Sexism Much?

[Fairfield Fan]

I went to the New York Times Sports section and clinked on the article titled, "What's Next In the NCAA Tournament? Let's Look Ahead"

What’s Next in the N.C.A.A. Tournament? Let’s Look Ahead

Since there was no separate article about the "Women's" NCAA tournament, I figured that this "What's Next" article would be inclusive of both the men's and the women's tournaments. How silly of me!

It seems that when a sports news program or an article talks about "college basketball", or "The Tournament", they mean the men's game. Only when they specify "women's college basketball," or the "women's tournament" are they talking about women. Otherwise, they just assume that you know that it's all about the men.

Why can't ESPN or NewYork Times or other outlets stop specifying gender only for women's sports, and just assume that if there is no gender mentioned, of course it's all about the men?

I don't bother watching the men's tournament, because, quite frankly, with all of the stars leaving after a few months, the men's game is boring: little teamwork, little cohesion, few really experienced players. The women's game is far more fun to watch: established power teams, developed teamwork over a period of years, lots of passing. In other words, it's what the men's game used to be.

The women deserve at least the semblance of gender equality in reporting.

 

[MSUFan2003]

The coverage is just based on what drives interest. They're not out to get women. I don't care much for the men's game, but I'm in the minority. March Madness is one of the biggest sporting events of the year, and it would be odd to specify that they are talking about the men's tournament when most people already realize that.

There are some sports (gymnastics, ice skating) where women are more popular, but basketball isn't one of them. There's nothing sexist about it. People just have different preferences.

 

[WestsideWaltz]

Katelyn Ohashi's Floor Routine is the single most watched athletic clip this year. Think about that for a second. Does anyone even know there is men's collegiate gymnastics anymore?

 

[lne001]

Katelyn Ohashi's Floor Routine is the single most watched athletic clip this year. Think about that for a second.

That was as of January 19. 2019. It is no longer the 'single most watched.' And even if it were, what would it prove other than Michael Jackson was still very popular? By the way, Katelyn dropped Michael from her routine as of yesterday.

Does anyone even know there is men's collegiate gymnastics anymore?

Not really, thanks to Title IX. But I had never heard of Katelyn Ohashi before either. In reality there are fifthteen men's Div I gymnastics programs, comprised of most of the B1G and the service academies.

 

[CamrnCrz1974]

It seems that when a sports news program or an article talks about "college basketball", or "The Tournament", they mean the men's game. Only when they specify "women's college basketball," or the "women's tournament" are they talking about women. Otherwise, they just assume that you know that it's all about the men.

Why can't ESPN or NewYork Times or other outlets stop specifying gender only for women's sports, and just assume that if there is no gender mentioned, of course it's all about the men?

The NCAA's official logos for the men's and women's Final Four are listed as follows:

Men: 2019 Final Four Minneapolis
Women: 2019 Women's Final Four Tampa Bay

Source:
ncaa tournament logo 2019 - Google Search

In other words, the official NCAA logos refer to the men's tournament without the gender moniker, but include "women's" before "Final Four" for the women's tournament.

I don't bother watching the men's tournament, because, quite frankly, with all of the stars leaving after a few months, the men's game is boring: little teamwork, little cohesion, few really experienced players. The women's game is far more fun to watch: established power teams, developed teamwork over a period of years, lots of passing. In other words, it's what the men's game used to be.

As a connoisseur of the men's game, I must respectfully disagree. There is amazing teamwork and cohesion in men's college basketball, with tremendous basketball skills, team chemistry, and passing.

But this is my vantage point. And you have a different one.

The women deserve at least the semblance of gender equality in reporting.

I agree. But the market is completely different for men's sports and women's sports.

And frankly, there are many on this board, Rebkell, and others who still complain about ESPN's coverage (which has expanded exponentially in recent years, both on TV and online) of women's basketball...and refuse to support ESPN. If there is no financial incentive for ESPN to cover the sport (in terms of clicks, subscribers, etc.), there will never be anything resembling the same level of coverage for women's sports.

 

[MSUFan2003]

Katelyn Ohashi's Floor Routine is the single most watched athletic clip this year. Think about that for a second. Does anyone even know there is men's collegiate gymnastics anymore?

True, and when was the last time a male gymnast received a big endorsement deal? The female gymnasts are the ones making the money in that sport. Simone Biles is a household name.

 

[MSUFan2003]

If there is no financial incentive for ESPN to cover the sport (in terms of clicks, subscribers, etc.), there will never be anything resembling the same level of coverage for women's sports.

Yup. It's about money. Nothing more. Nothing less. This is why you don't see much coverage of college baseball. It's a very niche sport that most of the country doesn't care about. It's not because people hate men. Most things in life boil down to the almighty dollar.

Women's basketball is a niche sport that does not financially sustain itself. The football program subsidizes its existence (at least in the SEC). I don't think that fact degrades its worth, and it doesn't lessen my enjoyment of it. I'd love for women's basketball to be more popular, but that's just not the reality. People should be allowed to organically gravitate to the sports that interest them. I love fast pitch softball, but, alas, State is depressing in that sport, so I follow Florida.

 

[HuskyNan]

@Fairfield Fan

It’s funny you single out the Times as it’s one of the better papers for covering women’s basketball, and UConn in particular.

 

[meyers7]

My wife and I try to have as much sexism as possible. (Usually with each other.)

 

[CocoHusky]

Just think we should save all cries of whatever "isms" for when we might really need them. This ain't it.

 

[Fairfield Fan]

The NCAA's official logos for the men's and women's Final Four are listed as follows:

Men: 2019 Final Four Minneapolis
Women: 2019 Women's Final Four Tampa Bay

Source:
ncaa tournament logo 2019 - Google Search

In other words, the official NCAA logos refer to the men's tournament without the gender moniker, but include "women's" before "Final Four" for the women's tournament.



As a connoisseur of the men's game, I must respectfully disagree. There is amazing teamwork and cohesion in men's college basketball, with tremendous basketball skills, team chemistry, and passing.

But this is my vantage point. And you have a different one.



I agree. But the market is completely different for men's sports and women's sports.

And frankly, there are many on this board, Rebkell, and others who still complain about ESPN's coverage (which has expanded exponentially in recent years, both on TV and online) of women's basketball...and refuse to support ESPN. If there is no financial incentive for ESPN to cover the sport (in terms of clicks, subscribers, etc.), there will never be anything resembling the same level of coverage for women's sports.

That logo is my point: The Final Four, without gender, is assumed to be male. In other words, it's the Real Deal. The women's Final Four is something less than the real deal: it's the "Women's Final Four".

Regarding the current men's game, I will date myself with this comment, but I remember watching the Dean Smith Carolina teams, the great Maryland teams under Lefty Driesell, and John Wooden's UCLA greats. The current teams are far younger, since the best players leave real quick. And they are a shadow of the great "teams" of years past. Wooden and Driesell and Smith knew how to coach, knew how to execute as a team. Indeed, my first glimpses of Coach Geno's teams reminded me of Dean Smith's team basketball. I hadn't seen beautiful basketball like that in decades. And that's why UConn women's basketball is so enjoyable to watch!

My point is that if you're going to have Final Fours or Tournaments for men and women, then call them the "men's tourney" and the "women's tourney." Don't assume that if there is no gender applied, of course it's the superior men's game. Just not fair.

 

[mbr33ct]

This is nothing new for the NCAA, they have gender specific tourney's that say "men's" and "women's".

As an example, I give you;

 

[Philly Kid]

Katelyn Ohashi's Floor Routine is the single most watched athletic clip this year. Think about that for a second. Does anyone even know there is men's collegiate gymnastics anymore?[/QU

Katelyn Ohashi's Floor Routine is the single most watched athletic clip this year. Think about that for a second. Does anyone even know there is men's collegiate gymnastics anymore?

There are only 16 NCAA teams nationwide in Mens Gymnastics. In 67 almost any major university had a mens team and few had womens teams, now it is reversed. In the Philadelphia region there were two separate leagues of 8 teams each at the HS level between PA and NJ now there are probably none.

 

[WestsideWaltz]

That was as of January 19. 2019. It is no longer the 'single most watched.' And even if it were, what would it prove other than Michael Jackson was still very popular? By the way, Katelyn dropped Michael from her routine as of yesterday.



Not really, thanks to Title IX. But I had never heard of Katelyn Ohashi before either. In reality there are fifthteen men's Div I gymnastics programs, comprised of most of the B1G and the service academies.

Actually, Katelyn dropped him from her routines last week and the MJ-less routines still have been viewed over 500k times in two days. Guess MJ wasn't that popular after all.

 

[CamrnCrz1974]

My point is that if you're going to have Final Fours or Tournaments for men and women, then call them the "men's tourney" and the "women's tourney." Don't assume that if there is no gender applied, of course it's the superior men's game. Just not fair.

In your initial post, you singled out ESPN and the New York Times:

It seems that when a sports news program or an article talks about "college basketball", or "The Tournament", they mean the men's game. Only when they specify "women's college basketball," or the "women's tournament" are they talking about women. Otherwise, they just assume that you know that it's all about the men.

Why can't ESPN or NewYork Times or other outlets stop specifying gender only for women's sports, and just assume that if there is no gender mentioned, of course it's all about the men?

But if ESPN and The New York Times are reporting it the way the NCAA characterizes it, this issue (the specific issue from your original post, not the general issue of gender and sports coverage) would be with the NCAA and not ESPN/The New York Times.

 

[Beemer]

The NCAA's official logos for the men's and women's Final Four are listed as follows:

Men: 2019 Final Four Minneapolis
Women: 2019 Women's Final Four Tampa Bay

Source:
ncaa tournament logo 2019 - Google Search

In other words, the official NCAA logos refer to the men's tournament without the gender moniker, but include "women's" before "Final Four" for the women's tournament.



As a connoisseur of the men's game, I must respectfully disagree. There is amazing teamwork and cohesion in men's college basketball, with tremendous basketball skills, team chemistry, and passing.

But this is my vantage point. And you have a different one.




I agree. But the market is completely different for men's sports and women's sports.

And frankly, there are many on this board, Rebkell, and others who still complain about ESPN's coverage (which has expanded exponentially in recent years, both on TV and online) of women's basketball...and refuse to support ESPN. If there is no financial incentive for ESPN to cover the sport (in terms of clicks, subscribers, etc.), there will never be anything resembling the same level of coverage for women's sports.

It's the old story- you have to give in order to get.

 

[Plebe]

Katelyn Ohashi's Floor Routine is the single most watched athletic clip this year. Think about that for a second. Does anyone even know there is men's collegiate gymnastics anymore?

These are probably all the men's programs listed here:
NC Men's Gymnastics Rankings - College Gymnastics Association | NCAA.com

 

[hussybulldog]

Is this a sexist decision that men need to play 3 out of 5 but women only need to play 2 out of 3 sets in tennis’ grand slam, although the prizes are the same?

 

[Jmsdawg]

My wife and I try to have as much sexism as possible. (Usually with each other.)

I remember but at 77 it is a distant memory!

 

[meyers7]

Just think we should save all cries of whatever "isms" for when we might really need them. This ain't it.

“Not that I condone fascism, or any -ism for that matter. -Ism's in my opinion are not good. A person should not believe in an -ism, he should believe in himself. I quote John Lennon, "I don't believe in Beatles, I just believe in me." Good point there. After all, he was the walrus. I could be the walrus. I'd still have to bum rides off people.”

 

[SVCBeercats]

The women deserve at least the semblance of gender equality in reporting.

How is this about UCONN? At best this should be on some general topics board.