SW Force Awakens - Review w/ spoilers (Don't read until after you see it)

[CL82]

Thought you all might enjoy this.

http://www.gloucesterclam.com/2016/...rs-of-the-first-order-re-death-star-doctrine/

Hysterical, but the comments are even better.

 

[tzznandrew]

Rian Johnson is doing episode VIII and Colin Trevorrow (Jurassic World) is doing episdoe IX.

My opinion on VII is very similar to yours. If the next two episodes are great and original I will have a positive opinion about it, but until those movies come out it is hard to completely judge TFA.

Yeah I don't see how others are that upset. It was a fun movie on its own that felt like Star Wars. There were similarities, for sure, but I think that's a bit overplayed. Or it won't be if others are too.

Trevorrow is directing, but my understanding is that Johnson is taking the basic plot from Kasdan/Abrams and writing both of the last two.

 

[MilliniumPrince]

They basically remade Episode 4. I thought it was good, but not great. A little too lighthearted for me. I thought Episode III was better. It is still worth the money.

I thought it would have been cool if both Rey and Finn were Jedies. I think I need to see it again.

 

[Penfield]

Trevorrow is directing, but my understanding is that Johnson is taking the basic plot from Kasdan/Abrams and writing both of the last two.

Just checked it out on IMDB and you're right which I think is a good thing.

I had read an article the other day and JJ said he would be helping Rian with his story and then Rian would be there to help Colin for IX so I assumed that meant Colin was writing the last one

 

[August_West]

 

[tzznandrew]

I'm sure there are a lot of really interesting easter eggs and red herrings like this that we'll see going forward.

 

[junglehusky]

I think we will see Kylo drawn back to the light... but maybe we will see Rey go closer to the Dark side thank Luke did????

 

[CL82]

I don't know why, but I suspect that Supreme Leader Snoke is going to be Yoda sized in person.

 

[The Viking]

Just checked it out on IMDB and you're right which I think is a good thing.

I had read an article the other day and JJ said he would be helping Rian with his story and then Rian would be there to help Colin for IX so I assumed that meant Colin was writing the last one

The script for VIII is done (they begin filming this month and I believe it comes out in May 2017)
Abrams read it and loved it. After reading it he told one of his friends he wished he stayed on as director for VIII. Apparently one of his friends says he never compliments other scripts the way he did after reading VIII.
I don't know much about Rian Johnson other than the fact he directed one of the best Breaking Bad episodes ever...the one where Hank and Gomez get shot in the desert. I went back and watched it after hearing it was Johnson at the helm and it was so well done. I think VIII will be outstanding.

 

[intlzncster]

Ok, people from the other thread: @August_West @Spartacus @Mr. Conehead @UCFBfan @junglehusky @tzznandrew @CL82 @Jarhead_1775 @Penfield @8893

Finally saw the damn thing. I'm going to post without reading any thing else here first. Overall, good, not great. I have to say that I was mildly disappointed; I didn't leave the theater all jazzed and walking on air. Failed on some really important things imo.

First the good:

Loved the intro. Instant . The original scroll effect, combined with scan down to planet, still holds up.

Harrison Ford killed it once again in the reprise of Han. There's a reason this guy is one of the best actors of his generation. Only bummer is we won't get to see him in future episodes. Although, I did think killing the character off was overall a good move, added a much needed pathos to the film.

Kilo Ren. Loved that actor. Love the getup. Loved the Saber. The voice with helmet on and off. Almost everything about him. Except for his childishness sometimes, but I can let that slide given that he is supposed to be 'underdeveloped' force-wise. He along with Han were my favorite characters. The Han Solo death scene was awesome. Chewie going ballistic after was awesome.

Vader helmet scene was awesome. Ren struggling with himself. I like that. A well done look at his stage of development.

While, prior to watching, I scoffed at the politically correct casting overall, John Boyega as the turncoat stormtrooper was really very good. Great casting/acting there. They wrote his character a little poorly, as he was a bit too bumbling for my taste--especially in the beginning, but he was my third favorite character in the movie (behind Han and Kylo).

Really loved the cinematography throughout. They didn't overdue the CGI, as they did in the first 3 episodes, where it felt like Industrial Light & Magic was testing the limits of a new toy (they were). The ships and the space was a nice mix between the feel of the original trilogy and newer modernized CGI effects. Well done.

There weren't any completely hokey characters. That's a good thing. Some people didn't like the little droid. I was a fan. Nice mix between (too hokey) C3P0--which worked in the 70's--and R2D2. He was funny, but not often obnoxious. Thumbs up little droid dude.

I like most of the Luke scene at the end. It was almost powerful. Cool helicopter camera technique at the end to the closing credit. The only problem was that the holding out of the saber (for what seemed like 20 minutes) was stilted. It should have ended with Rey holding out the saber for about 5-10 seconds. Luke, eyes watering, raises his hand and uses the force to pull the saber through the air and into his hand. Scene ends with him examining the saber in his outstretched hand, struggling with opposing internal dueling emotions, as the the helicopter camera shot takes us out to darkness. Where do I apply for a scripwriter's position?

And now for the criticism (yes, I realize I have a high standard):

If I had wanted to see the plot of Episode IV, I would have popped Episode IV in the DVD player and not spent the $20 and dragged my arse to the theater. Couldn't they have branched out a little further than that? Is there a modicum of creativity running around in Hollywood these days? It was a homage to Episode IV, and to a lesser extent V and VI. This is what Hollywood churns out left and right these days. Remakes or comic book knock offs. No actual creative writing.

Chewy was more expressive than in IV-VI, but I thought that took away from the character. I don't want to see Chewy smile. That's not his shtick. I also wanted to see him in permanent mourning for Han. Not grinning ear to ear.

The lightsaber scenes were underwhelming, choreography wise. Though the snowy setting for the fight was great though. I think they hit a high point in Episode VII with Darth Maul. Darth Maul was a criminally underused character and should have been present through the first 3 episodes (yes, I know they wanted one villain in each -> stupid).

How the could Finn and Rey hang with Kylo Ren in a lightsaber dual? It makes no sense. Yes, I realize Finn is trained in hand to hand combat (despite working in sanitation and going on exactly ONE (failed) mission prior to that) and that Rey had done some fighting at home to survive. But this is the first time either of them truly fought with the weapon, pitted against a highly trained Jedi (both skillwise and in the force). Two swipes and they'd be split in half.

Carrie Fischer forgot how to act. She seemed borderline dumb at points.

The plan came together real quick. Like lightspeed quick. OK, let's figure out how to blow up this planet on the back of a napkin. Kid, you go destroy the Oscillators. Done. Send out 20 twenty dudes (which inexplicably is the entire fleet of the resistance?) and take it down the main cannon sight unseen. The rest of us will just sit here and twiddle our thumbs, hoping for the best, while the worlds biggest gun is point at our head. It felt more 'real' in Episode IV. Although, the flying and shooting in that scene was great.

The Millennium Falcon does not fly like a tie fighter. It's a 70's muscle car, as opposed to a modern day Porsche 911 Tie fighter. That's part of it's charm. I love the Falcon, and don't like seeing it disrespected like that.

How the did Rey learn to access the force so quickly, and with such control? It took Vader years. Look the greatest Jedi in the known universe (Luke) took a bunch of time, and he was getting tutored by the greatest Jedi ever (Yoda) and one of his protégés (Kenobi).

Wooden Rey has the same face the whole movie. Can't she have any expression other than a look of dumb consternation on her face? I have no idea if she can act or not. The directing and the script didn't let her? Dunno what to think there.

Snoke was interesting, but did they have to make him 100 feet tall? I realize it's a hologram/projection, and they wanted him to appear imposing but 10-15 feet on a raised dais would provide the same affect without feeling so silly.

As mentioned above the politically correct casting having 'strong powerful' young women and ethnically diverse black guy was strained to say the least. Don't try so hard Abrams.

While I get they have to show Rey's expertise in mechanics, she wouldn't come close to knowing the Falcon, and what it could do, compared to Han.

They didn't do a good job explaining the politics in the movie. Felt thrown in.

Tried too hard to intersperse humor throughout the movie. The level of the humor was more in tune with the original trilogy, a plus, but it's pervasiveness took over the film and lessened the impact of the actual funny scenes.

Can we have no more Death Stars or Death Planet super weapons please? It's tired. Think of something else. I'd rather have Lord Dark Helmet and his big schwartz at this point.

And how many times do you see ships just casually flying away from blowing up planets? Yes, I get you want that shot with the ships flying towards you, planet going supernova in the background. But for the love of god, have them jump into hyperspace to add an element of reality. And don't make the explosions trails touch/pass flying ships. If that happened the ships would be instantly incinerated/vaporized. This happens in all movies and it drives me absolutely batsh_t. I though the new Star Wars would be intelligent enough to avoid that.

That's all I have atm. The next movie will tell the tale of the tape in this series. Apologies for length. I'll read the rest of the thread now.

 

[intlzncster]

And some mod approve my magnum opus post above dammit. Took a while to type. @tzznandrew

 

[tzznandrew]

How the could Finn and Rey hang with Kylo Ren in a lightsaber dual? It makes no sense. Yes, I realize Finn is trained in hand to hand combat (despite working in sanitation and going on exactly ONE (failed) mission prior to that) and that Rey had done some fighting at home to survive. But this is the first time either of them truly fought with the weapon, pitted against a highly trained Jedi (both skillwise and in the force). Two swipes and they'd be split in half.

Finn did fight another storm trooper. Also, Chewy shot Kylo Ren and hit him directly. The movie takes great pains to shot what happens when that happens (people go flying). Ren stands there an takes it, and still battles them. Also, I didn't think Finn did very much. It was more like Luke/Vader in Empire. Ren played around with him, and then whooped him after he got hit in the arm (like Vader). Obviously the movie suggests that this may not really be the first time Rey used this weapon, even if she forgot it. Perhaps that last part will be proven wrong, and in which case I'd agree with your assessment a bit (still remember that Ren was injured).

Carrie Fischer forgot how to act. She seemed borderline ed at points.

Yup. That was brutal.

How the did Rey learn to access the force so ing quickly, and with such control? It took Vader years. Look the greatest Jedi in the known universe (Luke) took a bunch of time, and he was getting tutored by the greatest Jedi ever (Yoda) and one of his protégés (Kenobi).

Definitely not her first time. If it was, then yeah, your point is right. I think she's been trained.

Wooden Rey has the same face the whole movie. Can't she have any expression other than a look of dumb consternation on her face? I have no idea if she can act or not. The directing and the script didn't let her? Dunno what to think there.

Funny, I thought she was great.

As mentioned above the politically correct casting having 'strong powerful' young women and ethnically diverse black guy was strained to say the least. Don't try so hard Abrams.

This is strange to me. I don't see how it is "politically correct" to have the main character be a woman. Hell, in early drafts Luke was a woman. And I don't see what's politically correct about a black guy being a secondary lead here. Like, is the default white male? Does it have to be? Why would it be a statement for it not to be?

Regardless, like you points. Agree with a bunch.

 

[tzznandrew]

An interesting commentary that I pretty much entirely agree with:

 

[Dove]

Just parked my in a seat. Giggety.

Sorry Huskies.

 

[intlzncster]

Finn did fight another storm trooper.

Yah, that's why I specified against a Jedi. The previous encounter hardly coached him up to a professional level.

Also, Chewy shot Kylo Ren and hit him directly. The movie takes great pains to shot what happens when that happens (people go flying). Ren stands there an takes it, and still battles them.

Fair enough point. And that's definitely a factor. But I still feel like Ren should be able to slice Fin in half with only one arm and no legs. But maybe not.

Obviously the movie suggests that this may not really be the first time Rey used this weapon, even if she forgot it. Perhaps that last part will be proven wrong, and in which case I'd agree with your assessment a bit (still remember that Ren was injured).

Definitely not her first time. If it was, then yeah, your point is right. I think she's been trained.

I saw the little flashback, but wasn't sure what to make of it. I guess I just made the assumption that Rey was just as clueless as Luke on Tatooine. If that's not the case, then yeah, that clears a bunch of this stuff up for me. Wasn't really sure what to make of that Ben Kenobi-like figure at the beginning either, who could very well be a part of it.

Funny, I thought she was great.

Yeah, I don't know. She's def right for the role. And I think she's got the chops for it, just something wasn't there for me. Perhaps the directing might have let her down a bit there (for me).

This is strange to me. I don't see how it is "politically correct" to have the main character be a woman. Hell, in early drafts Luke was a woman. And I don't see what's politically correct about a black guy being a secondary lead here. Like, is the default white male? Does it have to be? Why would it be a statement for it not to be?

Eh, this is more of a pet peeve of mine than anything else. I'm about as anti-PC as you come; don't like people telling me what to think and do. PC culture just sucks all the humor and fun out life imo. And I'm not a conservative person socially either (not talking political designations here so don't start). So caring about type casting has nothing to do with black/white/green/purple people in the abstract. I don't care who you are as long as you're good.

It's just that Hollywood is really pushes home the 'inclusive' thing. It's cloying frankly. For example, Hollywood is pervasive with these ass kicking lead role chicks. Now if she's a superhero, vampire, jedi, or whatever, I can get behind that. Suspending disbelief is easy there. But the number of times I see some sprightly little chick kick the crap out of big badass trained killers is nauseating. I guess it's kind of like WCBB fans saying that Maya Moore could play on a men's team or something. It's like, no. No she couldn't. /rant Anyway, not really the clearest explanation of what I was going for, but c'est la vie. Not much to see there I guess.

 

[intlzncster]

Just parked my in a seat. Giggety.

Sorry Huskies.

Hey, we won. You know what you have to do now.

 

[intlzncster]

An interesting commentary that I pretty much entirely agree with:

Yeah good take. I tried to balance my review with positive and negative points, but looking back it seems a bit more negative. Oh well.

"I also think that being a contrarian dick makes people feel intelligent."

Great line. And apropos of the forum.

 

[tzznandrew]

Eh, this is more of a pet peeve of mine than anything else. I'm about as anti-PC as you come; don't like people telling me what to think and do. PC culture just sucks all the humor and fun out life imo. And I'm not a conservative person socially either (not talking political designations here so don't start). So caring about type casting has nothing to do with black/white/green/purple people in the abstract. I don't care who you are as long as you're good.

It's just that Hollywood is really pushes home the 'inclusive' thing. It's cloying frankly. For example, Hollywood is pervasive with these ass kicking lead role chicks. Now if she's a superhero, vampire, jedi, or whatever, I can get behind that. Suspending disbelief is easy there. But the number of times I see some sprightly little chick kick the crap out of big badass trained killers is nauseating. I guess it's kind of like WCBB fans saying that Maya Moore could play on a men's team or something. It's like, no. No she couldn't. /rant Anyway, not really the clearest explanation of what I was going for, but c'est la vie. Not much to see there I guess.

Hmm. Interesting the different takes on that. I think if the message was "look at us, we're being inclusive," sure, it's frustrating. But it just felt to me these were people. I mean, I think it's strange that casting a woman or a black man in a top blockbuster role would have to be some comment. The fact that the Marvel Movies have yet to have a movie led by a woman or non-white man is interesting.

And as for Hollywood being pervasive in these ass kicking lead role chicks... it is? Maybe I just don't see a lot of movies, but I can't really think of a ton. Kill Bill, Mad Max, this Star Wars. Sarah Connor in the old Terminator movies (but even there she's secondary).

I take your point on willing suspension of disbelief, though. That's still important for the movies. I just can't personally think of an action movie led by a woman outside of those I mentioned, and in each of those that isn't a problem, so far as I can remember.

 

[8893]

I see Rey as similar to the Jennifer Lawrence role in The Hunger Games movies.

The role of the woman huntress is certainly nothing new or PC. At least as far back as the Celts it was common to see women in these leading roles.

 

[tzznandrew]

I see Rey as similar to the Jennifer Lawrence role in The Hunger Games movies.

The role of the woman huntress is certainly nothing new or PC. At least as far back as the Celts it was common to see women in these leading roles.

There's another film I totally missed. I just don't go to the movies.

 

[storrsroars]

I enjoyed IV, V and VI. But I was much younger and those kinds of movies appealed to me in my 20s. I'm pretty tired of the series. I don't care for Marvel universe movies and this series is going that way. I had my wife's family in for the weekend and her nephew wanted to see VII, so I went, albeit reluctantly. It was IMAX 3-d.

I was immediately depressed as the coming attractions were pretty much completely comic book movies. Nothing I'm looking forward to seeing.

I pretty much agree with the complaints upthread as to plot holes and being too similar to IV.

Of the performances, there was no nuance to be found, except perhaps between Han and Leia. Chewy did more actual acting than the villains or the heroes. I actually found myself wishing Chewy had more screen time. The alien with the specs was probably the best acting of all. All her scenes were worthwhile.

Somebody just blast C3PO into bits. Inserting "him" into this movie was gratuitous at best. At least R2D2 being there had a point to it.

Why do stormtroopers even wear armor if the armor is useless? The fight scenes reminded me of 40s/50s movies where the heroes take out dozens of trained shooters while remaining unharmed themselves, even from shrapnel bits. Not to mention appearing to be the only ones to make it out of an exploding building alive.

I don't read the fan books or sites that discuss the details and backstories, but why does Ren even wear a helmet? Darth needed it due to disfigurement. Ren doesn't.

Obviously I'm not the target demographic. And seeing this did nothing to get me to eagerly await the next one.

 

[8893]

There's another film I totally missed. I just don't go to the movies.

Me neither. I saw that on DVD at the insistence of my oldest daughter, who promised I would like it. She was right. It was a very good movie imo. I have not seen the third, but akin to our discussions here, I thought the second one was a lot like a rehash of the first.

 

[intlzncster]

Hmm. Interesting the different takes on that. I think if the message was "look at us, we're being inclusive," sure, it's frustrating. But it just felt to me these were people. I mean, I think it's strange that casting a woman or a black man in a top blockbuster role would have to be some comment. The fact that the Marvel Movies have yet to have a movie led by a woman or non-white man is interesting.

And as for Hollywood being pervasive in these ass kicking lead role chicks... it is? Maybe I just don't see a lot of movies, but I can't really think of a ton. Kill Bill, Mad Max, this Star Wars. Sarah Connor in the old Terminator movies (but even there she's secondary).

I don't really want to get caught up in this, as I'd rather discuss the movie, but to respond: see, I think it almost IS 'look at us we are being inclusive'. This isn't based on Star Wars, it is a general overall observation of Hollywood. My initial reaction was based on that, prior to seeing the film; watching the movie, all characters worked really well, so I was happy. Yes, I realize this is a personal perspective.

I don't pay attention to movies all that much these days, as I'm more of a TV series guys. The best work is being done on TV, and movies, from Hollywood at any rate, are really, really lagging. But I do see it all the time. Small skinny chick grabs massive badasses ear and wrestles him into submission in a crying heap in front of her. It's just, "come on man."

Marvel has Wonder Woman coming out in 2017. And there's currently a super girl TV series. Gotham has a 16 year old chick who can inexplicably kick ass. And Marvel in general is sourced from comic books themselves, which has always been geared towards young males (the buyers).

Outside of this, on Ep VII in general, reading that other guys perspective on Facebook was a good take. I need to see the movie again, before I draw most of my conclusions. I think I missed the Rey backstory thing, and agree there's probably a lot more there than I thought. Again, I just assumed analogous to Luke, given that so much of the movie was the same as Ep IV. Star Wars Ring Theory was interesting too.

 

[intlzncster]

I see Rey as similar to the Jennifer Lawrence role in The Hunger Games movies.

The role of the woman huntress is certainly nothing new or PC. At least as far back as the Celts it was common to see women in these leading roles.

I didn't say it's new. Nor did I say it had to be a lead character. It's often in minor ones.

Divergent is a prime example, which is Hunger Games light. I don't mind the Kill Bills, because Tarantino movies are deliberate satire of violence. All you have to do is watch the typical gun fight and you can see that.

You notice it a lot in TV shows these days. See something like Banshee, with Carrie. Or Orphan Black with Helena. It's so far from reality, you just role your eyes. Movies are kind of cookie cutter. They'll do a remake of a movie but stick a female in the lead character just because; see the next RoadHouse which will star Ronda Rousey. Criminal that they are remaking that movie anyway.

Again, don't want to get caught up in this, as I'd rather talk about EpVII in general.

 

[tzznandrew]

I don't really want to get caught up in this, as I'd rather discuss the movie, but to respond: see, I think it almost IS 'look at us we are being inclusive'. This isn't based on Star Wars, it is a general overall observation of Hollywood. My initial reaction was based on that, prior to seeing the film; watching the movie, all characters worked really well, so I was happy. Yes, I realize this is a personal perspective.

I don't pay attention to movies all that much these days, as I'm more of a TV series guys. The best work is being done on TV, and movies, from Hollywood at any rate, are really, really lagging. But I do see it all the time. Small skinny chick grabs massive badasses ear and wrestles him into submission in a crying heap in front of her. It's just, "come on man."

Marvel has Wonder Woman coming out in 2017. And there's currently a super girl TV series. Gotham has a 16 year old chick who can inexplicably kick ass. And Marvel in general is sourced from comic books themselves, which has always been geared towards young males (the buyers).

Outside of this, on Ep VII in general, reading that other guys perspective on Facebook was a good take. I need to see the movie again, before I draw most of my conclusions. I think I missed the Rey backstory thing, and agree there's probably a lot more there than I thought. Again, I just assumed analogous to Luke, given that so much of the movie was the same as Ep IV. Star Wars Ring Theory was interesting too.

Well, none of those are Marvel, they're all DC.

Agree that, in general, TV is where it's at. Don't see a lot of movies, but love the diversity and depth of television television stories. The characters are much richer and the plots more interesting. Marvel has Jessica Jones (who has super strength) and Daredevil on Netflix, both of which I thought were great.

All this is a matter of opinion, obviously. I guess the whole "having a black guy and a woman as leads" doesn't strike me as PC, but just something that should be unsurprising, and is frankly all too rare. But too each his own.

I saw the movie twice. Lots of my opinions shifted after the first time. Somehow, I found it less derivative on second viewing.

 

[intlzncster]

I don't read the fan books or sites that discuss the details and backstories, but why does Ren even wear a helmet? Darth needed it due to disfigurement. Ren doesn't.

This one's easy to answer. Three reasons I can think of: 1. He clearly idolizes and strives to be Vader. Vader wears a helmet, so will Ren. 2. It is an intimidation factor. It makes him far more intimidating than otherwise and adds to his power over others 3. It hides his insecurities and makes himself feel more powerful. We know he's not all together emotionally, and this is a way to hide it.

 

[intlzncster]

Well, none of those are Marvel, they're all DC.

lol got me there.

 

[junglehusky]

What if I told you... it's not about just inclusiveness or PC, but about money? Families taking their daughters to the movies, buying toys for their daughters, that expands the market. Having members of the cast be non-white expands the market. Yay capitalism.

 

[intlzncster]

What if I told you... it's not about just inclusiveness or PC, but about money? Families taking their daughters to the movies, buying toys for their daughters, that expands the market. Having members of the cast be non-white expands the market. Yay capitalism.

Oh I agree with that entirely. A main part of the reason Hollywood sucks so bad right now, is that movies are made at the behest of marketing guys, not director vision. That shift has slowly been happening since the 70s, but has accelerated greatly in the 2000s. They want to make movies that make the most money, not that are the best movies. I'm saying this in general, disregarding the previous PC comment.

The best movies are made overseas now. Smaller film industries. Less answering to censors. Less answering to big money men. More creative license. Less Hollywood plastic star casting. More adult themes, adult characterizations, and real people as actors.

This article, though a few years old, is for people who love film and are curious about the 'state of the industry'. Highly recommend reading it.

https://www.gq.com/story/the-day-the-movies-died-mark-harris

All that said, PC culture is incredibly pervasive in Hollywood. If you speak out against certain things, rightly or wrongly, you can be blackballed.

 

[Scalito]

I didn't say it's new. Nor did I say it had to be a lead character. It's often in minor ones.

Divergent is a prime example, which is Hunger Games light. I don't mind the Kill Bills, because Tarantino movies are deliberate satire of violence. All you have to do is watch the typical gun fight and you can see that.

You notice it a lot in TV shows these days. See something like Banshee, with Carrie. Or Orphan Black with Helena. It's so far from reality, you just role your eyes. Movies are kind of cookie cutter. They'll do a remake of a movie but stick a female in the lead character just because; see the next RoadHouse which will star Ronda Rousey. Criminal that they are remaking that movie anyway.

Again, don't want to get caught up in this, as I'd rather talk about EpVII in general.

It irritates me much less in the fantasy and comic book genres. Not only is it not new to them because adolescent boys dream of hot girls in tight pants that act like men, so it seems less forced, it is less forced there. After all, a woman with super power this or wonderful power that can kick the crap out of men. It's when I see it in the action genre that I roll my eyes and get annoyed. Sorry, but small, good looking ch-cks can't beat up adolescent boys. One punch from a dude, and Ms. Frasier goes down. It's why we teach boys not to hit girls . . . .

The sexes are different. It's ok. Just like it's okay for a vampire Kate Beckinsale to run around in skintight leather kicking the crap out of dudes.