Wake may not want to pay players...

[nelsonmuntz]

The UAA is the University Athletic Association. It is schools like U Chicago, MIT, NYU, and similar. These are some of the best schools in the country, and their athletics suck by design. They have huge endowments, massive research budgets, and none of the administrators at these schools would even consider adding a semipro athletic department.

Paying players is a really big deal at a lot of schools, and particularly for schools like Northwestern, Duke, Stanford, Wake and Vandy.

 

[The Funster]

How many schools have PLENTY of money? RU and MD needed a life raft from the B1G because their AD's were hemorrhaging money. WVU was whining about the added expense of travel after joining the Big 12. P5 schools have been cutting non revenue sports because they don't have the cash to meet Title IX. There is no doubt that some of the elite athletic programs are making money. There are probably a few more who cook the books so it looks like they are making money.

Schools won't drop from the P5 though. Keeping up with the Jones' philosophy will prevent that. I don't think it will be the boon that many think it will though and I also think it will hurt athletes more than it helps the P5 institutions. Non P5 schools will have even less money and that means less opportunities to support other athletes.

 

[buddy]

Everyone write this down because it will save us a hell of a lot of time going forward.

Wake Forest is not leaving the ACC, the P5 or wherever some of you have them retreating from.

Never, ever, never, ever, ever, never. No one will ever give that up and no one will have to if their present conference survive. Either way, demotions won't help us.

Thank you for saying this. You are 100% correct.

 

[Calamitous]

Schools like Wake are in a different spot then the publics. Wake competes for students with elite private schools like the Ivies and the UAA schools. I think it is unlikely they would pass up the net revenue, but it is not out of the question that they or Vanderbilt draw the line at paying players. U of Chicago still gets a lot of mileage from discontinuing a powerhouse football program 80 years ago because it was contrary to their mission as a university. The vast majority of the students at a school like Wake do not identify with the other ACC student bodies or think much of a "rivalry". They think they are superior to Clemson students, and they are right for the most part. Paying players makes Wake a semi-pro program, and there is a stigma that will attach to that when it comes to attracting top students, and more importantly, top faculty.

I thought paying players was going to be a very tough line for the Wakes and Vanderbilts to cross. We shall see.

I assumed you meant AAU as it was either going to be the University Athletic Association or University of Alaska-Anchorage. Division III schools (like in the UAA) are very far removed from P5 autonomy legislation. Not even the 1-AA or non-P5 1-A schools are considering pay for play. Yes, NYU, Washington MO, Chicago, Brandeis, Rochester, Emory, Case Western Reserve and Carnegie-Mellon are all great universities, but they aren't even tracking what is going on in division 1-AA athletics much less the P5. And Wake may compete for students with those schools, but not student-athletes. No offense to the student-athlete, but schools like Northwestern, Vandy, Stanford, Notre Dame, Berkeley, Wake, Duke, UNC and UVa bend the rules to get some athletes into their school. For example, 5 star athletes Daryl Blackstock, Ahmad Brooks and Morgan Moses couldn't qualify at Virginia Tech but made it in to the ever so prestigious UVa. Go figure. I'm sure those guys could have ended up at UNC as well. Now, Duke and Wake hold a bit of a higher standard like Stanford. Their student-athletes seem fairly intelligent, but they wouldn't get into those schools if it were not for athletics.

 

[Fishy]

Enough.

Mike Vick went to Virginia Tech and he has potting soil in his head - Rainman could get into Virginia Tech, Duke, Wake or wherever else if he were a five-star player.

 

[Calamitous]

Enough.

Mike Vick went to Virginia Tech and he has potting soil in his head - Rainman could get into Virginia Tech, Duke, Wake or wherever else if he were a five-star player.

Don't disagree. And yet, Syracuse, UVa and UNC were heavily recruiting him and felt they missed out. My point was that even the "elite" schools do the same thing. Tech and other similar universities have been doing this for years. But so have the "elite" universities. NCAA football and basketball doesn't play by the same rules as I did in college. If I were lucky enough to be a super athlete, I would have gone to Duke. Otherwise, I'd never get into that school.

 

[pj]

There are no academics for elite players. There are just sham academics. This is true even at weaker schools. When I was at the University of Illinois professors complained that they couldn't fail athletes even though they did no work. At Harvard, the professors complained that they couldn't fail the daughter of the Sultan of Brunei. Some students bring academics to a university, others bring something else.

 

[SyracuseMiami]

If I'm a fan at BC or Syracuse I have to start wondering if there are $ problems cropping up. At Cuse Scott Schaefer is the best coach you can hire for a program in the ACC that has good past program history...and at BC the athletic dept with their recent men's hoops hire has pretty much told fans they are throwing in the towel in that sport.

I think there are a lot of other schools who should be worried about revenue/cash before Syracuse. Honestly, we are well ahead of a lot of schools in FBS.

 

[FDNY99]

I think there are a lot of other schools who should be worried about revenue/cash before Syracuse. Honestly, we are well ahead of a lot of schools in FBS.

The Schafer hire REALLY puzzled me. But I also can't believe Boeheim makes $1.9 mill/yr. If true then you will be handcuffed for a football coach salary until either Boeheim retires OR Gross gives him a HUGE raise......BC on the other hand with the last 2 hoops hires...tells me they may be having $$ issues

 

[pj]

The Schafer hire REALLY puzzled me. But I also can't believe Boeheim makes $1.9 mill/yr. If true then you will be handcuffed for a football coach salary until either Boeheim retires OR Gross gives him a HUGE raise.BC on the other hand with the last 2 hoops hires...tells me they may be having issues

I've said this before but if you are BC, why wouldn't you make minimal investments in athletics and just milk your ACC membership? They are far from being competitive with Duke or UNC in basketball or FSU or Clemson in football. What difference does it make whether they are 13th or 9th in major sports? Conference payouts are the same whether you finish first or last. They can finish 13th most years and make more money if they go cheap on coaches and recruiting and facilities and the rest.

When conferences change the payout structure, you'll see BC step up for athletics.

Syracuse is in a different spot, they are much larger, less prestigious academically, and in an unattractive city. They have a challenge recruiting students. They need the visibility athletics gives them. So they will invest, in basketball at least.

 

[upstater]

Every P5 conference commissioner, university president and athletic director is a complete liar with respect to any supposed money crunches. They (whether it's Texas or Wake Forest) have PLENTY of money to pay for facilities, players and coaches. Don't believe a word of their posturing to try to avoid compensating student athletes. The Big Ten and Wake Forests of the world aren't dropping to D3 - they're just whining because their ability to make tens of millions of dollars off of free talent is about to go away (and I say that as a Big Ten guy). They'll all pay up - paying students is a drop in the bucket compared to the facilities palaces that they're already spending money on.

The budget deficits are only propped by subsidies. Not to mention the facilities you speak of in your last sentence aren't even paid for by the ADs. It's not like people don't have access to the actual budgets, but no one wants to talk about that. When the entire budget is propped by subsidies, you're not making money.

 

[BC1978]

The Schafer hire REALLY puzzled me. But I also can't believe Boeheim makes $1.9 mill/yr. If true then you will be handcuffed for a football coach salary until either Boeheim retires OR Gross gives him a HUGE raise. BC on the other hand with the last 2 hoops hires...tells me they may be having issues

BC is not having the issues that you allude to. Not at all. You talk about the HC hires. The fact is that 4 years ago, the coach who was hired was a hot coaching prospect. For this past BB hiring process, BC went in a different direction. Yes, they saved some money on the HC hire, BUT they also made a decision to instead put significant dollars into the Assistant coaches who do the bulk of the recruiting. As a result, they were able to steal several good ones from other places. This strategy has borne early fruit as BC landed a couple of highly regarded players for this upcoming season (a real coup given the current state of the Program). I can tell you that most folks in the BC community are happy with the way the new staff has gotten off the ground. Also keep in mind that you are talking about the "third" sport at BC (behind #1 FB and #2 Hockey).

BC just made a huge investment in new video boards/ribbon boards/sound system at Alumni (the video boards will have a higher resolution the ones at Gillette).

Its a wealthy school that has always understood the critical role that athletics plays in keeping alumni interest/donations coming which, in turn, drives the success of the college. That's not gonna change. I know some of these folks. Trust me, they get it.

 

[FDNY99]

BC is not having the issues that you allude to. Not at all. You talk about the HC hires. The fact is that 4 years ago, the coach who was hired was a hot coaching prospect. For this past BB hiring process, BC went in a different direction. Yes, they saved some money on the HC hire, BUT they also made a decision to instead put significant dollars into the Assistant coaches who do the bulk of the recruiting. As a result, they were able to steal several good ones from other places. This strategy has borne early fruit as BC landed a couple of highly regarded players for this upcoming season (a real coup given the current state of the Program). I can tell you that most folks in the BC community are happy with the way the new staff has gotten off the ground. Also keep in mind that you are talking about the "third" sport at BC (behind #1 FB and #2 Hockey).

BC just made a huge investment in new video boards/ribbon boards/sound system at Alumni (the video boards will have a higher resolution the ones at Gillette).

Its a wealthy school that has always understood the critical role that athletics plays in keeping alumni interest/donations coming which, in turn, drives the success of the college. That's not gonna change. I know some of these folks. Trust me, they get it.

I recognize you from the CSNbbs boards. I'm the UCONN fan who made the comment to you about the relationship between the 2 schools thawing over a game played on ice. I was shocked they went in the direction they went last time for the hoops coach hire. But then again GDF didn't have a very good track record on hires..I liked Jags and thought he was nuts to fire him. You do know they offered the mob job to PC Coach Ed Cooley and he turned it down right? I don't doubt that BC doesn't have money...I'm just a little surprised that they didn't pony up the cash for both head coach AND his Asst's given the bb history at the school & stature of ACC hoops. The renovations you spoke about at Alumni...were they not done by donations? If they were how does donor $ and coaches salaries at BC affect each other. I would assume that donor $ would be used to upgrade facilities

 

[Fishy]

Boston College hired Jim Christian because that was the best they could do - it's just not a job people with prospects are going to want to take on. The bigger names won't take their calls.

Skinner was the absolute perfect coach for them - he was a clever enough recruiter to survive on the margins and he was never a threat to jump to a better job.

 

[Antiobserver]

I thought they dropped football already.