Will Baylor go undefeated again?

[doggydaddy]

NEVER seems overly strong for a 6'1" player unless all we are playing is definitional semantics. She primarily played small forward for the USA team. If you mean guard in the two tiered, guards and posts then sure she is a perimeter player and I actually prefer the two tiered position system myself. Is Prince ever the starter at power forward? Unlikely, but it is not real hard to envision lineups where Prince is effectively the 4 during her Baylor career.

Not sure that what a school lists a player as matters. You don't seem convinced by UConn listing Bria Hartley at 5'7". Was anyone convinced Candace Parker could really play all 5 positions because Tennessee slapped up every position designation to next to her nameon the roster?

She will be a power forward like Faris was a power forward last year. In name only.

Not sure why you use a listed height height for 3 years in comparison to how they list a player's position.

I suppose once Pope and Williams graduate this year, she could play the 4, but is she
really a power forward. I really don't think you believe that.

You mad at me Scotter? You've been on me a little lately.

 

[doggydaddy]

Prince was third on the team in rebounds, and Jefferson and Mabrey were the starting guards. Baylor lists Madden, and Hayden as guards too, you can call her what you want, Prince will play the 3 (small forward) this year.

Baylor's post players are a big question mark for the 2013/14 season. They could go with an athletic lineup and play Prince at the 4 .

It doesn't make her a power forward.

 

[Scotter]

She will be a power forward like Faris was a power forward last year. In name only.

If those are the definitions we are using then I agree in general, but not in the specific case of Faris. "Power forward" as it exists at UConn is her natural position, and the position she played in high school. She just happens to be only 5'10."

Not sure why you use a listed height height for 3 years in comparison to how they list a player's position.

I only used Bria height because you had just recently made a thread about it, but in general I don't find program positions to be all that more accurate than program heights. They're typically just as much product of some combination of what the player wants or what the SID feels like putting down.

I suppose once Pope and Williams graduate this year, she could play the 4, but is she
really a power forward. I really don't think you believe that.

In the Karl Malone classic sense obviously not, but how many of those are there playing the 4 in WCBB? As I indicated above when it comes to positions I perfectly happy to limit it to guards and posts. The 5 separate positions have some utility on the professional level, They seem to add more confusion than clarity on the college level and below, although Prince does fit fairly neatly into the small forward category. From what I've seen I don't think I would want her to do a whole lot of ball-handling on my team, but in the two tiered system she would be a guard.

You mad at me Scotter? You've been on me a little lately.

Mad? Nah. Probably just hitting on some of my pet peeves lately, one of them being absolute statements. Just now I was more just trying to understand if you really thought it was that black and white or if it was indeed just a difference in definitions. Besides who else am I going to spar with a little?

 

[msf22b]

Speaking of Stewie's fouls; I recall two sort of unnecessary reach-in types, one right after another. I had no idea that they were her only two of the tourney. Still, guarding Griner, those kind of tendencies are amplified. But I defer to your statistical exactitude, I overreacted. We'll see soon enough if there is any such tendency.

 

[easttexastrash]

It's not illogical to think Baylor will go undefeated. But, we've all seen superior teams get off on the wrong foot. In no time, it's the half and the favorite is down by 7. No worries, plenty of time left. The third quarter starts with a turnover and a couple missed shots. Down 12 as the 4th quarter begins. The star point guard throws the ball into the stands and that bench player can't seem to miss. Before you know it, the underdog is making their foul shots in the last two minutes and the game is over. This doesn't happen often, but once in 30 or so games isn't unrealistic. That's how it happens, and it's likely even if Baylor wasn't playing Uconn.

I can 100% guarantee you that Baylor will never be down at the beginning of the 4th quarter this season.

To me, Prince will only play the 3 or 2 this season because she has an excellent handle. She is a good rebounder but I am not sure that she handles contact well enough to play the 4...at least not this season with Williams, Pope and Chandler available for that position.

 

[Kibitzer]

I can 100% guarantee you that Baylor will never be down at the beginning of the 4th quarter this season.

Last time I looked, they still play two 20-minute halves in wcbb (no quarters), so that's a safe prediction.

 

[doggydaddy]

Last time I looked, they still play two 20-minute halves in wcbb (no quarters), so that's a safe prediction.

I believe that was ETT's point in his reply to a poster who said UConn was up last year going into the 4th quarter.

 

[Bestiarius]

I believe that was ETT's point in his reply to a poster who said UConn was up last year going into the 4th quarter.

There is always a 4th quarter of every game regardless of where the official breaks occur. In this case it's the last 10 minutes.

 

[triaddukefan]

I agree that UConn is the only team that can beat Baylor (Duke is not at that level) but I think fans overlook just how well Stanford defended Baylor last year.

While I will agree that Duke isnt on Baylor's level...... and Duke would be the overwhelming underdog... its not out of the realm of possibility that Duke could defeat them. It wouldnt be the biggest upset in the history of WCBB if that indeed happened. In a seven game series no... but one a one game basis..... I think we have the talent and depth to pull off the upset. A talented post who could keep Griner occupied on defense.... a great PG.... slashers....size... a deep bench... not sure if we have enough shooters... . Its too bad Duke doesnt play Baylor in the regular season... I think if a non-UCONN team wants to beat Baylor... they'd better get them in the regular season. They will be extra focused come mid March.

 

[meyers7]

-up and coming teams. Teams like Duke and UCONN

Awesome, we're an up and comer. Maybe we can sneak up on them in that Feb game.

 

[meyers7]

I can 100% guarantee you that Baylor will never be down at the beginning of the 4th quarter this season.

I'm gonna back you up 100% on that.

 

[doggydaddy]

There is always a 4th quarter of every game regardless of where the official breaks occur. In this case it's the last 10 minutes.

And October is the start of the 4th quarter of the year.

 

[doggydaddy]

While I will agree that Duke isnt on Baylor's level...... and Duke would be the overwhelming underdog... its not out of the realm of possibility that Duke could defeat them. It wouldnt be the biggest upset in the history of WCBB if that indeed happened. In a seven game series no... but one a one game basis..... I think we have the talent and depth to pull off the upset. A talented post who could keep Griner occupied on defense.... a great PG.... slashers....size... a deep bench... not sure if we have enough shooters... . Its too bad Duke doesnt play Baylor in the regular season... I think if a non-UCONN team wants to beat Baylor... they'd better get them in the regular season. They will be extra focused come mid March.

Duke is going to be really good this year.

 

[diggerfoot]

While I will agree that Duke isnt on Baylor's level...... and Duke would be the overwhelming underdog... its not out of the realm of possibility that Duke could defeat them. It wouldnt be the biggest upset in the history of WCBB if that indeed happened. In a seven game series no... but one a one game basis..... I think we have the talent and depth to pull off the upset. A talented post who could keep Griner occupied on defense.... a great PG.... slashers....size... a deep bench... not sure if we have enough shooters... . Its too bad Duke doesnt play Baylor in the regular season... I think if a non-UCONN team wants to beat Baylor... they'd better get them in the regular season. They will be extra focused come mid March.

It was Duke that beat a heavily favored Tennessee team, I believe with both Holdsclaw and Catchings (may be off on that), in the Final Four. I believe Pursue also upset them at the beginning of that year and went on to win the championship. What happened to Tennessee that year influenced me in two ways. A look at their roster and their string of championships suggested that no way was Tennessee ever supposed to lose that year, but they did. Twice. It's also the reason why I've always given GG the benefit of the doubt longer than most, though now even I have my doubts about GG.

I agree with Alex in thinking that we will beat Baylor here but might lose to them in New Orleans. However, maybe history will repeat itself. Can a team for the ages that went undefeated the year before, returning much of their roster including two superstars and the best player in the country, be upset during the regular season by the team that will replace them as champions that year, while Duke knocks them out in the Final Four? One can always hope.

 

[UConnCat]

While I will agree that Duke isnt on Baylor's level...... and Duke would be the overwhelming underdog... its not out of the realm of possibility that Duke could defeat them. It wouldnt be the biggest upset in the history of WCBB if that indeed happened. In a seven game series no... but one a one game basis..... I think we have the talent and depth to pull off the upset. A talented post who could keep Griner occupied on defense.... a great PG.... slashers....size... a deep bench... not sure if we have enough shooters... . Its too bad Duke doesnt play Baylor in the regular season... I think if a non-UCONN team wants to beat Baylor... they'd better get them in the regular season. They will be extra focused come mid March.

Ok. I really like this Duke team, btw, particularly the play of Gray, but I was disappointed in Duke's play against Stanford in the NCAAs last year. I guess we can chalk it up to youth, but I want Duke to show me that it can win games against elite teams like UConn and Baylor. I haven't seen it yet with Duke since McCallie took over.

 

[UConnCat]

Awesome, we're an up and comer. Maybe we can sneak up on them in that Feb game.

That's the ticket.

 

[Vowelguy]

It was Duke that beat a heavily favored Tennessee team, I believe with both Holdsclaw and Catchings (may be off on that), in the Final Four.

It was in the elite 8.

Semeka Randall was injured earlier that season and though back she was not close to the same player. That was huge. It also helped that Holdsclaw had a horrible shooting game.

Tenn played a very different game from Baylor. The Vols relied heavily on pressure defense; if you had experienced ball-handlers (not easy by any stretch) or TN couldn't set up its press, you could mitigate that advantage. As I said above, Baylor has much less variability -- Griner's height doesn't change on a day-to-day basis. And it's hard to miss too many uncontested shots 3 feet from the basket.

Step 1 is having a team with the interior size to not allow Griner to have a cakewalk. That alone eliminates >75% of teams.
Step 2 is a high functioning offense that can seal her off and hit shots and a defense that can keep her from getting comfortable. Only UConn has the resources to attempt that.

 

[MarieM]

im so excited for the upcoming season.. I have Uconn ending Baylors and Stanfords streak ..

 

[meyers7]

Something tells me Marie is excited.

 

[Rb335]

I like uconn's chances against Baylor in Hartford for one reason. Teams who are successful against Griner always draw her from the basket. We have more post options this year, but all can shoot the ball. Dolson from the top of the key, Stewart and Tuck have 3 point ability. Therefore, including the three just mentioned plus Hartley, KML, Faris, Doty, and Jefferson, that is 8 legit threats from downtown. That opens things for backdoors and easy points, much like what we saw from Stanford in Denver.​

 

[diggerfoot]

It was in the elite 8.

Semeka Randall was injured earlier that season and though back she was not close to the same player. That was huge. It also helped that Holdsclaw had a horrible shooting game.

Tenn played a very different game from Baylor. The Vols relied heavily on pressure defense; if you had experienced ball-handlers (not easy by any stretch) or TN couldn't set up its press, you could mitigate that advantage. As I said above, Baylor has much less variability -- Griner's height doesn't change on a day-to-day basis. And it's hard to miss too many uncontested shots 3 feet from the basket.

Step 1 is having a team with the interior size to not allow Griner to have a cakewalk. That alone eliminates >75% of teams.
Step 2 is a high functioning offense that can seal her off and hit shots and a defense that keep her from getting comfortable. Only UConn has the resources to attempt that.

Ah, Elite Eight. Thanks on that, I knew I was likely missing some detail going from memory. It goes without saying that Tennessee did not get beat by better teams that year, and that they had to contribute to their own downfall in some way. That can happen to any team, including the record setting UConn team in the first half of the Stanford championship game.

Holdsclaw had a terrible shooting night. Well, of course. If a heavy favorite loses one can assume that at least one key person had a terrible shooting night. Once again that can happen to any team. And while height doesn't change, how effectively you use that height can. Is Cambage unstoppable from 3'? Then wear her down and keep her farther out than three feet. Easier said than done, but it can and has been done, even with Griner.

You are in essence constructing the argument that Baylor is not going to be beat by a Duke if they play their A game. Agreed. Absolutely. On the other hand, if Tennessee played their A game they were not going to be beat that particular year by any other team also playing their A game. When Baylor plays their A game this year there is still the possibility they might be beat by one other particular team that plays their A game as well. Duke may be ruled out (though I'm not sure the gap between Duke and Baylor this year is as large as it was between Duke and Tennessee that year), but not the team that counts (from the Boneyard's point of view, sorry tdf).

I'll mitigate my homerism by expressing my greatest concern. UConn last year had trouble closing out tight games, including the one against Baylor. That means that, while UConn's talent level has increased for this year, that's not really the basic problem and what really needs to be improved is something more intangible. An added year's experience should help, but Baylor will be helped by that as well. We'll just have to see how the season plays out.

 

[connboy77]

Ah, Elite Eight. Thanks on that, I knew I was likely missing some detail going from memory. It goes without saying that Tennessee did not get beat by better teams that year, and that they had to contribute to their own downfall in some way. That can happen to any team, including the record setting UConn team in the first half of the Stanford championship game.

Holdsclaw had a terrible shooting night. Well, of course. If a heavy favorite loses one can assume that at least one key person had a terrible shooting night. Once again that can happen to any team. And while height doesn't change, how effectively you use that height can. Is Cambage unstoppable from 3'? Then wear her down and keep her farther out than three feet. Easier said than done, but it can and has been done, even with Griner.

You are in essence constructing the argument that Baylor is not going to be beat by a Duke if they play their A game. Agreed. Absolutely. On the other hand, if Tennessee played their A game they were not going to be beat that particular year by any other team also playing their A game. When Baylor plays their A game this year there is still the possibility they might be beat by one other particular team that plays their A game as well. Duke may be ruled out (though I'm not sure the gap between Duke and Baylor this year is as large as it was between Duke and Tennessee that year), but not the team that counts (from the Boneyard's point of view, sorry tdf).

I'll mitigate my homerism by expressing my greatest concern. UConn last year had trouble closing out tight games, including the one against Baylor. That means that, while UConn's talent level has increased for this year, that's not really the basic problem and what really needs to be improved is something more intangible. An added year's experience should help, but Baylor will be helped by that as well. We'll just have to see how the season plays out.

Last year UCONN didn't have Stewart, Tuck, and Jefferson. Something tells me if they had those three players they would not have lost any games to Notre Dame, would have in all probability beat Baylor in at least the first game in the regular season, and definitely would not have lost to St. John's.

 

[asuwish]

Geno has options, but he has to make the right moves. baylor has 2 teams I think may match up with them (uconn duke), and 5 more that should be very deep, and may give them a fight, but the most veteran team with 2 of the top say 8 players in the land (and they play the 2 most important positions pg & center) have a very good shot at undefeated again.

 

[Icebear]

im so excited for the upcoming season.. I have Uconn ending Baylors and Stanfords streak ..

I could hear this all day.

 

[triaddukefan]

Something tells me Marie is excited.