This is a journalist?

[doggydaddy]

ok...more Tennessee stuff.

I have seen editorial pieces that are less opinionated than this on the referee performances.

[Edited: Please do not quote material from premium sites -- JS]

I don't know, maybe it's just my opinion, but this ref complaining seems like such sour grapes and coming from the person that writes the game articles seems just wrong. And with that writer also moderating the tennessee message board?....well, no wonder they have so many posts complaining about the refs.

You would think someone with that much control over the Tennessee fans would take the high road on this issue.

 

[meyers7]

You would think someone with that much control over the Tennessee fans would take the high road on this issue.

Tennessee fans?, high road? Do you realize what you are saying?

 

[ThisJustIn]

I don't see anything wrong with what they wrote -- women's basketball refs stink.

 

[doggydaddy]

I don't see anything wrong with what they wrote -- women's basketball refs stink.

It may stink, but her article made it sound like they only stunk on calls against Tennessee.

 

[Icebear]

I don't see anything wrong with what they wrote -- women's basketball refs stink.

Sure, now you admit they stink. ;-)

 

[JS]

Board policies:

1. It's OK to quote or link informational material from other boards.

2. We have a policy against "dragging over" material that in our judgment serves more to inflame than to inform.

3. Copyrighted material may be quoted in a brief, attributed excerpt. Quotes from premium sites shouldn't be posted at all.

Now that we've edited the OP, we'll re-open the thread. Please focus on topics other than whether a particular board moderator/journalist is or should appropriately be raising reffing excuses for a loss.

Those topics might include the interesting one of whether there's a difference in refereeing between (a) the West Coast and other regions where arguably they call it tight on fouls but loosely on traveling, etc. -- the combo should favor offense -- and (b) the East Coast, BE/SEC and maybe post-season style, arguably let 'em play and be more physical, favoring defense.

Also the value of home court, and whether the reffing in WCBB sucks however they may be calling it.

 

[tomcat]

Well, that was informative. I get why it was edited out, but what we were left with was a narrative with no plot.

 

[vtcwbuff]

The plot lies elsewhere, along with other sundry orange tinted plots.

DD to answer your question - no I do not consider her a journalist. I'll refrain from commenting further.

 

[alexrgct]

Hey, if the LV mindset is to come up with a bunch of excuses for losing, I fully support it.

 

[JS]

what we were left with was a narrative with no plot.

Since I left you in that predicament, tomcat, allow me to thicken the plot a little bit. I believe DD is referring to an article here. I haven't read the full article as it's a pay site and I'd rather give my money to needy business tycoons.

In the OP, DD suggested Ms. Cornelius, journalist cum mod of the Summitt message board, made various comments indicating the refs cost the Lady Vols their 17-point loss to Stanford, or at least hurt them significantly. To support his point, DD culled a dozen or so quotes from the article. He then decried Ms. Cornelius's multiple roles in molding and sending LV fan opinion in that unworthy direction.

DD identified the source to me as a pay site, and by then I'd done enough looking on my own to see that outside of the article Ms. C. has raised the interesting issue (to me anyway) of regional differences in refereeing standards, as noted upthread for possible discussion.

Still a thin plot, I know, but you can watch the full movie if you'd like to pay for a ticket.

 

[JS]

Hey, if the LV mindset is to come up with a bunch of excuses for losing, I fully support it.

Yes. Let the process play out, at length and with many fresh stimuli.

 

[cardfan]

I watched the game twice and was there person with a very good vantage point. There were crappy calls on both ends. I thought her most arrogant statement was Stanford should send flowers to TN if Nneka gets National POY. Very poor taste and sportsmanship, for a 'journalist' or not.

 

[cardfan]

Maria's first time to Maples was 2008, so I'm not sure how much data she has to talk about refereeing differences. Her OP was based on another west coast reporter. Our 2008 game was called by Melissa Barlow, Clarke Stevens, and Marianne Karp, who all do national games not just west coast. Marianne did our game on Tuesday and I thought she made some awful calls, such as the phantom call on Lindy L. on Simmons 3pt attempt. She also missed a TN traveling by Simmons and didn't call Glory for clocking Nneka in the head.

Bottom line, we play great at Maples, they played crappy D, esp on Nneka and they looked very tired. Refs were usual sub par performance.

 

[EricLA]

i know this has sort of been beaten in other threads, but i find it amusing, really. for years tennessee has gotten calls. pat used to work the refs mercilessly. tennessee fans affectionately talk about Pat's "glare" which she used on players and refs alike. i suspect that only the truly objective fan could watch the game and make an informed comment on whether or not refs favored one team over the other, but someone asked a simple question on their board and never got an answer - tennessee attempted 29 free throws to Stanford's 16.

i realize the fouls were equal at 16 a piece, but tennessee almost took literally twice as many FT attempts as Stanford did. but i don't hear the Stanford fans crying about how they only called tennessee for fouls that were non-shooting, thus giving the huge advantage to tennessee.

bottom line, if Stanford and Tennessee were to play 10 games, i'm betting the Cardinal would win 8 0r 9 times.

 

[speedoo]

I watched the game twice and was there person with a very good vantage point. There were crappy calls on both ends. I thought her most arrogant statement was Stanford should send flowers to TN if Nneka gets National POY. Very poor taste and sportsmanship, for a 'journalist' or not.

I do believe she calls herself a journalist. If so, I am sure her followers there would agree. But I would strongly disagree, since a definition of journalist refers to one whose writing "is characterized by direct presentation of facts or description of events without an attempt at interpretation". Ms. Cornelius has spent so much time filling that board with the strongest possible anti-UConn sentiment, that she is probably not even capable of doing that.

 

[Lynx23]

The outcry from Tennessee fans over our getting only 3 free-throw attempts to Baylor's 18 attempts this past Sunday was deafening; in fact, I didn't hear it at all. Come to think of it, I don't recall too many complaints, if any, from the BY'ers either.

 

[KnightBridgeAZ]

Actually, and it is no shock, Tennessee had many more free throws than RU in their game at the RAC - but Carolyn Peck (of all people) noted that there was a difference in RU committing more fouls on the shooter vs. when Tenn,essee committed fouls. Didn't see either game (do have both on tape) but the RU fans seemed basically to agree with Peck that that explained some of the foul shot discrepancy.

I have always felt Tennessee tends to get the benefit of the doubt (I think the same thing about UConn, to be honest, though to a lesser extent - I always think there is some unintentional bias in how a ref sees a game) but will have to watch in these and future games whether or not Tennessee players are particularly adept at drawing shooting fouls or whether something else is in play.

 

[alexrgct]

Bottom line, when the final score is close, it makes some sense to talk about blatantly bad calls. When you get your ass handed to you, it makes no sense at all to talk about officiating.

The difference between the opening minutes of Stanford-Tennessee, when the LVs jumped out to an early lead, and the rest of the game, where they were beaten like red-headed stepchildren, was that the Ogwumike sisters and Kokenis started cold. Kokenis then scored five points in a row, and the O sisters, Nneka in particular, started evisecerating the LVs interior and mid-range defense. It's really that simple.

You play games like this against tough OOC competition to learn what kind of a team you have, not to bitch about the officiating after an unfavorable outcome. Basketball is a blazingly fast game, and the calls are very subjective. You need to fix what you have control over, not make excuses for losing what is ultimately a relatively meaningless game in December.

Or, you know, you could just piss and moan like it's your God given entitlement to win every basketball game your favorite team plays. Whatever.

 

[cardfan]

Excellent pts Alex

 

[doggydaddy]

Bottom line, when the final score is close, it makes some sense to talk about blatantly bad calls. When you get your ass handed to you, it makes no sense at all to talk about officiating.

The difference between the opening minutes of Stanford-Tennessee, when the LVs jumped out to an early lead, and the rest of the game, where they were beaten like red-headed stepchildren, was that the Ogwumike sisters and Kokenis started cold. Kokenis then scored five points in a row, and the O sisters, Nneka in particular, started evisecerating the LVs interior and mid-range defense. It's really that simple.

You play games like this against tough OOC competition to learn what kind of a team you have, not to bitch about the officiating after an unfavorable outcome. Basketball is a blazingly fast game, and the calls are very subjective. You need to fix what you have control over, not make excuses for losing what is ultimately a relatively meaningless game in December.

Or, you know, you could just piss and moan like it's your God given entitlement to win every basketball game your favorite team plays. Whatever.

An excellent post, Alex. You are so right about the pace of games and how tough it is to ref.

 

[vtcwbuff]

I like the way the folks in the orange pasture spun the ref situation. Since it was obvious that UTenn shot a lot more free throws than the Cardinal, they couldn't whine about a disparity in fouls called. Instead they landed on the old "the refs took our girls out of their game early" scenario. Most of them chose to ignore the fact that the big O kicked their ass - nearly single handed.

Tennessee fans always complain that the refs cost them the game. We should relish the fact that they've been complaining a lot in the last few years.

 

[MilfordHusky]

Bottom line, when the final score is close, it makes some sense to talk about blatantly bad calls. When you get your ass handed to you, it makes no sense at all to talk about officiating.

The difference between the opening minutes of Stanford-Tennessee, when the LVs jumped out to an early lead, and the rest of the game, where they were beaten like red-headed stepchildren, was that the Ogwumike sisters and Kokenis started cold. Kokenis then scored five points in a row, and the O sisters, Nneka in particular, started evisecerating the LVs interior and mid-range defense. It's really that simple.

You play games like this against tough OOC competition to learn what kind of a team you have, not to bitch about the officiating after an unfavorable outcome. Basketball is a blazingly fast game, and the calls are very subjective. You need to fix what you have control over, not make excuses for losing what is ultimately a relatively meaningless game in December.

Or, you know, you could just piss and moan like it's your God given entitlement to win every basketball game your favorite team plays. Whatever.

More gems from Alex. I may quote you on these too.

 

[UConnCat]

Bottom line, when the final score is close, it makes some sense to talk about blatantly bad calls. When you get your ass handed to you, it makes no sense at all to talk about officiating.

The difference between the opening minutes of Stanford-Tennessee, when the LVs jumped out to an early lead, and the rest of the game, where they were beaten like red-headed stepchildren, was that the Ogwumike sisters and Kokenis started cold. Kokenis then scored five points in a row, and the O sisters, Nneka in particular, started evisecerating the LVs interior and mid-range defense. It's really that simple.

You play games like this against tough OOC competition to learn what kind of a team you have, not to bitch about the officiating after an unfavorable outcome. Basketball is a blazingly fast game, and the calls are very subjective. You need to fix what you have control over, not make excuses for losing what is ultimately a relatively meaningless game in December.

Or, you know, you could just piss and moan like it's your God given entitlement to win every basketball game your favorite team plays. Whatever.

Great points. I've said repeatedly this season that Tenn is not a good defensive team. It wasn't good defensively last season and I haven't seen improvement so far this season. Tenn's problem the other night was the 97 points it allowed Stanford to score and that was the result of porous defense, not the referees.

 

[tomcat]

Thanks, JS. I appreciate the fill-in.

Since I left you in that predicament, tomcat, allow me to thicken the plot a little bit. I believe DD is referring to an article here. I haven't read the full article as it's a pay site and I'd rather give my money to needy business tycoons.

In the OP, DD suggested Ms. Cornelius, journalist cum mod of the Summitt message board, made various comments indicating the refs cost the Lady Vols their 17-point loss to Stanford, or at least hurt them significantly. To support his point, DD culled a dozen or so quotes from the article. He then decried Ms. Cornelius's multiple roles in molding and sending LV fan opinion in that unworthy direction.

DD identified the source to me as a pay site, and by then I'd done enough looking on my own to see that outside of the article Ms. C. has raised the interesting issue (to me anyway) of regional differences in refereeing standards, as noted upthread for possible discussion.

Still a thin plot, I know, but you can watch the full movie if you'd like to pay for a ticket.

 

[mr006]

"You would think someone with that much control over the Tennessee fans would take the high road on this issue."

Wouldn't that "high road" take them to Rocky Top anyway?