The cupboard is bare

[Carl Spackler]

You are totally wrong. Here was the OL depth chart at the start of the 2011 season:

LT: Ryan RSr, Bennett RJr, Gifford, FR
LG: Bardzak RSr, Bullock RSo,
C: Petrus RSr, Paull RFr
RG: Greene RSo, Cruz RFr
RT: Masters RJr, Friend RSo, Hanson RFr

In 2011, UConn had very balanced OL classes: 3 RSr, 2 RJr, 3 RSo, 3 RFr, 3 Fr, 3 walk-ons (1 RJr, 1 RSo, 1 RFr) and 2 long snappers of a Soph and a Senior. How can you get more balanced than that?!!! If the OL roster balance and roster was so out of whack, why did PP/GDL only bring to campus 3 OL in 2012 and 2 in 2013 the same number lost to graduation?

Face fact, PP/GDL did not develop the OL. And, they changed the blocking schemes as well!

There weren't enough OL's in the classes from 2008-2011 that came in, and of those that came in, we had attrition and lack of development and players are either gone or the 2 that remain are buried on the depth chart. Deleone and pasqualoni haven't coached a UCONN player since September 2013, and the players they brought in have beaten out the players that Edsall brought in under a new coaching staff. Seriously - I'm not going to argue this again. Deleone is a disaster of a coach, no doubt. Edsall left this program in Jan 2011 with a major deficiency in simple numbers of recruits coming in in multiple position groups. This is undeniable fact.

If you really take a unbiased look at the recruiting quality and talent from that same time parent - you've got a very, very wide gap between the handful of players that are really good, and the handful of players in each class that are gone. But that's all very subjective, the simple NLI recruiting cycle numbers for an 85 scholarship limit roster, are not subjective.

If I do ever get to talk to Randy again, I'm going to ask him why the 2011 incoming class was so small as of mid-December 2010.

 

[freescooter]

Pasqualoni took a very different approach to recruiting than Edsall. Randy took lots of athletic kids who weren't really polished as football player or were considered just a tad undersized or slow or something else. And he built them into football players. Sometimes I think those initial limitations kept us just a hair behind the more elite programs of the Big East but overall it worked. Pasqualoni looked for his prototypes and complained about the guys he found that were not quite as big or as fast or as polished as other teams had. Unlike Edsall developing guys wasn't in his DNA at the point he came to Storrs. Partly I think that was the result of so many years in the NFL.

 

[UConnJim]

There weren't enough OL's in the classes from 2008-2011 that came in, and of those that came in, we had attrition and lack of development and players are either gone or the 2 that remain are buried on the depth chart. Deleone and pasqualoni haven't coached a UCONN player since September 2013, and the players they brought in have beaten out the players that Edsall brought in under a new coaching staff. Seriously - I'm not going to argue this again. Deleone is a disaster of a coach, no doubt. Edsall left this program in Jan 2011 with a major deficiency in simple numbers of recruits coming in in multiple position groups. This is undeniable fact.

If you really take a unbiased look at the recruiting quality and talent from that same time parent - you've got a very, very wide gap between the handful of players that are really good, and the handful of players in each class that are gone. But that's all very subjective, the simple NLI recruiting cycle numbers for an 85 scholarship limit roster, are not subjective.

If I do ever get to talk to Randy again, I'm going to ask him why the 2011 incoming class was so small as of mid-December 2010.

So having 3 RSr, 2 RJr, 3 RSo, 3 RFr, 3 Fr, 3 walk-ons (1 RJr, 1 RSo, 1 RFr) and 2 long snappers of a Soph and a Senior is not balanced? I guess we just disagree. Where is the hole in the OL roster? If you claim they weren't very good players, I would argue they weren't developed by PP/GDL. You still haven't answered why PP/GDL only took 3 OLs in 2012 and 2 OLs in 2013, the same number that graduated, if they thought the cupboard was bare?

Edsall projected and developed recruits. Remember Kendall Reyes? 220 lb LB when he committed to UConn. Leaves UConn as a 300 lb DT/DE. Wouldn't have fit the PP/GDL "prototype". Maybe Diaco can develop PP/GDL's recruits into players, but I am confident that they will be better players under Diaco than they would have been under PP/GDL.

Anybody who thinks that UConn didn't have talent when PP/GDL took over isn't looking at the facts. The reality is that Diaco inherited the mess left by PP/GDL.

 

[Carl Spackler]

It seems that as hard as I have tried to make the distinction - and it's pretty clear when I re-read, that people can't keep the concepts of player talent separate from what it means to have actually recruited an adequate number of athletes through NLI cycles that will regularly fill out an 85 scholarship limit. Oh well.

 

[uconndogs]

Here's another example of P and GDL. When P took over he lost Robbie Frye (transfer) and the USC transfer (injury) as RBs so he was more or less forced to run McCombs. McCombs did a nice job running behind a pretty seasoned line (Ryan and that crew). Although, to me and a lot of folks it was obvious that McCombs was not an every down back.

Then nothing.......

No running back recruits, transfers and the OL goes reeling backwards. We got stuffed at the LOS to the point where Towson kicked our a$$es. The direction this thing went under P is unmistakable. I'm sure talent is part of the issue, but Towson.......................?

 

[UConnJim]

It seems that as hard as I have tried to make the distinction - and it's pretty clear when I re-read, that people can't keep the concepts of player talent separate from what it means to have actually recruited an adequate number of athletes through NLI cycles that will regularly fill out an 85 scholarship limit. Oh well.

Just explain how the OL heading into 2011 was not balanced by class? And, why did PP/GDL only recruit 3 OL in 2012 and 2 OL in 2013 if there was such a balance/talent problem? Please use numbers, not superlatives, to explain it to me.

The only spot on the roster that was troubling to me in 2011 was RB with Todman leaving after the Fiesta Bowl. After Todman left, it was clear another RB was needed to be recruited in the 2011 class, but I give PP/GDL a pass on that given they were just hired, but no excuse for not addressing the need in the 2012 class.

As for why the class was so small in December 2010, history has shown that Edsall typically grabbed 5 to 7 recruits after January 1st. PP/GDL grabbed 3 and lost 1 before signing day for a net 2. I believe Edsall would have stayed with history and the 2011 class would have been 3 to 5 players bigger and we would have seen another RB in the class.

Fun fact, the Edsall recruit PP/GDL lost was Adrian Amos a 2* safety (became 3* when he committed to PSU) that switched to Penn St and was a 5th round NFL draft pick of the Chicago Bears this year. Clearly, Edsall knew how to recruit.

 

[SubbaBub]

Pasqualoni took a very different approach to recruiting than Edsall. Randy took lots of athletic kids who weren't really polished as football player or were considered just a tad undersized or slow or something else. And he built them into football players. Sometimes I think those initial limitations kept us just a hair behind the more elite programs of the Big East but overall it worked. Pasqualoni looked for his prototypes and complained about the guys he found that were not quite as big or as fast or as polished as other teams had. Unlike Edsall developing guys wasn't in his DNA at the point he came to Storrs. Partly I think that was the result of so many years in the NFL.

My fear is that P/GDL scanned the recruiting site reports like they were the racing form at the dog track and offered kids willing to come here instead of the Patriot League, etc.

 

[Duncan Idaho]

So having 3 RSr, 2 RJr, 3 RSo, 3 RFr, 3 Fr, 3 walk-ons (1 RJr, 1 RSo, 1 RFr) and 2 long snappers of a Soph and a Senior is not balanced? I guess we just disagree. Where is the hole in the OL roster? If you claim they weren't very good players, I would argue they weren't developed by PP/GDL. You still haven't answered why PP/GDL only took 3 OLs in 2012 and 2 OLs in 2013, the same number that graduated, if they thought the cupboard was bare?

Edsall projected and developed recruits. Remember Kendall Reyes? 220 lb LB when he committed to UConn. Leaves UConn as a 300 lb DT/DE. Wouldn't have fit the PP/GDL "prototype". Maybe Diaco can develop PP/GDL's recruits into players, but I am confident that they will be better players under Diaco than they would have been under PP/GDL.

Anybody who thinks that UConn didn't have talent when PP/GDL took over isn't looking at the facts. The reality is that Diaco inherited the mess left by PP/GDL.

Just explain how the OL heading into 2011 was not balanced by class? And, why did PP/GDL only recruit 3 OL in 2012 and 2 OL in 2013 if there was such a balance/talent problem? Please use numbers, not superlatives, to explain it to me.
Then why did he try/recruit Transfer, 5th year, JUCO OL and TEs?

 

[Carl Spackler]

Just explain how the OL heading into 2011 was not balanced by class? And, why did PP/GDL only recruit 3 OL in 2012 and 2 OL in 2013 if there was such a balance/talent problem? Please use numbers, not superlatives, to explain it to me.

The only spot on the roster that was troubling to me in 2011 was RB with Todman leaving after the Fiesta Bowl. After Todman left, it was clear another RB was needed to be recruited in the 2011 class, but I give PP/GDL a pass on that given they were just hired, but no excuse for not addressing the need in the 2012 class.

As for why the class was so small in December 2010, history has shown that Edsall typically grabbed 5 to 7 recruits after January 1st. PP/GDL grabbed 3 and lost 1 before signing day for a net 2. I believe Edsall would have stayed with history and the 2011 class would have been 3 to 5 players bigger and we would have seen another RB in the class.

Fun fact, the Edsall recruit PP/GDL lost was Adrian Amos a 2* safety (became 3* when he committed to PSU) that switched to Penn St and was a 5th round NFL draft pick of the Chicago Bears this year. Clearly, Edsall knew how to recruit.

Honestly, I've done it umpteen times before with specifics. I'm not doing it again. Just think about this. In the space of 3 years (2011-2014) Pasqualoni came in - and immediately found a major recruiting hole at the OL - which he started bringing in lots of players from anywhere and everywhere, most of which were slated for immediate playing time. Some lasted and some didn't. Some never made it to campus, some did and left, some are still here. Diaco - came on board, and immediately found a recruiting hole at the OL, and started recruiting OL's heavily, most of which were slated for immediate playing time and now make up the majority of our roster. Unless I've really gone off the deep end, I don't see how this can be argued. Playing time for the OL - immediate? if there is one position that needs development time in football - it's offensive line. Why are two coaches within the space of 3 years recruiting true freshmen to be starters on the OL?

The fact that Deleone was as disaster of an OL coach and offensive coordinator for 2.25 seasons covers up the problem regarding recruiting for an adequate 10 players on a game day 2-deep roster over an earlier, and longer period of time. Why was Tyler Samra starting as a true freshmen? Because the coaches wanted to start a true freshmen on the OL? Why was Crozier starting as a true freshmen on the OL? Because Diaco wanted him to?

 

[UConnJim]

Honestly, I've done it umpteen times before with specifics. I'm not doing it again. Just think about this. In the space of 3 years (2011-2014) Pasqualoni came in - and immediately found a major recruiting hole at the OL - which he started bringing in lots of players from anywhere and everywhere, most of which were slated for immediate playing time. Some lasted and some didn't. Some never made it to campus, some did and left, some are still here. Diaco - came on board, and immediately found a recruiting hole at the OL, and started recruiting OL's heavily, most of which were slated for immediate playing time and now make up the majority of our roster. Unless I've really gone off the deep end, I don't see how this can be argued. Playing time for the OL - immediate? if there is one position that needs development time in football - it's offensive line. Why are two coaches within the space of 3 years recruiting true freshmen to be starters on the OL?

The fact that Deleone was as disaster of an OL coach and offensive coordinator for 2.25 seasons covers up the problem regarding recruiting for an adequate 10 players on a game day 2-deep roster over an earlier, and longer period of time. Why was Tyler Samra starting as a true freshmen? Because the coaches wanted to start a true freshmen on the OL? Why was Crozier starting as a true freshmen on the OL? Because Diaco wanted him to?

Again, no facts. It's hard to argue with someone who uses superlatives and not facts.

2012 OL recruits: Levy, Rugg, Samra (I'll also add Bockeloh)
2013 OL recruits: Hopkins, Schafenaker
2014 OL recruits when Diaco came in: Rutherford.

Where are all of these OL recruits to fill holes that PP/GDL identified?

And, Knappe was brought in as a DL.

Look, Edsall OL recruits needed to be developed as he was more focused on frames and athleticism. PP/GDL weren't projecting recruits, they were looking for prototypes. Of course Edsall recruited OL weren't going to be very good if PP/GDL didn't development them as they weren't ready to be productive players.

 

[Carl Spackler]

Again, no facts. It's hard to argue with someone who uses superlatives and not facts.

2012 OL recruits: Levy, Rugg, Samra (I'll also add Bockeloh)
2013 OL recruits: Hopkins, Schafenaker
2014 OL recruits when Diaco came in: Rutherford.

Where are all of these OL recruits to fill holes that PP/GDL identified?

And, Knappe was brought in as a DL.

Look, Edsall OL recruits needed to be developed as he was more focused on frames and athleticism. PP/GDL weren't projecting recruits, they were looking for prototypes. Of course Edsall recruited OL weren't going to be very good if PP/GDL didn't development them as they weren't ready to be productive players.

Many will remember - and hold my feet to the fire for it - the things I wrote about Pasqualoni and adequeatly recruiting for a division 1 roster when he was hired. Time has not yet proven me wrong. Edsall was not adequately recruiting for the roster in size/speed/and most importantly numbers. OL is the position group where it is simply undeniable. If we were talking about DB's right now, or RB's, you might have a leg to stand on, but you're just blowing smoke with this OL now, based on two things:

#1. Your belief that Edsall was adequately recruiting size/speed and most importantly numbers and
#2. Your belief that Pasqualoni and Deleone destroyed the program by failing develop Edsall's recruits on the OL.

Reality is that the defense during pasqualoni's 2.25 seasons was good. The offense sucked. The offense wasn't particularly great in 2010 either.

Reality is that Deleone took players that were either underdeveloped and not skilled enough and installed a new system, and he was a bad coach at teaching the system such that the players would perform well in it for 2.25 seasons.

Reality is that the majority of the great offensive line production in Edsall's years came from the same handful of players, rather than a robust recruiting of an effective 10 man group on a 2-deep roster rotating through classes over two 5 year recruiting cycles in division 1.

Reality is that we have had two head coaches in the space of 4 seasons bring in OL's that have significant playing time as true freshmen and two head coaches in the space of 4 years that have rotated OL's across the line with the stated purpose of attempting to develop adequate depth.

Reality is that Diaco gets a pass for a throwaway season at this point, because there is no other choice for fans and followers of the program, but he's got to improve as a coach.

I'm done with this. For real.

 

[Jarhead_1775]

Many will remember - and hold my feet to the fire for it - the things I wrote about Pasqualoni and adequeatly recruiting for a division 1 roster when he was hired. Time has not yet proven me wrong. Edsall was not adequately recruiting for the roster in size/speed/and most importantly numbers. OL is the position group where it is simply undeniable. If we were talking about DB's right now, or RB's, you might have a leg to stand on, but you're just blowing smoke with this OL now, based on two things: #1. Your belief that Edsall was adequately recruiting size/speed and most importantly numbers and #2. Your belief that Pasqualoni and Deleone destroyed the program by failing develop Edsall's recruits on the OL. Reality is that the defense during pasqualoni's 2.25 seasons was good. The offense sucked. The offense wasn't particularly great in 2010 either. Reality is that Deleone took players that were either underdeveloped and not skilled enough and installed a new system, and he was a bad coach at teaching the system such that the players would perform well in it for 2.25 seasons. Reality is that the majority of the great offensive line production in Edsall's years came from the same handful of players, rather than a robust recruiting of an effective 10 man group on a 2-deep roster rotating through classes over two 5 year recruiting cycles in division 1. Reality is that we have had two head coaches in the space of 4 seasons bring in OL's that have significant playing time as true freshmen and two head coaches in the space of 4 years that have rotated OL's across the line with the stated purpose of attempting to develop adequate depth. Reality is that Diaco gets a pass for a throwaway season at this point, because there is no other choice for fans and followers of the program, but he's got to improve as a coach. I'm done with this. For real.

Sure you are, Tolstoy!

 

[FfldCntyFan]

If I do ever get to talk to Randy again, I'm going to ask him why the 2011 incoming class was so small as of mid-December 2010.

This is just speculation but under RE we normally got a few recruits (a lot in the early years) late in the process (after mid-December). There probably would have been a more standard recruiting class that year if RE stuck around.

 

[freescooter]

Carl
The only disagreement I have with you is on the argument that we only had 2 productive oline classes. Even relatively early on UConn had pretty fair olines. Olovsky played behind some pretty good ones not great but given where the program was they weren't too bad and Brockington led the Big East in rushing too. That was really the start of UConns run of tough offensive lines.

 

[Carl Spackler]

Carl
The only disagreement I have with you is on the argument that we only had 2 productive oline classes. Even relatively early on UConn had pretty fair olines. Olovsky played behind some pretty good ones not great but given where the program was they weren't too bad and Brockington led the Big East in rushing too. That was really the start of UConns run of tough offensive lines.

I never said we only had 2 productive OL classes. I've said we weren't adequately recruiting for a full OL depth chart in bare minimum simple numbers from about 2006-2011 5 year cycle. That's not subjective, it's objective. subjectively - I can't see how anyone can conclude that we recruiting adequate speed, size, talent in the OL in the numbers we did recruit.

Edsall was able to get away with it because guys like Moe Petrus and Mike Hicks rank #1 and #2 for UCONN in consecutive starts - ALL TIME. They rank in the top 5 in career games played - ALL TIME. When you look further down those two lists - you see the names of the players they lined up with from 2006-2011 on both lists in the top 15-top20 - for UCONN players - ALL TIME.

For the record - the winningest 5 year period in UCONN history - is still the 1986-1990 seasons. THe guy with most starts there - DeGennaro. In the early 2000s, you don't see the OL's in that list - you see Dan Orlovsky.

Mixed in those lists are scattered long term defensive starters from each period too - Lawrence Wilson, James Hargrave - fantastic player. It's highly unusual to have multiple OL's bee in those lists.

Look - Edsall was able to win without recruiting a solid long term QB at UCONN because he lucked out in recruiting several long term starters on the OL.

 

[Tdaley]

Carl is correct. Edsall wasn't any better recruiter than Pasqualoni. In fact, Pasqualoni was able to recruit better offensive players in his two recruiting classes than Edsall did in his last few few classes.. We got an upgrade in receivers and a slight upgrade in the quarterback position. Edsall, however, knew how to win with his the limited ability to attract big time play makers to UConn. He built his defense with lunch pail players that could hit. He found diamonds in the rough for his defense and was always able to develop offensive linemen. As long as he had at least one quality running back, his teams could win games by pounding the ball, hitting hard on defense and not turning the ball over. His teams generally could not throw or catch the ball ( except in the Dan O years) but they knew how to play smash mouth football. After losing in the Fiesta bowl it was very clear that for this program to move forward we needed to be able to throw the football and add speed to our teams. Pasqualoni recognized that fact and set out to do so. Unfortunately, the execution of the plan was poor. He installed a pro style offense to throw the ball more but didn't have the talent to carry out that strategy. He was unable to recognize and fix the serious problems in the offensive line, yet he continue to run an offensive system that wasn't ever going to work with the players that he had. Remember, the last few years Edsall was here he was interviewing for every decent job that open up and opposing coaches were using that fact against us in the recruiting wars. Both Edsall and Pasqualoni played a role in causing the mess that our program is in today.

 

[UConnJim]

Carl is correct. Edsall wasn't any better recruiter than Pasqualoni. In fact, Pasqualoni was able to recruit better offensive players in his two recruiting classes than Edsall did in his last few few classes.. We got an upgrade in receivers and a slight upgrade in the quarterback position. Edsall, however, knew how to win with his the limited ability to attract big time play makers to UConn. He built his defense with lunch pail players that could hit. He found diamonds in the rough for his defense and was always able to develop offensive linemen. As long as he had at least one quality running back, his teams could win games by pounding the ball, hitting hard on defense and not turning the ball over. His teams generally could not throw or catch the ball ( except in the Dan O years) but they knew how to play smash mouth football. After losing in the Fiesta bowl it was very clear that for this program to move forward we needed to be able to throw the football and add speed to our teams. Pasqualoni recognized that fact and set out to do so. Unfortunately, the execution of the plan was poor. He installed a pro style offense to throw the ball more but didn't have the talent to carry out that strategy. He was unable to recognize and fix the serious problems in the offensive line, yet he continue to run an offensive system that wasn't ever going to work with the players that he had. Remember, the last few years Edsall was here he was interviewing for every decent job that open up and opposing coaches were using that fact against us in the recruiting wars. Both Edsall and Pasqualoni played a role in causing the mess that our program is in today.

WR had a lot of talent when PP/GDL took over: Kashif Moore RSr, Geremy Davis RFr, Tebucky Jones RFr, Nick Williams Jr, Leon Kinnard So, Isiah Moore RJr, Mike Smith Sr, Gerrard Sheppard RJr, Malik Generett RSo. You had one 6th round draft pick and 4 WRs (Smith, Williams, K. Moore, and Sheppard) who were signed by NFL teams. So, out of the 9 WRs PP/GDL inherited, 5 were thought highly enough by the NFL to sign and one, Jones, might be signed after leaving Fordham. And, PP/GDL inherited TE Ryan Griffin who they couldn't figure out how to utilize, yet he was drafted and plays for the Houston Texans.

As for QB, PP/GDL ran off the two best QBs on the roster. Michael Box had a good college career and even had some NFL draft consideration. He was rated the #68 QB coming out for the draft in 2014 by one service and was signed by the Redskins as an UFA. Mike Nebrich had a very good career at Fordham. By one service he was rated the #31 QB coming out this year and #46 by another. The QB position was serviceable when PP/GDL got to UConn, but they couldn't figure out how to make it work.

As for recruiting, I just don't see it with PP/GDL's recruits. They lost so many of the recruits after signing day and didn't develop what they had. WRs? Edsall left a better group than PP/GDL. TEs? Edsall left better talent. QBs? I think Edsall left better talent but Box and Nebrich left, although Cochran showed promise. OL? No question Edsall left better talent as it was a disaster last season and we were playing true freshmen. RBs? Kind of a push because Todman left early. Defense? Edsall left so much more talent than PP/GDL that it is not even debatable.

Guys, please stop with the "cupboard was empty" crap. Disco inherited a bare cupboard, not PP/GDL. PP/GDL were beyond their prime and not a good fit to return to college football.

 

[whaler11]

Based on what we saw I don't think it was 'luck' that Edsall recruited good offensive lines and didn't recruit good quarterbacks.

 

[Carl Spackler]

Based on what we saw I don't think it was 'luck' that Edsall recruited good offensive lines and didn't recruit good quarterbacks.

Call it what you want - but the facts are that the 2 big east titles b/w 2007-2010 came on the reliability of about 8 regular playing offensive linemen, one of which was a walk on recruited Danny Lansanah.

You're right though, can't call it luck that the majority of that group were multiple year starters. It's good fortune that none of them went down hurt regularly. Can't really tell what recruiting was like behind that group - other than the fact that two subsequent head coaches came in between 2011 and 2014 and immediately started addressing a recruiting problem on the OL - by playing true freshmen.

 

[SubbaBub]

You can rightfully ding Edsall for not recruiting skill players (QB/WR/DE). But, that's about it. His first full recruiting class as a BCS school won a conference title as seniors and two years later he won it again.

 

[freescooter]

Under Edsall and Foley we had not 1 but 2 walk on linemen drafted by the NFL. Edsall could find talent about as well as anyone.

 

[Pudge]

OK ... can we get consensus.

It is RE recruiting COMBINED with solid development that got us to a very good platform in a short amount of time. THE PP years pulled some good Stars but we saw meager development at key Line spots and no better QB play. And, HCRE was far better in putting RBs in positions that they could succeed.

Foley was good. But ... I suspect that his undoing was the same lack of development through the previous 3 years.

 

[Duncan Idaho]

You can rightfully ding Edsall for not recruiting skill players (QB/WR/DE). But, that's about it. His first full recruiting class as a BCS school won a conference title as seniors and two years later he won it again.

DEs?
Osunde, Tyler King, Cody Brown, Trev Williams, Julius Williams, Dan Davis, Lindsey Whitten, Jesse Joseph til hurt. Not to bad.

 

[Duncan Idaho]

Under Edsall and Foley we had not 1 but 2 walk on linemen drafted by the NFL. Edsall could find talent about as well as anyone.

Who was the second after Thomas?

 

[businesslawyer]

I sort of understand blaming a LOSING coach for losing seasons four years out. Blamng a WINNING coach for it is beyond absurd.

I don't have all day but three points will have to do.

1. Enough with the lack of TBs coming in the fall of '11. When that recruiting season stated a year earler, we had four -- FOUR -- TBs we were happy with coming back for the 11 season. Todman, who left early for the NFL, Wylie and Shumate, who lost their 5th years due to injury and Robbie Frey, who departed for grad school in his home state. You can't always be ready for four players at the same position in the same class to leave a year early. Stuff happens.

2. Spackler continues with this false narrative about a critical shortage of OL because we didn't have a competent two deep. We never had a real, ready two deep on the OL. If you followed our roster over a decade, HCRE's philosophy was clearly I only need 7 or 8 deep on the OL for any season because I'm only playing 5 barring injuries, and I'd rather go 3 deep at positions like WR, and DB, and LB, where if you don't play you can help me on specials. Our team was always built that way. It's just that when we changed coaches, the new staff couldn't make it work because we didn't develop the same percentage of underrecruited OLs into solid players that Edsall and staff did.

3. We didn't thrive with one core group of OL, as Spackler said. We ran the ball effectively (sometimes more effectively than others obviously) from the moment '03 until HCRE left, with the single exception of the year and a half when Edsall stubbornly played a post-injury TC. And that problem was solved immediately when TC got hurt and Donald Brown stepped in and went from bench to 200 yards a game behind the same OL in '06.

 

[whaler11]

How great would it be if Bizlaw was spelling DJs name wrong on purpose all along?

 

[businesslawyer]

I never said we only had 2 productive OL classes. I've said we weren't adequately recruiting for a full OL depth chart in bare minimum simple numbers from about 2006-2011 5 year cycle. That's not subjective, it's objective. subjectively - I can't see how anyone can conclude that we recruiting adequate speed, size, talent in the OL in the numbers we did recruit.

Edsall was able to get away with it because guys like Moe Petrus and Mike Hicks rank #1 and #2 for UCONN in consecutive starts - ALL TIME. They rank in the top 5 in career games played - ALL TIME. When you look further down those two lists - you see the names of the players they lined up with from 2006-2011 on both lists in the top 15-top20 - for UCONN players - ALL TIME.

For the record - the winningest 5 year period in UCONN history - is still the 1986-1990 seasons. THe guy with most starts there - DeGennaro. In the early 2000s, you don't see the OL's in that list - you see Dan Orlovsky.

Mixed in those lists are scattered long term defensive starters from each period too - Lawrence Wilson, James Hargrave - fantastic player. It's highly unusual to have multiple OL's bee in those lists.

Look - Edsall was able to win without recruiting a solid long term QB at UCONN because he lucked out in recruiting several long term starters on the OL.

I can't tell you how much I long for the days when -- like with basketball -- we criticized ourselves for how we were winning instead of how we are losing.

 

[Carl Spackler]

I can't tell you how much I long for the days when -- like with basketball -- we criticized ourselves for how we were winning instead of how we are losing.

One of my critiques of winning, was the recruiting coming on the tails of winning. Harbinger of sorrow.

 

[Kgun7]

Under Edsall and Foley we had not 1 but 2 walk on linemen drafted by the NFL. Edsall could find talent about as well as anyone.

I may be splitting hairs ... but Edsall didn't find Donald Thomas ... he may have developed him ... but Donald Thomas (with the help of Danny Lansanah) found Edsall ...

 

[Tdaley]

WR had a lot of talent when PP/GDL took over: Kashif Moore RSr, Geremy Davis RFr, Tebucky Jones RFr, Nick Williams Jr, Leon Kinnard So, Isiah Moore RJr, Mike Smith Sr, Gerrard Sheppard RJr, Malik Generett RSo. You had one 6th round draft pick and 4 WRs (Smith, Williams, K. Moore, and Sheppard) who were signed by NFL teams. So, out of the 9 WRs PP/GDL inherited, 5 were thought highly enough by the NFL to sign and one, Jones, might be signed after leaving Fordham. And, PP/GDL inherited TE Ryan Griffin who they couldn't figure out how to utilize, yet he was drafted and plays for the Houston Texans.

As for QB, PP/GDL ran off the two best QBs on the roster. Michael Box had a good college career and even had some NFL draft consideration. He was rated the #68 QB coming out for the draft in 2014 by one service and was signed by the Redskins as an UFA. Mike Nebrich had a very good career at Fordham. By one service he was rated the #31 QB coming out this year and #46 by another. The QB position was serviceable when PP/GDL got to UConn, but they couldn't figure out how to make it work.

As for recruiting, I just don't see it with PP/GDL's recruits. They lost so many of the recruits after signing day and didn't develop what they had. WRs? Edsall left a better group than PP/GDL. TEs? Edsall left better talent. QBs? I think Edsall left better talent but Box and Nebrich left, although Cochran showed promise. OL? No question Edsall left better talent as it was a disaster last season and we were playing true freshmen. RBs? Kind of a push because Todman left early. Defense? Edsall left so much more talent than PP/GDL that it is not even debatable.

Guys, please stop with the "cupboard was empty" crap. Disco inherited a bare cupboard, not PP/GDL. PP/GDL were beyond their prime and not a good fit to return to college football.