Tom Izzo vs. Jim Boeheim | Page 2 | The Boneyard

Tom Izzo vs. Jim Boeheim

The most overrated coach in the country vs. the most underrated coach in the country
I don't see the Picker as being underrated in any sense of the word - for all the talent he has had along with the Dome and to win 1 championship because of a one and done freshman does not make someone a HoFer. But they look at longevity and to be somewhere for 40 plus years where he could go winless and not get fired, well that is job security.
Izzo is a complete enigma to me - he has teams with enough talent to be a competitive team in the NBA and has 1 championship. He is the biggest choke artist along with the Squid in the history of the sport. In addition, with all the talent that K has had he should be in double figure NCs.
 
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Boy, that Izzo sure is terrible. 21 consecutive NCAA tournament appearances. 7 Final Fours. 48-20 record in the NCAAs. Loser.
 
Jaren Jackson Jr has to be one the most polarizing prospects in recent memory. I can't believe this kid is supposed to be a Top 5 or 6 pick some days.

I know he's really young but I don't know if I could spend a high or mid lottery pick on him. I figured he'd give the Cuse zone an issue and shoot several threes over the top; nope. He was a complete non-factor.
 
UCDaveD said:
How is Jim Boeheim underrated? He’s in the Hall of Fame.
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To be clear, I think he's underrated by fans and possibly the media (the latter of which can be difficult to judge given how many Cuse grads are in the business).

Boeheim is something of a poor man's Calhoun in my estimation - both recruited the same sort of players, looked to instill the same traits in their teams, and preached toughness/rebounding/half-court defense above all else. I think there's the misconception that, because Boeheim plays a zone, his methodology is radically different than Calhoun's. It isn't. The principles of man and zone defense are very similar and it can be argued that in the college game they almost look like the exact same thing.

Incidentally, you'll find that as the quality of the sport diminishes, the zone becomes more appealing. I think that's why Boeheim has had so much success from 2010-onward. The idea that you beat a great zone with ball movement and shooting is a misnomer. You beat a great zone with great individual talent. There isn't as much great individual talent in the college game as there once was and he's reaped the benefits of that.

To the extent that his teams have come up short in recent years is because of his offense. It's not because the zone is a gimmick that gets exposed in the tournament or whatever other explanation people want to come up with. Since 2010 they've ranked 14th, 17th, 16th, 6th, 13th, 20th, 18th, 119th (outlier alert), and 5th in adjusted defense. That's incredible foresight, incredible teaching, and incredible coaching. He doesn't get the credit he deserves because people don't research this stuff (and that includes the majority of people who get paid to talk about this for a living), but the fact that he's a magician is tough to deny at this point.
 
Boeheim is a clown. Izzo is not overrated but he is not the coach he used to be. Another enigma.
 
Hard to root for either of these coaches knowing what we know now over the last few years. I knew UCONN was lucky to have Calhoun over the years just didn’t know the depth of how lucky they really were....
 
Lefty2one said:
Jaren Jackson Jr has to be one the most polarizing prospects in recent memory. I can't believe this kid is supposed to be a Top 5 or 6 pick some days.

I know he's really young but I don't know if I could spend a high or mid lottery pick on him. I figured he'd give the Cuse zone an issue and shoot several threes over the top; nope. He was a complete non-factor.
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Wasn't he in foul trouble for a decent portion of the game?

In Jackson's defense:

Jackson is #2 in the nation in Box Plus/Minus (behind Gary Clark) and defensive box plus/minus (behind Isaiah Wilkins), and is top 20 in Win Shares per 40 minutes. He's legitimately one of the best defenders in the country as a true frosh.

He shoots almost 40% from 3 and 80% from the line and can play the 4/5 spot on most nights.

to me, he's one of those guys who will probably be a better pro than a collegian.
 
that zone was impressive yesterday though, even the 3's were contested most of the time. But having said that, I don't know why (ego?) coaches don't find video of the way Calhoun coached against that thing, especially when he had a big that could pass. Okafor in the short corner, for example.
 
As great as Izzo is he is overrated, a part of me saying that is punishment for losing to Syracuse.
 
Scoe said:
As great as Izzo is he is overrated, a part of me saying that is punishment for losing to Syracuse.
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as bad as he was yesterday, getting that bad 2015 team to the FF was just amazing.
 
Lefty2one said:
Jaren Jackson Jr has to be one the most polarizing prospects in recent memory. I can't believe this kid is supposed to be a Top 5 or 6 pick some days.

I know he's really young but I don't know if I could spend a high or mid lottery pick on him. I figured he'd give the Cuse zone an issue and shoot several threes over the top; nope. He was a complete non-factor.
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Tim Thomas?
 
It seems like Syracuse opponents as the second half wears on, forget to go to the basket and begin settling for 3's as the shot clock expires. Even teams with talented bigs, the same pattern happens. I don't think it will happen when they play Duke.
 
8893 said:
Which one enabled/tolerated more sexual abuse?
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they're both one seeds in opposing protected brackets not slated to meet until the Sexual assault enabling Championship game. Could be a tight one.
 
August_West said:
they're both one seeds in opposing protected brackets not slated to meet until the Sexual assault enabling Championship game. Could be a tight one.
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Who is in Baylor’s half of the bracket?
 
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