The Ross Enigma

[boog204]

I think Jaylin Stewart is the better all around basketball player but the issue for him IMO is that his game is a bit redundant to the two guys starting in front of him. I think Hurley sees Ross developing into a piece this team desperately needs, a defensive specialist.

Honestly, it took Castle 2/3 of the season to really figure things out (more so on the offensive side) and that was while getting starters minutes. Hopefully Ross can become a sort of poor man's Stephon Castle by tournament time. I hope it's just a confidence thing because it is pretty rough on the offensive end right now

Are we really comparing Stew to Castle? Even "bad" Castle at the start of the year was a great defender, could get in the lane and distribute, rebounded, and could handle the ball.

Stew's problem is that he's not a good shooter (consistent at 27-28% for two years), has a loose handle, and contrary to last season, has been bad defensively. So basically he's your classic 3/4 tweener. He's outstanding when he takes his time and drives to the hoop. He's excellent against a 2/3 because he's a good passer. But we're looking for him to give us some offense as a stretch 4 and he's not a good enough shooter to do that.

 

[boog204]

Ajou Deng, the best UConn player ever, followed closely by "The Ferrari," Rodney Purvis.

I'll just say this... If you, by chance, saw Ajou play at T-More you would have also thought he would be the best player to ever play at UConn. He played just like Durant on offense and blocked a million shots on D. It was crazy.

 

[RuffRuff]

I said this over the summer and people went nuts. Can't remember who it was that thought he'd be a 13-14ppg scorer and be gone to the NBA. I think Jaylin has talent. But the amount of people who speak of what really amounts to 4-5 good games here in his career is nuts. I do think he should start over Jayden, but the Stew love here is over the top.

On another thread I posted Stewarts +/- for the year. They are not good. He is consistently in the minus column. How a player can be a minus in a 30+ win is beyond my understanding.

Ross is -37 this year against good teams. Stew is -46 against good teams.

Thats substantial when your team net in those games is +25 (Dayton game weighing it down).

Again as a reference AM is +7.

Stew actually doesn’t have one positive net game. Don’t want to over index on Net +\-because it doesn’t tell the full story, but it’s a data point. A team being better with you on the floor is important.

 

[RuffRuff]

Are we really comparing Stew to Castle? Even "bad" Castle at the start of the year was a great defender, could get in the lane and distribute, rebounded, and could handle the ball.

Stew's problem is that he's not a good shooter (consistent at 27-28% for two years), has a loose handle, and contrary to last season, has been bad defensively. So basically he's your classic 3/4 tweener. He's outstanding when he takes his time and drives to the hoop. He's excellent against a 2/3 because he's a good passer. But we're looking for him to give us some offense as a stretch 4 and he's not a good enough shooter to do that.

Was pretty surprised when I saw him toss knuckles balls up in the August open practice as would have thought would have been a key area to work on in off season. I don’t think there is any way to be a consistent shooter with a shot void of rotation.

 

[HailUConn]

Ross is -37 this year against good teams. Stew is -46 against good teams.

Thats substantial when your team net in those games is +25 (Dayton game weighing it down).

Again as a reference AM is +7.

Stew actually doesn’t have one positive net game. Don’t want to over index on Net +\-because it doesn’t tell the full story, but it’s a data point. A team being better with you on the floor is important.

Be that as it may, but Jaylin is the on that get yanked at a blink of an eye. OTOH, Hurley seems to give more freedom to AM and Ross. I wonder if playing Jaylin longer and let him figure out mistakes in game time could pay dividend in the long term. I'd choose Jaylin's inconsistency of occasionally playing well to Ross' consistent offensive duds any time.

 

[superjohn]

I now know what your read in your non BY time. Don’t keep that old stash all to yourself.

Hustler was my jam.

 

[RuffRuff]

Hustler was my jam.

RIP Larry Flynt

 

[bendm]

Stew actually doesn’t have one positive net game. Don’t want to over index on Net +\-because it doesn’t tell the full story, but it’s a data point. A team being better with you on the floor is important.

Yeah we don’t beat zags without Stews big game

 

[6Nattys4Us]

I liken basketball to football thru this comparison:
1. In football, some RB just need 20+ runs to break 100 yards; others can do it in 13 runs
2. in basketball, some players need 20 minutes+ of play to break 10 pts or 10 rebounds; others can do it in 13 minutes.

Ross is a 20+ minutes guy who unless he gets that, is not going to have a good box score game. He has already shown with those types of minutes he can be a + player. (UNH and UMES were the only games he had 20+ minutes and scored 10+ in both; in every other game he did not reach 10 pts) - I get those 2 teams were not exactly Gonzaga level, but from a numbers standpoint they work.

Stewart is less dependent on minutes - he had 16pts in 16 minutes vs Memphis, and 10pts in 19 minutes vs Gonzaga.

The kicker is that Ross is averaging more minutes than Stewart per game (largely on the proclaimed defensive skills), but unless Ross gets to 20, he has not produced the numbers.

 

[imno1]

Is it possible Ross looks so good in practice because of the defense he's been facing?

 

[cp176]

Well we are heading into the second week of January. Stewart and Ross are not nearly as good at this time as I expected at least one of them to be. I hope things change for them right now they seem to hurt more than they help.

 

[StllH8L8ner]

Well we are heading into the second week of January. Stewart and Ross are not nearly as good at this time as I expected at least one of them to be. I hope things change for them right now they seem to hurt more than they help.

I thought Stew would step up a little more because he played some meaningful minutes for us last year, but anyone who thought Ross would go from zero minutes to becoming an NBA prospect is high as a kite. I think the early season cupcake schedule caused a lot of high expectations when in reality, all of those teams were fantastically terrible. I scored double digits against LeMoyne when they were DII back in the day for crying out loud…

 

[RuffRuff]

Well we are heading into the second week of January. Stewart and Ross are not nearly as good at this time as I expected at least one of them to be. I hope things change for them right now they seem to hurt more than they help.

Hear yeah - some here saying it’s still only Jan, meanwhile we are halfway into the schedule. Neither of these guys are trending, so I guess some think they’ll have an epiphany. Still crossing the fingers but that makes no sense. It’s rare that you see some development burst for sophomores halfway into the season, that’s what off seasons are for. Everyone here loves reciting the AJAX timeline as if it applies regularly.

 

[RuffRuff]

I thought Stew would step up a little more because he played some meaningful minutes for us last year, but anyone who thought Ross would go from zero minutes to becoming an NBA prospect is high as a kite. I think the early season cupcake schedule caused a lot of high expectations when in reality, all of those teams were fantastically terrible. I scored double digits against LeMoyne when they were DII back in the day for crying out loud…

Those cupcakes are entirely pointless to evaluate against. They show absolutely nothing. We played 2-3 too many and they did absolute zilch other than help boost our KP marginally. Not sure why you play anyone that is a lesser opponent than instrasquad for more than 2 games other than to break the seal. This year in particular it would have been massively beneficial to get a couple of decent mid majors on the calendar before having to see the first real teams in a bandbox 11 hours away. Brutal scheduling this year.

 

[lateralous]

Are we really comparing Stew to Castle? Even "bad" Castle at the start of the year was a great defender, could get in the lane and distribute, rebounded, and could handle the ball.

Stew's problem is that he's not a good shooter (consistent at 27-28% for two years), has a loose handle, and contrary to last season, has been bad defensively. So basically he's your classic 3/4 tweener. He's outstanding when he takes his time and drives to the hoop. He's excellent against a 2/3 because he's a good passer. But we're looking for him to give us some offense as a stretch 4 and he's not a good enough shooter to do that.

No, I was talking about Ross. "I think Hurley sees Ross developing into a piece this team desperately needs, a defensive specialist."

 

[Scottobot]

I'm scratching my head because I've seen several posters that I consider basketball savvy scratch their heads as to why Hurley keeps touting Ross and chose him to start over Mahaney and Stewart now that Liam is out.

The obvious reason has to be what Ross is doing in practice. If you listen to the Providence post game pressor Hurley stated Ross just needs a game where he makes a couple of threes and scores in other ways to be the player coach sees him in practice. Currently the only thing Ross has consistently shown is effort and athleticism. He's made some spectacular blocks, had some put backs and goes for rebounds. But beyond that he's demonstrated very little. So it comes down to this. Can Ross demonstrate in a game what he obviously has shown Hurley in practice? Hurley believes he can. Will it happen? That remains to be seen.

But it can't happen unless he's given every opportunity to try.

If this forum's overwhelming point of view is correct it won't happen and he shouldn't be given that opportunity. I have a different position, I think it can happen. And I believe he (and Stewart) are the x factors to how far this team can go tournament time.

UConn has not been good on defense all year regardless of who is playing. They have won games on offense. The offense has really only looked good when McNeeley is on the court. One of the few exceptions was the lineup for the last 12 minutes of Providence game. I think they found something with that 3 guard lineup featuring Mahaney, Diarra, Ball and Reed at center, and I hope we see more of that in upcoming games.

The problem with Ross and Stewart, is they need to be able to hit the 3 pointer or be able to drive to hoop and score, and they cannot do either at a high enough FG percentage. Stewart has had 2 games where he shot well, and he was effective, but he is at 28% 3Pfg for year. Ross at 20%. That just doesn’t cut it and it’s as simple as that. Mahaney is at 37% from 3, and has shown he can drive to hoop and score.
I think the team still needs to give Ross, Stewart minutes as they really need one of them to break out, and that will only happen if they play, but when the game is on the line I would put Mahaney in.

 

[ctchamps]

UConn has not been good on defense all year regardless of who is playing. They have won games on offense. The offense has really only looked good when McNeeley is on the court. One of the few exceptions was the lineup for the last 12 minutes of Providence game. I think they found something with that 3 guard lineup featuring Mahaney, Diarra, Ball and Reed at center, and I hope we see more of that in upcoming games.

The problem with Ross and Stewart, is they need to be able to hit the 3 pointer or be able to drive to hoop and score, and they cannot do either at a high enough FG percentage. Stewart has had 2 games where he shot well, and he was effective, but he is at 28% 3Pfg for year. Ross at 20%. That just doesn’t cut it and it’s as simple as that. Mahaney is at 37% from 3, and has shown he can drive to hoop and score.
I think the team still needs to give Ross, Stewart minutes as they really need one of them to break out, and that will only happen if they play, but when the game is on the line I would put Mahaney in.

I agree with everything you wrote. And everything you wrote is exactly how the coaches are handling things.

My only intention in starting this thread was to get a discussion as to why Ross is getting any minutes at all and why he’s getting more than Stewart.

 

[6Nattys4Us]

If we start Johnson we are at a deficit on defense and Ross is thought to be a plus defender to help equalize this.
While there are lots of posts about Reed, Jr starting over Johnson, the effect of Johnson in and not Reed, Jr., is a dynamic that cannot be overlooked on defense. Add in Liam's injury and it's exasperated.

That is why Ross is getting minutes -as a defender that we ALL hope can hit a few 3s and keep the other teams defense honest when he has the ball. I posted he needs 20 minutes as evidenced by every game with 20+ he scores 10+, but less than 20 minutes he does not. That has to change, but for right now, that is the Ross we have.

 

[Scottobot]

I agree with everything you wrote. And everything you wrote is exactly how the coaches are handling things.

My only intention in starting this thread was to get a discussion as to why Ross is getting any minutes at all and why he’s getting more than Stewart.

Stewart has shot better than Ross, but played worse on defense. Neither has been good on defense in my opinion, but Stewart has had some real lapses. Stewart is clearly better on offense in my opinion, and I think if he can improve defense and rebounding he will ultimately win those minutes.

Both of these guys need to learn that consistently playing above average on defense is better than making some fantastic defensive plays and completely blowing assignment on on other plays. Ross in particular is trying to block every shot and steal every o pass and that often leaves him out of position

 

[bendm]

It’s rare that you see some development burst for sophomores halfway into the season, that’s what off seasons are for.

The “Fab 5” label has not aged well. Castle was the only one that turned out to be fabulous. Ball is probably meeting expectations as a sophomore but Ross and Stew are not. Singare gets a pass I suppose. Certainly no comparison to the original Fab5

 

[aceboon]

The “Fab 5” label has not aged well. Castle was the only one that turned out to be fabulous. Ball is probably meeting expectations as a sophomore but Ross and Stew are not. Singare gets a pass I suppose. Certainly no comparison to the original Fab5

respectfully to them, there was no comparison when they originally signed

 

[RuffRuff]

The “Fab 5” label has not aged well. Castle was the only one that turned out to be fabulous. Ball is probably meeting expectations as a sophomore but Ross and Stew are not. Singare gets a pass I suppose.

Hurley hadn't yet got his wheels fully in motion, so was fabulous at the time. Hindsight view is the Fine Five. This upcoming class is projected to be much more a Fabulous 4 and I'd expect he keeps that momentum into future recruiting cycles. One thing I'd love to see him bring in more of is that twitchy athlete/dawg (Ajax/Castle), which we aren't getting in this class (although IA and AN might be those players). With Hassan leaving, I'd expect him to look at some options in the portal this year. It's hard to defend when you don't have some plus athletes or a full on eraser (which is hard to find).

Wild when you look at the portal rankings list to see who worked and who hasn't to date. Guys like Haggerty & Lanier have jumped up, and then guys like Davis, Aidoo and Storr have been busts.

2024 College Basketball Top Transfer Portal Players

The best 2024 college basketball players that have entered the transfer portal.

www.on3.com

 

[bendm]

respectfully to them, there was no comparison when they originally signed

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[aceboon]

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Yea I know the media and the staff were dubbing them that for promotion but there was no comparison, especially when you consider how the 2023 recruiting class was viewed by scouts as a whole.

 

[Scrutineer]

Staff may see similar things but how they are different is that they are not nearly as knee jerk as posters and see the full 360 of the situation. There may be plenty of details we don’t see that are important to overall team health. Can trust it and question it at the same time.

What fun would this place be if all we recited was “in staff we trust” ?

My take is they liked Ross and Stewart when they recruited them, have invested a lot of time and energy developing them, and don't want to bail on their potential......yet. But the time may come if they don't make more meaningful contributions.