Voepel on the Summitt book

[OneTrickPony]

I have to admit that I considered it a tacit admission that UTENN couldn't compete...

 

[Joe6cats]

I have always respected Voepel, and usually enjoy her articles. This is disappointing. The fact that the UTenn board is as negative about this one as we are, just says to me that she wimped out on a journalist's main responsibility: to sort out the truth and report it objectively.

 

[tennparker3]

Pat and Geno made up and are over it. Reason enough for me not to give a hoot about it anymore.

 

[DaddyChoc]

Pat and Geno made up and are over it. Reason enough for me not to give a hoot about it anymore.

if its printed in a new book... Pat gives a hoot and people are wondering why is she still stirrin the pot

 

[Shenandoah]

I have always respected Voepel, and usually enjoy her articles. This is disappointing. The fact that the UTenn board is as negative about this one as we are, just says to me that she wimped out on a journalist's main responsibility: to sort out the truth and report it objectively.

Seems to be what they're teaching in journalism school these days...

 

[CCinCT]

Seems to be what they're teaching in journalism school these days...

If you mean they're teaching "wimping out" I couldn't agree more.

 

[Bayareahusky]

or just not making an earnest effort to search for the truth.....

 

[hoopfan515]

If you mean they're teaching "wimping out" I couldn't agree more.

I wouldn't have expected anything else from Voepel. The only way to get an objective article or opinion is to go outside ESPN. The best article I have read so far was from Emma Carmichael from Deadspin.

How Pat Summitt Ruined The Best Thing About ... - Deadspin


deadspin.com/.../how-pat-summitt-ruined-the-best-thing-about-wome...

 

[pinotbear]

I wouldn't have expected anything else from Voepel. The only way to get an objective article or opinion is to go outside ESPN. The best article I have read so far was from Emma Carmichael from Deadspin.

How Pat Summitt Ruined The Best Thing About ... - Deadspin


deadspin.com/.../how-pat-summitt-ruined-the-best-thing-about-wome...

Since this article was written, a few things have happened - including revealations that Pat's programs weren't nearly as pristine as portrayed here. I would argue that, even when written, the article is inaccurate (or, at least simplistic) in describing UConn as being "fast-breaking" and relatively undisciplined compared with Tennessee. It wasn't until the TASSK force arrived that UConn was athletically comparable to Tennesee. The '95 team was obviously talented and disciplined, but not as deep nor athletic as Tennessee. Those were UT's strengths, whereas maximizing productivity and minimizing mistakes was UConn's. The article would lead you to believe that the opposite was true.

 

[DaddyChoc]

I wouldn't have expected anything else from Voepel. The only way to get an objective article or opinion is to go outside ESPN. The best article I have read so far was from Emma Carmichael from Deadspin.

How Pat Summitt Ruined The Best Thing About ... - Deadspin


deadspin.com/.../how-pat-summitt-ruined-the-best-thing-about-wome...

thanks... interesting article, more to the point but the writer should interview Pat today.

 

[CamrnCrz1974]

Been off for a few days, due to a difficult personal situation.

As to my question about what Tennessee fans thought, Mechelle Voepel responded (response below). I guess she agreed with me that if both sides to the conflict are unhappy with the result of the article, it must be a success!

Side issue, though. If someone is unhappy with a topic, you can always email Mechelle. If she does not hear from you, she would not be aware that anyone is upset.

Mechelle Voepel (2:48 PM)

I didn't get any e-mails on that topic, so I wasn't aware anyone was upset. Copy editors at ESPN.com - as with all news outlets - write tons of headlines daily. I seriously doubt more than three seconds' thought went into using the word "waxes" ... it probably fit the headline count, and that's about it. The story was a plug for Summitt's new book based on the part that "Sports Illustrated" chose to excerpt. I'd guess that's because to the average sports fan who really doesn't follow women's basketball, Pat and Geno are names those folks know. The news desk saw the excerpt, they ran it as a story, and an editor asked me to weigh in on it. I wrote a column in an hour and sent it in. I felt like I said the exact same stuff I've said 100 times already. That's about all there is to it. There are fans of all schools who think we're *against* their team ... that just comes with the territory in sports media. I don't live anywhere near UConn or Tennessee, unless you count being in the same country as "near." I think I have a very objective view of both programs. And I always say if *both* are angry at you, then you're doing OK.

 

[UConnCat]

Been off for a few days, due to a difficult personal situation.

As to my question about what Tennessee fans thought, Mechelle Voepel responded (response below). I guess she agreed with me that if both sides to the conflict are unhappy with the result of the article, it must be a success!

Side issue, though. If someone is unhappy with a topic, you can always email Mechelle. If she does not hear from you, she would not be aware that anyone is upset.

Mechelle Voepel (2:48 PM)

I didn't get any e-mails on that topic, so I wasn't aware anyone was upset. Copy editors at ESPN.com - as with all news outlets - write tons of headlines daily. I seriously doubt more than three seconds' thought went into using the word "waxes" ... it probably fit the headline count, and that's about it. The story was a plug for Summitt's new book based on the part that "Sports Illustrated" chose to excerpt. I'd guess that's because to the average sports fan who really doesn't follow women's basketball, Pat and Geno are names those folks know. The news desk saw the excerpt, they ran it as a story, and an editor asked me to weigh in on it. I wrote a column in an hour and sent it in. I felt like I said the exact same stuff I've said 100 times already. That's about all there is to it. There are fans of all schools who think we're *against* their team ... that just comes with the territory in sports media. I don't live anywhere near UConn or Tennessee, unless you count being in the same country as "near." I think I have a very objective view of both programs. And I always say if *both* are angry at you, then you're doing OK.

Her column read like it was written in an hour. But this idea that if both sides are unhappy "you're doing OK" is annoying but something we see too much in the media. It assigns two sides of an argument a false equivalence. So what you get is "the truth or reality must lie somewhere in the middle" or "I've made both sides upset so I must be right" which is not good reporting and doesn't support good opinions. Silence is sometimes better.

 

[DaddyChoc]

she did know? she don't read the Boneyard?

 

[CamrnCrz1974]

Her column read like it was written in an hour. But this idea that if both sides are unhappy "you're doing OK" is annoying but something we see too much in the media. It assigns two sides of an argument a false equivalence. So what you get is "the truth or reality must lie somewhere in the middle" or "I've made both sides upset so I must be right" which is not good reporting and doesn't support good opinions. Silence is sometimes better.

I think you are misconstruing a joke into a principle of journalism, then using that make a veiled reference that Voepel does not engage in good reporting and does not support good opinions. You have one position; TN fans have another. Both attacked the article is not convering certain things and not mentioning specific items that each side thought needed mentioning. It is pretty clear that what you have said as your conclusions from the middle position are *not* what Voepel conveyed in the article.

But here is a question...why would it take longer than an hour to write? Other than an excerpt from Pat Summitt's book, what is really *new* that Voepel has not covered over the last 5.5 years?

she did know? she don't read the Boneyard?

No, she does not. Voepel has not read message boards in several months now. I contacted her to bring it to her attention.

 

[UConnCat]

I think you are misconstruing a joke into a principle of journalism, then using that make a veiled reference that Voepel does not engage in good reporting and does not support good opinions. You have one position; TN fans have another. Both attacked the article is not convering certain things and not mentioning specific items that each side thought needed mentioning. It is pretty clear that what you have said as your conclusions from the middle position are *not* what Voepel conveyed in the article.

But here is a question...why would it take longer than an hour to write? Other than an excerpt from Pat Summitt's book, what is really *new* that Voepel has not covered over the last 5.5 years?

Well, I didn't think it was really a joke. In fact, you raised this very issue earlier in this thread:
If both sides to the conflict are unhappy with the result of the article, does that make it a success?

I like a lot of what Voepel writes and I've said as much on this board. But there are times I believe she writes like a political reporter who's afraid to alienate certain sides to a dispute. I've seen it before with the Tenn/UConn issues. I guess I want her to be the Jay Bilas of women's basketball. That's unfair, I know, but I think our game needs someone like that and she's the one I see as knowing the most, caring the most, and whose words people would respect. I want a stronger voice on the issues that matter to the women's game.

If there's nothing new, than why write it. That just frustrates readers who have come to expect more.

 

[CamrnCrz1974]

What I said as a joke is now akin to attacking all journalists, especially when the journalist in question (Voepel) made the same joke (and it was clear it was a joke via the emoticon; plus, I am not a journalist)? Not sure how that all ties together...

She answered why she wrote it. ESPN asked her to.

What else is she supposed to write if there is nothing new?

 

[UConnCat]

What I said as a joke is now akin to attacking all journalists, especially when the journalist in question (Voepel) made the same joke (and it was clear it was a joke via the emoticon; plus, I am not a journalist)? Not sure how that all ties together...

She answered why she wrote it. ESPN asked her to.

What else is she supposed to write if there is nothing new?

Sorry, your response makes no sense and twists what I said. First, I never said your joke (which I didn't realize you meant as a joke) was akin to attacking all journalists. I said that your joke is in fact a criticism (i.e., false equivalence) that is leveled against the political media and I think legitimately so. Second, I know you're not a journalist but I believed you were defending a journalistic practice that I find objectionable. I can't help tie together what you wrote.

If there is nothing new, there's always the option of writing nothing and saying as much to ESPN. If Voepel didn't feel she could say no, then I guess she'll understand if some considered her article not worth reading.

 

[TouchdownHusky]

Summit: sour grapes. She wants to criticize Geno, she needs to accept that all the talent she was getting was just as likely to have been recruited the same way. They weren't all coming to Knoxville because they liked orange.

 

[CamrnCrz1974]

Sorry, your response makes no sense and twists what I said. First, I never said your joke (which I didn't realize you meant as a joke) was akin to attacking all journalists. I said that your joke is in fact a criticism (i.e., false equivalence) that is leveled against the political media and I think legitimately so. Second, I know you're not a journalist but I believed you were defending a journalistic practice that I find objectionable. I can't help tie together what you wrote.

If there is nothing new, there's always the option of writing nothing and saying as much to ESPN. If Voepel didn't feel she could say no, then I guess she'll understand if some considered her article not worth reading.

What does the political media have to do with sports journalism?

I am not defending a journalistic practice, but I am freely and repeatedly pointing out how both TN and UConn fans took issue with the article Mechelle Voepel wrote.

As an aside, when ESPN "asks" to write an article, they are telling Voepel to do one. I thought she wrote a great piece incorporating what was new, summarizing the previous issues, and adding some additional thoughts. Hard to add lots of new information when there is not a plethora out there to add.

Also, I think it is interesting how many on this board complain about the coverage (or lack thereof) of women's basketball by ESPN and the national media, but now you are suggesting that Voepel not write the piece that is clearly of interest on a national level involving the two most recognized names in the sport.

 

[doggydaddy]

What does the political media have to do with sports journalism?

I am not defending a journalistic practice, but I am freely and repeatedly pointing out how both TN and UConn fans took issue with the article Mechelle Voepel wrote.

As an aside, when ESPN "asks" to write an article, they are telling Voepel to do one. I thought she wrote a great piece incorporating what was new, summarizing the previous issues, and adding some additional thoughts. Hard to add lots of new information when there is not a plethora out there to add.

Also, I think it is interesting how many on this board complain about the coverage (or lack thereof) of women's basketball by ESPN and the national media, but now you are suggesting that Voepel not write the piece that is clearly of interest on a national level involving the two most recognized names in the sport.

You really pay to visit The Summitt?

 

[CamrnCrz1974]

Yes, I pay to visit the Summitt. And I paid for the premium portion of this board back when it was affiliated with Scout/Fox Sports. To me, it is about supporting women's basketball. If I buy a subscription but I mostly post (at least on UConn and TN boards) on the women's board, hopefully the people who run the site will take notice (and add more premium content geared toward women's sports) and, in turn, hopefully the "higher ups" (those at Scout, etc.) will also pay attention.

Even if this board were to go to a subscription-based system, I would still pay for it. Heck, even if they only charged "outsiders" the subscription fee and not posters who are UConn grads or who cheer for UConn as their primary team, I would still pay for it.

 

[doggydaddy]

Yes, I pay to visit the Summitt. And I paid for the premium portion of this board back when it was affiliated with Scout/Fox Sports. To me, it is about supporting women's basketball. If I buy a subscription but I mostly post (at least on UConn and TN boards) on the women's board, hopefully the people who run the site will take notice (and add more premium content geared toward women's sports) and, in turn, hopefully the "higher ups" (those at Scout, etc.) will also pay attention.

Even if this board were to go to a subscription-based system, I would still pay for it. Heck, even if they only charged "outsiders" the subscription fee and not posters who are UConn grads or who cheer for UConn as their primary team, I would still pay for it.

Gee, I didn't ask if you were paying for this board. Who wouldn't pay for this wonderful site?

But the Summitt? Not sure what you get from that!!!

 

[ghostmutt]

I agree with the OP that Voepel leaves the allegation hanging out there when she only needed to add one line to the end of the fourth graph to balance the article:

"The NCAA found UConn guilty of a secondary recruiting violation involving a 2005 ESPN studio tour that the women's basketball office arranged for then-top recruit Maya Moore, whom Tennessee was also recruiting."

That's a paraphrase of how the news appeared in the original ESPN article that covered the end of the series.

To include the phrases "relationship...soured," "recruiting battles," and "nasty rivalry," in the lede, and then follow with three long-ish graphs directly quoting Summitt (e.g, "I'm not putting up with this anymore!") implies that it must have been some really dirty tricks that caused Pat to cancel the sport's marquee series.

Mechelle is a great WBB historian; her article is written for an audience of devoted fans that followed the whole saga, not necessarily the newcomers or the neutral folks who just don't care enough about the rivalry to know the history. One bit of attention to the NCAA's finding would provide a neutral tone.

The only thing on the Internet that I pay to read is the New York Times. If I wouldn't give my credit card to click-thru and read their hilarious indignation over the Geno-Mulkey ass grab, I never will.

 

[UConnCat]

What does the political media have to do with sports journalism?

I am not defending a journalistic practice, but I am freely and repeatedly pointing out how both TN and UConn fans took issue with the article Mechelle Voepel wrote.

As an aside, when ESPN "asks" to write an article, they are telling Voepel to do one. I thought she wrote a great piece incorporating what was new, summarizing the previous issues, and adding some additional thoughts. Hard to add lots of new information when there is not a plethora out there to add.

Also, I think it is interesting how many on this board complain about the coverage (or lack thereof) of women's basketball by ESPN and the national media, but now you are suggesting that Voepel not write the piece that is clearly of interest on a national level involving the two most recognized names in the sport.

Good God. You are an example of why I left the practice of law.

I raised the issue of false equivalence because I think Voepel does that from time to time when it comes to Tenn (Summitt) and UConn (Geno) issues, particularly Summitt's unsupported allegations of recruiting improprieties. I believe there are times Voepel writes as if she doesn't want to piss off either fan base. That's why I raised the issue of false equivalence. I think the so-called "joke" sometimes reflects the reality of her writing on these topics.

I did not suggest that she not write on the issue; I would have preferred that she write a stronger piece rather than just regurgitating what's in Summitt's book. Even she admitted that her piece was nothing new. As I said in my post, if ESPN wanted her to write the article, then fine. But that doesn't mean we need to think it's a good or interesting piece of journalism. It's not.

 

[Vowelguy]

Heck, even if they only charged "outsiders" the subscription fee and not posters who are UConn grads or who cheer for UConn as their primary team, I would still pay for it.

HEY MODS!!!!!!
I propose a subscription fee for Cam of $10,000, with the proceeds going to a BY end of season bash.

Shhh, but don't tell Cam he's the only pigeon, er subscriber, being charged.