TN ranking streak likely to end + And it does . . . (merged thread)

[j66kicker]

Not knocking the post, actually a good post. I will take the Husky high road though and say as much as I dislike Tenn, that was excruciating to watch. That is a broken woman, sad to say. She has had a long and storied career as a player and a coach but obviously way in over her head at this point.
Having said that I am obviously getting old and soft. A few years back I would have posted the video of DT punching the Tenn stanchion.

Geez - I wanted to take care of that for you, but I can't find a video. I was there at TBA that day - one of the greatest moments of my life. At least here is an article on the game...

http://www.nytimes.com/2002/01/06/s...-by-taurasi-uconn-is-no-1-by-a-long-shot.html

Key excerpt:

KNOXVILLE, Tenn., Jan. 5— Driving to the basket as top-ranked Connecticut was putting the finishing touches on a rout of No. 2 Tennessee today, Diana Taurasi made a layup and was fouled. She went over to the basket support, which was covered in Tennessee orange, and punched it with her left hand.

''I just wanted to hit something orange,'' she said after the Huskies defeated Tennessee, 86-72, before 24,611 fans at Thompson-Boling Arena.

It was the largest crowd to see a women's college basketball game, surpassing the 24,597 who watched these teams play here in 1998.

I have zero sympathy for today's LV, as I didn't that day when soph DT hung 32 on them.

 

[bballnut90]

Wow.. I knew Tennessee was loaded with talent but I didn't it was that much. Meanwhile, seems like Dawn is doing okay with considerably less talent. Aside from Coates in the 2013 class, our stars are sophomores. Everybody else was ranked on the low end. Tiffany Mitchell was a project but she will end up being a major selling point for Dawn. If Dawn can get back to back top 15ish or so classes in 2017 and 2018 then I think we'll be in business for the post-Wilson foreseeable future.

2017 will be a very important year of South Carolina's recruiting, as they'll lose Wilson, Gray, Davis and Cuevas all in one swoop. They didn't land any big players in 2015 or 2016, so they'll need to land some top players to make sure the cupboard doesn't go bare in 2017-18.

Teams setting themselves up nicely right now are Connecticut, Notre Dame, Texas, Baylor, Maryland and Ohio State. Teams that need to pick up some steam or risk some tumbling are South Carolina, Tennessee, and Stanford.

 

[HuskyNan]

I actually feel bad for Holly after watching her postgame interview. She looks and sounds so incredibly depressed. I hate the Vols, but no one should go through what she's going through. I assume she is a decent person who happens to be a terrible coach. She is paying a terrible emotional price for her lack of coaching skill. Yikes! I wouldn't wish that on anyone.

And yet, this decent person wasn't willing to apologize to the Moore family in order to restart the UConn-LV series.

I admit the video was tough to watch but Warlick is blind to the fact that the LV offense was not good when she took over and that it went from not good to bad to awful. How can a coach not see that? How do you not contact other coaches and get their perspective? At least Pat Summitt saw the problem, even if she couldn't completely fix it, and consulted Harry Perretta, among others I assume, in order to try something news. Bring in an assistant from, oh, Notre Dame or something and put in a twenty first century offense, for crying out loud. Yes, I see Warlick's genuine distress but she's laying in a bed of her own making.

 

[HardHatGuy#2]

Creme has 9 SEC team making the tournament. This I don't understand. There's only one dominant team and even they are struggling and the more the SEC teams beat up on each other. The more experts think its a great conference this year. They can't be watching the games.

I've said this in a few threads, this year. Remember the REAL Big East men's seasons; UConn, Syracuse, Georgetown, Pitt, St. John's, Providence, Seton Hall, Villanova and others would beat the stuffing out of each other all season long, then put 7 or more teams in the tournament. Fans would always complain about "East Coast Bias", and that most were middling teams at best, then 3 or more would advance to the Sweet 16. I think the SEC is the same thing this year, a bunch of really good teams beating each other up. I wouldn't be surprised to see 3 SEC teams in the Sweet 16.

 

[Sonny44]

I actually feel bad for Holly after watching her postgame interview. She looks and sounds so incredibly depressed. I hate the Vols, but no one should go through what she's going through. I assume she is a decent person who happens to be a terrible coach. She is paying a terrible emotional price for her lack of coaching skill. Yikes! I wouldn't wish that on anyone.

I agree.
Why do we have to hate the Vols? We are hating a memory folks. I'm not preaching here; just saying that it would be good for WCBB if they could make a come back. Same with Duke and UNC and even LSU IMO. We need to have 8-10 really good programs instead of 3-5.

 

[Wbbfan1]

Unfortunately last year Arkansas made the tourney with 13 losses. Lady Vols will make the tourney as a 7 or 8 seed unless they lose their last two Regular Season Games. Charlie Creme has 9 teams from the SEC making the tournament. Because the SEC has no Elite teams besides So Carolina that somehow means its a strong Conference that deserves 9 tournament teams.

Two games left in the regular season which they should win against Bama and UGA, but after the LSU flop all bets are off. They will not win the SEC tourney, so they'll have at least 12 and perhaps 13 losses. When's the last time a 12/13 loss team made the NCAA's?

 

[Kibitzer]

This Tennessee team is the largest collection of over rated, low bb iq, terrible shooting players ever assembled on one campus. . .can't shoot. . . can't pass. . . and play with little to no enthusiasm. Other than that, they're not bad.

Aside from that, Mrs. Lincoln, how was the play?

 

[Plebe]

Two games left in the regular season which they should win against Bama and UGA, but after the LSU flop all bets are off. They will not win the SEC tourney, so they'll have at least 12 and perhaps 13 losses. When's the last time a 12/13 loss team made the NCAA's?

Last year. Arkansas. 17-13 overall and 7-11 in the SEC. Got a 10 seed, beat 7-seed Northwestern in the 1st round, then got smoked by Baylor.

 

[HardHatGuy#2]

Can we start a petition for Ms.Warlick to retain her position for at least another 5 years?

A petition by UConn fans calling for her termination would probably have a bigger impact than the same from Vols fans.

 

[Bestiarius]

Yes - she has a very easy way to get out from under - at the end of the year thank everyone graciously and retire. With decent planning she should have saved enough for a very comfortable retirement and she could probably pick up any number of gigs with less stress and better success.
I agree that she seems like a pretty decent human being who is totally out of her depth.

Although Holly's coaching skills are sorely lacking, the current dilemma is not of her doing.

Going back to Pat's retirement, there was great support among the fans for Holly to take over. Pat wanted her as a successor and even said, "She's just like me." Management apparently agreed and hired Holly, then gave her a raise and contract extension.

I think most employees in her position would jump at a promotion and $600k+ salary.

Now those very same fans that supported her want her to resign and give up a significant amount of money for the "good of the program." Why should she do this? The current woes are the fault of Pat, the fans, and TN management, not Holly's. No one recognized that nepotism, inbreeding and politics is rarely a formula for success.

If Tennessee wants Holly out, the proper solution is to admit their mistake and honor the contract by either paying up or allowing the contract to run it's course.

 

[HuskyNan]

I've said this in a few threads, this year. Remember the REAL Big East men's seasons; UConn, Syracuse, Georgetown, Pitt, St. John's, Providence, Seton Hall, Villanova and others would beat the stuffing out of each other all season long, then put 7 or more teams in the tournament. Fans would always complain about "East Coast Bias", and that most were middling teams at best, then 3 or more would advance to the Sweet 16. I think the SEC is the same thing this year, a bunch of really good teams beating each other up. I wouldn't be surprised to see 3 SEC teams in the Sweet 16.

I'm not sure how you can watch the SEC teams' offenses and call them good. I saw a ton of air balls and botched lay ups to last a lifetime.

 

[j66kicker]

I agree.
Why do we have to hate the Vols? We are hating a memory folks. I'm not preaching here; just saying that it would be good for WCBB if they could make a come back. Same with Duke and UNC and even LSU IMO. We need to have 8-10 really good programs instead of 3-5.

I think it would be best for WCBB is they made a comeback AND we still hate them.

 

[UcMiami]

I've said this in a few threads, this year. Remember the REAL Big East men's seasons; UConn, Syracuse, Georgetown, Pitt, St. John's, Providence, Seton Hall, Villanova and others would beat the stuffing out of each other all season long, then put 7 or more teams in the tournament. Fans would always complain about "East Coast Bias", and that most were middling teams at best, then 3 or more would advance to the Sweet 16. I think the SEC is the same thing this year, a bunch of really good teams beating each other up. I wouldn't be surprised to see 3 SEC teams in the Sweet 16.

I would buy that about the SEC if any of these incredibly good teams played strong OOC schedules with some of their games actually being on the road (TN excepted from that blanket statement.)
Getting to the sweet sixteen in the current format by being over-seeded into the top sixteen has become an easier proposition as you play at home for the first two rounds. Getting out of the first round when you get over-seeded into the 5-7 lines also is a lot easier as you are playing significantly weaker competition in general.
SC - good road win OOC - at UCLA unranked at the time but #14 now by 3
TAMU - at Duke ranked 14th then now unranked
Miss - only two road games in OOC at TX a loss and at unranked LT a win
Mizz - no ranked teams played OOC
KY - one good road win against #14 ASU by 4 (while they were struggling with injuries I believe)
FL - no ranked road game OOC but a loss to Temple on the road
AUB - no ranked team OOC but losses to UVA and at Marq.
Meanwhile the bottom of the league compiled great OOC records against nobodies:
Vandy - 11-2 OOC (and 4-10 since)
Ala - 11-2 (3-10)
OleMiss - 8-5 (2-12)
The one thing that really surprises me this year is that normally the pretty good SEC teams are able to defend their home courts in conference while throwing in a few head-scratching road losses, but they aren't even doing that this year - a sign of strength, or just really bad teams with no consistency?

Comparing the Men's game to the women's is always an issue because it is a really different competitive environment - but comparing to the women's big east where they also got lots of teams in, and usually were well represented in the elite eight and the final four would be valid - the SEC has had one team reach a semi-final in the past 8 seasons and likely will have that same team back this year. If they have two teams in the elite eight, that will be impressive to me.

 

[Tonyc]

Reading what Tenn fans are saying and watching whats going on makes me think back to when Tenn came after UConn Geno his coaches our fans our players and former players. For those of you who didn't live through it read this thread and it was much worse for all of us then what Holly is going through. Nobody felt sorry for UConn and we prevailed. As much as the LVs team was not responsible for what happened to UConn many of those people who were responsible are still there. Do I feel bad for Holly...yes. Do I feel bad for the players yes. For the program I have no pity because of what they did to us and what theyre doing to the present LV team. Do changes have to occur at Tenn to make the LVs good again. I think so but this is not the way to go about it. Its ruthless.

 

[Fairfield Fan]

Two games left in the regular season which they should win against Bama and UGA, but after the LSU flop all bets are off. They will not win the SEC tourney, so they'll have at least 12 and perhaps 13 losses. When's the last time a 12/13 loss team made the NCAA's?

If UT loses to Georgia, does Tennessee still make the tournament? Do they deserve to go ahead of Temple? I don't gamble, but after this loss, will Charlie Creme really have Tennessee in there? Seems to me that just playing a tough schedule shouldn't be enough to get selected.

 

[Roundball fan]

I actually feel bad for Holly after watching her postgame interview. She looks and sounds so incredibly depressed. I hate the Vols, but no one should go through what she's going through. I assume she is a decent person who happens to be a terrible coach. She is paying a terrible emotional price for her lack of coaching skill. Yikes! I wouldn't wish that on anyone.

I even felt bad for Tenn. I had to slap myself.

 

[msf22b]

I've said this in a few threads, this year. Remember the REAL Big East men's seasons; UConn, Syracuse, Georgetown, Pitt, St. John's, Providence, Seton Hall, Villanova and others would beat the stuffing out of each other all season long, then put 7 or more teams in the tournament. Fans would always complain about "East Coast Bias", and that most were middling teams at best, then 3 or more would advance to the Sweet 16. I think the SEC is the same thing this year, a bunch of really good teams beating each other up. I wouldn't be surprised to see 3 SEC teams in the Sweet 16.

Speaking of men?
Certainly not woman.

 

[DaddyChoc]

I don't care who the coach is... good/great talent shouldn't be losing to mediocre talent. The players should be able to figure out some of the on-court issues as they are playing

 

[EricLA]

Looking at this blindly, everyone would pick Tennessee's lineup. Holly has under-performed in her ability to develop talent, under-performed in her ability to build a cohesive team, under-performed in her ability to get players to buy into her system, and under-performed in her in game coaching ability. Plus, she has no one on deck for 2016 and 2017. Dave Hart needs to get rid of her ASAP if the program has any chance of being a Final Four team in the next 5 years.

I'm curious about the bold comment - I thought you guys led for Kushkutuah? Not sure where things stood with the rest of 2017, but at the start of the year, wasn't Tenn looking at a really good class for 2017? Has that changed?

On another note, and this is not addressed at/to you...

Tennessee fans started a petition to reinstate the LVols logo and/or name. If they have been unable to accomplish that, what makes anyone think they will be able to convince the AD to fire her, especially after the 5 year extension and raise?

 

[meyers7]

I agree.
Why do we have to hate the Vols?

Why do some of you keep asking that? We've told you many times on here why it is the duty of any decent UCONN fan to hate TN and everyone associated with it. If you don't hate TN, that's on you.

 

[EricLA]

If UT loses to Georgia, does Tennessee still make the tournament? Do they deserve to go ahead of Temple? I don't gamble, but after this loss, will Charlie Creme really have Tennessee in there? Seems to me that just playing a tough schedule shouldn't be enough to get selected.

Here's the thing about the 2 teams - Most of Tennessee's losses have come against teams who will make the NCAA's. However, the exceptions are the pretty bad losses to Va Tech and now LSU. Compare that to Temple who has losses to Rutgers, Quinnipiac, St Joes, SMU, and most recently Memphis. Of Tennessee's 11 losses, 9 have been to NCAA teams while Temple's good losses were only to Florida State, UCONN twice, and Penn, who is at the top of their league and probably not a bad loss.

 

[CocoHusky]

I'm curious about the bold comment - I thought you guys led for Kushkutuah? Not sure where things stood with the rest of 2017, but at the start of the year, wasn't Tenn looking at a really good class for 2017? Has that changed?

On another note, and this is not addressed at/to you...

Tennessee fans started a petition to reinstate the LVols logo and/or name. If they have been unable to accomplish that, what makes anyone think they will be able to convince the AD to fire her, especially after the 5 year extension and raise?

2016 is pretty much a wrap in terms of players. For 2017 depending on who you talk to Lady Vols maybe in good shape. In addition to Kushkutuah (long though to be Lady Vols lean) there is Dorie Harrison (Izzy's sister) top 15 overall per ESPN and the number 2 Kid in the Class Rellah Boothe has expressed some level of interest in the Lady Vols although MD is thought to be the front runner. Lots of holes in the Lady Vols roster in '17 so too early to tell.

 

[Waquoit]

I ... just saying that it would be good for WCBB if they could make a come back. Same with Duke and UNC and even LSU

Why stop there? Let's hope for Immaculata and Delta State to get good again. At least they didn't go to great lengths to smear UConn.

 

[UcMiami]

2016 is pretty much a wrap in terms of players. For 2017 depending on who you talk to Lady Vols maybe in good shape. In addition to Kushkutuah (long though to be Lady Vols lean) there is Dorie Harrison (Izzy's sister) top 15 overall per ESPN and the number 2 Kid in the Class Rellah Boothe has expressed some level of interest in the Lady Vols although MD is thought to be the front runner. Lots of holes in the Lady Vols roster in '17 so too early to tell.

Hard to understand how any top prospect can look at the product on the floor, the demeanor of both coaches and players, and the style of play in general, and go 'Yeah, TN is the place for me!'
They have nice facilities a loyal fan base as long as you don't read their fan forums, and a great history, but ... The 2017 recruits were 10 years old the last time TN made it to a FF, and probably have pretty vague memories of that or even of Pat as a HC. And TN is not burning up the 'academic' wires - a good school but no better than a slew of other option.

You really do wonder about how recruits and their families and coaches make their final choices. Duke, ND, Stanford, the Ivies, PSU, UNC (even with the scandal) and a few others can appeal on academics regardless of what the team and coach are like. Other schools clearly have good coaches and nice chemistry that can appeal along with really nice facilities. Regional choices I understand. But ... beyond family ties or super fandom to a single school, or just being local, or being a religious choice, why would you choose a basket case program if you have other options?

 

[toadfoot]

Holly's post game Press Conference:

Good grief, that was hard to watch.