Who Will Be the 12th Big East Team?

[aburks41]

The Big East would be better off dropping a couple of schools rather than adding. DePaul has done nothing but take money since it joined. Butler really doesn’t fit. Seton Hall was a power... for about 3 years in the 1980s. Same with Georgetown though they were relevant for longer. But have essentially decided to be the Catholic Ivy. They don’t care if they win or lose as long as their faculty gets tapped for White House jobs But they couldn’t be dumped due to the fact that they bring the academic prestige every league requires. With a league of second tier commuter academic institutions saving Gtown and UConn they are needed as the league’ s Vanderbilt.

Georgetown is perhaps the biggest sleeping giant in college basketball. Once they figure out their coaching situation, they have all the resources, history, and pedigree to become Villanova 2.0

 

[HuskyBoi]

Need to stay at 11. 20 conferences games at a round robin cycle is already pushing the limit for conference games.

 

[Psolo12]

UMass, Liberty, VCU

I hope this is a joke

 

[aburks41]

I hope this is a joke

People insisting on turning the Big East into another AAC are idiots. It wasn't even exciting playing Memphis half the time, and now some "fans" would want us to play Liberty? LIBERTY?!? Come on

 

[freescooter]

I wouldn't be surprised to see Syracuse come back to their roots over the next 10 years or so, especially if the landscape changes dramatically and if they struggle to find their identity post Boeheim.

Yeah. No chance. Syracuse and BC are not giving up their spots in the ACC. Not now. Not ever. Why in gods name would they leave the top basketball conference even forgetting about football? While you can argue the big East is a power conference, on no planet is it equal to the ACC.

 

[Guapo]

(I’m part of the problem) but I can’t believe this thread is this long. Y’all must be bored.

 

[freescooter]

Georgetown is perhaps the biggest sleeping giant in college basketball. Once they figure out their coaching situation, they have all the resources, history, and pedigree to become Villanova 2.0

Maybe but I doubt it. They honestly don’t care about this any more. They are far more interested in being in the top 25 national universities than in the Tip 25 in basketball. They are effectively taking an Ivy League view of athletics while collecting a payment from the Big East. But as I said they bring a level of prestige to a conference of mostly 2nd tier academic institutions. They play the role that Vanderbilt plays in the SEC. People from St Johns and DePaul and Providence can be like the farmer who entered his mule in the Kentucky Derby. Don’t expect him to win but claim to benefit by the company.

 

[Guapo]

Maybe but I doubt it. They honestly don’t care about this any more. They are far more interested in being in the top 25 national universities than in the Tip 25 in basketball. They are effectively taking an Ivy League view of athletics while collecting a payment from the Big East. But as I said they bring a level of prestige to a conference of mostly 2nd tier academic institutions. They play the role that Vanderbilt plays in the SEC. People from St Johns and DePaul and Providence can be like the farmer who entered his mule in the Kentucky Derby. Don’t expect him to win but claim to benefit by the company.

I don’t know if that’s true. They’ve just been significantly impacted by the rise of UVA and, to a lesser extent, Virginia Tech (and, like everyone else in the Northeast, Villanova). They used to have a monopoly on the talent rich DMV, but that’s just not the case anymore.

as someone who lived in DC from for a handful of years recently, I also think one of their bigger problems is the Verizon Center. It seats like 24k for basketball, which is just far too big for a program Georgetown's size. Even when they get a “good” college basketball crowd of 12-13k, it still feels empty. Imo they should build their own facility across the Key Bridge in Rosslyn, VA.

But also keep in mind they have the number 11 recruiting class in the nation next year, including the Big East’s only 5 star.

 

[Kolumbo]

I hope this is a joke

Sort of. It's great to be playing familiar basketball schools again but this isn't a long term solution for UConn. Liberty is on an upward trajectory in all sports and it's pumping money into athletics like Jordan Belfort pumped . . . you know. The school is only 50 years old. Football finished top 20 and basketball is in first place in its conference. Adding a program from Virginia is a good move.

 

[alphasigko]

As has been noted many times, the BE needs to expand - doing so would enable a two division league, and with that, a few less BE games per season (i.e., play teams in your division twice....) and a more room for OOC games.

While no longer a factor for us, football may still drive otherwise candiate schools (big fan base, proximity, large stadium availability - such as Temple) from even considering an invite.

So in my view, I think we should strongly consider a few A-10 schools - with Dayton or UMASS my choices. Dayton (despite) their current record would be my first choice, since Dayton has a strong fan base, and since their location would be a perfect fit in a "west" BE division. UMASS would offer us a true local rival (assuming DH could still out-recruit them) -ala when they had Cal and Camby. I supporsse we could consdier URI for the same reason too - but I don't know much about the size of their fan base and basketball venue.

I would even consider BC coming back - but despite their mediocre ACC performance in both sports, I don't they would want to play independent football and the bad feelings probably still persist.

FWIW I vote for UD

 

[bendm]

The Big East would be better off dropping a couple of schools rather than adding. DePaul has done nothing but take money since it joined. Butler really doesn’t fit. Seton Hall was a power... for about 3 years in the 1980s. Same with Georgetown though they were relevant for longer. But have essentially decided to be the Catholic Ivy. They don’t care if they win or lose as long as their faculty gets tapped for White House jobs But they couldn’t be dumped due to the fact that they bring the academic prestige every league requires. With a league of second tier commuter academic institutions saving Gtown and UConn they are needed as the league’ s Vanderbilt.

so much hate for the 3rd best basketball conference in the country since it's founding. love that it drives you so crazy.

 

[HuskyDogArt]

P5 contraction is coming. It will be one of our former BE conference mates with a poor football program.

We are already in the BE, we can't join again...

Oh you meant another ex BE member with a lousy FB team...RU sure?

 

[superjohn]

so much hate for the 3rd best basketball conference in the country since it's founding. love that it drives you so crazy.

Guy is a masochist, he's been bludgeoned on this issue for years now.

 

[Griggs]

I like 11 teams. But if wanted, I would say Cincinnati. But don't see it happening because of Xavier, and their football team is on the rise and would not go independent.
So 11 is good.

 

[Ratso]

i’d keep it east..URI is not the worst choice

 

[Fishy]

As has been noted many times, the BE needs to expand - doing so would enable a two division league, and with that, a few less BE games per season (i.e., play teams in your division twice....) and a more room for OOC games.

This is dumb. Stop thinking it.

 

[Slasher]

If (and it's a big if) the Big East were to expand there's no way they go to divisions in basketball.

 

[RayIsTheGOAT]

I think 11 schools is more perfect than any situation we’ve been in in my lifetime. Why are we trying to fix something that isn’t broken whatsoever?

The only way the Big East considers expanding again is if the opportunity comes along for a really high level program that raises the profile of the whole conference long-term (see, “UConn”).

 

[Drew]

Why are some of you even entertaining the idea of letting a mid major team into a power conference? That’s just stupid and does nothing to help the big east. Sorry to break it to y’all but no one cares about Davidson, Dayton, Drake(??), or UMass..also 11 is the magic number for a round robin. Expanding to 12 is never happening and shouldn’t happen unless Cuse, Notre Dame, or Pitt want to come back (and that is never ever happening either)

I mean lets not pretend that isn't exactly what happened to create the existing version of the league.

Creighton was in the Missouri Valley before joining the league in 2013
Xavier was in the Atlantic 10 before joining the league in 2013
Butler was in the freaking Horizon League before moving to the A10 for a single year and then ultimately the Big East in 2013

Even the previous version of the Big East had added teams from mid major leagues:

Marquette joined the Big East from CUSA in 2005. Before that they were members of the Horizon league and the Great Midwest league for basically the entirety of their athletics program's history
DePaul joined the Big East from CUSA in 2005 and was a founding member of CUSA in 1995
Other teams to join in 2005 from CUSA: Louisville, Cincinnati, USF

Oh, and not to mention that most people would consider UConn's add from the American as a team moving from a mid major to a power conference.

Just over half of the existing league membership was a "mid major" as recently as 16 years ago. Athletic conference membership continuously changes and always has changed. I'm not trying to discredit the current version of the league, I'm just saying let's not act like there isn't precedent for doing exactly what I've bolded in the above. If you were going to add a team (and again it's not happening), where they currently play shouldn't even be remotely close to a deciding factor. You have to remember these are academic institutions that would be looking for peer schools and like minded institutions (i.e. Jesuits in the case of the Big East) to join together for academic research and other purposes in addition to athletic competition.

 

[Huskymagic]

The only school you add to the Big East outside the P5 is Gonzaga. It doesn't matter how far they are from the rest of the schools. Everyone else does not move the needle.

If a P5 school ever wanted to join us, you take either the Cuse and or Notre Dame. I can't see this happening, but you welcome them with open arms. Everyone else is just filler.

 

[navery12]

Oh, and not to mention that most people would consider UConn's add from the American as a team moving from a mid major to a power conference.

I can promise you nobody thinks this

 

[McLovin]

Putting aside the fact that 11 teams works perfectly for a 20 game round robin schedule, here is the issue with adding a 12th team.

What team would we add to the conference that would have a long term positive financial impact for the league (big fan base) and increase the league's competition as a whole (ability to keep a top tier coach to build a program)?

Outside of UConn, Nova and Georgetown, I don't think there are any schools in our conference who can attract a power 5 quality coach / keep a power 5 potential coach from jumping ship when things get good.

We saw it happen recently with Xavier, Butler and Marquette. This means that they need to keep replacing quality coaches with undervalued quality coaches to keep their teams & league competitive. What team do we add that wouldn't have that concern? VCU, Dayton, UMass and the likes have all proven to be stepping stone programs.

Gonzaga would be the only program from a competition stand point that would elevate the league, but that is never happening since they are so far west. Also, Mark Few may have another decade of run in him, but after that the NBE might be left holding a west coast lemon on every team's travel schedule.

Wichita State might have been a good add a few years ago with Gregg Marshall set to be a lifer there, but it looks like the league dodged a bullet with that.

 

[Drew]

I can promise you nobody thinks this

A team moves from the AAC to the Big East- did that team move from a mid major league to a power league?

 

[Drew]

Putting aside the fact that 11 teams works perfectly for a 20 game round robin schedule, here is the issue with adding a 12th team.

What team would we add to the conference that would have a long term positive financial impact for the league (big fan base) and increase the league's competition as a whole (ability to keep a top tier coach to build a program)?

Outside of UConn, Nova and Georgetown, I don't think there are any schools in our conference who can attract a power 5 quality coach / keep a power 5 potential coach from jumping ship when things get good.

We saw it happen recently with Xavier, Butler and Marquette. This means that they need to keep replacing quality coaches with undervalued quality coaches to keep their teams & league competitive. What team do we add that wouldn't have that concern? VCU, Dayton, UMass and the likes have all proven to be stepping stone programs.

Gonzaga would be the only program from a competition stand point that would elevate the league, but that is never happening since they are so far west. Also, Mark Few may have another decade of run in him, but after that the NBE might be left holding a west coast lemon on every team's travel schedule.

Wichita State might have been a good add a few years ago with Gregg Marshall set to be a lifer there, but it looks like the league dodged a bullet with that.

1. I agree with your bolded. UConn should 100% dominate this league going forward because not only are we the school with the most resources available to us but also we're one of the 3 biggest brands by far in the league. Xavier has already had to replace multiple coaches, Marquette, DePaul, Butler, etc are fine programs but we've seen guys jump ship for bigger opportunities from there. The rest of the schools have established fine programs but like... Creighton? Seton Hall? Providence? These are all incredibly small regional schools with virtually zero national appeal or brand. UConn will benefit in both the short and long term from the brand and pure size of the school compared to everyone else in the league.

2. Wichita I actually think is well positioned even post Marshall because of the Koch $$. If you're willing to outspend everyone in your league, you have a chance to be good year in and year out. Plus a die hard fanbase and great facilities. In a weird way it almost helps Marshall was forced out in the way he was rather than having him stay another 20 years and trying to replace him after that. Now with Isaac Brown there I think they'll be fine but Marshall was being paid in the top 10 of all coaches in CBB. They'll be fine long term if they're willing to keep that level of commitment up.

 

[Huskymagic]

Putting aside the fact that 11 teams works perfectly for a 20 game round robin schedule, here is the issue with adding a 12th team.

What team would we add to the conference that would have a long term positive financial impact for the league (big fan base) and increase the league's competition as a whole (ability to keep a top tier coach to build a program)?

Outside of UConn, Nova and Georgetown, I don't think there are any schools in our conference who can attract a power 5 quality coach / keep a power 5 potential coach from jumping ship when things get good.

We saw it happen recently with Xavier, Butler and Marquette. This means that they need to keep replacing quality coaches with undervalued quality coaches to keep their teams & league competitive. What team do we add that wouldn't have that concern? VCU, Dayton, UMass and the likes have all proven to be stepping stone programs.

Gonzaga would be the only program from a competition stand point that would elevate the league, but that is never happening since they are so far west. Also, Mark Few may have another decade of run in him, but after that the NBE might be left holding a west coast lemon on every team's travel schedule.

Wichita State might have been a good add a few years ago with Gregg Marshall set to be a lifer there, but it looks like the league dodged a bullet with that.

Gonzaga would be a great add. The distance is not that a big deal in the modern era. It has enough history, success, name recognition, and fan base that it adds plenty of value.

Outside of UCONN and Nova, there is no program in the Big East with a bigger national following than the Zags. It doesn't matter that they are out West. Few will be there a while, and even post-him they will be able to recruit a quality coach even more so if they have the Big East to sell.

This is is the only non P5 school that solidifies the Big East for a long time.