Wbbfan1
And That’s The Way It Is
- Joined
- Aug 26, 2011
- Messages
- 9,163
- Reaction Score
- 17,437
Some Disturbing Trends
- Thread starter Wbbfan1
- Start date
- Status
.
Good grief. The only thing I agree with Kallam on is that the Olympics punched a hole in the WNBA season. That's going to happen every four years, like it or not, until the Summer Olympics is moved to October.
I think the McCoughtry fiasco is the most exciting thing to happen to women's basketball in a long time. Women's sports is woefully behind men's sports on the leaderboard.
Good grief. The only thing I agree with Kallam on is that the Olympics punched a hole in the WNBA season. That's going to happen every four years, like it or not, until the Summer Olympics is moved to October.
I think the McCoughtry fiasco is the most exciting thing to happen to women's basketball in a long time. Women's sports is woefully behind men's sports on the leaderboard.
VAMike23
The Virginian
- Joined
- Aug 26, 2011
- Messages
- 8,512
- Reaction Score
- 17,295
"The Huskies and Geno Auriemma may be familiar, but they are almost too familiar, and lacking in charisma. (Quick, name their best player.)"
I think we'll see plenty of charisma this year, even with no DT types on the team (which seems to be what the author wants to see).
I think we'll see plenty of charisma this year, even with no DT types on the team (which seems to be what the author wants to see).
Damn! What's the matter with me? How could I forget that the NCAA WCBB Championship Trophy is awarded to the team and coach with the most charisma?
My bad.
alexrgct
RIP, Alex
- Joined
- Aug 26, 2011
- Messages
- 10,091
- Reaction Score
- 15,648
You can't name UConn's best player because a) eight of the 11 kids were underclassmen or in high school last year, and b) it figures to be one of the most balanced, talanted teams in WCBB history if the team plays like they're expected to. How could you not be excited about UConn and Baylor this upcoming season?
- Joined
- Jun 10, 2012
- Messages
- 31,616
- Reaction Score
- 3,964
It's funny how people from every part of the country enjoy following this uncharismatic team...? 
UcMiami
How it is
- Joined
- Aug 26, 2011
- Messages
- 14,197
- Reaction Score
- 47,324
Stupid column, though I do like his conclusion. And I do think there are noticable improvements like a woman being chosen to represent the Jordan brand, some pretty exciting players at every level (hmmm wasn't last year the year of a certain ND point guard trending crazy on twitter?) And as for players leaving the sport for VB, and water polo, and lacrosse - um, I'd like to see some actual facts attached to that - I am unaware of anyone on say a hoopgirz watch list as a HS freshman droping BB for VB.
H
Husk-E
I'm personally just as excited about this team as I have been about any other team. If this team lacks charisma then I don't know what team doesn't.
easttexastrash
Stay Classy!
- Joined
- Oct 7, 2011
- Messages
- 9,582
- Reaction Score
- 13,224
This is a great point. But some believe that the players don't have a responsibility, but they do, IMO.
"The future of the game depends on the roots and branches, and those who care about the sport need to invest in the future as well as glory in the present."
I'm not sure what steps BG can take to be more media friendly but if that is an area that she can help in I hope she does. She does have a very laid back personality and doesn't seem to be the type to seek out a ton of attention off the court.
Odd that the article does not mention Diggins, who IS very media friendly. As much as I can get irritated with the focus on her looks rather than her talent, I have to admit that she brings positive attention to WCBB and will really help the WNBA. She will be a marketing dream.
"The future of the game depends on the roots and branches, and those who care about the sport need to invest in the future as well as glory in the present."
I'm not sure what steps BG can take to be more media friendly but if that is an area that she can help in I hope she does. She does have a very laid back personality and doesn't seem to be the type to seek out a ton of attention off the court.
Odd that the article does not mention Diggins, who IS very media friendly. As much as I can get irritated with the focus on her looks rather than her talent, I have to admit that she brings positive attention to WCBB and will really help the WNBA. She will be a marketing dream.
easttexastrash
Stay Classy!
- Joined
- Oct 7, 2011
- Messages
- 9,582
- Reaction Score
- 13,224
I was disappointed that Destinee Hooker, who starred in volleyball and track at Texas, never played a game in WCBB. She was all-state in HS in Texas and would have been fun to watch on the basketball court.
sarals24
Lone Starlet
- Joined
- Oct 12, 2011
- Messages
- 3,987
- Reaction Score
- 8,123
I agree the players have a responsibility to represent themselves and their teams in a positive light. As far as growing the game, most of them do give back in some way to their communities or to young players. Maya is a perfect example of this with her camps and leadership talks.
Griner is growing the game in the sense that she is getting people interested who normally wouldn't, mainly with her on-court actions. Her personality seems to be more introverted off the court, and I don't think she should have to change to "grow the game". She's done that by virtue of being 6"8 and dunking.
Women's basketball is a niche sport, and will remain so, IMO. It's not going to have mainstream appeal because people will invariably compare it to the men's game and find it lacking. Too bad. I would argue that women's soccer is more "appealing" on a national level; people get more invested in the women's national team games because of the World Cup, etc. But they've had loads of trouble sustaining a league, no matter how much they try to "grow the game".
I think the best way to make the sport popular is to play at a consistently high level and grow rivalries among schools, teams, states, etc. It's getting there, and has grown leaps and bounds.
I'm curious, ETT, what exactly you think the players need to be doing to grow the game beyond what they are already doing?
Griner is growing the game in the sense that she is getting people interested who normally wouldn't, mainly with her on-court actions. Her personality seems to be more introverted off the court, and I don't think she should have to change to "grow the game". She's done that by virtue of being 6"8 and dunking.
Women's basketball is a niche sport, and will remain so, IMO. It's not going to have mainstream appeal because people will invariably compare it to the men's game and find it lacking. Too bad. I would argue that women's soccer is more "appealing" on a national level; people get more invested in the women's national team games because of the World Cup, etc. But they've had loads of trouble sustaining a league, no matter how much they try to "grow the game".
I think the best way to make the sport popular is to play at a consistently high level and grow rivalries among schools, teams, states, etc. It's getting there, and has grown leaps and bounds.
I'm curious, ETT, what exactly you think the players need to be doing to grow the game beyond what they are already doing?
VAMike23
The Virginian
- Joined
- Aug 26, 2011
- Messages
- 8,512
- Reaction Score
- 17,295
I'm sure they will make a good impression ...
And I have been just as active as anyone when it comes to looking forward to the impact of the 3 Musketeers.BUT, personality-wise and impact-wise, I am really interested in seeing how KML carries herself this season. Will she step it up and assert herself consistently? Will she emerge as an oncourt leader, like Bria? (I know Kelly has been stepping forward as well re: leadership, but I see Bria as being the more active leader during games and I expect that to continue.) Will KML's photo, by later in the season, be the one that gets featured when the TV screen is advertising the next big UCONN game?
I am betting that the photo chosen by the promo people at various networks will be Bria's this year, and that she will be our primary leader. But I will say this: If it is KML's photo that starts getting featured, and if KML emerges as our scoring leader--taking the big Sophomore step forward as most of the great players do--we will beat Baylor twice and we will go undefeated.
easttexastrash
Stay Classy!
- Joined
- Oct 7, 2011
- Messages
- 9,582
- Reaction Score
- 13,224
Stewart seems to have a very similar personality as Griner...kind of quiet and unassuming. I am not sure that she will has the type of magnetic personality to be a media darling. Jefferson, on the other hand, seems to be a marketing dream.
- Joined
- Aug 26, 2011
- Messages
- 3,938
- Reaction Score
- 3,867
Unlike most here, I do not disagree with too many points in the article, though I was totally unaware of the surging popularity of women's volleyball. In the end, the better athletes will always play basketball. Basketball is also a very low maintenance sport.
easttexastrash
Stay Classy!
- Joined
- Oct 7, 2011
- Messages
- 9,582
- Reaction Score
- 13,224
Same here. I think this article is spot-on. There simply aren't that many "likable" figures in the game right now. WCBB is usually a two or three team race with little suspense until the Final Four. There just isn't enough excitement to attract a broad audience.
The Olympic team was very good but most of the games were fairly boring. Then the players come back to the league that should be showcasing their talents and about half the players from the US don't play for a number of games. That is a hard way to gain respect.
Drumguy
Funny, now I mostly play guitar
- Joined
- Aug 26, 2011
- Messages
- 1,498
- Reaction Score
- 3,067
Just EDD.
msf22b
Maestro
- Joined
- Aug 27, 2011
- Messages
- 6,308
- Reaction Score
- 17,201
I can't speak to the Vollyball contention but the idea of assisting the development of charisma in woman's BB is a concept I can approve of.
Classical music (my field) forgot about it for a few decades and look what's happened there...quick, who's the most famous conductor, pianist, violinist? Yo Yo ( a mere cellist) is the only classical musician generally recognized Finally, in Dudamel, we have an exciting and charismatic conductor, but it will still be a while until he is a house-hold name.
Ms Maya, an intensely competitive sort, certainly filled the bill for the last generation of UConn players; a young woman of brains, talent, beauty and charisma and the beat goes on in Minny and the world.
I disagree with the auther's contention about EDD, she has become more than willing to share her story and has attracted a great deal of attention regardless of what she decides for the future.
Charisma takes different forms; Stewie might just wind up very charismatic in a aw-shucks kind of laid back style. It would have been perfect if she was from Alabama or Mississippi with a Southern Tang. A good publsist could have done wonders with that.
Which brings me to my last point. Charisma is often the result of really talented press agents developing a persona for an individual and then selling it to the media. Very much a part of the entertainment field, this approach is much less common in sports.
Maybe it is needed.
Classical music (my field) forgot about it for a few decades and look what's happened there...quick, who's the most famous conductor, pianist, violinist? Yo Yo ( a mere cellist) is the only classical musician generally recognized Finally, in Dudamel, we have an exciting and charismatic conductor, but it will still be a while until he is a house-hold name.
Ms Maya, an intensely competitive sort, certainly filled the bill for the last generation of UConn players; a young woman of brains, talent, beauty and charisma and the beat goes on in Minny and the world.
I disagree with the auther's contention about EDD, she has become more than willing to share her story and has attracted a great deal of attention regardless of what she decides for the future.
Charisma takes different forms; Stewie might just wind up very charismatic in a aw-shucks kind of laid back style. It would have been perfect if she was from Alabama or Mississippi with a Southern Tang. A good publsist could have done wonders with that.
Which brings me to my last point. Charisma is often the result of really talented press agents developing a persona for an individual and then selling it to the media. Very much a part of the entertainment field, this approach is much less common in sports.
Maybe it is needed.
EricLA
Cronus
- Joined
- Aug 24, 2011
- Messages
- 15,136
- Reaction Score
- 82,937
How could you NOT agree with this comment? 
Candace Parker – telegenic and talented – has yet to consistently play with the competitive fire that made players like Lisa Leslie and Sheryl Swoopes must-see opponents.
As for the lacking charisma, I think he's referring to what UCONN has enjoyed for many years, and at least one should emerge this year. First Sue, then Diana, Brit Hunter was certainly a "compelling story line", and then we had the Renee, Tina, and Maya years. For the most part, he's referring to a "franchise" player. Someone the entire country (or anyone with even a passing interest in WCBB) knows. This year, they have Griner, Diggins and EDD to market the heck out of. Certainly compelling players and stories.
Now at UCONN, we enter the Bria and Stef years, which will overlap with the KML and 3 muskateers era. For all that UCONN was great last year, and going to be great this year, they lack a pure super star (like ND's Diggins, Delaware's EDD, or Baylor's Griner). That's not to say one or more won't emerge, and I get that people may be tired of UCONN's sustained excellence over the past 5 years (5 consecutive final 4's, soon to be 6,7,8 etc)... but you hear the same "complaints" on the men's side as Kentucky, Kansas, Duke, UNC, Michigan State, and even usually UCONN are almost always in the top 10 and chasing a NC. Sure the Butler and VCU stories are great as those teams made it to the final 4, but the "blue chip" teams are almost always in it and usually shut out the other mid majors.
And BTW, this past year in the sweet 16 you had Kansas, Ga Tech, SJU, St Bonaventure, Penn State, and Gonzaga. a great representation of mid majors to go along with teams that have never been that far (or not recently) in the sweet 16. How was that not compelling?
He goes on to say "The other top teams are perennials as well. Duke, Stanford, Notre Dame and so on aren’t teams that anyone is really dying to see, even though they are obviously all very good. Even mid-major darling Delaware is hard to get revved up about because superstar Elena Delle Donne is not only quiet and unassuming, but there are reasonable questions about her passion for the game."
Can't really disagree with that, except for the lines about what fans really want to see. First, is the casual, or even avid, sports fan really interested in WCBB? I'd argue no. If you look at the ratings of WCBB games (or WNBA games) on TV, they obviously fall far short of NBA or MCBB games. So the interest, in both attendance, and fans at home, is more often comprised of the fans of individual schools. Would the casual fan have been more "dying to see" Gonzaga vs. St. Bonaventure in the finals? Would that have had better ratings than ND vs. Baylor? Hardly. It would have been less watched IMHO.
Tennessee, Louisville, ISU, Uconn, Notre Dame, Baylor, Purdue, Michigan State, Oklahoma and New Mexico comprise the top 10 in attendance for 2012. It's a testament to the fan bases that ISU and New Mexico are there because neither has won a NC, or even been to a NC game, never mind even a final 4. ISU has only made 2 elite appearances in 1999 and again in 2009. And those are the fan bases who would be most likely to watch a national championship game. Mainly because they are more interested in WCBB than other fan bases.
But his opinion that there are "genuine concerns" about the health of WCBB as more and more young talent is choosing volleyball makes no sense. EDD is the only top 50 or so kid i've EVER heard of choosing VB over WCBB - and she ended up back on the hoops court. If he's going to make a conclusion like that, it ought to be based in facts. And lastly, he talks about the future of the game depending on those involved now to "invest in the future as well as the glory of the present"... Um... ok. I'll bite - interesting point Clay. Any suggestions? Ideas? Thoughts on who, what and how? No? Figures. It's way more easy to throw out a bunch of critical comments than actually do some research and make some real suggestions...
Candace Parker – telegenic and talented – has yet to consistently play with the competitive fire that made players like Lisa Leslie and Sheryl Swoopes must-see opponents.
As for the lacking charisma, I think he's referring to what UCONN has enjoyed for many years, and at least one should emerge this year. First Sue, then Diana, Brit Hunter was certainly a "compelling story line", and then we had the Renee, Tina, and Maya years. For the most part, he's referring to a "franchise" player. Someone the entire country (or anyone with even a passing interest in WCBB) knows. This year, they have Griner, Diggins and EDD to market the heck out of. Certainly compelling players and stories.
Now at UCONN, we enter the Bria and Stef years, which will overlap with the KML and 3 muskateers era. For all that UCONN was great last year, and going to be great this year, they lack a pure super star (like ND's Diggins, Delaware's EDD, or Baylor's Griner). That's not to say one or more won't emerge, and I get that people may be tired of UCONN's sustained excellence over the past 5 years (5 consecutive final 4's, soon to be 6,7,8 etc)... but you hear the same "complaints" on the men's side as Kentucky, Kansas, Duke, UNC, Michigan State, and even usually UCONN are almost always in the top 10 and chasing a NC. Sure the Butler and VCU stories are great as those teams made it to the final 4, but the "blue chip" teams are almost always in it and usually shut out the other mid majors.
And BTW, this past year in the sweet 16 you had Kansas, Ga Tech, SJU, St Bonaventure, Penn State, and Gonzaga. a great representation of mid majors to go along with teams that have never been that far (or not recently) in the sweet 16. How was that not compelling?
He goes on to say "The other top teams are perennials as well. Duke, Stanford, Notre Dame and so on aren’t teams that anyone is really dying to see, even though they are obviously all very good. Even mid-major darling Delaware is hard to get revved up about because superstar Elena Delle Donne is not only quiet and unassuming, but there are reasonable questions about her passion for the game."
Can't really disagree with that, except for the lines about what fans really want to see. First, is the casual, or even avid, sports fan really interested in WCBB? I'd argue no. If you look at the ratings of WCBB games (or WNBA games) on TV, they obviously fall far short of NBA or MCBB games. So the interest, in both attendance, and fans at home, is more often comprised of the fans of individual schools. Would the casual fan have been more "dying to see" Gonzaga vs. St. Bonaventure in the finals? Would that have had better ratings than ND vs. Baylor? Hardly. It would have been less watched IMHO.
Tennessee, Louisville, ISU, Uconn, Notre Dame, Baylor, Purdue, Michigan State, Oklahoma and New Mexico comprise the top 10 in attendance for 2012. It's a testament to the fan bases that ISU and New Mexico are there because neither has won a NC, or even been to a NC game, never mind even a final 4. ISU has only made 2 elite appearances in 1999 and again in 2009. And those are the fan bases who would be most likely to watch a national championship game. Mainly because they are more interested in WCBB than other fan bases.
But his opinion that there are "genuine concerns" about the health of WCBB as more and more young talent is choosing volleyball makes no sense. EDD is the only top 50 or so kid i've EVER heard of choosing VB over WCBB - and she ended up back on the hoops court. If he's going to make a conclusion like that, it ought to be based in facts. And lastly, he talks about the future of the game depending on those involved now to "invest in the future as well as the glory of the present"... Um... ok. I'll bite - interesting point Clay. Any suggestions? Ideas? Thoughts on who, what and how? No? Figures. It's way more easy to throw out a bunch of critical comments than actually do some research and make some real suggestions...
UcMiami
How it is
- Joined
- Aug 26, 2011
- Messages
- 14,197
- Reaction Score
- 47,324
I actually think a good example is Whalen for MN - she is not a typically 'charismatic' personality, but her play and her girl next door kind of appeal is very marketable, especially in her home state.
I think one of the marketing strengths of women's basketball is their all american student athlete appeal - these women stay in school, generally are good students and good people, and they give back to their community. I think that has been carried forward by the WNBA quite well, and by the pro players themselves. We here in CT adopt them as 'extended family members'.
- Status