Sun sinking in the EAST?

[calpedaler]

HH. You misunderstood. Nan is saying that no one is holding a grudge against Tara for her treatment of Becca any more than they are holding a grudge against Geno for his. No grudges for nobody. All friends playing nicely together.

I will forever hold a grudge against my second grade teacher, Mrs. Blue, for telling me my handwriting would always be sloppy because I'm left handed. Not even Huskynan can convince me otherwise.

 

[huskeynut]

Back to the topic at hand - AD is a terrible coach. As long as she is the head coach of the Sun, they will be cellar dwellers.

Why the Sun management ever hired her is beyond me. Her record is not that good. And her track record is three to four years at any one place. Then she's gone.

 

[ed4ourgirls]

All of this puts me in mind of Tennessee fans bitching and moaning
about Holly.

BTW the Sun beat Atlanta today.

 

[RoyDodger]

All of this puts me in mind of Tennessee fans bitching and moaning
about Holly.

BTW the Sun beat Atlanta today.

And take note that Renee Montgomery actually played 19 minutes and scored 18 points. I still don't understand why Donovan has her on the bench.

 

[Jim]

Think of the bright of AD's coaching-- KML will continue to play in Connecticut after she graduates.

 

[lanieer]

I'm willing to bet you that Renee gets more playing time after her last two games. I really think that Bentley is going to be a very good player. She does tend to dish out more assists then Renee or at least she did at Atlanta last year. As long as Renee scores when she gets in she'll be in the game.

 

[psconn]

IIRC, the consensus sentiment here two years ago was not very much in Coach Thibault's corner. IMO, the Sun went as far as they could with Coach Thibault and instituted a change:
2008 - Lost in 1st round as the 2nd seed to 3rd seeded NY.
2009 - Did not make the playoffs
2010 - Did not make the playoffs
2011 - Lost in 1st round as the 2 seed to 3rd seeded Atlanta
2012 - Lost in the 2nd round as the #1 seed to 2nd seeded and eventual WNBA champion Indiana.

Does anyone here honestly believe the Sun is a better team than their won/lost record indicates? Could they possibly be a better team sans Tina? Hypothetically, they fire Coach Donovan, who are the Sun going to hire to lead them back into the playoffs?

There were a lot of haters expressing themselves against Coach T with few alternatives mentioned other than ridiculous notions of getting Geno or Jen. Calling that rabble a "consensus" is far from accurate. The notion that the Sun are better without Tina is also ridiculous. That said, I like our newbies a lot. Cheney and Alyssa are doing a great job for rookies and Kelsey Bone shows flashes of real talent at times. If she were a more consistent finisher she would have impressive numbers because she is getting really good looks. If anyone is looking sub-par it is KT. Those automatic threes that killed us when she was with Indy just are not there so far. Coming off of back surgery, and not playing last year, she may come into form late in the season.

 

[DishNSwish]

Team effort leads Connecticut Sun to 85-76 victory over Atlanta Dream

http://post original url/TAY9sK7d89

 

[Striper69]

I think the East will be a dogfight to the end this season. If the Sun get their act together I think they will be in the playoffs at the very least.
The two main problems I've seen is that Katie Douglas has been under achieving and Thomas hasn't found her niche on offense yet but I think she will.

 

[UConnCat]

Donovan was testy when asked about Renee's minutes. http://courantblogs.com/uconn-women/how-does-renee-montgomery-fit-in-be-careful-how-you-ask/

BTW, I watched some of the 1st half of yesterday's game and the Dream fell apart early. Angel continued to shoot and miss and pass up open teammates. She also started chewing out a teammate on the court for what appeared to be Angel's mistake and was promptly sent to the bench by Cooper.

 

[Orangutan]

I think the East will be a dogfight to the end this season. If the Sun get their act together I think they will be in the playoffs at the very least.
The two main problems I've seen is that Katie Douglas has been under achieving and Thomas hasn't found her niche on offense yet but I think she will.

It will be a dogfight for the last two playoff spots but I think Chicago and Atlanta will separate themselves in time. Atlanta will have Dumerc shortly and Chicago will have Prince and Fowles by July. So those teams should improve.

The Sun strike me as a team who don't know what their best lineup is. Seems like Donovan is still throwing things at the wall to see what sticks. I really like their young frontcourt. Bone, Ogwumike, and Thomas have a lot of potential together. I was impressed with Bentley.

They have pieces. It's just a matter of playing together and being cohesive. They didn't do that against Chicago and gave up 101 points. They did do that against Atlanta and won. At least they won't be boring.

 

[Striper69]

Donovan was testy when asked about Renee's minutes. http://courantblogs.com/uconn-women/how-does-renee-montgomery-fit-in-be-careful-how-you-ask/

BTW, I watched some of the 1st half of yesterday's game and the Dream fell apart early. Angel continued to shoot and miss and pass up open teammates. She also started chewing out a teammate on the court for what appeared to be Angel's mistake and was promptly sent to the bench by Cooper.

I was wondering why Renee didn't get a lot of playing time. I think Douglas was looking like she was going to be doing great in preseason so that's what might have set Renee back.

I don't think Coop will stand for any tantrums from Angel this year. They can only get even better when DuMerc arrives.

 

[Striper69]

It will be a dogfight for the last two playoff spots but I think Chicago and Atlanta will separate themselves in time. Atlanta will have Dumerc shortly and Chicago will have Prince and Fowles by July. So those teams should improve.

The Sun strike me as a team who don't know what their best lineup is. Seems like Donovan is still throwing things at the wall to see what sticks. I really like their young frontcourt. Bone, Ogwumike, and Thomas have a lot of potential together. I was impressed with Bentley.

They have pieces. It's just a matter of playing together and being cohesive. They didn't do that against Chicago and gave up 101 points. They did do that against Atlanta and won. At least they won't be boring.

BTW- I think Tamera Young read your post last week about her not being a good scorer. She said something in an interview this weekend about her scoring more after she was hot in the first half against the Sun.

 

[VAUConnFan]

Well the consensus would have been wrong. So I don't get what your point is. While I agree with current expectations, whose fault is that? It's what you'd expect of a bad coach and bad management, isn't it? So while we know this team has no shot- I think we knew other years during MT's reign some years we had no shot. Your showing past history appears like some kind of indictment on MT when in fact imo he just met capabilities of his teams for the most part.

We were a paper tiger in 2012. Tina was not the best player in WNBA but it appeared that way. A GM has ot be smart enough to know that. Indiana made a great move to get Larkins that allowed them to compete on the inside as well. With that said if Whelan was healthy - they win- the West had the dominant teams. And Atlanta has shown they have been among the best. Our Sun have been limited.

Don't we all know Tina was the key to this team? Do you think the GM and AD knew we'd stink for 3 at least 3 straight years after MT left? Couldn't you have predicted that -if you knew Tina wan't going to be happy? You realize we are going to be Stewie sweepstakes, right? So does the GM get a pass for lousy basketball for four straight years?

Yes, showing past history is an indictment of Coach Thibault as a way of possibly explaining the reason he was fired. When he was fired, I do not recall any posters criticizing the move. Now I seems that many are lamenting the firing given the Sun's current lack of success. Understandable. IMO, Coach Thibault would still be in CT if the Sun had reached the finals as a #1 seed in 2012. I do not believe it was the coach's fault. Indiana got hot at the right time. No one was going to beat them.

The economic and roster structure of the WNBA as it is, makes a GM's job quite difficult. One cannot stockpile players, replace injured ones, and, until this year had only 11 slots and a stingy cap from which to work all this hocus pocus. Does the GM get a pass? IMO, the Sun GM has not made good trades, nor has he drafted particularly well. Not that I could point out more than two GMs that have done better. the women's game, right now, does not produce a lot of impact players. Minnesota is better than everyone else because they have two bona fide superstars. When Phoenix had two superstars, they ruled the roost.
I believe that if CT had shown an intent to draft an outside player like Sims as opposed to Chiney, Tina Charles would still be toiling happily in CT.

 

[VAUConnFan]

There were a lot of haters expressing themselves against Coach T with few alternatives mentioned other than ridiculous notions of getting Geno or Jen. Calling that rabble a "consensus" is far from accurate. The notion that the Sun are better without Tina is also ridiculous. That said, I like our newbies a lot. Cheney and Alyssa are doing a great job for rookies and Kelsey Bone shows flashes of real talent at times. If she were a more consistent finisher she would have impressive numbers because she is getting really good looks. If anyone is looking sub-par it is KT. Those automatic threes that killed us when she was with Indy just are not there so far. Coming off of back surgery, and not playing last year, she may come into form late in the season.

Maybe the question was misleadingly phrased, but I was certainly not suggesting that the Sun was a better team without Tina. On the contrary, the question was meant to suggest that they could not possibly be a better team without her.

 

[psconn]

Yes, showing past history is an indictment of Coach Thibault as a way of possibly explaining the reason he was fired. When he was fired, I do not recall any posters criticizing the move. Now I seems that many are lamenting the firing given the Sun's current lack of success. Understandable. IMO, Coach Thibault would still be in CT if the Sun had reached the finals as a #1 seed in 2012. I do not believe it was the coach's fault. Indiana got hot at the right time. No one was going to beat them.

The economic and roster structure of the WNBA as it is, makes a GM's job quite difficult. One cannot stockpile players, replace injured ones, and, until this year had only 11 slots and a stingy cap from which to work all this hocus pocus. Does the GM get a pass? IMO, the Sun GM has not made good trades, nor has he drafted particularly well. Not that I could point out more than two GMs that have done better. the women's game, right now, does not produce a lot of impact players. Minnesota is better than everyone else because they have two bona fide superstars. When Phoenix had two superstars, they ruled the roost.
I believe that if CT had shown an intent to draft an outside player like Sims as opposed to Chiney, Tina Charles would still be toiling happily in CT.

I could not disagree more. Tina was going to end up in NY. Coach T's dismissal just moved the timeline and Tina was never going to "happily toil" in CT again.

 

[Striper69]

She's right where she wanted to be right now.

She's said so.

 

[Striper69]

Donovan was testy when asked about Renee's minutes. http://courantblogs.com/uconn-women/how-does-renee-montgomery-fit-in-be-careful-how-you-ask/

BTW, I watched some of the 1st half of yesterday's game and the Dream fell apart early. Angel continued to shoot and miss and pass up open teammates. She also started chewing out a teammate on the court for what appeared to be Angel's mistake and was promptly sent to the bench by Cooper.

Douglas really got under Angel's skin (I'm watching the game). None of the Dream were hitting shots and Angel was scoreless in the first half. Maybe Donavan keeps Douglas in the game for her defense.

BTW- I think Orakova might've gotten waived to make room for DuMerc.

 

[Striper69]

Atlanta Dream Activates Celine Dumerc for Tuesday Game vs. Los Angeles
ATLANTA, June 2, 2014 — The WNBA Atlanta Dream announced today that point guard Céline Dumerc has been removed from the suspended list, and will be active for the Dream’s game against the Los Angeles Sparks on Tuesday, June 3. The game tips off at 7 p.m. in Philips Arena and will be nationally televised by ESPN2.
Dumerc, who was placed on the suspended list while fulfilling her overseas playing commitments to her French club team, arrived in the United States on Sunday and passed her physical Monday. To make room for her on the roster, the Dream waived rookie guard Inga Orekhova.
Dumerc, a two-time EuroLeague All-Star, just completed a French League season that saw her help Bourges Basket reach the semifinals of the EuroLeague championships as well as the finals of the French League playoffs. She averaged 8.2 points, 4.8 rebounds and 6.0 assists in 31 French League games, and 8.9 points, 4.9 boards and 4.9 assists in 18 EuroLeague contests.
The five-foot, seven-inch lefty is also the captain of the French national team and led her team in scoring while guiding France to the silver medal at the 2012 London Olympics. She was named the 2012 FIBA Europe Women’s Player of the Year following her Olympic performance.
Dumerc was named France’s Sportsman of the Year in 2012 by Radio France, becoming the first female to ever receive the award. She also earned the prestigious La Gazzetta dello Sport Female European Basketball player of the year award for 2012.
The three-time Eastern Conference Champion Atlanta Dream is in its seventh season in the Women's National Basketball Association (WNBA). The Dream has qualified for the playoffs in each of the past five seasons, including conference titles in 2013, 2011 and 2010. Season tickets and single-game tickets for the 2014 season are now available and can be purchased by calling (877) 977-7729 or visiting www.AtlantaDream.net. The next home game is scheduled for Tuesday, June 3, against the Los Angeles Sparks at 7 p.m. The complete 2014 schedule can be found at www.wnba.com/dream/schedule.

 

[CL82]

Actually, it was UConn fans who had the issue with Tara. They were insulted that she would put USA Basketball ahead of the desires of the home crowd. And, if you read "Venus to the Hoop" and other writings about the time, you'll hear Rebecca recognize she was rather out of her league.

Anne Donovan, as I'm sure you will recall, won Olympic gold in '08.

Paul Pasqualoni won the Fiesta Bowl and the Orange bowl, just not at UConn. Anne Donovan's Sun has the stench about them that Pasqualoni's Huskies did.

 

[Orangutan]

BTW- I think Tamera Young read your post last week about her not being a good scorer. She said this weekend that something about her scoring more after she was hot in the first half against the Sun.

Well, I'm glad to see it. She still didn't get into double figures, though, which was kind of an upset after scoring 9 in the first quarter. Of course, scoring isn't really her role. Breland, Delle Donne, Quigley, etc. have that covered. She is doing a nice job on defense and rebounding. She adds enough on offense to make the defense guard her, which is enough.

 

[hoophuskee]

HH. You misunderstood. Nan is saying that no one is holding a grudge against Tara for her treatment of Becca any more than they are holding a grudge against Geno for his. No grudges for nobody. All friends playing nicely together.

Nope- nan mentioned a 20 year old grudge. Nan repleid to my messages. But my posts ahd nothign to do with holding a 20 year old grduge. I just made a comment back then I felt Tara held a grudge vs Rebecca. To even mention 20 years missed the point.

 

[meyers7]

Seriously, Tara's job was to win the Olympics, not get more publicity for the team.

Actually I think she was supposed to get as much publicity for the team (and players) as possible, and absolutely win the Gold. The WNBA was all set to launch. They needed the publicity.

 

[j66kicker]

My memory is Rebecca was placed on the team, against Tara's wishes, because she was the poster child for the new WNBA and they needed the pub. Not sure any of the parties were "wrong", but it created resentment vs Tara in CT.

 

[Sakibomb25]

Geno has said for those that aren't going to get mintues, he doesn't coach them the same way, does he? In other words, a player buried on the bench that won't get important mintues, he doesn't go after them in the same manner, does he? I heard him say something to that affect. It's a philospohy I agree with. The last player on the bench that you aren't going to play important mintues - you don't go out of your way to blast them. You're out to win the Olympics not waste your time on a player not as good. As long as the last player is hustling that should be it. Again --I didn't hear Laetner getting ripped on the men's side.

I wasn't going to get involved in this but... here I am.

First of all, Tara was coaching in the Olympics. The Olympics. This isn't college basketball here. This is the cream of the crop. You treat everyone the same, no matter what, even if its a player you didn't want on the team.

If Lobo was placed on the team against her wishes, then Tara did the absolute right thing by "ripping" into her. If the rest of the team thought Lobo didn't deserve a spot because she wasn't as talented, it would hurt team chemistry if they saw Lobo was being treated differently by the coaching staff.

 

[hoophuskee]

I wasn't going to get involved in this but... here I am.

First of all, Tara was coaching in the Olympics. The Olympics. This isn't college basketball here. This is the cream of the crop. You treat everyone the same, no matter what, even if its a player you didn't want on the team.

If Lobo was placed on the team against her wishes, then Tara did the absolute right thing by "ripping" into her. If the rest of the team thought Lobo didn't deserve a spot because she wasn't as talented, it would hurt team chemistry if they saw Lobo was being treated differently by the coaching staff.

So the NBA guys should have ripped into Laetner too? They didn't. So you think the NBA coach and guys were wrong for not ripping into him like Tara did? Do you really think Laetner deserved a spot and was a benefit for the NBA team? IMO you can't have it both ways.

By the way, are you a Stanford fan?

 

[Icebear]

Yes, he is.

 

[Sakibomb25]

So the NBA guys should have ripped into Laetner too? They didn't. So you think the NBA coach and guys were wrong for not ripping into him like Tara did? Do you really think Laetner deserved a spot and was a benefit for the NBA team? IMO you can't have it both ways.

By the way, are you a Stanford fan?

I have no insight as to the dynamics of the men's Olympic basketball team. I also don't know who coached the team and how similar they were to VanDerveer's style of coaching. So I can't really comment on your question. And I also never said the players were ripping into Lobo, so whether players ripped into Laetner is of no consequence.

And how does Laetner's spot on the team and his benefit to an NBA team have any place in this discussion of whether Lobo deserved to be treated the same way as her Olympic teammates by VanDerveer?

 

[hoophuskee]

I have no insight as to the dynamics of the men's Olympic basketball team. I also don't know who coached the team and how similar they were to VanDerveer's style of coaching. So I can't really comment on your question. And I also never said the players were ripping into Lobo, so whether players ripped into Laetner is of no consequence.

And how does Laetner's spot on the team and his benefit to an NBA team have any place in this discussion of whether Lobo deserved to be treated the same way as her Olympic teammates by VanDerveer?

Don't take this the wrong way. And after this post - I'm done the Tara back-in-the-day argument. You can have final word. If you want to PM me - okay we can go back and forth. The points I make below I am not bashing you.

1--- It was my feeling that I expressed that I felt tara went over-the-top with Rebecca AT THAT TIME (and to elaborate for anyone reading this the 1st time no way am I suggesting even close here is there any grudge now by Tara or recent or close to recent.) . I use the men and women as a comparison though- that's why I bring them up. I do follow men and women and I do like to compare. As an example, I have gotten into a recent dispute with two posters on this board that I've found the women's college game more appealling than the men's because the men's truly great players leave early. The point is- not whether I'm right or wrong as to what is more appealling (it's preference anyways) but the point is is I do compare - and at least two posters felt a compulsion to compare as well and disagree with what I was saying. They felt the men was "more."

2-- You avoided the question regarding the men or you have no idea or no interest on how they conducted themselves.

3-- If you don't know how Laetner was treated I'll tell you how he was in my opinion. It was nothing like what you say a coach should do. Never heard Laetner getting thrown out- is totally unneccesary unless there is some extreme reason. I don't believe there was an extreme reason to throw out Rebecca. Apparently if you don't even know who the coach was, then I don't feel you're either equipped to respond or I don't buy what you say as what is meaningful for a coach to be in this situation. So on one side we have the men- they didn't rip into Laetner such as by kicking him out of practices and on the women we had Tara - just shortly removed from getting clobbered by Rebecca and UCONN- chucking her out and making her cry.

4--- Last night on NBA TV they had on the men's Dream Team Olympics of that year and they highlighted how the coach Chuck Daley had a tough task of managing eleven egos. Not twelve but eleven. Thus your point of all players needed to be treated the same doesn't hold water with me. Remember it is my point that I was (I highlight WAS. No longer --been many, many, many year ago - this is water under the bridge. I wish her and Stanford well for a long time now.) ripping mad at Tara. Because I am comparing the two coaches of which it seems like you can't do because maybe you didn't even follow the men? Don't take this as a slam. You told me you don't even know the coach's name was. And you didn't even bother to google it. If you just forgot his name - fine. But you or anyone else show me Daley kicked out Laetner in practice like Tara did - I'll say I was wrong about Daley.


In regard to the players - your comment of And I also never said the players were ripping into Lobo, so whether players ripped into Laetner is of no consequence.

This was a repsonse to your irrelevant point of

If the rest of the team thought Lobo didn't deserve a spot because she wasn't as talented, it would hurt team chemistry if they saw Lobo was being treated differently by the coaching staff.

My point was you brought up how team chemistry would be affected. Men players ripping into Laenter would be as one example that could affect team chemistry. I was trying to be cordial by giving an example.

5----- Bottomline is- if you don't think the men and women can be compared in this manner then we look at things differently. I look at this NBA finals as the San Antonio Spurs playing the game like the old teams of the past. A pleasure to watch them. IMO they play like UCONN in which all are good passers. I loved Shea Ralph because even as she lost her athleticism she was still an amazing passer. Overall the beauty of a backdoor cut and lay in is better for me than a dunk. The dunking contests (and for that matter unrelated but even the Home Run hitting contests in baseball) are boring to me. These are comparisons I make. Just like comparisons to men and women's game and coaching overall and refs men game vs women's. etc. I compared in this instance how Daly and Tara coached, and what I felt was appropriate which I why I expressed at that time - personal for me that Tara went over-the-top.