This Loss is about what we will become

[GoUconn7961]

It took a couple of years of Tina Charles getting owned by Sylvia Fowles for her to develop into the beast she was at UConn
It took a couple of years for Kara Wolters, Stephanie Dolson, Rebecca Lobo, and Kiah Stokes to be the players they were, and are.

How quickly we forget, and how impatient we are. I include myself in that a lot of times. Bigs develop differently.

 

[Plebe]

Shiny new object? Geno has been running pressure defenses forever including both man and zone presses as well as half court traps. That’s just basketball.

If UConn goes with a smaller more athletic lineup using Sarah at the 5, it makes absolute sense to also employ a pressure defense as they did against USC. If you’re not pressuring all over the court with that lineup, you open yourself up to a defensive mismatch in the low blocks, which happened several times when USC got the ball in to Iriafen down low vs Sarah.

Okay, just call it pressure defense, then. A more apt comparison might be Ohio State. What Tennessee employs is a variant all its own, a dizzying constant turnstile of incoming and outgoing subs, in which 10 players average between 13 and 24 minutes and no one plays more than that. Maybe that style works great for Kim Caldwell, but I don't believe Geno sees it as something to emulate.

 

[Duncan Idaho]

Think they need one more person that they can consistently rely on especially against the better teams. Hope one emerges.

 

[oldude]

Okay, just call it pressure defense, then. A more apt comparison might be Ohio State. What Tennessee employs is a variant all its own, a dizzying constant turnstile of incoming and outgoing subs, in which 10 players average between 13 and 24 minutes and no one plays more than that. Maybe that style works great for Kim Caldwell, but I don't believe Geno sees it as something to emulate.

Point taken. But you have to believe that Geno and his staff are taking a hard look at the 2nd half film and considering whether or not to routinely pressure opponents.

My favorite option is the diamond full-court press that turns into a half-court trap once the ball gets over the half-court line. The key to that type of pressure for UConn is Aubrey at the top of the press. She is like a giant octopus who eats up passes and turns them into easy transition baskets.

 

[BobbyJ]

Okay, just call it pressure defense, then. A more apt comparison might be Ohio State. What Tennessee employs is a variant all its own, a dizzying constant turnstile of incoming and outgoing subs, in which 10 players average between 13 and 24 minutes and no one plays more than that. Maybe that style works great for Kim Caldwell, but I don't believe Geno sees it as something to emulate.

I agree. And I don't believe that kind of PT is going to attract many top 10 type recruits. It will be interesting to see how many minutes her starting five plays against any top 10-15 teams.

 

[Plebe]

I agree. And I don't believe that kind of PT is going to attract many top 10 type recruits. It will be interesting to see how many minutes her starting five plays against any top 10-15 teams.

Time will tell. No South Carolina player is currently averaging more than 25 mpg either, on a roster loaded with top 10 and top 20 talent. And, Caldwell has already scored a much better recruiting class than Harper ever did, including the #11 and #14 players. As for her substitution patterns in big games, I don't expect them to vary much from the FSU and IA games, both of which were tight until the final minutes.

Bringing the discussion back to UConn, it seems like an annual Boneyard tradition to clamor for a nonstop full-court press, and it's become equally traditional for this wish to never materialize. But who knows, maybe this is the year that all changes.

 

[Hoops66]

Point taken. But you have to believe that Geno and his staff are taking a hard look at the 2nd half film and considering whether or not to routinely pressure opponents.

My favorite option is the diamond full-court press that turns into a half-court trap once the ball gets over the half-court line. The key to that type of pressure for UConn is Aubrey at the top of the press. She is like a giant octopus who eats up passes and turns them into easy transition baskets.

I absolutely agree. One of my best memories of Nika was her charging the player bringing up the ball at half court and forcing a possible change in the play or having the rest of the offense committing too soon. If the offense is too slow up the floor and two defenders change you might get panic that she would get caught in the back court, resorting in forced passes etc. I've seen it work many times, so using it every so often might be worth it. KK, Ash, Morgan, Paige and others would make a great "assault team."

 

[oldude]

I absolutely agree. One of my best memories of Nika was her charging the player bringing up the ball at half court and forcing a possible change in the play or having the rest of the offense committing too soon. If the offense is too slow up the floor and two defenders change you might get panic that she would get caught in the back court, resorting in forced passes etc. I've seen it work many times, so using it every so often might be worth it. KK, Ash, Morgan, Paige and others would make a great "assault team."

There are a number of advantages to playing a pressure defense that go far beyond forcing turnovers. First and foremost, it forces opponents to devote valuable practice time to dealing with the pressure. The extra time spent breaking the pressure on each possession is that much less time spent on offensive execution. To the extent that offensive execution time is limited it forces teams to play faster, often resulting in poor shot selection.

 

[oldude]

Time will tell. No South Carolina player is currently averaging more than 25 mpg either, on a roster loaded with top 10 and top 20 talent. And, Caldwell has already scored a much better recruiting class than Harper ever did, including the #11 and #14 players. As for her substitution patterns in big games, I don't expect them to vary much from the FSU and IA games, both of which were tight until the final minutes.

Bringing the discussion back to UConn, it seems like an annual Boneyard tradition to clamor for a nonstop full-court press, and it's become equally traditional for this wish to never materialize. But who knows, maybe this is the year that all changes.

You are correct about the annual BY tradition. We will learn fairly soon whether this year the BY is just howling at the moon once again, or maybe there’s something to it. Geno is not going to wait until the Huskies are down vs TN or SC to try out a pressure defense again. If what I suggest is correct, you will see UConn use a pressure defense in the next few games vs Providence and/or Marquette. It may only be for a qtr or a half. But if UConn plans to play defense like tOSU or TN, they need to get comfortable doing it sooner rather than later.

 

[Plebe]

You are correct about the annual BY tradition. We will learn fairly soon whether this year the BY is just howling at the moon once again, or maybe there’s something to it. Geno is not going to wait until the Huskies are down vs TN or SC to try out a pressure defense again. If what I suggest is correct, you will see UConn use a pressure defense in the next few games vs Providence and/or Marquette. It may only be for a qtr or a half. But if UConn plans to play defense like tOSU or TN, they need to get comfortable doing it sooner rather than later.

But if it's only for a quarter or a half, then it's not really different than what Geno has already been doing. With Griffin on the court, in particular, he almost seems to prefer it because she's a monster disruptor on defense but largely ineffective in half-cout offense.

 

[Stagnant]

We speculated all summer how Geno has enough fresh legs to play a pressure defense for a full game. Yet we only see it when UConn is in desperation mode. Wouldn't it make sense to play this more often? Someone get Geno on the phone.

Now that you mention it. We pressed big time in the first game of the season against Boston. And we really haven’t done it since.

I think the Avery Howell three pointer is an example of why we don’t press more. Just a fear that good teams will break the press and it will lead to open 3 pointers.

I don’t think you can press every team though. I definitely wouldn’t recommend pressing Notre dame.

 

[Conndog]

My fear is that they will both "emerge" against the weaklings of the Big East and think they have improved.

Thinking they have improved will be better than present, because that will lessen any hesitation. Jana needs to just catch the ball, and in one motion both pivot and jump towards the basket with her shot. She is 6’5, so unless her defender has perfect timing and is equally tall, she’ll be able to get off her shot or she will be fouled. Brady too is hesitating but similarly, even if confidence is boosted against inferior teams, can better develop her fall-away jumper and other post moves. She too should just catch, pivot and shoot. That is all that Kiki Iriafen would do, and we all saw how effective a fast shot can be.

 

[oldude]

But if it's only for a quarter or a half, then it's not really different than what Geno has already been doing. With Griffin on the court, in particular, he almost seems to prefer it because she's a monster disruptor on defense but largely ineffective in half-cout offense.

Geno has almost always had 1 or more experienced bigs who could consistently score in the low post or knock down 15-20 ft jumpers from the FT line extended. So far this season, he doesn’t really have that option. IMO, the lack of a true post scoring option has been a problem for this UConn team, particularly vs ND & USC.

So what’s the solution? Continue to force the basketball into Ice and Jana until they get better? Play 4 on 5 halfcourt offense? Or, how about pushing tempo with your defense to create more transition scoring?

 

[hoophuskee]

It took a couple of years of Tina Charles getting owned by Sylvia Fowles for her to develop into the beast she was at UConn
It took a couple of years for Kara Wolters, Stephanie Dolson, Rebecca Lobo, and Kiah Stokes to be the players they were, and are.

How quickly we forget, and how impatient we are. I include myself in that a lot of times. Bigs develop differently.

Thier 1st matchup Tina had 17-9. The 3rd matchup Tina had 18-6. These are not comparable to Jana and Ice.

 

[hoophuskee]

There are a number of advantages to playing a pressure defense that go far beyond forcing turnovers. First and foremost, it forces opponents to devote valuable practice time to dealing with the pressure. The extra time spent breaking the pressure on each possession is that much less time spent on offensive execution. To the extent that offensive execution time is limited it forces teams to play faster, often resulting in poor shot selection.

There is also a counter. When you press you have to pratcice it. And when you do that you are also taking time away from other things that you might have worked on.

Secondly, when you press in a manner UCONN was vs USC, you are leaving at least one player open at all times. So, if the team is prepared for it and practice heavily agianst it, then it might happen that you get blitzed in the 1st haff to. Vs otherwise you could have won just playing halfcourt defense.

Not saying don't. Just be careful what you wish for.

 

[oldude]

There is also a counter. When you press you have to pratcice it. And when you do that you are also taking time away from other things that you might have worked on.

Secondly, when you press in a manner UCONN was vs USC, you are leaving at least one player open at all times. So, if the team is prepared for it and practice heavily agianst it, then it might happen that you get blitzed in the 1st haff to. Vs otherwise you could have won just playing halfcourt defense.

Not saying don't. Just be careful what you wish for.

Yes & no. Yes you have to practice it. But you have to practice defense anyway, and if that’s your defense, that’s what you practice.

There’s always the possibility that it doesn’t work against a particular team with capable ball handlers. But that’s why you scout opponents and put together a game plan. If you’re using a man-to-man press, it’s pretty easy to just back off and play your regular man-to-man half court defense.

 

[GoUconn7961]

Thier 1st matchup Tina had 17-9. The 3rd matchup Tina had 18-6. These are not comparable to Jana and Ice.

It still took a couple of years to get them all where they wanted to be and Geno wanted them to be. Tina's stats doesn't change that.

 

[cohenzone]

I don’t have time or the will to read through the thread, so sorry if this is repetitious. I think the main take away of value from this game is the level of defensive intensity needed to beat a really good team. The team swarmed in the second half like in no other game this year and that is why Juju and USC had a lot of trouble. Two halves like that and we become a really tough out.

 

[Rowdy831]

To me the defense is step too slow on recovery and it allows teams wide open looks from their preferred spots. Too many times their offside defenders are getting too far out of position to guard their own player. This is very fixable and one detail will really help a lot. They absolutely need someone inside that can change shots and that is Jana.

Now that the tougher part of the schedule is come and gone they (coaches) will be more patient with Jana and allow her to get confidence in her game. Losing two games to top teams isn't the end of the world for young teams but it will get the amatuer experts worked up. I do love to read peoples opinions and think many have really good points. I also think some of them might be the same as what the coaches want but can't seem to get.

 

[Tonyc]

The fact that we came back late in the third qtr and had the lead makes me believe what we are capable of. If USC is now ranked 4 we could be there too. We are going to get better because are margin of improvement is much higher due to how young and inexperienced we are. I expect alot of improvement over the next few weeks from our underclassman and I expect Azzi and Griff to come back, work off the rust and be 90%+ by the middle of February. In the second half we showed how good we can be and I expect us to build on that.

 

[Skeets]

Now that you mention it. We pressed big time in the first game of the season against Boston. And we really haven’t done it since.

I think the Avery Howell three pointer is an example of why we don’t press more. Just a fear that good teams will break the press and it will lead to open 3 pointers.

I don’t think you can press every team though. I definitely wouldn’t recommend pressing Notre dame.

Well, if you press you run the risk of getting burned. I say press until the minuses start to out way the pluses, then stop. Until then, press. UConn should force the issue. tOSU didn't worry about getting burned, did they? That was a risk for them that worked out great. Lesson to be learned.