OT: Travelers Championship 2023

[Chin Diesel]

'Technology has passed this course by': Rory McIlroy calls TPC River Highlands obsolete

After an 18 under at the Travelers Championship, Rory McIlroy was unimpressed by TPC River Highlands, saying "technology has passed this course by."

sports.yahoo.com

I don't disagree with anything Rory said, but as him being "the face" of the tour these days I am wondering how much weight these comments will have as it relates to the event's status and placement next year when the schedule is finalized.

I personally think the course is now setup to be a perfect Champions Tour venue, as much I as hope that DOESN'T happen.

I brought up some of this stuff earlier about making the course more robust.

You can make the greens trickier by adding more hills and humps and running off more missed shots.

I would extend 10 to a Par 5, Make 11 a bit longer, and move tees back on 12 and 14. Add one stroke and about 180-200 yards. It's not just the added yards, it meams making them hit driver more often instead of 3-woods and long irons. More driver means less accuracy and more shots out of the rough which turns birdies in to pars.

I think it would be awesome if they could move 13's tee across the rail road track and add about 40-50 yards to thst hole as well.

I like 15/16/17 but 16 can use another 15-20 yards. Make them hit 5-6-7 iron instead of 8's and 9's.

Fialnally, do something about #9. Gotta do something to make cutting thst dog leg a major no no.

Truth be told, scores on Sunday were respectable but when the course is soft and wind is dead, everyone goes low.

 

[MJKI]

I brought up some of this stuff earlier about making the course more robust.

You can make the greens trickier by adding more hills and humps and running off more missed shots.

I would extend 10 to a Par 5, Make 11 a bit longer, and move tees back on 12 and 14. Add one stroke and about 180-200 yards. It's not just the added yards, it meams making them hit driver more often instead of 3-woods and long irons. More driver means less accuracy and more shots out of the rough which turns birdies in to pars.

I think it would be awesome if they could move 13's tee across the rail road track and add about 40-50 yards to thst hole as well.

I like 15/16/17 but 16 can use another 15-20 yards. Make them hit 5-6-7 iron instead of 8's and 9's.

Fialnally, do something about #9. Gotta do something to make cutting thst dog leg a major no no.

Truth be told, scores on Sunday were respectable but when the course is soft and wind is dead, everyone goes low.

I would extend 10 if possible but making it a par 5 does no help for the argument. It should be a much more stout par 4. Same with 1, 2. Guys shouldn’t have flip wedges into multiple 4s. Shave the rough on 15 to make anything left run into the water. Throw a center line bunker at 230-245 on 17 to make the tee shot more than a throw away. Let the tree on the left overhang more on 18 to avoid the bomb and gauge a bit and force a right to left shot shape.

 

[Punkbo]

As much as we don’t want to hear it, Rory is 100% correct. Even the pros don’t want a birdie fest. The course needs to be more challenging. Certainly lengthening the course without changing the par-70 layout would be a good start. But the biggest issue is the rough. The Tour doesn’t allow the course to grow out the rough for regular Tour events. Therefore, the rough is not nearly punitive enough for the world’s best players.

 

[Waquoit]

Golf is a bit like NASCAR these days. The technology has overwhelmed the playing area and has hurt the competition. The GHO/Traveler's has always had to fight off it becoming a birdie-fest. I'm sure they are brainstorming as we speak.

 

[Chin Diesel]

Golf is a bit like NASCAR these days. The technology has overwhelmed the playing area and has hurt the competition. The GHO/Traveler's has always had to fight off it becoming a birdie-fest. I'm sure they are brainstorming as we speak.

Again, Sunday wasn't too bad.

Bradley -2
Harman -6
Blair -8
Cantlay -3
Reavie +1
Scheffler -5
McCarthy -3
McIlroy -6
Min Woo Lee -3
JT -3
Connors -4

Those numbers aren't out of line with many other tournaments, including major championships.

The Thursday and Saturday scoring was were the course was defenseless. Soft fairways kept tee shots in the short stuff and iron shots in to the green, even from the fairway rough, stuck.

 

[Waquoit]

Again, Sunday wasn't too bad.


The Thursday and Saturday scoring was were the course was defenseless. Soft fairways kept tee shots in the short stuff and iron shots in to the green, even from the fairway rough, stuck.

I felt that this year was a bit of an anomaly with the 72 hole score.

 

[Umami Zen]

So Rory hits a 385 yd tee shot on 18 on Sunday.. Half wedge into green ..And pars the hole. Says course is obsolete because technology has passed it by.. Is a designated tournament per PGA.. One of the few complaints I heard.. If TPC wants to challenge the field more.. Better start buying real estate around the course when and if it becomes available for specific expansion. Considered one of the favorite Tour stops by players.

 

[Chin Diesel]

So Rory hits a 385 yd tee shot on 18 on Sunday.. Half wedge into green ..And pars the hole. Says course is obsolete because technology has passed it by.. Is a designated tournament per PGA.. One of the few complaints I heard.. If TPC wants to challenge the field more.. Better start buying real estate around the course when and if it becomes available for specific expansion. Considered one of the favorite Tour stops by players.

As far as real estate, do this. Move the path of field road to the west on the empty lot where there's parking by about 100'. Move the 9th tee to the current southwest corner of Field Rd and Golf Club Rd. extending #9 about 50 more yards back from the current tree.

Added benefit of having some more grass for fans around the current 8th green and a new 9th green tee area.

 

[Chin Diesel]

Another crude drawing.

#10 extend it to become a true dog leg left and add some yards to it. Then, take #11 and instead of playing 14 yards downhill and be a wedge or 9-iron, flatten it out and reverse the direction. That frees up 30-40 yards to make 12 a longer par 4 where more players have to hit driver instead of laying up.

Just need to re-route a maintenance road along the north edge of the property.

Obviously not drawn to scale bu there is plenty of room in those woods to re-make 10-12. Make it Cromwell's version of Amen Corner for all I care.

 

[nadav]

Interesting, Chin. They need to do something, seems like.

 

[Vuce]

Travelers Championship executive says agreement close on tournament being permanent designated event

The Travelers Championship likely will remain as a designated event on the PGA Tour with a no-cut field of no more than 80 players.

www.ctpost.com

Hopefully Rory's comments don't carry to much weight and Travelers can maintain the elevated event status. Some interesting tidbits in the article about what the future of an elevated event could look like.

I mentioned this earlier but the Travelers will be elevated again next year and beyond. Announcement within a month or so and it will remain the week following the US Open. As far as whether elevated events will have a cut or not, the Tour is working through those details now

 

[uconnfan68]

As much as we don’t want to hear it, Rory is 100% correct. Even the pros don’t want a birdie fest. The course needs to be more challenging. Certainly lengthening the course without changing the par-70 layout would be a good start. But the biggest issue is the rough. The Tour doesn’t allow the course to grow out the rough for regular Tour events. Therefore, the rough is not nearly punitive enough for the world’s best players.

Make it a par 68. Then lengthen it.

 

[Palatine]

There is plenty of room to toughen the course. #16 is an obvious spot. You could move the 16th green well back (over 200 yards) and to to the left. They should also shrink the green. The water almost never comes into play so you don't really lose any drama.

Fairway mounds or traps (or both) on #2. This hole is way too easy. It is defenseless at this point. A tougher second shot would be appropriate.

Make #11 a two tiered green.

A real golf designer could make minor adjustments on 4-6 holes and make this a much sterner test.

 

[Duncan Idaho]

Any official attendance numbers yet?

 

[huskymedic]

 

[uconnfan68]

There is plenty of room to toughen the course. #16 is an obvious spot. You could move the 16th green well back (over 200 yards) and to to the left. They should also shrink the green. The water almost never comes into play so you don't really lose any drama.

Fairway mounds or traps (or both) on #2. This hole is way too easy. It is defenseless at this point. A tougher second shot would be appropriate.

Make #11 a two tiered green.

A real golf designer could make minor adjustments on 4-6 holes and make this a much sterner test.

Pete Dye wasn’t a real golf designer?

 

[Palatine]

Pete Dye wasn’t a real golf designer?

He's dead. Could you miss the point more completely?

 

[uconngb]

Make it a par 68. Then lengthen it.

Yeah, um that’s never gonna happen

 

[uconngb]

He's dead. Could you miss the point more completely?

Not to mention the fact that his original design has been modified multiple times already. The original design was a DISASTER and one of the least favorite courses on tour.

 

[Palatine]

Travelers says changes are coming to TPC River Highlands after complaints over low scores

Changes will be made to the TPC River Highlands golf course after record low scoring last week during the PGA Tour’s annual Travelers Championship. Travelers Executive Vice President and Chie…

www.courant.com

 

[mauconnfan]

Obviously rain, soft courses assist these guys tremendously. They are playing darts again in Detroit at the Rocket Mortgage and the scores are even better than last week. Multiple players at -20 to -17 heading into the final day. 4 inches of rain the week heading in to this one left the courses defenses down like Cromwell.

I like Rory but he needs to be a little more careful with his frustrations after losing by 6 then proclaiming the course to be easy!

 

[Chin Diesel]

Obviously rain, soft courses assist these guys tremendously. They are playing darts again in Detroit at the Rocket Mortgage and the scores are even better than last week. Multiple players at -20 to -17 heading into the final day. 4 inches of rain the week heading in to this one left the courses defenses down like Cromwell.

I like Rory but he needs to be a little more careful with his frustrations after losing by 6 then proclaiming the course to be easy!

I was just going to male this comment.
Detroit CC is over 7300 yards and a Par 72. It's a non-elevated event meaning overall talent inbthe field is less than Travelers.

 

[Punkbo]

I was just going to male this comment.
Detroit CC is over 7300 yards and a Par 72. It's a non-elevated event meaning overall talent inbthe field is less than Travelers.

View attachment 89398

Different argument. Hadwin tied a course record with a 63 yesterday. Our course record is a 58. Two players shot 60 last week. Our course is too short and too easy.

 

[Chin Diesel]

Different argument. Hadwin tied a course record with a 63 yesterday. Our course record is a 58. Two players shot 60 last week. Our course is too short and too easy.

I agree TPC needs to get tougher. But it's far from the only clurse getting torn up.
A 63 on a Par 72 is -9. A 60 on a Par 70 is -10.

Detroit is a 72 and 500 yards longerd than River Highlands.

 

[Punkbo]

I agree TPC needs to get tougher. But it's far from the only clurse getting torn up.
A 63 on a Par 72 is -9. A 60 on a Par 70 is -10.

Detroit is a 72 and 500 yards longerd than River Highlands.

I think we’re on the same page. The difference between TPC River Highlands and every other course is Travelers is my local tournament. I used to cheer for guys with local connections like Ken Green, Jerry Kelly, Tim Petrovic, Pat Sheehan, Jay Williamson, JJ Henry, etc. Since there aren’t too many current PGA players with local ties, I cheer for the course. It’s rare nowadays that the course wins.

 

[uconnfan68]

He's dead. Could you miss the point more completely?

Failure to grasp sarcasm is a first step in developing Alzheimer's.

 

[Duncan Idaho]

I mentioned this earlier but the Travelers will be elevated again next year and beyond. Announcement within a month or so and it will remain the week following the US Open. As far as whether elevated events will have a cut or not, the Tour is working through those details now

Just saw it confirmed by the Tour schedule. Calling it one of the now "signature events" No cut. Jack's event week before the U.S. Open.

 

[Vuce]

Just saw it confirmed by the Tour schedule. Calling it one of the now "signature events" No cut. Jack's event week before the U.S. Open.

I heard this was coming back when I posted this from hints they were dropping at work from a few of the people that run the tournament. It’s going to remain a signature event for a while - love it!