major conferences was an unreasonable expectation.

notice what is left out ...

Louisville, UC and UConn quickly were at the level of Pitt and RU and BC. It was a flash of light. Field a product? We were better than Syracuse from virtually day One to the time they slimed their way out.

I don't think Pitt or BC or Syracuse are what they say they are. Swofford and gang weren't nearly as market sensitive nor great speculators as to future turns of where CFB could go. Central NY, for instance, has declining demographics and that Brand really has a vague future. This will always irk me. The selection of the ones who left for the ACC (actually until it was Louisville) posed few of the longterm viability that UConn does as a Program.

 

[UConn990411]

The ACC was the only option.

Notre Dame can play anyone anywhere anytime. They're Notre Dame - they don't need the help of pissants like Syracuse, Boston College or Pittsburgh to arrange a local football game.

The fact that you think otherwise is one of your more delusional efforts.

He's the definition of delusional.

Or, as I like to call it, an ACC fan.

 

[buckaineer]

According to many sources Notre Dame had the exact same offer of partial football from the Big XII.

And now Notre Dame doesn't have to arrange those local games. They will happen naturally because they are playing those teams with the ACC making the arrangements.

The BIG 12 never made any offer to Notre Dame. This is completely untrue--another story created by ACC types to make themselves feel better about what they did.

 

[buckaineer]

Here is what the BIG 12 commissioner reported to ESPN on Notre Dame:

excerpt:

You've already acknowledged talks between the Big 12 and Notre Dame. How would you describe how close Notre Dame was to coming to your league, vs. the ACC?

We never got to the point of any negotiations at all. We talked conceptually about it, and agreed that it was going to be very difficult for us to do anything until after our television contract was put to bed....

What would you tell fans who believe the Big 12 missed out on adding Notre Dame or an ACC power to the league?

I think our strategy is sound. I think the thinking of our presidents and athletic directors is unified, and I'm convinced that larger is not better than status quo.

http://espn.go.com/blog/big12/post/_/id/55478/part-2-big-12-commish-bob-bowlsby-qa

 

[TerryD]

Here is what the BIG 12 commissioner reported to ESPN on Notre Dame:

excerpt:

You've already acknowledged talks between the Big 12 and Notre Dame. How would you describe how close Notre Dame was to coming to your league, vs. the ACC?

We never got to the point of any negotiations at all. We talked conceptually about it, and agreed that it was going to be very difficult for us to do anything until after our television contract was put to bed....

What would you tell fans who believe the Big 12 missed out on adding Notre Dame or an ACC power to the league?

I think our strategy is sound. I think the thinking of our presidents and athletic directors is unified, and I'm convinced that larger is not better than status quo.

http://espn.go.com/blog/big12/post/_/id/55478/part-2-big-12-commish-bob-bowlsby-qa

Buck:

It is not as clear cut as you try to make it. The Big 12 was in talks with ND about partial membership, including up to six football games per year.

Deloss Dodds, Bob Bowlsby and Chuck Neinas were all caught by surprise when ND and the ACC signed their deal.

There was no formal offer, but lots of talks and Dodds, for one, thought he had ND on the hook for a potential deal.

Texas and the Big 12 certainly very much wanted ND to join that conference as a partial member.



http://www.sportsbusinessdaily.com/Daily/Issues/2012/09/13/Colleges/Big-12.aspx



News of Notre Dame's impending move to the ACC "came as a big surprise to many in the Big 12," according to Chip Brown of ORANGEBLOODS.com. Big 12 Commissioner Bob Bowlsby and former Big 12 interim Commissioner Chuck Neinas "both had conversations" with Notre Dame AD Jack Swarbrick about joining the conference, including keeping the school "in the loop about the Big 12's decision to partner with the SEC on the Champions Bowl, which will begin New Year's Night 2015." The conversations "had included Notre Dame playing up to six games against Big 12 schools." A source said, "No one is going to say it publicly, but this is a bit of a surprise and a big disappointment. We thought Notre Dame would be able to pursue its own network in the Big 12 and be a great fit here. I'm not sure what Notre Dame is going to be able to do in terms of its own network in the ACC" (ORANGEBLOODS.com, 9/12). Bowlsby said, "We never got to the point where we were talking about, ‘This is what it will cost,’ or ‘This is what our concerns are.'" He said that extended negotiations "on the Fox and ESPN TV deals also played a role" in Notre Dame not joining the Big 12. Bowlsby: "We had spent some time about how this might fit together. Everybody knew Notre Dame wanted football to stay independent. That creates rough spots, especially for us in the middle of a TV negotiation. Had the TV deal been completed months ago, it would have given us a known element" (DALLAS MORNING NEWS, 9/13). Meanwhile, Texas Men's AD DeLoss Dodds said of Notre Dame's move, "They had to do something. We wish they would have come this way, but they did what was right for them and we absolutely understand that" (WSJ.com, 9/12).

 

[whaler11]

The Big 12 would have been bat crazy to not offer the same deal the ACC did.

 

[btstimpy]

The BIG 12 never made any offer to Notre Dame. This is completely untrue--another story created by ACC types to make themselves feel better about what they did.

A story created by DeLoss Dodds of Univerity of Texas at Austin. I even had him tell the story to me. I don't know if it makes ACC types feel better, but Notre Dame chose the ACC over the Big XII when it had offers to basically have the same arrangement from both conferences. Did the Big XII formally take a vote to offer? No. The ACC closed the deal first. But if you know anything about the Big XII, if DeLoss Dodds wanted something, he was rarely told no.



Try minute 23, and he can tell this story to you too. Might even make you feel good. He also says FWIW that he wants to stay at 10 schools in the Big XII, but Louisville and BYU are who he would support for members 11 and 12.

 

[btstimpy]

Do you have a link for that?

Minute 23

 

[btstimpy]

Here is what the BIG 12 commissioner reported to ESPN on Notre Dame:

excerpt:

You've already acknowledged talks between the Big 12 and Notre Dame. How would you describe how close Notre Dame was to coming to your league, vs. the ACC?

We never got to the point of any negotiations at all. We talked conceptually about it, and agreed that it was going to be very difficult for us to do anything until after our television contract was put to bed....

What would you tell fans who believe the Big 12 missed out on adding Notre Dame or an ACC power to the league?

I think our strategy is sound. I think the thinking of our presidents and athletic directors is unified, and I'm convinced that larger is not better than status quo.

http://espn.go.com/blog/big12/post/_/id/55478/part-2-big-12-commish-bob-bowlsby-qa

What do you expect him to say? Yes we wanted Notre Dame and conceptually offered the same deal, but they chose someone else.

If he publicly admitted that, I think he'd be run out of town. He does admit the concept was discussed, and I linked for you the fact that DeLoss Dodds 'strongly' wanted it to happen. What Deloss actually got was a 4 game home and home with Notre Dame and Texas. The Big XII opportunity for Notre Dame is gone.

 

[buckaineer]

What do you expect him to say? Yes we wanted Notre Dame and conceptually offered the same deal, but they chose someone else.

If he publicly admitted that, I think he'd be run out of town. He does admit the concept was discussed, and I linked for you the fact that DeLoss Dodds 'strongly' wanted it to happen. What Deloss actually got was a 4 game home and home with Notre Dame and Texas. The Big XII opportunity for Notre Dame is gone.

Please. The BIG 12 is one of the the most successful power conferences. There has never been a need for Bowlsby to make up stories like Swofford does. The BIG 12 was never giving ND the deal the ACC did and wasn't considering it. They talked with Notre Dame and it is well documented in the news. They never made any offers. It is pretty amusing to continually see you ACC fans try and link ACC type issues of insecurity and instability to the BIG 12 though.

 

[buckaineer]

Buck:

It is not as clear cut as you try to make it. The Big 12 was in talks with ND about partial membership, including up to six football games per year.

Deloss Dodds, Bob Bowlsby and Chuck Neinas were all caught by surprise when ND and the ACC signed their deal.

There was no formal offer, but lots of talks and Dodds, for one, thought he had ND on the hook for a potential deal.

Texas and the Big 12 certainly very much wanted ND to join that conference as a partial member.



http://www.sportsbusinessdaily.com/Daily/Issues/2012/09/13/Colleges/Big-12.aspx



News of Notre Dame's impending move to the ACC "came as a big surprise to many in the Big 12," according to Chip Brown of ORANGEBLOODS.com. Big 12 Commissioner Bob Bowlsby and former Big 12 interim Commissioner Chuck Neinas "both had conversations" with Notre Dame AD Jack Swarbrick about joining the conference, including keeping the school "in the loop about the Big 12's decision to partner with the SEC on the Champions Bowl, which will begin New Year's Night 2015." The conversations "had included Notre Dame playing up to six games against Big 12 schools." A source said, "No one is going to say it publicly, but this is a bit of a surprise and a big disappointment. We thought Notre Dame would be able to pursue its own network in the Big 12 and be a great fit here. I'm not sure what Notre Dame is going to be able to do in terms of its own network in the ACC" (ORANGEBLOODS.com, 9/12). Bowlsby said, "We never got to the point where we were talking about, ‘This is what it will cost,’ or ‘This is what our concerns are.'" He said that extended negotiations "on the Fox and ESPN TV deals also played a role" in Notre Dame not joining the Big 12. Bowlsby: "We had spent some time about how this might fit together. Everybody knew Notre Dame wanted football to stay independent. That creates rough spots, especially for us in the middle of a TV negotiation. Had the TV deal been completed months ago, it would have given us a known element" (DALLAS MORNING NEWS, 9/13). Meanwhile, Texas Men's AD DeLoss Dodds said of Notre Dame's move, "They had to do something. We wish they would have come this way, but they did what was right for them and we absolutely understand that" (WSJ.com, 9/12).

The BIG 12 never made any secret of the fact they pursued Notre Dame and I never said they didn't. They were never offering ND partial membership like the ACC did and they never offered ND such membership.
Texas is one school in the BIG 12--they don't own or control the conference. Notice UL, BYU and ND are not members or partial members. The only conference with partial members is the ACC.

Sorry it offends you ACC types to not be able to accept that only the ACC offered such a deal--but those are the facts.

 

[whaler11]

What I wrote about ND is pretty clear. Your post has nothing to do with it. They PREVENTED the split. You got it totally reversed.

They did... you know what other school fought like hell against a split right?

 

[btstimpy]

Please. The BIG 12 is one of the the most successful power conferences. There has never been a need for Bowlsby to make up stories like Swofford does. The BIG 12 was never giving ND the deal the ACC did and wasn't considering it. They talked with Notre Dame and it is well documented in the news. They never made any offers. It is pretty amusing to continually see you ACC fans try and link ACC type issues of insecurity and instability to the BIG 12 though.

LOL. The Bic XII is out in the Plains States plus Texas. The ACC had 11 bowl teams in 2013 and the National Champion. To keep talking trash about the Big XII making more money than the ACC is just that TRASH. Keep talking though. Good Luck!

 

[btstimpy]

The BIG 12 never made any secret of the fact they pursued Notre Dame and I never said they didn't. They were never offering ND partial membership like the ACC did and they never offered ND such membership.
Texas is one school in the BIG 12--they don't own or control the conference. Notice UL, BYU and ND are not members or partial members. The only conference with partial members is the ACC.

Sorry it offends you ACC types to not be able to accept that only the ACC offered such a deal--but those are the facts.

The Big XII offered partial membership. The Big XII got a big old Moon. And the Big XII opportunity for Notre Dame is gone. Thank you guys very much.

 

[buckaineer]

LOL. The Bic XII is out in the Plains States plus Texas. The ACC had 11 bowl teams in 2013 and the National Champion. To keep talking trash about the Big XII making more money than the ACC is just that TRASH. Keep talking though. Good Luck!

the BIG 12 is a national conference that spreads from. Texas through the northern midwest to the Ohio Valley/Western PA/Mid Atlantic region. its one of the most succesful conferences that have existed with more top four finishes than anyone other than the SEC by far. The BIG 12 had nine of ten in bowls the previous year for a historical record. the BIG 12 was the top revenue conference last year for all media rights and will continue to keep pace with the other leagues. Consistent success and continued success. Oklahoma didn't get the chance to play but clearly could have defeated FSU as they stomped everyone's season long Number one Alabama. The last two times OU and FSU played it wasnt close- just a couple of seasons back. OU won in a landslide.

The ACC had one good year in nearly twenty after being pumped up all season by their media partner. FSU despite being good for the ACC had the lowest sos of any team in a decade after playing in the fourth lowest rated conference last year-- which was a drastic move up for the ACC. The ACC is now a conference with BC on an island, SU on an island, Pitt on an island, soon UL on an island, Miami on an island, all separated by great distances from the rest of the conference mostly located in the southeast. The SEC and Big Ten dominate the television and fanbases in the majority of ACC " territory-by a wide margin. The ACC has the lowest payouts by far of all major conferences despite getting two increases in just a short period after turning over all media rights to their tv partner, who now has a year long "feel good" blitz going for that league. ACC is the only P5 league with a lawsuit attempting to keep other schools from leaving by punishing one that is leaving.

Talk about trash- no one from the ACC should be saying anything.

 

[buckaineer]

The Big XII offered partial membership. The Big XII got a big old Moon. And the Big XII opportunity for Notre Dame is gone. Thank you guys very much.

the BIG 12 has offered two schools membership recently- TCU and WVU. Both accepted. Notre Dame was never offered by the league and only the ACC offered ND the ability to keep its independence in football, take bowl games, exposure and revenues from its league for a minor payout increase which the ACC was desperate for.

 

[billybud]

Bucky does rant on about the ACC...it is his passion.

I spent half of my life as a fan with my team playing as an independent. Haven't, after 23 years, really gotten into the conference stuff.

As long as my team can do well...and it has,

I understand Notre Dame's feelings....It is all about how their team does, not other folks.

Saying that, the ACC has been good for FSU. Three national championships since joining...Only Alabama has won more in the BCS Era (3 to FSU's 2).

The Big 12 isn't a bad league...it just, other then Texas and Oklahoma, features flyover schools and WVU stuck way out east.

WVU is a great program and should be playing in the east. Maybe the Big 12 will put together an eastern pod and that would be interesting...

I have always thought that the ACC and SEC made an error by not picking up the Eers.

 

[NickyNewark]

Bucky does rant on about the ACC...it is his passion.

I spent half of my life as a fan with my team playing as an independent. Haven't, after 23 years, really gotten into the conference stuff.

As long as my team can do well...and it has,

I understand Notre Dame's feelings....It is all about how their team does, not other folks.

Saying that, the ACC has been good for FSU. Three national championships since joining...Only Alabama has won more in the BCS Era (3 to FSU's 2).

The Big 12 isn't a bad league...it just, other then Texas and Oklahoma, features flyover schools and WVU stuck way out east.

WVU is a great program and should be playing in the east. Maybe the Big 12 will put together an eastern pod and that would be interesting...

I have always thought that the ACC and SEC made an error by not picking up the Eers.

I also was never too big on conference because the team I follow was an Indy for half or more of my life also. I also agree on WVU except I don't think the SEC is natural for them but the ACC is outside of the fact they get a bad knock as an educational dud !?! My nephew received a fine education there and had a fair to good SAT score(1370)IMO. Almost heaven.

 

[btstimpy]

the BIG 12 is a national conference that spreads from. Texas through the northern midwest to the Ohio Valley/Western PA/Mid Atlantic region. its one of the most succesful conferences that have existed with more top four finishes than anyone other than the SEC by far. The BIG 12 had nine of ten in bowls the previous year for a historical record. the BIG 12 was the top revenue conference last year for all media rights and will continue to keep pace with the other leagues. Consistent success and continued success. Oklahoma didn't get the chance to play but clearly could have defeated FSU as they stomped everyone's season long Number one Alabama. The last two times OU and FSU played it wasnt close- just a couple of seasons back. OU won in a landslide.

The ACC had one good year in nearly twenty after being pumped up all season by their media partner. FSU despite being good for the ACC had the lowest sos of any team in a decade after playing in the fourth lowest rated conference last year-- which was a drastic move up for the ACC. The ACC is now a conference with BC on an island, SU on an island, Pitt on an island, soon UL on an island, Miami on an island, all separated by great distances from the rest of the conference mostly located in the southeast. The SEC and Big Ten dominate the television and fanbases in the majority of ACC " territory-by a wide margin. The ACC has the lowest payouts by far of all major conferences despite getting two increases in just a short period after turning over all media rights to their tv partner, who now has a year long "feel good" blitz going for that league. ACC is the only P5 league with a lawsuit attempting to keep other schools from leaving by punishing one that is leaving.

Talk about trash- no one from the ACC should be saying anything.

LOL. I didn't realize that there were so many islands on the east coast. But whatever, Syracuse can do a flyover to Boston College and be fine.

ACC schools will make more money than Big XII schools in TV money in 2013-2914. It will be around $23 milion for the ACC schools while $20 million for the Big XII. And with 11 bowl schools, the BCS National Champion, and the Orange Bowl Champion, there is a rather large bowl fund on top of that. You can keep saying that the ACC is the lowest, and you can continue to be incorrect. It's up to you.

 

[buckaineer]

Buddy plays an interesting game. When he thought FSU was going to leave the conference he now pretends not to care about, he ran all over the internet preaching and ranting how great his conference was and how it was the best place for FSU, blah, blah, blah. Now, suddenly when he realizes his school has been bamboozled he never cared--LOL. I am certain many of you have read his b.s. elsewhere and know of what I speak of.

The BIG 12 is a national conference that has two major networks carrying its games coast to coast and internationally. The ACC is made up of four Carolina schools, an odd mix of tiny private schools and large public institutions spread in odd pockets around the east. There is a small pocket in Boston, a small pocket in upstate NY State, a small pocket in western PA, a giant leap to the rest of the conference, a small pocket in places like Miami and Atlanta, a portion of western South Carolina and NC and VA--much of the VA market though is the DC area where fans of many schools hail from.

I've always thought FSU was a good program. It's too bad that FSU's president kaibashed a move for them before the BIG 12 showed serious interest. Always thought it would have been good if the BIG 12 had saved FSU from its basketball centric conference dominated by UNC and Duke and filled with tiny privates that make up the weakest and lowest revenue conference of the majors.