UConn -- Gay Hockey Players are Welcome

[babysheep]

Did the women mind when you looked at their and wahoosies?
If not, I should have gone to BU.

So, what, you should be afraid of a gay guy seeing your ass?

Are gay men unable to resist from looking if they are asked by the staff and/or players to respect other players' privacies (which should be the policy for both gay and straight hetero players already anyway)? Because I'm sure that that is what everyone at BU was asked to do/knew to do out of simple courtesy and I'm sure things went fine most of the time.

 

[Frank Ivy]

I don't understand this statement. Are you saying that gays are not equal in value or significance to straights?

You're doing exactly what I said my issue was.
I'm saying that gay people, as individuals, are entitled to the same legal rights as non-gays. Shouldn't that be enough?

I'm insulted for having the opinion that two guys getting it on is eeew?

See the point? The point is, many gay people don't just want equal rights. They also want to be viewed as one equivalent variation of several possibilities. And, if you don't accept that position, you are vilified, even if you completely support their equal treatment under the law, as I do.

Does that help?

The result, of course, culturally, is that some gay people don't just want equal access to marriage, military, and such - what some want is to change the culture so that people don't view homosexuality as a disturbing/repulsive aberration.

I absolutely support the rights of gays, but I also absolutely support the rights of people to be disturbed/offended by the behavior. Many gays don't support that 2nd right.

An example of where this becomes a battleground is, for example, in the public classrooms, where some gay advocates would want to move the curriculum toward materials that normalize gay relationships and present it as an equivalent variation to heterosexual interaction to young children. The problem, of course, is that many people view homosexuality as an aberration, not a variation, and they would not want their children subjected to that curriculum.

There's your fight right there.

That's not equal treatment under the law - that's equal treatment under the culture. That's the real battle that's being fought - the marriage thing is simply one trench in that war.

 

[Frank Ivy]

Are gay men unable to resist from looking if they are asked by the staff and/or players to respect other players' privacies (which should be the policy for both gay and straight hetero players already anyway)?

This is just naive. If a dude was mixed in with the UCLA volleyball women's team for changing/showering, you really think asking him to "not look" would take care of the discomfort of the women?

All right, that's it. We're straying from light hearted.

 

[BigErnMcCracken]

The result, of course, culturally, is that some gay people don't just want equal access to marriage, military, and such - what some want is to change the culture so that people don't view homosexuality as a disturbing/repulsive aberration.

Imagine that. You sound like a ******* dinosaur. It's actually kind of pitiable. You sound like someone who woke up in the 1950s and was inadvertantly transported to 2012. And the fact that you're so strident in your opinions makes it sadder.

 

[babysheep]

I absolutely support the rights of gays, but I also absolutely support the rights of people to be disturbed/offended by the behavior. Many gays don't support that 2nd right.

What if I'm disgusted by mentally dumb children? What if I live in the South and am still disgusted by black people? What do you think of the possibility that many gay people find your heterosexual desires disgusting?

 

[Frank Ivy]

What do you think of the possibility that many gay people find your heterosexual desires disgusting?

That's the beauty of it man - I expect that many do find my sexual preferences disgusting - and I completely support their right to have that opinion, and I wouldn't for a second dream of trying to force them to believe that my idea of fun sex is good or better than theirs. In other words, I wouldn't try to change the culture to force them to accept me as I am.

Didn't expect that, did you?

 

[Frank Ivy]

What if I live in the South and am still disgusted by black people?

You're entitled to your racist opinions - as long as you don't try to foist them on me. Frankly, I don't view the world as full of races, but rather full of people - but if you want to hate whatever group, that's your right, and I support it, and I wouldn't want to try to brainwash your kids to believe what I believe, which is that all are entitled to equal treatment under the law, regardless of any physical characteristic (or sex orientation).

 

[Frank Ivy]

Imagine that. You sound like a ******* dinosaur. It's actually kind of pitiable. You sound like someone who woke up in the 1950s and was inadvertantly transported to 2012. And the fact that you're so strident in your opinions makes it sadder.

Actually, no. It's like I woke up in some future world, where people are free to live as they please, and hold whatever views they want, as long as they're not hurting anybody else, and people respect the right of others to differ in opinion, and I got transplanted back to this place, where people like you tell me that I'm a bad person for being physically repulsed by the image of two men getting it on. I'm bad, in essence, because our creator made me this way. It's not right or wrong - I'm attracted to women. That's the way it is. I'm also repulsed by fat women, much the same as gay men interaction.

I'm a bad person to you because I was born this way. And you would insult me because of how my brain was wired when I was born. What does that sound like? Sounds like you're doing exactly what gay people say you shouldn't do to them - judge them for their sexual preferences that are hard wired.

Shame on you.

 

[upstater]

Maybe my entire football and rugby team were gay, but I'm pretty sure guys looked at each other.

 

[MattMang23]

Maybe my entire football and rugby team were gay, but I'm pretty sure guys looked at each other.

That's called checkin out the competition.

 

[babysheep]

That's the beauty of it man - I expect that many do find my sexual preferences disgusting - and I completely support their right to have that opinion, and I wouldn't for a second dream of trying to force them to believe that my idea of fun sex is good or better than theirs. In other words, I wouldn't try to change the culture to force them to accept me as I am.

Didn't expect that, did you?

You are so incredibly ignorant it's hilarious, and yes I expected you to try to make yourself look like you care.

You don't care because the overall culture of America isn't heterophobic and does not spawn hate against you. That is why gay people want to change American culture. Are you offended by the civil rights movement? Because Dr. Martin Luther King Jr. wanted to change American culture as a whole so that people of all races could eventually love each other and coexist peacefully. Obviously the situation for gays is different than it was (and still is) for blacks but both want the same thing, and there's no reason for them to not want people to love them and get along with them.

 

[phillionaire]

That's the beauty of it man - I expect that many do find my sexual preferences disgusting - and I completely support their right to have that opinion, and I wouldn't for a second dream of trying to force them to believe that my idea of fun sex is good or better than theirs. In other words, I wouldn't try to change the culture to force them to accept me as I am.

Didn't expect that, did you?

Being a straight white male in America is literally like being a Jew in 1939 Germany

 

[caw]

Frank,

I somewhat agree, you should have the right to your beliefs. You shouldn't be criticized for not watching a movie.

I don't think you are expressing yourself well on the topic of "equivalent".

 

[caw]

Being a straight white male in America is literally like being a Jew in 1939 Germany

Just no.

 

[joober jones]

Why is this even news? Last I knew, gay people could play hockey anywhere.

 

[SeattleHoop]

You are so incredibly ignorant it's hilarious, and yes I expected you to try to make yourself look like you care.

You don't care because the overall culture of America isn't heterophobic and does not spawn hate against you. That is why gay people want to change American culture. Are you offended by the civil rights movement? Because Dr. Martin Luther King Jr. wanted to change American culture as a whole so that people of all races could eventually love each other and coexist peacefully. Obviously the situation for gays is different than it was (and still is) for blacks but both want the same thing, and there's no reason for them to not want people to love them and get along with them.

Both of you make good points actually but go too far. I think it's fine that homosexuals want to change American culture and views towards homosexuality. It's making progress too. For example have you seen "Modern Family"? I don't watch it regularly but the gay couple in the show are my two favorite characters and I see them as "normal". That is just one small example. So trying to change culture is fine imo. Not too mention I have had gay friends that I find really cool and "normal". However, getting angry because someone doesn't agree with your views is absolutely wrong. This is where I agree with Frank. I think having sex with another man is gross. I just do. I can think it is gross if I want. Just like a homosexual thinks heterosexuality is gross, I think having sex with another dude is weird. In fact, the majority of the world will always see it that way, because most of the world is heterosexual. Homosexuals are the minority. There culture can be accepted as normal but the act of homosexuality will ALWAYS be seen as different by many people because most people are attracted to the opposite sex. Accept them, YES. Equal rights, YES. Let them teach their culture, YES. Agree with them, YOUR CHOICE.

 

[Sportsman5]

I think Frank's analogy about religion is fairly accurate. You can support people to live their lives how they want without completely agreeing with it. I'm not gay, but my brother is and some friends are. I completely support them in whatever they want to do, who they date, what they do in their bedroom. I try to be as accepting as I can, but I still prefer not to shower with a gay person. I also think that most of my female friends would prefer not to shower with me next to them. It seems like a reasonable viewpoint to me.
The bottom line for me is that you can do whatever you want in your life as long as it doesn't involve me in any way. If it involves me directly, than I have the right to be involved with a choice. For example, if a man says that he will play on the same soccer team with a women, but due to religious reasons he will not shower next to them, than it seems reasonable to accommodate that request. I don't see much of a difference between that and a hockey player saying that I will play on the same team as a gay man, but I won't shower next to them due to my beliefs (religious or other).
If someone thinks I am a bigot for this belief, than you must be a crazy hippie who thinks our current culture is totally screwed up I support your opinion, but still think you are a crazy hippie

 

[Frank Ivy]

You are so incredibly ignorant . . . there's no reason for them to not want people to love them and get along with them.

Nah. I'm not ignorant, if you mean that to be "uninformed, uneducated." If you mean "I don't like your views," then yes.
Whether they want people to love them is beside the point.
I don't love or hate homosexual men more or less than anybody else.
I don't care about them more or less than anybody else.

It's as simple as this - they don't have a right to try to force me or anybody else to "love them." In your view, apparently, that should be the goal. In my view, live and let live.

I find the sexual interaction between men to be off putting.
Is that what your issue is with me?
You view that as ignorant?

That's just you trying to force your culture on my biology. You're not different (although you think you are) from the religious nuts trying to tell gay people that they should change and not be gay.

 

[ShakyTheMohel]

Frank,

I somewhat agree, you should have the right to your beliefs. You shouldn't be criticized for not watching a movie.

I don't think you are expressing yourself well on the topic of "equivalent".

Exactly. It is the equivalent piece.

 

[8893]

I don't get the big deal. Our field hockey team has been welcoming lesbians for as long as I can remember.

 

[Rico444]

Frank,

quit being so gay.

 

[upstater]

Both of you make good points actually but go too far. I think it's fine that homosexuals want to change American culture and views towards homosexuality. It's making progress too. For example have you seen "Modern Family"? I don't watch it regularly but the gay couple in the show are my two favorite characters and I see them as "normal". That is just one small example. So trying to change culture is fine imo. Not too mention I have had gay friends that I find really cool and "normal". However, getting angry because someone doesn't agree with your views is absolutely wrong. This is where I agree with Frank. I think having sex with another man is gross. I just do. I can think it is gross if I want. Just like a homosexual thinks heterosexuality is gross, I think having sex with another dude is weird. In fact, the majority of the world will always see it that way, because most of the world is heterosexual. Homosexuals are the minority. There culture can be accepted as normal but the act of homosexuality will ALWAYS be seen as different by many people because most people are attracted to the opposite sex. Accept them, YES. Equal rights, YES. Let them teach their culture, YES. Agree with them, YOUR CHOICE.

I do think it says more about you than most. I mean, no one is asking you to imagine yourself getting it on, unless those are your desires. Most people are simply relaxed and fine with the type of normal affection (kissing, groping, hugging) we see in public all the time. That's it. And no, I don't think most gays are grossed out by straights kissing and hugging, and a great many straights I know feel the same way (about the reverse).

Then again, there are lots of straights who freak out at public affection between straights, and some gay and straights are probably distressed by breast-feeding, and nipples, and all sorts of sexuality. Personally, I think this isn't natural at all and it's all a sign of some hangup. (DUCKS)

 

[Kitaman]

At least Rudy's kids will one day get a full scholarship.

 

[phillionaire]

Just no.

it's called sarcasm broseph