Will Hartford Athletic ever win a game?

[Waquoit]

You don’t think they should cover the gray concrete circling the field? High school basketball padding would have made it look 500% better.

I guess. But again, so what? They would be spending extra money in a temporary home for how big an audience? ESPN+ and My9 viewers. And how many of those care about it? I think Athletic has done so many things right I can't be bothered with "you missed a spot over there" level stuff.

 

[Pudge]

Reading a little and thinking relegation and competition ... the US is developing into a hybrid of OUR Professional history (soon all franchises in MLS will be owned individually by solid deep pockets; then the USL starts to come around) and the Premier League models.


"... similar to EFL, the second tier USL will now be called the USL Championship, its third tier offering -- set to begin play in 2019 -- will be named USL League One, while the amateur Premier Development League will be renamed USL League Two. All three leagues will be contained under the USL organization.

"The USL has spent the past eight years transforming our league to meet the evolving needs of our team owners, players, coaches, fans and partners," said USL CEO Alec Papadakis via a prepared statement."


So ... you have this monstrosity of EXPAND manifest destiny in MLS which is a money grab. Then. Hartford and others (including affiliated teams for MLS) build their base, get financially stronger, FANS ... etc. I just found out that the project I have been kinda working in Baltimore - Westport - is targeted for a USL stadium. Hard to see - down the line - that they will keep Baltimore out of the Hartford level of leagues, considering the size of the GDP is #19 in the US Metropolitan rank.

Maybe this will work into something great. IF ... you do well at the USL level, MLS gives you the capacity to jump. The stadium in Baltimore discussion is modest (but exciting location); that could be the groundwork for something in the future.

 

[ZooCougar]

Reading a little and thinking relegation and competition ... the US is developing into a hybrid of OUR Professional history (soon all franchises in MLS will be owned individually by solid deep pockets; then the USL starts to come around) and the Premier League models.


"... similar to EFL, the second tier USL will now be called the USL Championship, its third tier offering -- set to begin play in 2019 -- will be named USL League One, while the amateur Premier Development League will be renamed USL League Two. All three leagues will be contained under the USL organization.

"The USL has spent the past eight years transforming our league to meet the evolving needs of our team owners, players, coaches, fans and partners," said USL CEO Alec Papadakis via a prepared statement."


So ... you have this monstrosity of EXPAND manifest destiny in MLS which is a money grab. Then. Hartford and others (including affiliated teams for MLS) build their base, get financially stronger, FANS ... etc. I just found out that the project I have been kinda working in Baltimore - Westport - is targeted for a USL stadium. Hard to see - down the line - that they will keep Baltimore out of the Hartford level of leagues, considering the size of the GDP is #19 in the US Metropolitan rank.

Maybe this will work into something great. IF ... you do well at the USL level, MLS gives you the capacity to jump. The stadium in Baltimore discussion is modest (but exciting location); that could be the groundwork for something in the future.

The owners don’t own their teams in MLS. The league owns the teams and the investors are actually investor/operators.

It’s a big structural design flaw that started out as training wheels to keep it from collapsing like the NASL did in the ‘80s.

I could see the MLS split in two and then have pro/rel between those two divisions.

 

[Waquoit]

It’s a big structural design flaw that started out as training wheels to keep it from collapsing like the NASL did in the ‘80s.

To keep it from paying players too much, you mean.

 

[Pudge]

Capitalism 101

I agree that the "structural flaw" is obvious. But, the hands that reached out and grabbed franchises to create something ... aren't going to be satisfied with brownie points and cheers. At some point, stress will develop amongst the deep pockets and there will be a push for greater returns.

Then. The USL is interesting in that I just read the Reno franchise is owned by the Simon mall development family (which owns the Indiana Pacers); the San Antonio Spurs family (ClearChannel) owns one; etc.

Whatever. The 'training wheels' ain't gonna hold back a bunch of these hard drivers.

Seems like only yesterday that I attended a Rochester Rhinos game and they were a hot name nationally; the OWNERSHIP puked. And, my lesson from that is everything about MLS is a new ballgame. May not satisfy the soccer knowing cult in the pews; however, all is good in our land as this is gradually developing. Happy that Hartford has a foot in the door.

 

[Da_Aisijimo_Gou]

I could see the MLS split in two and then have pro/rel between those two divisions.

Based on MLS corp structure and massive investment requirements, we likely both agree chances of MLS relegation are dubious. Barring highly unexpected changes, relegation chances are neglible at best. It is what it is ...

On a somewhat related topic, watching yesterday’s riveting Southend United League One relegation-saving comeback defeat of Sunderland was good fun. Leading by a goal, tied by SUN and going down, go ahead goal, and the Shrimpers hanging on barely for dear League One life ...

Stephen Humphrys strike saves Southend United as Sunderland fear League One playoff flop

 

[whaler11]

I guess. But again, so what? They would be spending extra money in a temporary home for how big an audience? ESPN+ and My9 viewers. And how many of those care about it? I think Athletic has done so many things right I can't be bothered with "you missed a spot over there" level stuff.

They seem to be off to a decent start. I don’t see how you can look at that and not be completely distracted by how bad that looks.

The over the air games are going to end up with some viewers - the stained cement is a total turnoff. Seems like a pretty easy and inexpensive fix.

AA baseball is popular 15 miles down the road because it’s a prettier place to see a game.

 

[Waquoit]

AA baseball is popular 15 miles down the road because it’s a prettier place to see a game.

I'm worried about you. This comment is Jobber-esq talking about the broken windows. Plus you are way off on the mileage, you know they are not nearly that far apart. And it's not even a good example. They drew twice the Yard Goats average attendance. When I was leaving, I heard nothing but positive comments like "That was fun". Not one person said, "I'm not coming back until do something about the cement."

 

[whaler11]

I'm worried about you. This comment is Jobber-esq talking about the broken windows. Plus you are way off on the mileage, you know they are not nearly that far apart. And it's not even a good example. They drew twice the Yard Goats average attendance. When I was leaving, I heard nothing but positive comments like "That was fun". Not one person said, "I'm not coming back until do something about the cement."

I’m pretty sure you can do better.

1. The cement issue is a ‘TV’ issue. You should be a better supporter and demand simple fixes.

2. An announced 11k is a decent opening night. Are you willing to bet 4k are there in three weeks?

3. Do you not realize that the Yard Goats outdraw the Rock Cats because of the stadium? Do you not remember when the Rock Cats drew big crowds to the new stadium?

 

[ZooCougar]

To keep it from paying players too much, you mean.

It’s about preventing competition and suppressing the cost of labor. It’s biting them in the butt as the best young American talent goes to Europe almost always now.

Meanwhile college soccer has dried up.

 

[TheDoggPound]

I’m pretty sure you can do better.

1. The cement issue is a ‘TV’ issue. You should be a better supporter and demand simple fixes.

2. An announced 11k is a decent opening night. Are you willing to bet 4k are there in three weeks?

3. Do you not realize that the Yard Goats outdraw the Rock Cats because of the stadium? Do you not remember when the Rock Cats drew big crowds to the new stadium?

Your takes are horrible.. how about get off the messageboard for 5 minutes and actually do something instead of moan and groan like an entitled little brat

 

[whaler11]

Your takes are horrible.. how about get off the messageboard for 5 minutes and actually do something instead of moan and groan like an entitled little brat

good argument champ. uconn loves losers like you

 

[Waquoit]

I’m pretty sure you can do better.

1. The cement issue is a ‘TV’ issue. You should be a better supporter and demand simple fixes.

2. An announced 11k is a decent opening night. Are you willing to bet 4k are there in three weeks?

3. Do you not realize that the Yard Goats outdraw the Rock Cats because of the stadium? Do you not remember when the Rock Cats drew big crowds to the new stadium?

1. There is no "cement issue". It's all in your head.
2. You maybe right, but it will have nothing to do with your "cement issue".
3. Do you not realize that they will be playing in a brand-new stadium soon that will look great on TV. And that your cement issue will be forgotten. And that you will then find another ridiculous nit to pick.

You must be trolling with this, I feel silly playing along.

 

[whaler11]

1. There is no "cement issue". It's all in your head.
2. You maybe right, but it will have nothing to do with your "cement issue".
3. Do you not realize that they will be playing in a brand-new stadium soon that will look great on TV. And that your cement issue will be forgotten. And that you will then find another ridiculous nit to pick.

You must be trolling with this, I feel silly playing along.

lol hopefully someone at hartford athletic actually gives a crap about how they are presented.

your teams would be better served if someone involved actually had some pride.

 

[ZooCougar]

Capitalism 101

I agree that the "structural flaw" is obvious. But, the hands that reached out and grabbed franchises to create something ... aren't going to be satisfied with brownie points and cheers. At some point, stress will develop amongst the deep pockets and there will be a push for greater returns.

Then. The USL is interesting in that I just read the Reno franchise is owned by the Simon mall development family (which owns the Indiana Pacers); the San Antonio Spurs family (ClearChannel) owns one; etc.

Whatever. The 'training wheels' ain't gonna hold back a bunch of these hard drivers.

Seems like only yesterday that I attended a Rochester Rhinos game and they were a hot name nationally; the OWNERSHIP puked. And, my lesson from that is everything about MLS is a new ballgame. May not satisfy the soccer knowing cult in the pews; however, all is good in our land as this is gradually developing. Happy that Hartford has a foot in the door.

I wish I shared your optimism.

For every Atlanta United you have two Colorado Rapids and New England Revolution. MLS still doesn’t have a good ratings or big media revenue. Once expansion is done? Where is the big money going to come from. There is no interest nationally in any MLS match up.

It’s not even the third most popular league in the United States.

You need Pro/Rel to drive sustained investment in the lower divisions.

 

[kibblesnbits]

lol hopefully someone at hartford athletic actually gives a crap about how they are presented.

your teams would be better served if someone involved actually had some pride.

This has to be one of the most inane arguments I’ve ever heard. 1) No one but you cares (ahem, has pride) about this massive problem. 2) It’s not a trivial fix or expense to print hundreds of yards of covering for the concrete facing - which makes no sense for a short-term home for a minor league (2nd Division) team. 3) For all your raving about the Yard Goats, remember that they couldn’t even come up with a temporary home for more than a handful of games. For those they did play in Norwich I’m sure you expected them to show some pride in enhancing the stadium. Imagine the indignity of playing in a stadium with NY-Penn team logos. 4) In a few years after the glow wears off will be the real test for both the YGs and HA. The Bridgeport Bluefish drew capacity crowds their first few seasons too. In the EL franchises like Bowie and Akron used to be big draws but bring in mediocre to small crowds these days. When attendance declines for the YG I’m sure you’ll have plenty of additional opportunities to display your incredible business acumen.

P.S. I went by Dillon today and it is looking very nice. Add in some brightly colored tents for VIPs, supporters and the beer garden and it will be a fine place to watch a game. It won’t have all the amenities of DD Park, but it also cost about 20% as much. If the team improves and plays well at home, I can see it providing a nice, intimate setting for a 2nd Division team with solid 2nd Division crowds.

 

[whaler11]

This has to be one of the most inane arguments I’ve ever heard. 1) No one but you cares (ahem, has pride) about this massive problem. 2) It’s not a trivial fix or expense to print hundreds of yards of covering for the concrete facing - which makes no sense for a short-term home for a minor league (2nd Division) team. 3) For all your raving about the Yard Goats, remember that they couldn’t even come up with a temporary home for more than a handful of games. For those they did play in Norwich I’m sure you expected them to show some pride in enhancing the stadium. Imagine the indignity of playing in a stadium with NY-Penn team logos. 4) In a few years after the glow wears off will be the real test for both the YGs and HA. The Bridgeport Bluefish drew capacity crowds their first few seasons too. In the EL franchises like Bowie and Akron used to be big draws but bring in mediocre to small crowds these days. When attendance declines for the YG I’m sure you’ll have plenty of additional opportunities to display your incredible business acumen.

P.S. I went by Dillon today and it is looking very nice. Add in some brightly colored tents for VIPs, supporters and the beer garden and it will be a fine place to watch a game. It won’t have all the amenities of DD Park, but it also cost about 20% as much. If the team improves and plays well at home, I can see it providing a nice, intimate setting for a 2nd Division team with solid 2nd Division crowds.

lol

 

[Rentschler9]

Are all whalers fans this petulant?

Rentschler was fun last night. Crowd was into it. Someone mentioned HA sold out of scarves, which is a good problem to have. An independent pro team in Hartford is something that has been missing for far too long.

 

[Pudge]

Through the magic of Instagram, I get clips after clips of Yankee stadium games.

I mention this because my friend Mario, who sends them as he moves down late in games, shows me nothing but concrete. Like the stands are empty late. Some of these games were rainy. Some were obviously over early.

You got to get past the “Look”. Games. I can always find something interesting when I’m there live & in person. Complaining about the unused upper deck (etc) is way too much thought about trivial stuff

 

[Pudge]

I wish I shared your optimism.

For every Atlanta United you have two Colorado Rapids and New England Revolution. MLS still doesn’t have a good ratings or big media revenue. Once expansion is done? Where is the big money going to come from. There is no interest nationally in any MLS match up.

It’s not even the third most popular league in the United States.

You need Pro/Rel to drive sustained investment in the lower divisions.

We can find this in every sport. Embarrassingly. Like 90% of Marlin Baseball.

I’m still stuck thinking about Sunderland til I Die. You can spend & spend. But that may just be on crazy ass pursuits that drop you far lower.

 

[ZooCougar]

We can find this in every sport. Embarrassingly. Like 90% of Marlin Baseball.

I’m still stuck thinking about Sunderland til I Die. You can spend & spend. But that may just be on crazy ass pursuits that drop you far lower.

Sunderland is an example of poor leadership and management.

We’ve seen clubs get competent leaders and come back from the dead or achieve a higher ceiling like Southampton and Bournemouth.

The City of Hartford could have almost instantly vault themselves into the expansion discussion if they had approved the construction of major league caliber soccer specific stadium. Fat chance I know.

 

[Palatine]

4) In a few years after the glow wears off will be the real test for both the YGs and HA. The Bridgeport Bluefish drew capacity crowds their first few seasons too. In the EL franchises like Bowie and Akron used to be big draws but bring in mediocre to small crowds these days. When attendance declines for the YG I’m sure you’ll have plenty of additional opportunities to display your incredible business acumen.

The Yard Goats and to a lesser extend the Athletic have the advantage of being in areas where hundreds of apartments are being constructed with more on the drawing table. Close to 400 units will come on line this year within a few blocks of Dunkin Donuts Park. Another 200 units are planned behind the right field fence and another 600 after that will fill out the final development.

Near Dillon Stadium the Colt Armory has 129 units (all rented) with another 48 under construction. There are another 50+ going up next to the Arch Street Tavern. The old nail factory is now filled with rented lofts. The new Dillon will only enhance the area's prospects.

These areas are growing and improving parts of the city. The new demographics will also make the neighborhoods more attractive to visitors. This should keep he crowds respectable for a long time.

 

[Waquoit]

Are all whalers fans this petulant?

Rentschler was fun last night. Crowd was into it. Someone mentioned HA sold out of scarves, which is a good problem to have. An independent pro team in Hartford is something that has been missing for far too long.

Don’t lump whaler fans in with whaler. He’s in his own miserable world.

 

[Pudge]

The Yard Goats and to a lesser extend the Athletic have the advantage of being in areas where hundreds of apartments are being constructed with more on the drawing table. Close to 400 units will come on line this year within a few blocks of Dunkin Donuts Park. Another 200 units are planned behind the right field fence and another 600 after that will fill out the final development.

Near Dillon Stadium the Colt Armory has 129 units (all rented) with another 48 under construction. There are another 50+ going up next to the Arch Street Tavern. The old nail factory is now filled with rented lofts. The new Dillon will only enhance the area's prospects.

These areas are growing and improving parts of the city. The new demographics will also make the neighborhoods more attractive to visitors. This should keep he crowds respectable for a long time.

The hard thing ... isn't the residential. It seems NEW apartments absorb. What is hard in development is to enliven an area with well-conceived mixed use. Storrs Center - where I remember the initial origins - is a good case study. Some works/some doesn't. It is hard.

 

[whaler11]

Don’t lump whaler fans in with whaler. He’s in his own miserable world.

lol yeah i can see successful programs and franchises and have expectations for our local ones.

it’s way better to just shut up and watch someone like suzie lax burn the entire athletic program to the ground.