I think MoJeff can be considered best pg ever - but you asked why maybe Bird? Note: I am not suggesting below is my opinion as stated before - I think MoJeff has a shot to be considered best ever. I mean if we lose and a guard torches UCONN and MoJeff couldn't stop her while playing a belwo average overall offensive game - will she be considered greater than Bird in that this team is considered so far ahead of everyone else? MoJeff arguable si palyign with the greatest player in UCONN History. Bird palyed with a Dt - but a soph DT. BIG DIFFERENCE.
Okay here are some of the reasons for Bird or NOT MoJeff- again though I am NOT saying who is greater just answering your question. I prefer to wait for season's end to declare.
1-- Statistics are hard to use overall therefore how valid can we use assists and assist is to turnovers when we compare both? MoJeff has had the luxury of playing with the greatest 3pt shooter in NCAA History and arguably the greatest player in UCONN History. Up until last year all that was required of her was to pass and play great defense. She didn't have to "create" until last year. So the assists vs turnovers comparison between the two is "iffy." Bird at a younger AGE was REQUIRED to be more aggressive which is why she shoots more - and yet doesn't have as efficient consistent scorers (like Stewie and KML). In addition, who really makes a more efficient pass in the post? We know Geno raves about Bird's post passing - but keep in mind in Bird's career - she didn't have the upperclassmen like Dolson to dump to and as good as "The Three Sisters" were, the efficiency of a combo of Dolson/KML/Stewie is easier to get an assist.
2-- In Bird's soph year was superior to MoJeff's, right? In Bird's soph year we can remember her great play vs Tenn, right? They couldn't stop her late even though "Boo" Randle was trying to be all over her. In bigger games Bird would take bigger shots early on. In 99-00 I think in semis vs Penn State - Bird was enormous in that game from what I recall. In contrast look at MoJeff's soph year. She was the 5th option. I don't remember many boneyarders at all being upset with Doris Burke's idiotic comments in finals vs ND when she took two shots Burke criticized her for taking them. That's because the expectation was that MoJeff didn't NEED to shoot (Bird did). Think about it- MoJeff was being left wide open in that game by a gimmick ND defense. And she was barely even shooting and being criticized when she did shoot and consensus was that she was justifiably criticized. In Sue Bird's soph year she was shooting 50% from 3 while averaging 4 3's a game. Would ND have been able to play that kind of defense if the soph Bird was on the court?
3-- Let's face from soph year onwards in particular last year- the UCONN conference of AAC was not as good as Bird's competition relatively speaking. Therefore the stats are harder to be as good.
4-- And while MoJeff is a superior defender imo -- Bird did NOT have the luxury of the consistency of the frontline defense that MoJeff has had. Dolson was DPOY her sr year? And Stokes imo the greatest defender in UCONN History along with Stewie imposing help defense. When we lost to Stanford last year, MoJeff did gamble and lose her man. This year a big concern by many was our perimeter defense -- though can't say it was MoJeff's fault but can't say she should be automatically blameless.
5-- Individually Bird was NPOY. MoJeff has little chance of that though because she is "competing" with Stewie. But it is the highest award for an individual in which she followed through in her sr year with a championship. If UCONN doesn't win this year- it is possible something went terribly wrong in the backcourt which is MoJeff's responsibility. Even now individually teams are okay with MoJeff shooting. Though MoJeff certainly makes them pay. She has proven that this year and last.
OK - I'll bite. And agree stats are only so good especially with PGs. And I am just adding a counter to some of your points not really disagreeing. (And I do love this)
1. The list of players Bird played some or all of her career with are all over the best percentage shooters in Uconn history - starting with her classmates - Williams #1 .703, Cash #9 .551 and Jones came in at .505, then the others she played some years with - #5 J. Moore, #6 Shea, #7 Kelly Schumacher, #12 Hansmeyer. Other notables: Sveta at .500 and DT at .469. Moriah - for top performers at Uconn: Dolson at #4 .588 and left off the list but does barely qualify Stokes .599 (she should be listed at #4 moving the other ranks down), Her classmates aren't bad with Morgan at .545 and Stewart at .514 (and rising), other notables KML at .486, Hartley at .453, Nurse at .486 (and falling), Faris at .455 - I think overall Sue probably had the better percentage shooters to pass to. Sue's 3 teams shot .539, .499, and .520, Moriah's last two shot .503 and .540 and they are currently at .524 (her freshman year .496) so pretty close, but interestingly Sue was fortunate she wasn't passing to herself as she shot below the team average while Moriah is unfortunate not to be passing to herself as she is shooting well above the team average.
2. On three point shooters - I grant you KML at #2 for Mo, but Sue had #5 Sveta, # 9 DT and #14 Shea to pass out to. (Stewart might just sneak onto that list this year if she can keep her current percentage through the year. Their teams shot: Sue - .463, .385, .405; Moriah - .366, .406, and currently .365 (freshman year .378) but I am too lazy to back out Sue's and Moriah's numbers and they both shot significantly better than their team average. And really for a PG you are better passing to a two point shooter than a three point shooter in general as the percentages tend to be significantly better.
3. Agree that Moriah has had the better shot blockers behind her, but Sue's back line was't bad with Schumacher ranked #8, Asjha #10, Swin #13, J. Moore #14, and Sauer #16 ( DT is # 11 by the way) and I am not sure how much the back line defense has to do with steals. Sue's teams rank #2, #5, and #9 on the all time list while Moriah's rank #14 and #10 (and her freshman year ranks number #6.) Most of Moriah's steals seem to come from her quick hands and speed rather than gambling in passing lanes. I think Moriah is a superior defender because of speed and quickness, and not so much her help defense or gambling, and when she plays denial defense is when the real frustrations of her player show up, and that has nothing to do with help defenders.
4. I think Sue was a better big moment player but you can match a TN with a SC game. Sue scored 10.9 ppg as a sophomore v. Moriah's 10.0 but took 0.7 more shots to accomplish it while dishing 0.6 fewer assists and committing 0.5 more turnovers. Sue had a 2.0 A/TO, Moriah came in at 3.0
5. Before January Moriah in the last two plus years has shot threes at about .300 - after January 1st she has shot at above .600. Her overall shooting percentages have been more steady at around .575. We'll see what she does this year - she has already raise her 3 percentage by about 70 points. I agree about the conference strength though 2000-02 the BE was yet to become the consistently strong league it became in the middle and late 2000s. I think the overall strength of the OOC has been stronger in Moriah's years than it was in Sue's years.
