South Carolina survives UCLA | Page 3 | The Boneyard

South Carolina survives UCLA

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So...South Carolina wins on a bad night and that makes them beatable ? I think you could say that about any team. They win with their defense and it's been that way for years. They will shut you down just when you think you have the game in hand. Both of their losses last year were last shot losses.....come on....the tournament is where defense counts the most.
Yes. Stanford, UCONN for sure can beat South Carolina. Maybe a few others on a night when South Carolina doesn't play like South Carolina. I was impressed again with South Carolina's defense in Q4, but I also saw chinks in their armor in the game vs UCLA.
 

npignatjr

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Carolyn Peck is a cheer leader for Boston, and SC. The defender was holding her arm and it slipped off and hit her in the face. I had to pause, to laugh. That is like hitting someone's fist with your jaw.
Her game call for last night should permanently remove her name from any HOF mention.
 

Bigboote

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So I guess physically holding Boston's are down is with two hands is not a foul. For everyone that wants more fouls called on Boston and even Aja, when she was here, having you every taken an objective look at the number of uncalled fouls against them on the sagging zones. We have seen players with two players with both of their arms physically pushing and grabbing these two to no end. It is lucky that neither have a mean streak or someone might have been laid out before now.
It was called a foul, that’s why Boston shot a free throw.
 
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You don't seem very familiar with the technical rules. Its all about the ELBOWs in the face. If you elbow someone in the face going up for a rebound, that is a technical. Doesn't matter if it was a basketball move or not.

A long review doesn't mean it wasn't black or white, they could have been reviewing what level of tech she needed to get.

Well now I know someone who definitely IS NOT familiar with the rules: When is it NOT a violation of rules for a defender to undercut a bigger post player, to shove their hips and legs under the hips and into the legs of the taller post player established in their post position. The UCLA player even put her own body to the side, so she could use her leg strength better in trying to up-root Boston up and out of her post position.

When you are in post position, and a defender undercuts you from behind and tries to take your legs out from under you, what naturally happens? Your upper body falls backwards, causing your balance to fall backwards, and often then causes your arms to flail outward to regain your balance. But was the UCLA player called for the foul for undercutting Boston?

This was a common trick by the NBA's Dennis Rodman, to stick his legs under the rump and into the legs of a taller post player from behind, and in effect try to use his strength to lift UP and OUT to relocate said post player from his established position. It is against the rules and Rodman was often called for it - and many other times he wasn't.

Also defenders from the rear of a post player, when that post player is on offense, will often stick their arms and hands in front of that player to interfere with the passing lane of any pass into the post player. But those post players have the right to clear those areas - either by moving the defender's arms/hands out of the way, or by moving their own arms in front of the defender's arms. In the course of doing this, a post player will already be flailing her arms around from time to time.

And you're also supposed to give an offensive player their vertical space to make offensive moves to the basket when they have the ball. The shorter UCLA player who's head is about shoulder height to Boston, snug up into Boston so close that she could've kissed Boston on the cheek, when Boston was turning (making a post move) to the basket, and her elbow hit the girl in the face. Boston was called for the offensive foul - the UCLA girl seemed to have established her own defensive position - but so many people have tried to claim that Boston was throwing elbows, but all she did was turn with the ball in the air to make her post move.

But that happens all the time in the NBA to shorter players who try to defend post players, or try to block them out for rebounds: you place your face in the area of those guy's elbows, then expect to get elbowed in the face. Players like Cartwright, Rollins, Olajuwon, O'Neil always had strong post moves with elbows out - NOT swinging elbows, but gripping the ball tightly with both hands above their heads, and clamping down those hands hard with their arms, thus causing their elbows to stick up and outward. It's up to Boston to "feel" the defender on her body, and make post moves that separate her from the defender, so that any contact after that will be called on that defender.
 
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Her game call for last night should permanently remove her name from any HOF mention.


That's right. And the other thing she did a year or so ago - I can't remember what that was at this time, but that thing should ALSO permanently remove her from consideration for ANYTHING else, for the rest of her life, whatever it was.......


:rolleyes:
 

Gate81

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I think they had to call the elbow on Boston if they saw or heard about the uncalled elbow on Boston vs. Prechtel of Stanford, who then was out of action for concussion protocol for the following game. And no shorter player angling in excuse applies to Ashten Prechtel.
 
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I think they had to call the elbow on Boston if they saw or heard about the uncalled elbow on Boston vs. Prechtel of Stanford, who then was out of action for concussion protocol for the following game. And no shorter player angling in excuse applies to Ashten Prechtel.
Didn't realize Prechtel suffered a concussion due to that. Ugh.
 
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Well now I know someone who definitely IS NOT familiar with the rules: When is it NOT a violation of rules for a defender to undercut a bigger post player, to shove their hips and legs under the hips and into the legs of the taller post player established in their post position. The UCLA player even put her own body to the side, so she could use her leg strength better in trying to up-root Boston up and out of her post position.

When you are in post position, and a defender undercuts you from behind and tries to take your legs out from under you, what naturally happens? Your upper body falls backwards, causing your balance to fall backwards, and often then causes your arms to flail outward to regain your balance. But was the UCLA player called for the foul for undercutting Boston?

This was a common trick by the NBA's Dennis Rodman, to stick his legs under the rump and into the legs of a taller post player from behind, and in effect try to use his strength to lift UP and OUT to relocate said post player from his established position. It is against the rules and Rodman was often called for it - and many other times he wasn't.

Also defenders from the rear of a post player, when that post player is on offense, will often stick their arms and hands in front of that player to interfere with the passing lane of any pass into the post player. But those post players have the right to clear those areas - either by moving the defender's arms/hands out of the way, or by moving their own arms in front of the defender's arms. In the course of doing this, a post player will already be flailing her arms around from time to time.

And you're also supposed to give an offensive player their vertical space to make offensive moves to the basket when they have the ball. The shorter UCLA player who's head is about shoulder height to Boston, snug up into Boston so close that she could've kissed Boston on the cheek, when Boston was turning (making a post move) to the basket, and her elbow hit the girl in the face. Boston was called for the offensive foul - the UCLA girl seemed to have established her own defensive position - but so many people have tried to claim that Boston was throwing elbows, but all she did was turn with the ball in the air to make her post move.

But that happens all the time in the NBA to shorter players who try to defend post players, or try to block them out for rebounds: you place your face in the area of those guy's elbows, then expect to get elbowed in the face. Players like Cartwright, Rollins, Olajuwon, O'Neil always had strong post moves with elbows out - NOT swinging elbows, but gripping the ball tightly with both hands above their heads, and clamping down those hands hard with their arms, thus causing their elbows to stick up and outward. It's up to Boston to "feel" the defender on her body, and make post moves that separate her from the defender, so that any contact after that will be called on that defender.
She was called for a foul. And Boston didn't even have the ball when she elbowed her. Not sure you even watched the play before you wrote this novel.
 
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Actually they only had 33 rebounds to SC 44. When you actually count the rebounds versus what ESPN has for the total the numbers are far off.
 

Bigboote

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Actually they only had 33 rebounds to SC 44. When you actually count the rebounds versus what ESPN has for the total the numbers are far off.
The totals include team (dead-ball) rebounds, which aren't credited to any player.
 
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I must have missed the part in the rules that says contact by an elbow to the opposing players head is permissible when “it’s a basketball play.”
I remember how I laughed many many years ago, when John Havlicek from the Celtics was being interviewed after a game and he had a big black eye and the reporter asked him what happened? He said I fouled his elbow with my eye! Ha!
 
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In many ways UCLA put up a good fight, but one thing they kept trying to do was driving to the hoop and trying to score over Boston or Cardosa. That was almost always a blocked shot waiting to happen. UCLA had roughly 25% of their two-point attempts blocked. They kept falling into the trap, SC would extend and overplay the defense luring them into a drive.

Trying to score at the hoop against either one of those is usually a losing proposition. The inside game is virtually taken away making beating them from the perimeter even more difficult. For the most part, however, SC's offense looked limited as well, exceptional pounding it inside, but struggling to score when they couldn't get it inside.
 
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In many ways UCLA put up a good fight, but one thing they kept trying to do was driving to the hoop and trying to score over Boston or Cardosa. That was almost always a blocked shot waiting to happen. UCLA had roughly 25% of their two-point attempts blocked. They kept falling into the trap, SC would extend and overplay the defense luring them into a drive.

Trying to score at the hoop against either one of those is usually a losing proposition. The inside game is virtually taken away making beating them from the perimeter even more difficult. For the most part, however, SC's offense looked limited as well, exceptional pounding it inside, but struggling to score when they couldn't get it inside.
South Carolina look out of sync as they dealt with the switching box and one. Last year and the year before they had these issues early in the season with Henderson playing, for whom everyone is trying to be their cure all for why their team will beat SC. As with years past, South Carolina normally figures it out and thus, if you are hoping for the events of this game to translate against your team, it would be an unwise perception. South Carolina has had some good shooting games thus far this year, and some clunkers. Note, their offensive numbers this year are ahead of last year's numbers already so go ahead and take your best shots. They will be ready as they move throughout the season imo
 

#1florida

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Well now I know someone who definitely IS NOT familiar with the rules: When is it NOT a violation of rules for a defender to undercut a bigger post player, to shove their hips and legs under the hips and into the legs of the taller post player established in their post position. The UCLA player even put her own body to the side, so she could use her leg strength better in trying to up-root Boston up and out of her post position.

When you are in post position, and a defender undercuts you from behind and tries to take your legs out from under you, what naturally happens? Your upper body falls backwards, causing your balance to fall backwards, and often then causes your arms to flail outward to regain your balance. But was the UCLA player called for the foul for undercutting Boston?

This was a common trick by the NBA's Dennis Rodman, to stick his legs under the rump and into the legs of a taller post player from behind, and in effect try to use his strength to lift UP and OUT to relocate said post player from his established position. It is against the rules and Rodman was often called for it - and many other times he wasn't.

Also defenders from the rear of a post player, when that post player is on offense, will often stick their arms and hands in front of that player to interfere with the passing lane of any pass into the post player. But those post players have the right to clear those areas - either by moving the defender's arms/hands out of the way, or by moving their own arms in front of the defender's arms. In the course of doing this, a post player will already be flailing her arms around from time to time.

And you're also supposed to give an offensive player their vertical space to make offensive moves to the basket when they have the ball. The shorter UCLA player who's head is about shoulder height to Boston, snug up into Boston so close that she could've kissed Boston on the cheek, when Boston was turning (making a post move) to the basket, and her elbow hit the girl in the face. Boston was called for the offensive foul - the UCLA girl seemed to have established her own defensive position - but so many people have tried to claim that Boston was throwing elbows, but all she did was turn with the ball in the air to make her post move.

But that happens all the time in the NBA to shorter players who try to defend post players, or try to block them out for rebounds: you place your face in the area of those guy's elbows, then expect to get elbowed in the face. Players like Cartwright, Rollins, Olajuwon, O'Neil always had strong post moves with elbows out - NOT swinging elbows, but gripping the ball tightly with both hands above their heads, and clamping down those hands hard with their arms, thus causing their elbows to stick up and outward. It's up to Boston to "feel" the defender on her body, and make post moves that separate her from the defender, so that any contact after that will be called on that defender.
what a surprise, that you would have this view point.
 
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She was called for a foul. And Boston didn't even have the ball when she elbowed her. Not sure you even watched the play before you wrote this novel.

An offensive player does NOT need to "have the ball" for a defensive player to undercut them to try to root them out of their preferred post position on the floor - BEFORE they get said ball in their hands. It's STILL a defensive foul per the rules. Had Boston had the ball in her hands when she was undercut, it's very likely that she wouldn't have flailed her arm which hit the UCLA player, but then she'd likely have fallen to the floor losing her balance. I watched the play and the replay of the play many times.

I am confused as to the point of your comments I quoted above. I ALSO referenced a second time that Boston hit a UCLA player with her elbow, in the 1st half. Boston definitely HAD THE BALL in her hands and was trying a post move to the basket. My comments referenced two separate instances, not just one. What are you referrencing about?
 
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An offensive player does NOT need to "have the ball" for a defensive player to undercut them to try to root them out of their preferred post position on the floor - BEFORE they get said ball in their hands. It's STILL a defensive foul per the rules. Had Boston had the ball in her hands when she was undercut, it's very likely that she wouldn't have flailed her arm which hit the UCLA player, but then she'd likely have fallen to the floor losing her balance. I watched the play and the replay of the play many times.

I am confused as to the point of your comments I quoted above. I ALSO referenced a second time that Boston hit a UCLA player with her elbow, in the 1st half. Boston definitely HAD THE BALL in her hands and was trying a post move to the basket. My comments referenced two separate instances, not just one. What are you referrencing about?
The point is she she was undercut after she got the ball, they called a foul, but she elbowed her illegally before she had the ball and it was a good technical call.
 

npignatjr

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The point is she she was undercut after she got the ball, they called a foul, but she elbowed her illegally before she had the ball and it was a good technical call.
The "missed" elbow to the face came first. How the officials missed an elbow up high and called the other foul until after the elbow it was brought to their attention.
 
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The "missed" elbow to the face came first. How the officials missed an elbow up high and called the other foul until after the elbow it was brought to their attention.
Officials miss things. It's easy for us to say this when we have replays and different camera angles than they do on the court while the game is live. I'm not trying to excuse them, however they did go to the video, reviewed it and made the correct call.

It's no different than a call that happened during the WNBA play-offs where A'ja Wilson and Gabby Williams both ended up getting called on a drive where Williams scored while Wilson tried to defend her. If memory serves correct, Wilson was initially called for the blocking foul, however the refs reviewed the play because Wilson had been hit in the head. The replays clearly showed Williams tried to clear space while going to the basket and her arm hit Wilson in the head. Without the review, Wilson would have the only played called for the foul when it was clear that Williams had also committed one
 

npignatjr

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Officials miss things. It's easy for us to say this when we have replays and different camera angles than they do on the court while the game is live. I'm not trying to excuse them, however they did go to the video, reviewed it and made the correct call.

It's no different than a call that happened during the WNBA play-offs where A'ja Wilson and Gabby Williams both ended up getting called on a drive where Williams scored while Wilson tried to defend her. If memory serves correct, Wilson was initially called for the blocking foul, however the refs reviewed the play because Wilson had been hit in the head. The replays clearly showed Williams tried to clear space while going to the basket and her arm hit Wilson in the head. Without the review, Wilson would have the only played called for the foul when it was clear that Williams had also committed one
You would think the obvious elbow to the head thru above the shoulder would be easier to see than contact down low looking through bodies. Especially since contact on the head/face is considered dangerous and fouls called for that is a point of emphasis
 
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You would think the obvious elbow to the head thru above the shoulder would be easier to see than contact down low looking through bodies. Especially since contact on the head/face is considered dangerous and fouls called for that is a point of emphasis
No argument there, but you have to consider the positions of the referees on the court and what they're watching out for at the same time. It's easier said than done from what I've learned through friends who are FIBA certified referees.
 

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