Whitmer puts up 3 in first half

[EdgewoodNHV]

I just think it's hilarious that anybody can look at a guy with a 0-to-10 TD-to-INT ratio and think, "That is definitely the guy."

 

[UCFBfan]

I just think it's hilarious that anybody can look at a guy with a 0-to-10 TD-to-INT ratio and think, "That is definitely the guy."

I'm not sure anyone is saying he's definitely the guy but is the alternative any better or giving us wins? I think what most are saying is that if Boyle is going to get a shot next season, what does it hurt to let him start a few games this season and see what happens. Worst thing that happens is we lose which at this point we've seemed to have mastered.

 

[EdgewoodNHV]

I'm not sure anyone is saying he's definitely the guy but is the alternative any better or giving us wins? I think what most are saying is that if Boyle is going to get a shot next season, what does it hurt to let him start a few games this season and see what happens. Worst thing that happens is we lose which at this point we've seemed to have mastered.

Worst thing is that he gets really hurt or demoralized/mentally unfit playing behind that O-line and never really recovers. There are worse things than losing football games. People act as if it's a risk-free move, and I am not sure I think it is.

I mean, I'd start him, but I don't think it's one of those 100% totally obviously right things that Palatine implies it is.

 

[Carl Spackler]

If an outsider cane in and spent a decent amount of time observing our fan base he would walk away scratching his head.

We had a transfer QB who led us to a bowl win, in the heart of SEC territory against South Carolina and then took us to the Fiesta bowl but most here (and in the stands) couldn't wait for him to run out of eligibility. Now at least one poster on this board is holding him up as a successful transfer.

We had a coach who took us from (literally) nothing to five bowl games in seven seasons, two partial championships of a BCS conference and a BCS bowl game yet there were more posters here knocking him than supporting him along the way (while deriding those who supported him as apologistas). Recently a poster here commented on our current head coach, comparing him to the head coach who did lead us to every bowl game we've participated in, believing that the comparison was an insult to the current head coach.

When speaking of the success that we did have, many of our fans (and posters here) spend their time emphasizing the shortcomings (the loss at West Virginia in 2007, losing to Temple in 2010) rather than appreciate the accomplishments.

In many ways we are our own worst enemies.

I wanted Zach Frazer to start, and play over Endres. Frazer couldn't throw a spiral to save his life, but he could get the ball in the general vicinity - unlike Lorenzen who couldn't hit the side of a barn. Endres threw like a pro, but I didn't want him playing. I was accused by posters of being Frazer's dad.

 

[Bonehead]

I'm not sure anyone is saying he's definitely the guy but is the alternative any better or giving us wins? I think what most are saying is that if Boyle is going to get a shot next season, what does it hurt to let him start a few games this season and see what happens. Worst thing that happens is we lose which at this point we've seemed to have mastered.

You really think he is going to be here next year, dont you?


It could hurt team morale, his own confidence and/or the confidence of others...theres a lot it can hurt. Its NOT just about TB - this is a team. Plus we have NO IDEA what goes on at practice and behind closed doors - for all we know the leg pain sit game was discipline...His coach said he lacked intensity and such - but who cares about the other 10 guys - let him play...

 

[Bonehead]

I wanted Zach Frazer to start, and play over Endres. Frazer couldn't throw a spiral to save his life, but he could get the ball in the general vicinity - unlike Lorenzen who couldn't hit the side of a barn. Endres threw like a pro, but I didn't want him playing. I was accused by posters of being Frazer's dad.

better than being accused as being his Mom...

 

[KOD594]

In normal circumstances I would not play Boyle based on his performances but this is not normal times. We have a senior QB who makes bad decisions and throws with or without pressure and is 1-9 in his starts the last two years and the one win was saved by Foxx's punt return. We are at the most looking at three wins and not sure if we even beat Army if they go nine in the box and we keep trying to run. See what we have in Boyle so can make decisions going into next year. Hope he does well, but need to know regardless. Would not be happy if we played out the string with Whitmer, see Boyle transfer and have a redshirt transfer year and then have two productive seasons elsewhere. At this point I will take having the team playing for the future than the dismal present.

 

[Palatine]

I just think it's hilarious that anybody can look at a guy with a 0-to-10 TD-to-INT ratio and think, "That is definitely the guy."

It's hilarious that you can look at a guy with an o-10 won/loss record and think, "His back up doesn't deserve a chance."

 

[FfldCntyFan]

we have NO IDEA what goes on at practice and behind closed doors .

Most important post of this thread (and many others).

 

[junglehusky]

It's hilarious that you can look at a guy with an o-10 won/loss record and think, "His back up doesn't deserve a chance."

It's hilarious that you can use a made up win-loss record and also make up a quote that Irish Loop didn't say.

 

[UCFBfan]

You really think he is going to be here next year, dont you?


It could hurt team morale, his own confidence and/or the confidence of others...theres a lot it can hurt. Its NOT just about TB - this is a team. Plus we have NO IDEA what goes on at practice and behind closed doors - for all we know the leg pain sit game was discipline...His coach said he lacked intensity and such - but who cares about the other 10 guys - let him play...

Honestly, I don't think he'll be here next year. However, that could change if he performs well in games when given the chance. I really don't know. I agree with you that we don't know what is going on in practice. What I do know is that our current QB is not getting it done.

I just think it's crazy that people are now at the point where they're ready to write Boyle off as gone and transferring and that is ok when we have ZERO clue what our QB situation will be next year. You have a NC State transfer and an incoming frosh who runs well more than he throws. So we'll either be starting a transfer QB or a true freshmen. That thought doesn't make me feel like we're in for a better season next year.

So what does it hurt to start him, whether or not he's staying. The whole thing just boggles my mind and there is no answer.

We can all argue this over and over and no one here will know the result. However, we'll never know what he could have done either if he's not given the chance this season to show what he can do. Regardless, it's up to Diaco and that's the bottom line....

 

[Bonehead]

Honestly, I don't think he'll be here next year. However, that could change if he performs well in games when given the chance. I really don't know. I agree with you that we don't know what is going on in practice. What I do know is that our current QB is not getting it done.

I just think it's crazy that people are now at the point where they're ready to write Boyle off as gone and transferring and that is ok when we have ZERO clue what our QB situation will be next year. You have a NC State transfer and an incoming frosh who runs well more than he throws. So we'll either be starting a transfer QB or a true freshmen. That thought doesn't make me feel like we're in for a better season next year.

So what does it hurt to start him, whether or not he's staying. The whole thing just boggles my mind and there is no answer.

We can all argue this over and over and no one here will know the result. However, we'll never know what he could have done either if he's not given the chance this season to show what he can do. Regardless, it's up to Diaco and that's the bottom line....

Well said -

Play Boyle at this point - I will cheer wildly for him - but in CW defense his numbers last game were almost identical to the winning teams QB - there is more to Boyle than any of us know, that is for sure - whether it is injury, lack of confidence and intensity, whatever, there is a back story in my opinion. I dont understand how he hasnt played more at this point as well - unless the coach has no confidence in his abilities, which wouldnt make sense when he palys 2-8 snaps a game.

 

[kemba]

I think they are just giving Boyle limited playing time to see if he can show them something. If he does than they can increase his time, so far he hasn't done anything to show he deserves more playing time. Before the season Diaco spoke not just about redshirting him but protecting him, and referenced how he was mishandled last year. Throwing him out there for a full game when he's not ready, and it's a terrible situation for any QB would be making the same mistake as last year

 

[FfldCntyFan]

One thing that was glaring last season (and I believe that this played a large role in Diaco's multiple comments on how more than one QB would play) was that once a QB lost his starting job he was banished to oblivion. I don't know what the correct answer is here but I do know that someone with an actual football background should be able to make a better decision on this than any one of us. Add to the equation the fact that he also has significantly more knowledge of the situation than any of us has, believing that our opinion is the better decision is comical.

 

[whaler11]

One thing that was glaring last season (and I believe that this played a large role in Diaco's multiple comments on how more than one QB would play) was that once a QB lost his starting job he was banished to oblivion. I don't know what the correct answer is here but I do know that someone with an actual football background should be able to make a better decision on this than any one of us. Add to the equation the fact that he also has significantly more knowledge of the situation than any of us has, believing that our opinion is the better decision is comical.

I'm not saying anyone is right but you could say the same thing about Weist and he didn't exactly bat 1.000.

 

[ZooCougar]

Except for that Frazer guy...who ended up leading us to a BCS game...but other than that...

Comparatively speaking, he was better than Whitmer, but Frazer got worse every year under Edsall. His best year was 2009, when he was actually really good. But like all QBs not named Orlovsky, he got worse the more he played.

 

[EdgewoodNHV]

It's hilarious that you can look at a guy with an o-10 won/loss record and think, "His back up doesn't deserve a chance."

I actually didn't say that. I did say I would start Boyle. But quite frankly, I don't think it matters that much. Between the turnovers at running back (by all) and the truly atrocious O-line, I do not think it's going to make a significant difference, and I suspect whatever development Boyle gets this season may well be counteracted by the possibility of psychological damage from taking a ton of hits behind that O-line.

I'm also a little unsure where you got that record.

 

[CTBasketball]

I actually didn't say that. I did say I would start Boyle. But quite frankly, I don't think it matters that much. Between the turnovers at running back (by all) and the truly atrocious O-line, I do not think it's going to make a significant difference, and I suspect whatever development Boyle gets this season may well be counteracted by the possibility of psychological damage from taking a ton of hits behind that O-line.

I'm also a little unsure where you got that record.

It matters because if Boyle doesn't start and grab the reigns to the program by the end of the year, he's likely going to transfer at the end of this season. Especially if Diaco throws him into a QB competition with Davis and Shirreffs.

 

[Jimmy Serrano]

Most important post of this thread (and many others).

My only gripe with this position of yours is that nothing stopped you and a few others from posting about stuff that supposedly happened behind closed doors the last 3 years. I wouldn't trust anything I heard from player's parents. Not saying they're dishonest but they're hardly an unbiased spectator in all of this.

 

[freescooter]

It matters because if Boyle doesn't start and grab the reigns to the program by the end of the year, he's likely going to transfer at the end of this season. Especially if Diaco throws him into a QB competition with Davis and Shirreffs.

And that matters why? I don't get the whole "Boyle is special" stuff at all. I think you can make a case for starting him, but as I've posted before it is essentially based on a need to change the psychology of the team, and occasionally a new qb does that, and a desire to find out if he is the real deal or a career back up . That will be important in terms of who we look at bringing in next year. If Boyle isn't the real deal, we will likely need to find a JUCO to come in and compete for the job next season.

 

[Palatine]

And that matters why? I don't get the whole "Boyle is special" stuff at all. I think you can make a case for starting him, but as I've posted before it is essentially based on a need to change the psychology of the team, and occasionally a new qb does that, and a desire to find out if he is the real deal or a career back up . That will be important in terms of who we look at bringing in next year. If Boyle isn't the real deal, we will likely need to find a JUCO to come in and compete for the job next season.

Give Boyle a chance. Give him a start. What is so radical about that when your current starter has no wins this century.

 

[freescooter]

I don't disagree. I'd start him just to see and for the reasons I listed. We're 1-5. What's the worst that will happen, 1-6? And I'd give Johnson the start at running back, too. He is a good back, and he protects the football.

 

[noeynox]

And that matters why? I don't get the whole "Boyle is special" stuff at all. I think you can make a case for starting him, but as I've posted before it is essentially based on a need to change the psychology of the team, and occasionally a new qb does that, and a desire to find out if he is the real deal or a career back up . That will be important in terms of who we look at bringing in next year. If Boyle isn't the real deal, we will likely need to find a JUCO to come in and compete for the job next season.

Boyle has gotten a raw deal here. He was rushed into action as true freshman on a bad team with a terrible oline play and we are surprised he struggled with interceptions? Then he was supposed to be redshirted this year, and then when the starter gets hut hurt that plan is scrapped so he can get a meaningless series here and there?

I don't know if Boyle will ever be the answer here. I didn't like his body language when he came in the game against Tulane and they showed him in dthe huddle. Again, who could be shocked if his confidence level is shot at the moment given how he has been treated. Seriously, If I were him and his family, I would seriously question if he is ever going to get a fair shot here or not.

At the very least, once we are mathematically eliminated from bowl contention, they should just let him play if he is healthy. None of this having to worry he is coming out if he makes a mistake or not. At the very least it would give him and the program both an idea of whether or not he has a future here. His first two years here have been mismanaged by the coaches, Diaco included.