Seton HeII Post Game Thread

[nelsonmuntz]

One other thing I would recommend is not pulling the fire alarm too quickly. There is going to be more volatility year to year and even month to month with the transfer portal, and fans just have to deal with it. Kansas, UConn and UNC are learning what happens when your transfers underperform or simply do not get on the same page. It will happen next year with other teams.

Traditional recruiting is becoming increasingly irrelevant. As good as McNeeley is, he has too many games like yesterday's. Coaches need to make tough decisions about whether it is better to tie up a sizable chunk of NIL in a one-and-done frosh that is used to dominating one-on-one against inferior competition, or get a 21 year old that is polished at the college game but is just a hair below what is needed athletically to be a first round NBA lock. These are not easy decisions, and you can see why so many old-time coaches are calling it quits.

 

[FfldCntyFan]

Yes it's my post and it makes me a feel a whole lot worse about this team. Hurley should be the one owning the loss.

Perhaps. I personally believe that there's enough blame that a few should get a piece of it.

As far as players not placing the necessary level of seriousness in each game, that's entirely on them.

 

[HuskyWarrior611]

One other thing I would recommend is not pulling the fire alarm too quickly. There is going to be more volatility year to year and even month to month with the transfer portal, and fans just have to deal with it. Kansas, UConn and UNC are learning what happens when your transfers underperform or simply do not get on the same page. It will happen next year with other teams.

Traditional recruiting is becoming increasingly irrelevant. As good as McNeeley is, he has too many games like yesterday's. Coaches need to make tough decisions about whether it is better to tie up a sizable chunk of NIL in a one-and-done frosh that is used to dominating one-on-one against inferior competition, or get a 21 year old that is polished at the college game but is just a hair below what is needed athletically to be a first round NBA lock. These are not easy decisions, and you can see why so many old-time coaches are calling it quits.

College coaching is suppose to be about developing young men first and foremost.

If it turns into building the best roster every year without care for actually developing the best talent it’s no different than the NBA and Euroleague. Which is disappointing.

Before any asks, naturally having a focus on developing talent the right way should lead to winning games long term.

 

[Kolumbo]

The Inbounds Situation
So much talk about the inability to get the ball in play multiple times so maybe it deserves its own thread. What was the major issue here, or was it several factors? We all agree it was inexcusable but was it on Hurley, players, defense?

1. Lack of an effective play which seems impossible to believe
2. Players failed to execute the play
3. SHU defended superbly
4. SHU fouled preventing players to get open
5. AK was too careful or missed throw-in opportunities
6. All of the above

I can accept that Hurley coached an awful game yesterday but I also believe a coach can only do so much. I have to believe something is going on with the players.

 

[RuffRuff]

One other thing I would recommend is not pulling the fire alarm too quickly. There is going to be more volatility year to year and even month to month with the transfer portal, and fans just have to deal with it. Kansas, UConn and UNC are learning what happens when your transfers underperform or simply do not get on the same page. It will happen next year with other teams.

Traditional recruiting is becoming increasingly irrelevant. As good as McNeeley is, he has too many games like yesterday's. Coaches need to make tough decisions about whether it is better to tie up a sizable chunk of NIL in a one-and-done frosh that is used to dominating one-on-one against inferior competition, or get a 21 year old that is polished at the college game but is just a hair below what is needed athletically to be a first round NBA lock. These are not easy decisions, and you can see why so many old-time coaches are calling it quits.

Really good post. Its what makes roster construction fascinating these days, striking the balance, building depth and having insurance plans built in, while maintaining harmony. It’s really hard. This year will be a learning season for a really smart staff, pretty confident they’ll pull smart levers to figure it out. I’d imagine they’ve been scouting portal possibilities already.

It was said already but staff over invested in the soph class, and the continuity piece. There is no question a portal alternative or two could have made this team better. There is nothing streaming off that group that suggests they know our system so well it’s must have. If anything it’s been the opposite.

To the last post - sure developing young men is important, at UConn’s level winning takes priority. They can happen in tandem, but doesn’t have to. Duke is an example. Memphis and UK are other examples.

If anyone wants to scout the portal Drake is on ESPN2.

 

[FreeKlaiber]

If you want to put yesterday's loss on coaching, fine. It's a valid argument.

This back and forth however is on your claim that AK stating the players aren't always taking the opponents as seriously as they should is on Dan Hurley is an entirely different argument. Tell me this wasn't your post:
View attachment 107042

It is an awful sign that AK is shouldering the blame for this season. You can't question his desire. However, he and many teammates have been put in situations that they can't succeed. Dan Hurley's stubborness is continuing trying to put square pegs into round holes, defensively especially. The roster construction and having no penetrators other than Hass is beyond limiting. Regardless, We can't be in a one possession rock fight with inferior teams like this. Dan Hurley is not great at in game x and o's, especially seems to tighten up against Seton Hall in jersey

An example of "looking like a poorly coached team" just from final play. Whether or not he was fouled on the play, do you think designing a set to get the ball into a corner trap with your no ballhandling guard is a good O.O.B. play design? We've done it all year, but its usually 6 foot Hass getting the ball in the corner, then immediately trapped. There are a TON of O.O.B. that don't inbound directly into the corner trap like St Johns or last night. But here we are. and if you are going to run an inbounds play that passes it into corner, have a 1) headier player who knows you dont have to split the trap, and can just pivot and take the foul or 2) have a taller player to receive inbounds if in corner (Stew or AK). It's poor coaching IMO to do the football gimmick play at end of game and then pass into a trap to guard who can't dribble. and I agree, Tarris not getting to utilize his post up game against a team like that is also bad coaching (and I'm a Samson stan). Also not fan of sanctimoniously preaching only getting the right type of guy from the right kind of family bla bla, but then calling them out for being too nice. I feel bad for where Dan Hurley must be mentally right now after playing WWE heel and now eating crow, but I feel worse for AK.

 

[F101Voodoo]

The lack of a call on the previous play with McNeeley was worse hacked across both arms reaching for the ball

As others and I had said we should not have been in the situation that a bad call or two would decide the game. That goes right back to the first half.

 

[HuskyWarrior611]

To the last post - sure developing young men is important, at UConn’s level winning takes priority. They can happen in tandem, but doesn’t have to. Duke is an example. Memphis and UK are other examples.

If anyone wants to scout the portal Drake is on ESPN2.

They should work in tandem. That’s what college is about.

Because just as easily as you can have a year of development where you don’t win as much you can also have a year like this where you pour everything into pushing plays like Diarra, AK, Mahaney, and Samson to the front and get nothing out of it.

At least with development you set yourself up for the future. This season turning out this way is magnified by the fact that we’re getting not much out of the sophomores and our freshman seasons were a waste.

I’d rather have went all in on doing things to make our young players better to be great for next season. Now we’re stuck in no man’s land wondering if we should invest in our guys even more or roll the dice on the portal where there’s STILL a chance of bad results and continuing to go down this path of selling out for wins that may or may not happen.

 

[RuffRuff]

They should work in tandem. That’s what college is about.

Because just as easily as you can have a year of development where you don’t win as much you can also have a year like this where you pour everything into pushing plays like Diarra, AK, Mahaney, and Samson to the front and get nothing out of it.

At least with development you set yourself up for the future. This season turning at this way is magnified by the fact that we’re getting not much out of the sophomores and our freshman seasons were a waste.

I’d rather have went all in on doing things to make our young players better to be great for next season. Now we’re stuck in no man’s land wondering if we should invest in our guys even more or roll the dice on the portal where there’s STILL a chance of bad results and continuing to go down this path of selling out for wins that may or may not happen.

There are some coaches trying that, Painter, Shaka. It’s limiting.

The portal is here.

Look at the best teams this year - portal stamped all over.

Speaking of Painter, gonna be interesting to see what happens with Braden Smith when he gets a 2-3mm NIL offer in the portal as a senior with no NBA potential. This could be his one chance to cash out.

 

[HuskyWarrior611]

There are some coaches trying that, Painter, Shaka. It’s limiting.

The portal is here.

Look at the best teams this year - portal stamped all over.

Speaking of Painter, gonna be interesting to see what happens with Braden Smith when he gets a 2-3mm NIL offer in the portal as a senior with no NBA potential. This could be his one chance to cash out.

They consistently have top 10 teams though and they don’t recruit at the level we do.

 

[1999GoodSon]

+1. When the team loses to Seton Hall, the problems are way past the refs.

Yes yes and yes. Although it won't, this comment should vaporize further discussion of the ref's role in us being on the losing end of whatever that was we all saw yesterday. Whether the zebras will, won't, did or don't is like arguing with the shape of clouds.

 

[RuffRuff]

They consistently have top 10 teams though and they don’t recruit at the level we do.

Matt Painter is unlikely to ever win a NC. He got to his first final 4 with a uber dominant 7’4” guy last year. If you want your upside to be a S16, you can roll that system out.

 

[BigTenFan]

There are some coaches trying that, Painter, Shaka. It’s limiting.

The portal is here.

Look at the best teams this year - portal stamped all over.

Speaking of Painter, gonna be interesting to see what happens with Braden Smith when he gets a 2-3mm NIL offer in the portal as a senior with no NBA potential. This could be his one chance to cash out.

Purdue will come up with the money to keep Smith, Loyer and TKR

Say what you want about Painter but he develops talent and has built a great culture in West Lafayette.

 

[RuffRuff]

Purdue will come up with the money to keep Smith, Loyer and TKR

Say what you want about Painter but he develops talent and has built a great culture in West Lafayette.

No doubt - much respect for the guy, but he’s unlikely to roll out NC potential teams often.

There will be programs willing to pay big for Smith next year and I’ve seen nothing to suggest Purdue has deep pockets. Smith strikes me as a loyal kid so I’m sure they figure it out.

 

[AntG168]

No doubt - much respect for the guy, but he’s unlikely to roll out NC potential teams often.

There will be programs willing to pay big for Smith next year and I’ve seen nothing to suggest Purdue has deep pockets. Smith strikes me as a loyal kid so I’m sure they figure it out.

They found the money for Edey.

 

[BigTenFan]

They found the money for Edey.

They found 8 million dollars to fire the football coach after two years and hire another one...they will find the money to keep one of the best players to ever wear a Purdue uniform.

 

[nelsonmuntz]

Really good post. Its what makes roster construction fascinating these days, striking the balance, building depth and having insurance plans built in, while maintaining harmony. It’s really hard. This year will be a learning season for a really smart staff, pretty confident they’ll pull smart levers to figure it out. I’d imagine they’ve been scouting portal possibilities already.

It was said already but staff over invested in the soph class, and the continuity piece. There is no question a portal alternative or two could have made this team better. There is nothing streaming off that group that suggests they know our system so well it’s must have. If anything it’s been the opposite.

To the last post - sure developing young men is important, at UConn’s level winning takes priority. They can happen in tandem, but doesn’t have to. Duke is an example. Memphis and UK are other examples.

If anyone wants to scout the portal Drake is on ESPN2.

My point is that everything is going to happen slower in terms of on court performance by the players. The upperclassmen are just better than they were 10 or 20 years ago. The NIL has had a huge difference in the quality of play, because now borderline NBA players and euro players stay in school, and the players for whom pro ball is not an option clearly put more time into their games because they are getting paid. There were a lot of players in the old days that would mail it in junior year on because, what difference did it make? That does not happen as much anymore.

Better upperclassmen means that the non-superstar underclassmen on major conference teams are going to have to wait their turn, and really work hard to get on the court. I am sure Hurley is getting a lot of game film from MAAC, MVC, MAC, WCC and AAC players that want a shot at the big time, and are busting their butts to get here. Nothing is guaranteed to the current freshmen and sophomores on the team.

So that means both, A) don't read too much into how the current sophomores are playing, and B) nothing is guaranteed. I think Stewart has potential but he has to pull his head out of his butt on defense. His defensive instincts are terrible. Ross...eh. I will defer to the coaches. He may develop into a role player and he will know the system and may be willing to accept the role. I am not as down on Mahaney (I know he is a junior) as some, although I don't know how much NIL he is making so maybe I should be.

 

[nelsonmuntz]

Just noting here that Auriemma had Bueckers on the court with under 2 minutes left in a game he was leading by 25+. Hasn't he learned anything in the last 5 years of coaching Bueckers and Fudd?

 

[tennmike]

Well I respect you and your thoughts so I never called you a loser so not sure why my post was brought into that equation.

The elephant in the room isn’t the refs last night that’s where we disagree. Bad calls happen but up 7 with 36 seconds left is not a game you lose without stupid plays, bad decisions and not being able to get the ball in bounds. Solo missed a huge FT, he fouled a crappy shooter for 3 easy ones and HD let a guy get to the hole without a defensive play and then Alex gagged not getting the ball in bounds. The refs only came into play because the coaches and players didn’t react in a winning manner. Hence why I disagree.

And Hass allowed a bowling ball an unimpeded lane to the basket with seconds left in the game. Last year's team had BBIQ in spades; this year not so much.
And to think there aren't any fresh legs on the bench that can get free for an inbounds pass (Reed, Abraham, Nowell). If Nowell is not better than the injured version of Hass, then that's saying something. Yeah, we're not in practice so what the heck to we know?
We didn't make up the 3-peat narrative.

This loss was so bad that it should count as two losses. UConn literally lost the game twice due to serious ineptitude.

 

[controlfade]

There are some coaches trying that, Painter, Shaka. It’s limiting.

The portal is here.

Look at the best teams this year - portal stamped all over.

Speaking of Painter, gonna be interesting to see what happens with Braden Smith when he gets a 2-3mm NIL offer in the portal as a senior with no NBA potential. This could be his one chance to cash out.

Duke is a top team and they clearly are not stamped by the portal. If anything they are the complete opposite.
The portal is a tool

Matt Painter is unlikely to ever win a NC. He got to his first final 4 with a uber dominant 7’4” guy last year. If you want your upside to be a S16, you can roll that system out.

no one is ever likely to win a NC, the odds are not in your favor.
People can also claim Hurley got his first ever tournament win with an uber dominant 7’2” monster.

 

[jibsey]

This is a hard thing to admit when your team has been this dominant but there are 7-8 teams in the BE with similar levels of talent that make for close games and “upsets” that are really not upsets except for the ranking numbers. Ok Seton Hall is not one of them but they rise up yesterday, scratched and clawed AND the announcer referenced how many close games they had lost.

 

[Scrutineer]

I'm sure this will be an unpopular opinion, but I still expect a Sweet 16 berth this season. I think that's now the ceiling rather than the floor for this team like I did preseason, but I still think it happens

STOP? Who the he*Kc are you? I never told you what to post. I can post whatever I want.

The refs lost us the game. As bad as UConn played, a call on the last play on a mauled Solo Ball and UConn wins. You deny that a call on that play and UConn wins? Don't repeat what I already know; that UConn played bad and Dan Hurley made mistakes and so on. And don't tell me Solo was not fouled. I have seen the call made more times than not made. And don't give me any Basketball 101 crap. Answer the question.

My take is most people here simply believe this game should never have been close so why waste time discussing the impact of the refs or any other excuse for a horrible loss?

 

[Brad Palmer]

You take yourrrr timeeeeeee because with more than one minute left the clock CONTINUES TO RUN.

It’s the smartest move you can possibly make. Yes, you have to inbound the ball successfully, but that is an insanely high BBIQ decision Alex always makes.

But if you struggle to inbounds the ball, why would you wait and let the other team set up their pressure? Get it inbounds quickly.

 

[Scrutineer]

He absolutely has taken accountability after losses. Maybe he doesn't do it enough for some people, but he certainly has.

Jim Calhoun is a legend and a mount rushmore coach, but lets not pretend Calhoun always blamed only himself postgame after bad losses without firing off shots at others, whether it be players not executing or officials. And let's be clear there are a lot of folks who thought Calhoun was a detestable POS as well.

Calhoun has also had clunker seasons, sort of like this one. Seasons where he was preseason 10-20 and ended up barely over .500.

Is Hurley perfect? no. Is he stubborn? Hell yeah. And winning two in a row including #2 by larger domination than any team in the history of the sport will only fuel that stubborness.

But he has also shown a willingness after the end of rough seasons to adjust - and I fully expect he and his staff will be humbled by what happened this year and will hit the offseason completely energized.

In summary, it was one of the worst, most bizarre finishes to games in UConn history. And there were a lot of owners of it. But Dan Hurley and his staff won back to back national championships. Show the man at least a little bit of freaking respect for god sakes.

I believe many here think Dan Hurley has changed for the worse with the arrogance and pettiness he's shown since the 2nd title. I know I don't like it and hope Andrea and his Mom and Dad wake him up.

He was a likeable, passionate, fan of UConn and the Big East and did much to endear himself to the players and fans in his first few years but now acts much differently. Consider the comment he infamously made to the referee about not turning his back on him. Smacks of privilege and arrogance he never showed his first five years here.

Maybe it's not possible to be humble and great. Most of us would be lucky to be one of those two.

 

[Edward Sargent]

Just noting here that Auriemma had Bueckers on the court with under 2 minutes left in a game he was leading by 25+. Hasn't he learned anything in the last 5 years of coaching Bueckers and Fudd?

Yeah but the girls helped pull me off the ledge!!