UConn and stealing..

[Guapo]

They need to compare subsidies for UConn to subsidies from other states. Is it out of kilter?

This morning I read private contractors are making $750 per child per day housing separated refugee children. Is Fasano up in arms?

The question I have from the Fasano quote that I think cuts to the heart of the matter is the following:

What are UConn’s means and who sets those parameters?

We hear people say all the time that “UConn is not living within its means” but that is a totally meaningless statement unless we understand what those means are.

This requires us to have a conversation about how to view UConn’s place in the state.

I happen to believe that it’s very smart for states to aggressively promote and maintain their flagship schools. I would point to North Carolina and Georgia has places where the impact of doing that has really paid off. I also believe that cutting UConn to the bone (l realize people like @whaler11 are not arguing for this BUT there are definitely people who do want to do that, like Fasano) will tremdously hurt the long term prospects for the state.

There are not a lot of things currently drawing people to Connecticut but UConn is one of those rare things that are. It is a resounding success for a state that has messed up so many other things and I shudder to think what the state of the state would be now had projects like UConn 2000 not been undertaken.

 

[CL82]

You’ve got examples of people who make 200k being dead for 9 months and nobody notices?

Yes there aren’t enough adminstrators at UConn Health... that’s it.

C'mon it was only one time... Who hasn't paid a dead employee for 9 months?

 

[intlzncster]

What's the subsidy for research at UConn? They take 60% for general funding. Where do these research funds sit in the overall mix? 20% 30% 40% If the budget is a billion, and research is $250m, then 60% of that gets swept into the general fund.

You're asking the wrong guy upstater. It's my general consensus that academics*, and even more so, university administrators make far too much money. There's so much bloat at schools it's insane.

*I come from a family of them, so I don't have a huge bias one way or another

 

[intlzncster]

Ya, all good 'cept most employers want to see (proof of) that degree. Kind of a racket though.

I get that, I do. But I do think the attitude is changing, even if it's slow. For example, you see a lot of tech guys able to jump in after 6 month intensive comp courses. Skills should be a priority, not a piece of paper.

University works for people who are going into medicine, law, science, research, etc. And English teachers. Everything else is pretty much useless.

 

[whaler11]

We hear people say all the time that “UConn is not living within its means” but that is a totally meaningless statement unless we understand what those means are.

This requires us to have a conversation about how to view UConn’s place in the state.

I happen to believe that it’s very smart for states to aggressively promote and maintain their flagship schools. I would point to North Carolina and Georgia has places where the impact of doing that has really paid off. I also believe that cutting UConn to the bone (l realize people like @whaler11 are not arguing for this BUT there are definitely people who do want to do that, like Fasano) will tremdously hurt the long term prospects for the state.

There are not a lot of things currently drawing people to Connecticut but UConn is one of those rare things that are. It is a resounding success for a state that has messed up so many other things and I shudder to think what the state of the state would be now had projects like UConn 2000 not been undertaken.

No matter what you consider the value... there is no money.

The SALT changes are going to make that even more stark because the high-income residents have even more reason to leave now.

The entire state budget is going to get swallowed whole by the pension liability. UConn’s funding is going to gradually move to zero barring an absolute miracle.

 

[Guapo]

I get that, I do. But I do think the attitude is changing, even if it's slow. For example, you see a lot of tech guys able to jump in after 6 month intensive comp courses. Skills should be a priority, not a piece of paper.

University works for people who are going into medicine, law, science, research, etc. And English teachers. Everything else is pretty much useless.

An education for education sake is worth something.

I have my history degree from UConn. I do nothing involving history, yet the critical thinking skills I developed while in school have been invaluable to me.

Believe it or not, you can’t learn everything there is to know, much less know how to process that information, just by reading Wikipedia.

 

[Guapo]

No matter what you consider the value... there is no money.

The SALT changes are going to make that even more stark because the high-income residents have even more reason to leave now.

The entire state budget is going to get swallowed whole by the pension liability. UConn’s funding is going to gradually move to zero barring an absolute miracle.

So the state is just going to cease to exist?

 

[intlzncster]

An education for education sake is worth something.

I have my history degree from UConn. I do nothing involving history, yet the critical thinking skills I developed while in school have been invaluable to me.

Believe it or not, you can’t learn everything there is to know, much less know how to process that information, just by reading Wikipedia.

Not at the price they are charging. $5-10k max per year, with the same ability to receive grants/scholarships.

I'm not talking about wikipedia either come on. I'm talking about real, online education with professors.

 

[intlzncster]

I imagine the way presidents operate today they see entire parts of the university as fungible. Sure, just axe entire academic disciplines and install e-sports! Who cares??!

E-sports makin' money tho. Just sayin'

 

[whaler11]

So the state is just going to cease to exist?

How is not being able to fund higher ed the same thing as not existing?

The state got saved this year when they got a huge one time windfall because the feds closed a loophole that forced hedge funds billionaires to pay taxes on money accumulating off-shore.

They have 127 billion and growing in unfunded pension liability and the wealthiest families are trickling out of state every month.

36% of the state income tax comes from 10 towns and 51% of the state’s revenue is from the income tax....

19-20 already projects to a 2 billion deficit - and since any tax increase is going to be self-defeating so start looking for non-higher ed spending that isn’t fixed costs... good luck.

 

[the Q]

How is not being able to fund higher ed the same thing as not existing?

The state got saved this year when they got a huge one time windfall because the feds closed a loophole that forced hedge funds billionaires to pay taxes on money accumulating off-shore.

They have 127 billion and growing in unfunded pension liability and the wealthiest families are trickling out of state every month.

36% of the state income tax comes from 10 towns and 51% of the state’s revenue is from the income tax....

19-20 already projects to a 2 billion deficit - and since any tax increase is going to be self-defeating so start looking for non-higher ed spending that isn’t fixed costs... good luck.

If these hedge funds move down south, ct would be in bad shape.

 

[intlzncster]

I happen to believe that it’s very smart for states to aggressively promote and maintain their flagship schools. I would point to North Carolina and Georgia has places where the impact of doing that has really paid off. I also believe that cutting UConn to the bone (l realize people like

North Carolina and UNC was smart enough to have an actual town be built up around it.

 

[upstater]

You're asking the wrong guy upstater. It's my general consensus that academics*, and even more so, university administrators make far too much money. There's so much bloat at schools it's insane.

*I come from a family of them, so I don't have a huge bias one way or another

Administrators is another story. As for academics, your average salary for tenured/tenure-track people at a place like UConn is around $75k (and that's with the $200k outliers). Incoming TT prof ($55k-60k), midcareer post tenure ($75k), full professor $90-100k). If you do the math, and consider when these people start jobs (early 30s), you're better off as a plumber starting at age 18 and averaging $40k throughout your life. Don't go into for the money.

As for bloat, there is huge administrative bloat. Administrative costs are up 400% in a decade. But as I said, this is a business school phenomenon foisted on academics who don't like it (obviously the 6 figure salary people like it). Still, these costs account for only 5% of the budget and don't at all explain the massive rise in tuition. If you dropped a neutron bomb that rids the world of administrators, you'd only have a 4% savings in the budget.

Considering we spend more money per kindergarten student than colleges spend per student, you can argue the teaching side is highly efficient, especially in the world of adjuncts. The only thing more efficient would be unpaid "interns." Many studies have indeed shown this.

 

[Guapo]

Administrators is another story. As for academics, your average salary for tenured/tenure-track people at a place like UConn is around $75k (and that's with the $200k outliers). Incoming TT prof ($55k-60k), midcareer post tenure ($75k), full professor $90-100k). If you do the math, and consider when these people start jobs (early 30s), you're better off as a plumber starting at age 18 and averaging $40k throughout your life. Don't go into for the money.

As for bloat, there is huge administrative bloat. Administrative costs are up 400% in a decade. But as I said, this is a business school phenomenon foisted on academics who don't like it (obviously the 6 figure salary people like it). Still, these costs account for only 5% of the budget and don't at all explain the massive rise in tuition. If you dropped a neutron bomb that rids the world of administrators, you'd only have a 4% savings in the budget.

Considering we spend more money per kindergarten student than colleges spend per student, you can argue the teaching side is highly efficient, especially in the world of adjuncts. The only thing more efficient would be unpaid "interns." Many studies have indeed shown this.

Oh man, you’re about to make some people’s heads explode.

 

[intlzncster]

Administrators is another story. As for academics, your average salary for tenured/tenure-track people at a place like UConn is around $75k (and that's with the $200k outliers). Incoming TT prof ($55k-60k), midcareer post tenure ($75k), full professor $90-100k). If you do the math, and consider when these people start jobs (early 30s), you're better off as a plumber starting at age 18 and averaging $40k throughout your life. Don't go into for the money.

Jeez, I've got a buddy who's an Asian Studies PhD (currently teaching at Oxford) who's getting offered $150k for his first spot in the US. Asian Studies.

Still, these costs account for only 5% of the budget and don't at all explain the massive rise in tuition. If you dropped a neutron bomb that rids the world of administrators, you'd only have a 4% savings in the budget.

Then where in the hell are the price increases coming from? Infrastructure arm race?

 

[upstater]

Jeez, I've got a buddy who's an Asian Studies PhD (currently teaching at Oxford) who's getting offered $150k for his first spot in the US. Asian Studies.

Then where in the hell are the price increases coming from? Infrastructure arm race?

It's been well established that the drop in state funding is met with an almost identical rise in tuition. If anything, the rise in tuition should be higher had they chosen to replace faculty leaving the profession (why? Technology adoption, higher health plan costs, more regulations and regulatory officers, more administrators). Instead they hire adjuncts. In 1990, U. California received $16k in funding per student from the state. In 2015 it received $9k in funding per student. A drop of $7k. Tuition rose from $3k to $12k. 400% increase.

 

[Travelman6]

I get that, I do. But I do think the attitude is changing, even if it's slow. For example, you see a lot of tech guys able to jump in after 6 month intensive comp courses. Skills should be a priority, not a piece of paper.

University works for people who are going into medicine, law, science, research, etc. And English teachers. Everything else is pretty much useless.

True and I wish I had gone that route (tech) too.

I don't know, I've parlayed a degree in sociology into a pretty nice gig teaching abroad in places like China, Colombia, Guatemala and now Mexico and have had serious talks and job offers from good schools in Thailand, Myanmar and Dominican Republic in the past. Some of these schools are very good schools (IB) including the one I currently work for. Any way, I guess if you have a degree in a field you did not mention it boils down to how you market yourself and finding clever ways to make use of that degree. In the US it was more of a struggle but I was still able to find decent stuff.