Thoughts on injuries

[Zinethar]

Training methods change constantly as a result of more data and medical research. When I first started coaching it was standard practice to have a stretching program before every practice and contest. A few years later it was determined that practice had led to many more injuries to athletes that needed explosive movements during their sports. The next thing we introduced active warmup exercises to our college teams (I noticed that UConn also was using the same techniques at that time). We had trouble convincing freshmen that it was not appropriate to stretch before a workout or game because they still did that in high school (it takes time to filter down). About the same time strength and conditioning started focusing on weight training for all types of sports. We got a lot of resistance to that from the men's basketball coach because he was afraid it would affect their shooting (IMHO that would have been a good thing ). Now look at what current NBA or college men look like. I have no idea what is now the current thing as I have been retired since 2013 from coaching but I bet the knowledge is even better now.

 

[meyers7]

If you look at stats over a ten-year span, do you have any evidence that UConn has any more injuries than the average D1 program?

But the point is you want less. Not equal to (certainly not more). We got 11 NC's, we don't want to be compared/similar to other programs.

And you don't need a 10 look, just back to 2016.

 

[Cuango]

Not to blame anyone, but look at how C. Williams blew out her knee soon after arriving in her WNBA training camp after being drafted.
And she was a player who was shown lifting extremely heavy weights in a UConn video.

Compare what happened to her to a player like Olivia Nelson Odada who barely ever missed a game who you know never lifted the kind of weights that C. Williams did.

IMO just because a person has developed the muscles to lift super heavy weights doesn't mean that the rest of their body can handle all of the extra strain.
I don't know if there's any science that limits how much weight that a person should lift on a regular basis without compromising other parts of the body that is put under strain to lift all of that weight.
Just because a person can do it doesn't mean that a person should do it.

The professionals can't even manage to define a concussion so how can professionals be relied on to determine how much weight to too much weight?

We still don't know how some players have become injured in the UConn program whether it happened during practice or in the weight training room.
I'm not pointing any fingers at anyone because in the end each player is responsible for whatever they do, & they can do things improperly & beyond what's recommended.

We also don't know what types of drug substances that players are taking including caffine which is the drug of choice for many college athletes.
If they overdo it then that's on them.

I guess my question is, how can you have any idea how much weight Liv lifted, or CWill for that matter? Furthermore, I would be very surprised if any of the players are not on some sort of official, individual weight lifting plan provided by the S&C coach.

 

[sun]

I guess my question is, how can you have any idea how much weight Liv lifted, or CWill for that matter? Furthermore, I would be very surprised if any of the players are not on some sort of official, individual weight lifting plan provided by the S&C coach.

Okay.
I did see Liv doing a chin up in a video.
But let me ask you thiis, is it always a good idea to jump up & down while holding a barbell full of weight like C. Williams was shown doing?
Since when is a fitness instructor also a medical specialist?
Do they recommend weight training based on the feedback of the athlete & how much pain & discomfort that they can endure?
We already know that staff doesn't know all of the medical records & injury history of every UConn athelte, yet they're supposed to be able to recommend the maximum weights that can be ifted safely by each individual?
I think that there's some gueswork & assumptions involved.
Another question would be how closely are the athletes monitored & supervised while they're exercising?
Who is watching to see that each & every one is doing everything properly & as recommended?
Not that recommdations are always perfect....
I'm just opining that the system can be flawed by human error which we all know that humans are capable of making errors.
The system may be flawed, the athletes may be flawed, every case is different & without blaming anybody.

 

[Rowdy831]

The above, along with Rowdy831's post. In addition to strength and conditioning, nutrition, etc. I'm wondering about the medical aspect of prevention. It's odd to me to read that medical staff correlated Paige's ACL tear to her prior tibial plateau injury. So...if they knew this could happen...why didn't they look to PREVENT it? Set a regimen to minimize the probability of the injury occurring. Management. The same with Azzi, Ayanna, ... Possible exploratory radiology on these known issues periodically.

It is not uncommon for 13-16 year old female athletes to have non contact ACL injuries but in young women the ratios are much closer to their male counterparts. With Paige I always thought the injury was to the ACL when I saw it so I wasn't surprised when she had another knee injury. With Azzi I saw her injury last year and it did not look like a knee movement that I have seen result in an ACL problem. As a rule I do not believe in bad luck so I would be prone to do a lot of investigating if I were the head of UConn WBB to make sure our training wasn't contributing to the issue.

 

[Rowdy831]

Okay.
I did see Liv doing a chin up in a video.
But let me ask you thiis, is it always a good idea to jump up & down while holding a barbell full of weight like C. Williams was shown doing?
Since when is a fitness instructor also a medical specialist?
Do they recommend weight training based on the feedback of the athlete & how much pain & discomfort that they can endure?
We already know that staff doesn't know all of the medical records & injury history of every UConn athelte, yet they're supposed to be able to recommend the maximum weights that can be ifted safely by each individual?
I think that there's some gueswork & assumptions involved.
Another question would be how closely are the athletes monitored & supervised while they're exercising?
Who is watching to see that each & every one is doing everything properly & as recommended?
Not that recommdations are always perfect....
I'm just opining that the system can be flawed by human error which we all know that humans are capable of making errors.
The system may be flawed, the athletes may be flawed, every case is different & without blaming anybody.

I was told that the issue with younger female athletes is the knee wasn't strong enough to support the weight and force applied by well conditioned athletes. With that said I would say absolutely NO to jumping with additional weights and barbells could be up to an additional 20% of their total body weight.

 

[BobbyJ]

It is not uncommon for 13-16 year old female athletes to have non contact ACL injuries but in young women the ratios are much closer to their male counterparts. With Paige I always thought the injury was to the ACL when I saw it so I wasn't surprised when she had another knee injury. With Azzi I saw her injury last year and it did not look like a knee movement that I have seen result in an ACL problem. As a rule I do not believe in bad luck so I would be prone to do a lot of investigating if I were the head of UConn WBB to make sure our training wasn't contributing to the issue.

You should use better sources for information before you make these statements. Women are 2-8 times more likely to tear an ACL than males. If you don't think the UConn medical staff and trainers have access to and utilize the best methods of injury prevention and treatment, then you're just wrong. This info is commonly known and widely used by most all major athletic programs. People questioning the UConn staff are not doing any research and making irresponsible claims and assertions about their competency and are out of touch with what really goes on.

Are ACL Tears Really More Common in Women?

Certain injuries—ACL tears, ankle sprains, and stress fractures—are more common in female athletes.

www.yalemedicine.org

 

[Cuango]

The above, along with Rowdy831's post. In addition to strength and conditioning, nutrition, etc. I'm wondering about the medical aspect of prevention. It's odd to me to read that medical staff correlated Paige's ACL tear to her prior tibial plateau injury. So...if they knew this could happen...why didn't they look to PREVENT it? Set a regimen to minimize the probability of the injury occurring. Management. The same with Azzi, Ayanna, ... Possible exploratory radiology on these known issues periodically.

How do you know they didn’t try to prevent it? This assumption that a highly trained and educated specialist would somehow put the shining jewel in the UConn crown at risk is very puzzling to me. Whenever I see video of our team training together, I’m almost always struck by the unique and unusual things they are doing. To me, it looks as though she, (Hudy) is constantly searching out the latest training methods. I don’t think for a moment that these injuries, devastating as they have been, are in any way, the fault of Hudy and her assistant/s! Sometimes, a cigar is just a cigar!

 

[Longtime fan]

I'm starting to get worried that Ayanna may red shirt this year. Trying to purge those negative thoughts.

I am, too. The lack of progress ( as defined by her still not being ready ) is a red flag. And there are kids who take a long time to heal. But this gives DeBerry a chance.

 

[stamfordhusky]

As hard as it was to do, I think this thread may have reached a new Boneyard level of absurdity. People who have no facts, no medical knowledge, and no experience at all in strength and conditioning are chiming in with absurd statements and criticisms of well trained and well regarded UConn staff members.

It is clear from the many absurd statements that about half of the contributors to this thread have absolutely no knowledge whatsoever on this subject.

 

[hoopsdiva]

Apparently Caroline is still out. I'm starting to get Kiersten Walters vibes from her.

 

[Rb335]

Apparently Caroline is still out. I'm starting to get Kiersten Walters vibes from her.

Definitely not great news. I had hoped she’d recover with rest, and the off-season provides that time to step away from the game and recover. Tough to see her in the same situation, another year later. A tough player who I don’t think will ever give up. Wish she could put this behind her because she’s got so much talent when healthy. Bummed for her and the team.

 

[Ozimoto]

I certainly hope Carol can get healthy and realize the potential of her freshman season. Sometimes things are not meant to be...

 

[Dynastic]

Actually there is. I will dig through the mountains of accumulated stuff I got over my 50 years of coaching and try to find some for you. There are always unicorns and I never implied that those injuries were always career ending just that athletes who push their bodies the hardest tend to suffer more injuries. A hamstring injury isn't as devastating as an ACL but certainly is an explosive injury. BTW Jordan only played 18 games one year due to a broken foot.

50 years of coaching impressive, but really “that athletes who push their bodies the hardest tend to suffer more injuries”. I don’t even know what to unpack from that. All of these student athletes probably push their bodies the hardest. I watched Jordan play dozens of times and I know that… and then he won multiple MVPs and championships.

 

[Dynastic]

Brady had a bad knee injury in 2008, changed his training regime from weight to flexibility and changed his diet. I don't believe Jordan was ever a big weight guy. Tennis players I have no idea.

True Brady did get hurt and then made some changes, adjusted. I truly believe some of these guys are given tremendous gifts of feat, but they all work incredibly hard to achieve their respective results. I’m thinking tennis players are really into flexibility as well.

 

[reelfan]

Another really long season.

 

[Zinethar]

I was referring to all the players at this level not just the "stars". You don't get to play D1 or Pro without being exceptional compared to most other humans.