UT playing today against the LVs

[VolFan]

Significant* autocorrect

 

[HuskyNan]

Totally, but respectfully disagree Nan. Not many players have gotten bashed by UConn fans, for on and off-court, issues more than ND's Skylar Diggins did. She was never good enough for some and too much off a diva for others. The reason Louisville and Stanford don't get picked on is they aren't perceived as legit threats. During the Diggins era, the Irish were a very worthy opponent who got the best of the Huskies more often than many in this forum liked. It's natural to "go after" your enemies. With that being said, it's not that I (others) see the LV's as a legit threat, they definitely are not, but that I (others) are do not respect the views of their fan base, and love to poke holes in their arguments and point out their illogical thinking in general. LV fans don't know what they don't know and it's too tempting not to clue them in.

As far as saying it to their face, I have no problem doing so with the people I am addressing/replying to like stwainfan and VolFan as well as all the lurkers from The Summitt including TinyVol, Orange007, Vol720, sheilafrostfan and prophet1 just to name a few. I am not speaking to players like Simmons or Russell. This forum is no different than sports talk radio where "constructive comments" are shared in "discussions" by many every day.

So, using your logic, if I'm angry with you it's OK with you if I insult your parents, spouse and kids?

 

[Zorro]

It will be very interesting to see how they fare against Stanford and Kentucky.

 

[Stray Cat]

So, using your logic, if I'm angry with you it's OK with you if I insult your parents, spouse and kids?

Sure fire away, provided I drag them into the conversation first, by busting into your house and discussing their talents, accomplishments and honors in comparison to your kids and other students nationally.

And it doesn't have to do with anger, some of us on here just like to "debate" issues. In fact, DD is the most accomplished Master Debater I know. But I digress. Rarely, do I make a statement that I do not at least attempt to support. And rarely do I initiate threads...I generally reply to statements I do not agree with or that are poorly supported.

"See, man, that's the difference between us. You think we're fighting, I think we're finally talking!" -- Rod Tidwell

 

[doggydaddy]

One thing continually brought up is that we haven't played anybody. Many teams we scheduled we thought would be top 25 ranked but aren't. However that doesn't diminish that they are quality teams. Chattanooga, MTSU, Georgia Tech, and Texas are all or have been at some point receiving sign gigabit amounts of votes for the Top 25 and will all be tournament teams. Not to mention, Mulkey backed out of coming to Knoxville so we had to replace that game with Oakland because the big programs already had their schedules filled. We still play Stanford, Notre Dame, Kentucky, SCar, LSU, Georgia, and Texas A&M who are all Top 25, so we will see our fair share.

I guess we will just have to disagree on what a quality team is. Winning by the margins they did against Virginia and GTech is not impressive for a #3 team.

And against this schedule their stats are quite unremarkable,

 

[doggydaddy]

So, using your logic, if I'm angry with you it's OK with you if I insult your parents, spouse and kids?

I don't believe that compares to calling a player slow and plodding.

 

[Phil]

I'd like to publicly apologize to Mercedes Russell for using her very normal learning curve as a freshman post as a vehicle to tease Tennessee fans. I meant no harm to her and if that was how this ended up as a thread, I'm sorry.

Nicely done. I felt some of the comments were really directed at the kool-aid kids who thought MR was the second coming of Parker. It isn't really her fault that some fans had unrealistic expectations, and it is unfortunate that attempts to tweak the LV fans came across as criticism of Mercedes.

 

[Stray Cat]

One thing continually brought up is that we haven't played anybody. Many teams we scheduled we thought would be top 25 ranked but aren't. However that doesn't diminish that they are quality teams. Chattanooga, MTSU, Georgia Tech, and Texas are all or have been at some point receiving sign gigabit amounts of votes for the Top 25 and will all be tournament teams. Not to mention, Mulkey backed out of coming to Knoxville so we had to replace that game with Oakland because the big programs already had their schedules filled. We still play Stanford, Notre Dame, Kentucky, SCar, LSU, Georgia, and Texas A&M who are all Top 25, so we will see our fair share.

Agree that sometimes good intentions in the scheduling arena aren't always realized. Playing "quality" opponents is one thing...defeating elite opponents is another. Please name the elite non-conference opponents the LV's have defeated in the past five seasons. It's kind of difficult to defeat elite opponents when you can't even advance to the Final Four.

Things that make you go hmmm!

 

[doggydaddy]

Nicely done. I felt some of the comments were really directed at the kool-aid kids who thought MR was the second coming of Parker. It isn't really her fault that some fans had unrealistic expectations, and it is unfortunate that attempts to tweak the LV fans came across as criticism of Mercedes.

I've seen a few Tennessee games this year. I was surprised how slow Russell got up and down the court. I'm wondering how to discuss that on this board. It feels like criticizing players in any way is a no no now.

 

[Icebear]

I've seen a few Tennessee games this year. I was surprised how slow Russell got up and down the court. I'm wondering how to discuss that on this board. It feels like criticizing players in any way is a no no now.

Yes, she does not run the court well. I am not sure of her conditioning but that is true of many freshmen and especially so of posts.

 

[Phil]

One thing continually brought up is that we haven't played anybody. Many teams we scheduled we thought would be top 25 ranked but aren't. However that doesn't diminish that they are quality teams. Chattanooga, MTSU, Georgia Tech, and Texas are all or have been at some point receiving sign gigabit amounts of votes for the Top 25 and will all be tournament teams. Not to mention, Mulkey backed out of coming to Knoxville so we had to replace that game with Oakland because the big programs already had their schedules filled. We still play Stanford, Notre Dame, Kentucky, SCar, LSU, Georgia, and Texas A&M who are all Top 25, so we will see our fair share.

You probably know there's a bit of history involved. Not all of us were as smart as Nan, who made the correct decision to avoid the Purina styled site. Those of us that couldn't tear our eyes from the train wreck endured years of color coded commentary putting forth the proposition that UConn, who typcially had a top five Strength of Schedule, was actually playing cupcakes. And unless you were playing the very toughest schedule ever, you should just shut-up. No excuses allowed. Not acceptable that Geno had to play the bottom of the Big East Conference, who were weaker than the bottom of the SEC. No allowances for continuing long-time scheduling agreements, even when the other team was not very strong. Not acceptable to arrange a home team visit for a senior if that team wasn't top-drawer.

So with that context, when we see the "explanation" of why the current LV schedule isn't as tough as it used to be, it is tempting to ... but I won't. Your explanation makes sense.

 

[doggydaddy]

So with that context, when we see the "explanation" of why the current LV schedule isn't as tough as it used to be, it is tempting to ... but I won't. Your explanation makes sense.

Well, makes sense for Baylor. Not sure which teams were scheduled that were thought to be top 25 teams and ended up not that good. Texas? MTSU? GTEch? I don't think so.

One of the weaker Tennessee schedules. No matter what the reason. I would say that they haven't performed so well against it even in winning.

 

[VAMike23]

I'd be lying if I said Meighan doesn't frustrate me. We will see a lot more Carter and Reynolds throughout the year. Not sure on Carter's season numbers, but she has been a deadly shooter. Problem is, she rarely shoots. That needs to change. Meighan was efficient shooting last game but Holly was vocally displeased with her turnovers. This team can be very good but our zone offense has to get way better and we can't start slow because teams like Stanford, Notre Dame won't let us come back. I am glad that Holly addressed free throws and layups last press conference. That's the difference is us winning and dominating. I think we are getting better but there is much work to be done before we can declare we are Final Four bound. We first need to get a No. 1 seed which means winning 2 of 3 between Stanford, Notre Dame and Kentucky.

I think the problem is more systemic, and it's mainly coaching.

How many times in the last year or two has Holly herself said, "We haven't practiced offense" or words to that effect?

And, although the defense and rebounding is better (IMO) than the offensive efficiency, it hasn't been nearly what it was in the past despite the presence of some very good (highly rated) talent year in and year out. Even if you just start with Massengale's class, they have gotten highly rated talent. Just as an aside, to stress that this is about coaching and not players, I really think Graves is excellent and Ariel is having a strong year so far. As two examples.

But shooting % is low and assists are low compared to the most successful teams (not just UCONN) and games like last year's Louisville game in the tournament show that UT is just not getting it done at the level that they should--getting stops, coming up big when they most need to, etc.

I think UT will be a good team but never a great team as long as the current coaching staff is there. Holly is not going to change her stripes all that much. Yes she's a newly-minted HC but she is not a newly-minted coach. And the problems with offense pre-date her as well. She just hasn't done very much to improve the situation.

It will be interesting to watch them against Stanford. That will tell us a lot about this year's LV vintage.

 

[Justavisitor]

Stray Cat



UTenn has a tradition of anointing there future stars before they arrive.
Massengale was trumpeted as being the team's savior.
Didn't quite work out.

Massengale is on Naismith watch list, one of the top point guards in the country, and is having a terrific year. She was the NCAA player of the month in November. Looks to be working out just fine.


Averaging 14 pts. on 42% fg (45% from 3), 6.6 assist per game, and 2 steals per game

 

[LadyVolFan]

Does anyone on this board remember Stef's ability to run the floor as a freshman? Yes Mercedes can and will improve, just trying to put things into perspective with regards to freshman posts coming out of high school.

 

[doggydaddy]

Does anyone on this board remember Stef's ability to run the floor as a freshman? Yes Mercedes can and will improve, just trying to put things into perspective with regards to freshman posts coming out of high school.

One ranked #1 and one ranked in the 30's coming out of HS.

Expectations are quite different.

 

[Stray Cat]

One ranked #1 and one ranked in the 30's coming out of HS.

Expectations are quite different.

Plus, one player lost a lot of weight during her four years and one player needs to gain some (muscle) weight. Different issues here. Plus what DD said.

 

[doggydaddy]

Massengale is on Naismith watch list, one of the top point guards in the country, and is having a terrific year. She was the NCAA player of the month in November. Looks to be working out just fine.


Averaging 14 pts. on 42% fg (45% from 3), 6.6 assist per game, and 2 steals per game

Glad you found the one poster that said something bad about Massengale. The rest noted her improved play.

 

[Bayareahusky]

It is interesting seeing all the varied opinions here.... including those of fans from Duke, KY, LV Nation, etc.... the perspectives are intriguing. This thead being bout Tenn..... I like their team.... a couple of bangers up front who can play.... and I have been impressed this year especially with Massengale.... I think and have always thougt for all her time there that Simmons is a liability (when has she won a significant game forthem in 4 yrs?) and Russell is green..... Wow.... with her lack of running the floor.... that is a big hole..... not to mention transition basketball.... what about simply getting back on defense for normal sets? but, as my previous posts have said.... I am sure she will develop fully I time..... I bleed National Flag Blue, but I am not an LV hater.... just a realist and at this point a real skeptic.... I will be watching and taking scrupulous notes when they play vs good comp. e.g. Stanford , ND..... I really question the coaching staff in general.... and their ability to develop ....Exhibit 1 may be Simmons..... in 4 years.... I would think she would have improved more than she has..... she has come a little..... but not enough to warrant a starting position.... at least playing the way she has been..... just my 2 cents

 

[VolFan]

I will say Mercedes has scored extremely efficiently against the man defense when she has gotten the minutes. The problem is getting the ball inside when teams play zone on us. That is what she has struggled most with. As the team continues to put the zone offense in place, I think you'll see Mercedes scoring output rise. I will note, though, she is not a very good rebounder. That stems, again, from her lack of aggressiveness which will come in time.

 

[LadyVolFan]

I think most would agree that Mercedes would be starting in nearly all programs in the nation except the top 5 or so. This speaks to the production that Izzy has had on the floor this year. Mercedes will be fine but whether or not she becomes the dominant post that many hope for remains to be seen. We all know the learning curve for posts in the college game is much steeper than that of guards. Candace is one of the few exceptions in this category, but lets not forget she was in college a full year before stepping onto the court.

 

[Stray Cat]

I will note, though, she is not a very good rebounder. That stems, again, from her lack of aggressiveness which will come in time.

Sounds simple enough...but if you aren't naturally aggressive, it's not something Mercedes can necessarily teach herself. She is in large part, a product of her coaches, past and current.

Once again, it comes back to coaching or lack there of at Tenn. When are LV fans going to realize this and demand some accountability and/or a change?

And why do LV fans refuse to answer questions like this? I have been harping on Simmons for not ever boxing out her defender when a shot goes up. That is just basic basketball. Why is this individual behavior tolerated in a team sport? Whether she is not being taught to do so or simply refuses to do so, both are COACHING ISSUES. Don't tell me for second that Geno would have any of this.

Would some LV fan(s) PLEASE answer my questions.

 

[HuskyNan]

I've seen a few Tennessee games this year. I was surprised how slow Russell got up and down the court. I'm wondering how to discuss that on this board. It feels like criticizing players in any way is a no no now.

Oh please. I object to people making undue criticism of Mercedes because they don't like the team she plays for, and you know it. It's not like you to play the victim card.

I'm tired of the LVs. It's a rare week that the Boneyard doesn't have a Tennessee thread. And to all those folks that claim the Boneyard resides on a lofty peak because we don't trash other people and team's players here - you just killed that premise once and for all.

 

[HuskyNan]

Sounds simple enough...but if you aren't naturally aggressive, it's not something Mercedes can necessarily teach herself. She is in large part, a product of her coaches, past and current.

Once again, it comes back to coaching or lack there of at Tenn. When are LV fans going to realize this and demand some accountability and/or a change?

And why do LV fans refuse to answer questions like this? I have been harping on Simmons for not ever boxing out her defender when a shot goes up. That is just basic basketball. Why is this individual behavior tolerated in a team sport? Whether she is not being taught to do so or simply refuses to do so, both are COACHING ISSUES. Don't tell me for second that Geno would have any of this.

Would some LV fan(s) PLEASE answer my questions.

You need to view more wcbb teams. UConn, ND, Stanford, Duke and maybe a dozen more are rare in their ability to play a pretty game. Most teams out there are simply ugly to watch. Tennessee isn't unusual in its shortcomings, sadly, it's come back to the pack.

 

[doggydaddy]

Oh please. I object to people making undue criticism of Mercedes because they don't like the team she plays for, and you know it. It's not like you to play the victim card.

I'm tired of the LVs. It's a rare week that the Boneyard doesn't have a Tennessee thread. And to all those folks that claim the Boneyard resides on a lofty peak because we don't trash other people and team's players here - you just killed that premise once and for all.

Saying Russell is slow getting up and down the court is not trashing. Not in any way.

And while I apologized for using her poor performance in the last game to tweak the LV fans, I did NOT trash her.

If that is playing the victim, so be it. I still love ya.

 

[doggydaddy]

You need to view more wcbb teams. UConn, ND, Stanford, Duke and maybe a dozen more are rare in their ability to play a pretty game. Most teams out there are simply ugly to watch. Tennessee isn't unusual in its shortcomings, sadly, it's come back to the pack.

Totally agree. But the fans of the other teams playing ugly ball don't come here to tell us how wonderful they are.

But I will take a Tennessee moratorium. Not sure how long it will last.

Starting...........NOW!

 

[Phil]

Sounds simple enough...but if you aren't naturally aggressive, it's not something Mercedes can necessarily teach herself. She is in large part, a product of her coaches, past and current.

Once again, it comes back to coaching or lack there of at Tenn. When are LV fans going to realize this and demand some accountability and/or a change?

And why do LV fans refuse to answer questions like this? I have been harping on Simmons for not ever boxing out her defender when a shot goes up. That is just basic basketball. Why is this individual behavior tolerated in a team sport? Whether she is not being taught to do so or simply refuses to do so, both are COACHING ISSUES. Don't tell me for second that Geno would have any of this.

Would some LV fan(s) PLEASE answer my questions.

Unlike Nan, I don't mind threads about the LVs. They are a top 10 team, and very much a part of the national discussion. However, this is a UConn site, not n LV site, and I think it is quite inappropriate to suggest that LV fans have any responsibility to post here, and they are not obligated to use this forum to address issues you have.

If you want to exhort fans to do your bidding, I urge you to sign up for an account at the LV's place.

 

[Bayareahusky]

VolFanand LdyVolFan.... I think we are in agreement on Russell in that she will mature in her time... and izzy has played a good role....

I hope the criticism of the critiquing of Mercedes doesn't involve me.... I had said thatshe looks painfully slow getting up and down floor.... this is honestcriticism..... but I harbor her no ill will....

As a follower of Tara's team out here as well as my Huskies.... 12/21 will prove interesting

 

[HuskyNan]

Saying Russell is slow getting up and down the court is not trashing. Not in any way.

And while I apologized for using her poor performance in the last game to tweak the LV fans, I did NOT trash her.

If that is playing the victim, so be it. I still love ya.

Well, I love you too, you big goof. And I never said it was you trashing Mercedes.

I was confused about one post, though, when a UConn fan called her "plundering". I thought he meant "lumbering" but he could have been saying she's a pirate. Either way, it didn't sound appropriate. I remember the worst of Creamsicleville calling Kara Wolters lumbering years ago and found it demeaning and childish in the extreme. It made me unhappy to see it implied here.

My defense of Mercedes, who seems like a nice kid, is only because I think adults (ahem) should leave the youngsters out of their squabbles. As highly ranked as she is, I wouldn't trade any of our NCAA-best froncourt for her, not Morgan or Stef or Kiah or Breanna. I wish Mercedes well, and understand her struggles as a freshman post player with the weight of expectations riding on her shoulders, but I hope she gets schooled should UConn and Tennessee meet. Nothing personal.