OT: World Cup

[shizzle787]

The other reason is that we still try to push MLS on the MNT. The Big 5 leagues are much better than MLS.

 

[shizzle787]

Again. You are not looking at the whole picture.

We hired a manager who sucks at generating offense. He was fired by Hammarby for being unable to score.

Look at our record since June. As we got closer to the WC the goals dried up even further.

We left an American off the roster who is scoring goals in a decent Euro league in favor of guys like Ferreira, Morris and FOUR right backs.

Why oh why did we waste 4 slots on right backs?

I do disagree with those things. But we still need a #9.

 

[LIuconn]

What portion of Ggg being a bad coach do you not agree with? He was crap at Hammarby and .500 in MLS. His teams never scored goals

 

[jrazz12]

US Soccer hasn't yet come to face the reality that it cannot serve two masters, the MLS and actual international success.

Klinsmann told us this very clearly 12 years ago and did his best to draw the line in the sand, but was tarred and feathered for it

 

[shizzle787]

What portion of Ggg being a bad coach do you not agree with? He was crap at Hammarby and .500 in MLS. His teams never scored goals

Mispelling. I agree with a lot of what he said. Berhalter was pretty boring.

 

[HCCForever]

Looks like Germany vs Brazil circa 2014.

Brazil sure looked good today. I had planned on cutting out early to watch the second half in a soccer pub but the first half changed my mind. Have to wait until Friday for the Brazil Croatia match.

BTW that 7-1 blowout by Germany vs Brazil in 2014 still boggles my mind, especially since the host country was Brazil. I had the pleasure of visiting Brazil in 2015 and was amazed at al the people playing soccer at the beach. Like watching people in the US playing frisbee at the beach.

 

[ZooCougar]

The other reason is that we still try to push MLS on the MNT. The Big 5 leagues are much better than MLS.

It’s like you are posting from 10 years ago.

 

[SubbaBub]

They achieved what I expected with this group and coach.

I'm not buying the youth narrative. True we have a lost generation in the 26-30 age range, but pulisic & weston are 24, Adams 23. That's prime. Jude Bellingham is running England and he's 18 (sure, 1 person but it's not rare)

Average age of teams at the World Cup 2022 | Statista

Iran's squad was the oldest out of any team at the 2022 FIFA World Cup, with an average age of 28.9.

www.statista.com

We're talking 1 year of average age away from mid pack. This same roster would be the oldest in 2026 (obvi ream Morris roldan and yedlin won't be there, but for context).

We've got some guys, we need depth and someone to take on being "the man" at their club. Preferably a creative mid. We trotted out 3 defensive mids all tournament

Euro prime, SA prime. Not US prime. There are still 2026 spots for younger guys that didn't play or make the squad. I see the age breakdown as a plus and is one of the things GG got right. They met expectations though they did it the hard way. Needing a point vs England and holding off Iran until the final whistle was not how anyone would have mapped it out. Maybe avoided disappointment is more accurate given how pathetic the attack was, though the defense as weak as it was held up until they found a well-organized and disciplined Dutch side. England could have done similar, but I feel they had too many options and were a bit afraid to lose.

Absolutely need someone to be the talisman on the field and not just in social media promos. Relying on anyone on any day didn't work.

 

[SubbaBub]

Klinsmann told us this very clearly 12 years ago and did his best to draw the line in the sand, but was tarred and feathered for it

Klinsmann had no respect for what we had and the players hated him.

 

[ZooCougar]

Klinsmann had no respect for what we had and the players hated him.

Some of the players hated him. Mainly the ones that we didn’t need anymore.

He was 100% right.

 

[Kolumbo]

The real reason we didn't perform well goes back to a talent deficit vs. the top-10 nations.
The reason for this is not because we don't have talent but because in many cases that talent has parents who can't afford to send their kids to elite academies or travel teams in their youth. We have a pay for play system that values payment more than talent. By and large, upper middle class families produce the most players, but many more talented players never get a chance.

You don't see this in England, Brazil, or Germany. Money is not an obstacle there and thus the game is open to kids from even the poorest families. The talent (not money) ensures the cream of the crop rises.

Seeing this first hand. Many kids play with the town rec league, some kids pay for the local private academy, and some kids do both. You can clearly see the difference in their training and it's too bad because some of the kids who only play rec are great athletes but don't have the skilled training. The rec leagues are coached by volunteer parents who may or may not have ever played soccer, never mind having any idea how to teach the skills.

With Little League Baseball all the coaches are parents who played the game, and even if they didn't play varsity, they've watched years of baseball and know how to teach a kid to hit, throw and catch. It really is a huge difference in overall resources between baseball and soccer.

 

[HuskyHawk]

Some of the players hated him. Mainly the ones that we didn’t need anymore.

He was 100% right.

Like Bradley, king of back pass that’s so lazy it’s likely to get intercepted. Never met an offensive opportunity he couldn‘t ruin by going backwards. That was later. He was good as a young player.

I think USA lacks an offensive identity. We aren’t able to play the game like the Dutch, English or Germans do, we lack the big targets and crisp passing and organization. We don’t have the creativity Brazil has, or Spain or France. Teams packed the middle, letting us get wide, knowing our crossing game is awful. We have a roster to attack up the middle, but can’t make the quick intuitive one touch passes very often. I suppose we could try a Japan or Italy style counter game, we have some speed. But unless you have a legendary defense like Italy used to, I feel like it’s tough to go far with that. Felt like we has no cohesive approach on offense. We did all of those things at times, with no plan.

 

[HuskyHawk]

Seeing this first hand. Many kids play with the town rec league, some kids pay for the local private academy, and some kids do both. You can clearly see the difference in their training and it's too bad because some of the kids who only play rec are great athletes but don't have the skilled training. The rec leagues are coached by volunteer parents who may or may not have ever played soccer, never mind having any idea how to teach the skills.

With Little League Baseball all the coaches are parents who played the game, and even if they didn't play varsity, they've watched years of baseball and know how to teach a kid to hit, throw and catch. It really is a huge difference in overall resources between baseball and soccer.

Yeah, but is that Georgia? Growing up in Manchester, CT, we had a youth soccer program back in the 70s. Admittedly Manchester and Ridgefield dominated the state at the HS level back in my day, and I’m sure that was part of why. But now? Soccer is just as well funded in most places. I think we miss what we have with basketball, the street ball game they have in most of the world. Poor kids in urban neighborhoods are picking up a round orange ball, not a soccer ball. Kids in Brazilian favelas have nothing but futbol.

 

[ZooCougar]

Like Bradley, king of back pass that’s so lazy it’s likely to get intercepted. Never met an offensive opportunity he couldn‘t ruin by going backwards. That was later. He was good as a young player.

I think USA lacks an offensive identity. We aren’t able to play the game like the Dutch, English or Germans do, we lack the big targets and crisp passing and organization. We don’t have the creativity Brazil has, or Spain or France. Teams packed the middle, letting us get wide, knowing our crossing game is awful. We have a roster to attack up the middle, but can’t make the quick intuitive one touch passes very often. I suppose we could try a Japan or Italy style counter game, we have some speed. But unless you have a legendary defense like Italy used to, I feel like it’s tough to go far with that. Felt like we has no cohesive approach on offense. We did all of those things at times, with no plan.

Jurgen would have been better as a GM. He’s an idea guy and I liked his ideas. Once his players started to age out he tried to find the next group but those guys either didn’t pan out or they weren’t ready.

Unfortunately his ideas weren’t aligned with MLS and Soccer United Marketing which is the same thing as MLS. So they blackballed him.

He wanted to create an American soccer identity and a style of play that reflected who we were. Direct play, imposing our will on the opponents. If he had this cycle’s pool I think he would have been more successful at implementing this than Gregg.

In the last World Cup with him Graham freaking Zusi assisted twice! Even Julian Green scored a goal. Our best striker pulled a hammy and we still scored.

Being a German, he’s very blunt and doesn’t hold back. People thought that was rude but he was just being direct.

 

[Kolumbo]

Yeah, but is that Georgia? Growing up in Manchester, CT, we had a youth soccer program back in the 70s. Admittedly Manchester and Ridgefield dominated the state at the HS level back in my day, and I’m sure that was part of why. But now? Soccer is just as well funded in most places. I think we miss what we have with basketball, the street ball game they have in most of the world. Poor kids in urban neighborhoods are picking up a round orange ball, not a soccer ball. Kids in Brazilian favelas have nothing but futbol.

No, Central Connecticut. This town has a history of winning state titles. And it wins because many of the kids are well trained from an early age. But still a majority of the kids don't sign up for the private premier travel teams and they don't get the training. I'm pretty sure that's why Fairfield County always has great teams too. $$$.

I watched them play Weaver a couple of years ago and you couldn't even call it a game, the skill level was so different. Crazy that Hartford and its neighbor West Hartford are worlds apart when it comes to soccer.

 

[August_West]

What portion of Ggg being a bad coach do you not agree with? He was crap at Hammarby and .500 in MLS. His teams never scored goals

That all may be true, but casual fan me watched a bunch of US players in four games that were afraid of every opportunity they had every game. Bad crosses and horrible hits in the box. Embarrassing.

 

[LIuconn]

Being a German, he’s very blunt and doesn’t hold back. People thought that was rude but he was just being direct

I used to work with Germans. Shockingly direct at first but quickly learned to prefer it

 

[HCCForever]

No, Central Connecticut. This town has a history of winning state titles. And it wins because many of the kids are well trained from an early age. But still a majority of the kids don't sign up for the private premier travel teams and they don't get the training. I'm pretty sure that's why Fairfield County always has great teams too. $$$.

I watched them play Weaver a couple of years ago and you couldn't even call it a game, the skill level was so different. Crazy that Hartford and its neighbor West Hartford are worlds apart when it comes to soccer.

That is crazy. I looked up the CT state high school champions and noticed that teams like West Hartford, Glastonbury, Farmington, Rocky Hill and Wethersfield won frequently. Both Bulkeley and Hartford High won state championships in the 70s but haven't won since.

I am a contemporary of the Motta's (John and Ricky) who helped Bulkeley achieve success in the mid 70s and went on to play at the University of Hartford. Back in those days, Italian Americans lived in the South End of Hartford and played all the time at Colts and Goodwin Park to name a few parks.

https://www.casciac.org/pdfs/champions_boyssoccer.pdf

 

[ColchVEGAS]

That is crazy. I looked up the CT state high school champions and noticed that teams like West Hartford, Glastonbury, Farmington, Rocky Hill and Wethersfield won frequently. Both Bulkeley and Hartford High won state championships in the 70s but haven't won since.

I am a contemporary of the Motta's (John and Ricky) who helped Bulkeley achieve success in the mid 70s and went on to play at the University of Hartford. Back in those days, Italian Americans lived in the South End of Hartford and played all the time at Colts and Goodwin Park to name a few parks.

https://www.casciac.org/pdfs/champions_boyssoccer.pdf

A lot of those European groups left Hartford for surrounding areas and have been replaced by those of Hispanic and Caribbean descent. The sport of focus in that area has mainly shifted to basketball.

 

[HuskyHawk]

Jurgen would have been better as a GM. He’s an idea guy and I liked his ideas. Once his players started to age out he tried to find the next group but those guys either didn’t pan out or they weren’t ready.

Unfortunately his ideas weren’t aligned with MLS and Soccer United Marketing which is the same thing as MLS. So they blackballed him.

He wanted to create an American soccer identity and a style of play that reflected who we were. Direct play, imposing our will on the opponents. If he had this cycle’s pool I think he would have been more successful at implementing this than Gregg.

In the last World Cup with him Graham freaking Zusi assisted twice! Even Julian Green scored a goal. Our best striker pulled a hammy and we still scored.

Being a German, he’s very blunt and doesn’t hold back. People thought that was rude but he was just being direct.

My former boss was German (lived in Brussels, worked in Luxembourg). It was during the Klinsmann era here and we used to talk about it. Boss's name was Juergen of course. That identity is exactly what we need. We've got guys who like many different styles and we aren't cohesive. I still work with several Germans all the time, had a call with one yesterday, they are indeed pretty direct.

Side story, when in Sao Paulo, Brazil for work with my German boss, he would buy art. But he had our driver (you had to have a driver there) negotiate the prices, because Germans don't negotiate for things. Cars and houses both get sold or don't sell, at the asking price. Just like buying stuff at Target. We always had to do the tips for him on dinners in the U.S. He loved Brazil, probably because it was so different.

We need somebody with a vision, who can get all these guys on the same page. I suggest we not try to play a Barcelona style possession game. At times it seemed like Gregg was going for that, and I think we left a lot of offensive chances on the pitch as a result, and lacked the skill needed. They need to get this one right.

 

[storrsroars]

For folks who find futbol boring, Spain v Morocco is exhibit A of sleep-inducement.

 

[ZooCougar]

For folks who find futbol boring, Spain v Morocco is exhibit A of sleep-inducement.

I’m not watching. Is Spain doing their tiki taka short passing crap?

 

[ZooCougar]

My former boss was German (lived in Brussels, worked in Luxembourg). It was during the Klinsmann era here and we used to talk about it. Boss's name was Juergen of course. That identity is exactly what we need. We've got guys who like many different styles and we aren't cohesive. I still work with several Germans all the time, had a call with one yesterday, they are indeed pretty direct.

Side story, when in Sao Paulo, Brazil for work with my German boss, he would buy art. But he had our driver (you had to have a driver there) negotiate the prices, because Germans don't negotiate for things. Cars and houses both get sold or don't sell, at the asking price. Just like buying stuff at Target. We always had to do the tips for him on dinners in the U.S. He loved Brazil, probably because it was so different.

We need somebody with a vision, who can get all these guys on the same page. I suggest we not try to play a Barcelona style possession game. At times it seemed like Gregg was going for that, and I think we left a lot of offensive chances on the pitch as a result, and lacked the skill needed. They need to get this one right.

It seems like they were going for the Barcelona style. But to me that’s like fighting the last war.

I’d rather have a more direct approach. In this WC we held the ball a bunch and it never amounted to much.

Whenever you asked Greggggggg to explain the US philosophy it came out as over complicated gobbledegook.

If you can’t explain it in two or three sentences it’s probably not good. He also gave guys “homework”.

 

[storrsroars]

I’m not watching. Is Spain doing their tiki taka short passing crap?

Yes, indeed they have been. Doing the hoops equivalent of a weave near half court every possession.

To be fair, Spain is getting a little more aggressive in 1st OT.

edit: Morocco just blew a great chance at a goal, so Spain will probably go back in its shell

 

[HuskyHawk]

Yes, indeed they have been. Doing the hoops equivalent of a weave near half court every possession.

To be fair, Spain is getting a little more aggressive in 1st OT.

edit: Morocco just blew a great chance at a goal, so Spain will probably go back in its shell

Spain just missed two good chances. Hit the post with the second.