Walz in position "to own women's basketball"

[Wonkster]

No, I won't, because I can't. I'm not an expert on WCBB and don't pretend to be. However, Louisville has been to the Final Four two of the past five years with Walz as coach, his team managed to knock off Baylor, Tennessee, and Cal in the NCAA's this year, and he also managed to recruit Bria Smith, the Schimmel sisters, and Sara Hammond, who UCONN had a strong interest in. Slaughter and Reid aren't too bad, either. Now we can debate the semantical meaning of "proven commodity" but I think that would be a waste of time for both of us. I'll stand by my opinion and respect yours, though.

Please don't mistake my position. I agree that Jeff Walz is an excellent coach, but his delivery hasn't quite lived up to his all-star billing so far.

I do thank Walz for delivering the most dramatic game I've ever seen in WCBB in the thriller against Baylor, and also for eliminating Baylor early in this year's NCAAs. The game was a much-needed reminder that nothing is guaranteed in women's college basketball.

 

[intlzncster]

Please don't mistake my position. I agree that Jeff Walz is an excellent coach, but his delivery hasn't quite lived up to his all-star billing so far.

But as Phil says above, Waltz's start is better than Geno's was.

Of course, the difference between Louisville and its facilities nowadays and UConn and its facilities in the 1980s is astronomical.

 

[Wonkster]

But as Phil says above, Waltz's start is better than Geno's was.

Of course, the difference between Louisville and its facilities nowadays and UConn and its facilities in the 1980s is astronomical.

You misread Phil's phrasing. The difference between the two's early records is miniscule. I also doubt Geno was being hailed as the second coming of John Wooden after six years, either.

Let's see where Jeff is vis-a-vis Geno after his first 10 years, when you can begin to drawn some reasonable inferences. Walz has still got plenty of time to turn into the second coming of Andy Landers.

 

[intlzncster]

You misread Phil's phrasing. The difference between the two's early records is miniscule. I also doubt Geno was being hailed as the second coming of John Wooden after six years, either.

Let's see where Jeff is vis-a-vis Geno after his first 10 years, when you can begin to drawn some reasonable inferences. Walz has still got plenty of time to turn into the second coming of Andy Landers.

HOF coach and 4x National coach of the Year? Nothing to sniff at.

Granted, hasn't won the big one. But hasn't there been only 6 or 7 NCAA Champion Coaches since 1995?

 

[HuskyNan]

Man let's not start the replace Geno with a 'proven commodity' vs 'one of our own' debate now.

We just got done this with Calhoun and it was an f''ing headache.

Besides, Geno's a long way off from retirement. I don't even think this is his last contract, unless of course he extends it again.

Apples and oranges, really. Geno took over a program that was playing in the old field house while the sport was, basically, in its infancy. Jeff Walz took over an established Division I program with excellent facilities in a time when women's basketball was much more in the mainstream. And, yes, Geno had Kerry Bascom but Jeff inherited a team with Angel, who had a much stronger supporting cast than Kerry, and which had gone 27-8 in the previous year.

 

[Icebear]

Could have said ths about a young Andy Landers.

Yes, the implication is not that he does or has done it but that he is in a position to do it if that is his desire and he fulfills the possibility. Geno owns it now, Pat before him. Walz is now in a position for owning women's basketball at some point in the next two decades. Geno is nearer the end of his career than Walz who at 41 is potentially still nearer the beginning.

 

[Icebear]

Man let's not start the replace Geno with a 'proven commodity' vs 'one of our own' debate now.

We just got done this with Calhoun and it was an f''ing headache.

Besides, Geno's a long way off from retirement. I don't even think this is his last contract, unless of course he extends it again.

And Walz started off with a program in better condition and which already had better recruits, including Angel.

Oops, you beat me to it, Nan.

 

[pap49cba]

Nan, is your new avatar a way of saying you don't like the new logo?

 

[intlzncster]

Apples and oranges, really. Geno took over a program that was playing in the old field house while the sport was, basically, in its infancy. Jeff Walz took over an established Division I program with excellent facilities in a time when women's basketball was much more in the mainstream. And, yes, Geno had Kerry Bascom but Jeff inherited a team with Angel, who had a much stronger supporting cast than Kerry, and which had gone 27-8 in the previous year.

Hmm. Not what I was trying to point out. I wasn't debating Jeff vs Geno. I was talking about who the fanbase wants to be HC once Geno retires. Do they want a proven HC from another program or would they rather have an inhouse option, one of their own (eg as Ollie was to Calhoun)?

It was an endless debate, and while possibly worthwhile when the time comes, that time is not now.

 

[intlzncster]

And Walz started off with a program in better condition and which already had better recruits, including Angel.

Oops, you beat me to it, Nan.

See reply to Nan.

 

[semper]

He's a really smart guy, with excellent strategies. I'm so glad he's around!

 

[DobbsRover2]

Comparison here might be on MCBB side with Butler's Brad Stevens who has also led his team to two NCs in his first six years though without getting the crown, is young, and has been highly courted by programs with bigger institutional names. Hard to say if he will ever get the path to equal what a Calhoun or K-Duke have won in modern times, and I'm guessing by the time a Walz might become the top name in WCBB that winning titles in the quantity of Geno or Summitt will be harder due to a wider breadth of competition, just as no one thinks of a hot-shot MCBB coach approaching Wooden's record.

But Walz has a story now that should be far more compelling than UTenn's to potential recruits, and I wouldn't be surprised if he does start to win more of those battles. "You remember that we've been in two NC games while you've been a teen? Well, we need you to get us to the next step." Holly: "I know you haven't seen us in Final Fours since you left elementary school, but we really need you to stay pretty close to getting there so our fans won't cut us completely to shreds for not being able to live up to the teams of the past." And if I was the AD and the Louisville promo department, I would be hyping that to the max.

 

[intlzncster]

But Walz has a story now that should be far more compelling than UTenn's to potential recruits, and I wouldn't be surprised if he does start to win more of those battles. "You remember that we've been in two NC games while you've been a teen? Well, we need you to get us to the next step." Holly: "I know you haven't seen us in Final Fours since you left elementary school, but we really need you to stay pretty close to getting there so our fans won't cut us completely to shreds for not being able to live up to the teams of the past." And if I was the AD and the Louisville promo department, I would be hyping that to the max.

Plus, and I know people don't like to talk about this, but the fact he's a male (not bad looking either) gives him an advantage with a certain type of recruit. Think a DT, who outright stated she wanted a male coach (not that DT's are growing off trees everyday). It's an advantage by being more of a rarity in the sport. I think some top level recruits prefer to be coached by a man because, they feel they'll get pushed harder. Whether they're right about that is inconsequential in how it affects their decision making process coming out of high school. And still other's might be looking for a strong male role model, a father figure of sorts.

Some girls prefer a woman for coach too, of course, but there's boatloads of options for them there.

Just another side point.

 

[rocky rococo]

I'm hardly a knee-jerk Walz supporter, far from it. However, the dismissal of his recruiting I've seen in a couple posts strikes me as a bit odd. Perhaps someone could remind me what the other schools in competition for Sara Hammond and Bria Smith were? My memory may have suffered from my illness, but I seem to recall there were some recognized national powers in the hunt for those players.

 

[Wonkster]

I'm hardly a knee-jerk Walz supporter, far from it. However, the dismissal of his recruiting I've seen in a couple posts strikes me as a bit odd. Perhaps someone could remind me what the other schools in competition for Sara Hammond and Bria Smith were? My memory may have suffered from my illness, but I seem to recall there were some recognized national powers in the hunt for those players.

Hammond stayed home, as did Chong. They are a wash, as far as Louisville and UConn are concerned.

Does anyone know how hard (if at all) Geno recruited Bria Smith, who played ball somewhere in Greater Long Island?

 

[KnightBridgeAZ]

Walz is a bright young coach (duh). If (I'm not getting into the discussion) he hasn't recruited as well as UConn fans think he should have, he has been fairly successful with what he has recruited, no? Too bad he hasn't won his conference championship. Maybe his chances will eventually improve if that University of Connecticut and Notre Dame get out of his way.

Um, excluding some very well known commodities - with some very well known star players - exactly how many teams have been to the final four twice in the last 5 years???

 

[UcMiami]

Walz is a bright young coach (duh). If (I'm not getting into the discussion) he hasn't recruited as well as UConn fans think he should have, he has been fairly successful with what he has recruited, no? Too bad he hasn't won his conference championship. Maybe his chances will eventually improve if that University of Connecticut and Notre Dame get out of his way.

Um, excluding some very well known commodities - with some very well known star players - exactly how many teams have been to the final four twice in the last 5 years???

Good points - say ... with the exception of Uconn, how have the top ranked recruiting teams faired since Walz got his HC job? He has two FF's but better than that, two championship games. Let's see - Baylor - 1, ND - 2, Stanford - 2, TN - 2, Rutgers - 1, Texas A&M - 1, Duke - 0, Maryland - 0, UNC - 0, etc. Drop his first year when he was unable to recruit and TN is down to 1 and Rutgers joins the great donut club.

 

[intlzncster]

Hammond stayed home, as did Chong. They are a wash, as far as Louisville and UConn are concerned.

Does anyone know how hard (if at all) Geno recruited Bria Smith, who played ball somewhere in Greater Long Island?

We were on her fairly early I think, but then backed off.

 

[Geno-ista]

Gosh, these statements are not, nor are they intended to be, any statement about Geno's place in the world. No need to see them that way. Walz is already a game changer for the sport at his university, just as Geno was at UConn. Will he become as dominant a force as GA? No sign of that, but who knows. Hard to achieve that, and the modern level of competition will (hopefully) progress to where even a GA would have a hard time matching his accomplishments, just as Wooden would have a harder time in today's game.

that is a great comment- totally thought out with great insight- as our womens game is really beginning to move forward-

 

[Geno-ista]

We were on her fairly early I think, but then backed off.

Bria smith was from Christ The King- which has been a steady provider of u conn players- Bria is something!

 

[UConnNick]

People on this board seem to have a lot of respect for Jeff Walz. He may or may not build Louisville into a powerhouse but one thing is certain, Geno will retire someday and a suitable replacement who can attract top recruits will need to be found if UCONN is to continue as the top WCBB program. There has always been speculation about former players eventually replacing Geno but maybe, just maybe, the best candidate is once again a male. Sustaining excellence is not easy and recruiting is the key, along with exceptional coaching. That's not to say a former UCONN player couldn't do the job, but Walz is a proven commodity. The bigger question is, would he want the job, especially if his program continues to develop at its current trajectory?

He won't want it if UCONN is still playing in the American Whatever Conference when that happens.

 

[Geno-ista]

Louisville is definitely one of our current conference mates, at least on the WBB side, that I'd like to see on the OOC schedule fairly regularly. They're quickly becoming my second favorite program to follow. I'm just jealous of the WBB league they'll get to play in starting in 2014/2015.

Ditto from this fan- they were a great bunch to meet at the big east Tmt also- sat right next to the teams under the hoop and they were all super!

 

[UConnNick]

But as Phil says above, Waltz's start is better than Geno's was.

Of course, the difference between Louisville and its facilities nowadays and UConn and its facilities in the 1980s is astronomical.

Not to mention that nobody was watching women's college BB in the 1980's. It's a whole lot easier to get noticed now than it was then. Even after making the FF appearance in 1991, nobody was predicting Geno would eventually become the absolute best coach in the country at the D-I level. Nice puffery from the Louisville athletic dept., but that's about it.

 

[Geno-ista]

People on this board seem to have a lot of respect for Jeff Walz. He may or may not build Louisville into a powerhouse but one thing is certain, Geno will retire someday and a suitable replacement who can attract top recruits will need to be found if UCONN is to continue as the top WCBB program. There has always been speculation about former players eventually replacing Geno but maybe, just maybe, the best candidate is once again a male. Sustaining excellence is not easy and recruiting is the key, along with exceptional coaching. That's not to say a former UCONN player couldn't do the job, but Walz is a proven commodity. The bigger question is, would he want the job, especially if his program continues to develop at its current trajectory?

This is really the question that haunts me. I believe this will be geno's last tour of duty here. I hope i'm wrong. I always just thought Jen Rizzotti was the front runner. Jeff Walz is really something. Maybe Rick Pitino or coach K from Duke would like to take a crack at the woman's game in Ct??? Then they could experience real pressure and high expectations!!!

 

[DaddyChoc]

We were on her fairly early I think, but then backed off.

yup thats what happened

I wonder whats Jill Cook's gripe is with Geno these days

 

[intlzncster]

yup thats what happened

I wonder whats Jill Cook's gripe is with Geno these days

Do you remember why, Choc? I think we targeted someone else, but can't remember who or if we even got them.

 

[alexrgct]

The thing about Geno is that, no matter who is on the squad, he gets his kids to play a certain style and with a certain level of intensity and commitment. I don't see Jeff's teams playing like that- not consistently at any rate. He's doing a good job at Louisville, but to "own" WBB, it will take a maniacal obsession with doing everything perfectly all the time (Geno), or being able to get the very best players, irrespective of geography, on a consistent basis. Jeff hasn't done either of those things to this point.

Geno is 59. He might coach until he's 64. He might coach until he's 74. It's going to depend on a lot of factors even he doesn't know yet. How effective he'd be as he gets older is also variable based on a number of currently unknowable factors. But until he retires, he's Geno, he's the Godfather, and it's his world until he decides it's not.

 

[UConnCat]

Do you remember why, Choc? I think we targeted someone else, but can't remember who or if we even got them.

I don't believe Bria ever received an offer. Geno stayed in contact and attended several of Bria's games but he never seemed sold on Bria fitting in with the UConn offense. She's not a point guard, though Walz shifted her there to free up Schimmel. She doesn't shoot well enough to be an effective shooting guard and isn't going to spread the floor (she took a total of 7 three-pointers this season and didn't make one). He was satisfied bringing in KML and Brianna Banks.

 

[pap49cba]

I don't believe Bria ever received an offer. Geno stayed in contact and attended several of Bria's games but he never seemed sold on Bria fitting in with the UConn offense. She's not a point guard, though Walz shifted her there to free up Schimmel. She doesn't shoot well enough to be an effective shooting guard and isn't going to spread the floor (she took a total of 7 three-pointers this season and didn't make one). He was satisfied bringing in KML and Brianna Banks.

He may have decided the last he needed was Bria I, Bria II, Brianna and Breanna.

 

[Waquoit]

Hermann said. “I have been saying it for several years. I think he’s in a position to own women’s basketball.”

That's some bad karma right there. The "Jewel of the East" is still looking for title No. 1.