Sean Woods Incident (Morehead State vs Kentucky)

[mauconnfan]

If the kid didn't continue to talk back I'm guessing the "discussion" wouldn't have lasted as long........but the hard push never needed to happen........kids are different now they know everything and have posse's and !! Can't take some hard criticism........you know what you're getting into when you sign up to play as they always said with Knight and Calhoun........

 

[coachRD]

Anyone else see him drive a player to near tears? Thoughts? His team looked really athletic against UK. But that incident might overshadow it.

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I will say this-in general, when a team sees their coach lose control and his focus ON THE TASK AT HAND for a sustained block of time like this coach did, that's not good. That shows instability and limited skills as a team leader. Coaches demand that players "move on" from distractions in a game, whether it is a personal mistake made by the player, a mistake made by a teammate, a perception that a referee missed a call/made a bad call, etc....that coach has to be able to "turn the page" and coach his team. There is NOTHING that kid could have said that should have pulled that coach's single-minded focus away from the game for that length of time. Anything the kid said could/should have been dealt with after the game after the initial response. I'm not even commenting on the level of intensity/nature of the coach's behavior, I'm just commenting on the effectiveness of his coaching during that time. I see a coach who took his eye off the ball and couldn't handle the moment.

 

[mauconnfan]

I will say this-in general, when a team sees their coach lose control and his focus ON THE TASK AT HAND for a sustained block of time like this coach did, that's not good. That shows instability and limited skills as a team leader. Coaches demand that players "move on" from distractions in a game, whether it is a personal mistake made by the player, a mistake made by a teammate, a perception that a referee missed a call/made a bad call, etc....that coach has to be able to "turn the page" and coach his team. There is NOTHING that kid could have said that should have pulled that coach's single-minded focus away from the game for that length of time. Anything the kid said could/should have been dealt with after the game after the initial response. I'm not even commenting on the level of intensity/nature of the coach's behavior, I'm just commenting on the effectiveness of his coaching during that time. I see a coach who took his eye off the ball and couldn't handle the moment.

While I agree with the general theme of your post "coaching" college kids goes beyond X's and O's as I'm sure you know and we don't know what happened out there......if he has a capable staff to see things through on the court the time may have been right in this instance to address the miscommunication between he and the player!

 

[cohenzone]

While I agree with the general theme of your post "coaching" college kids goes beyond X's and O's as I'm sure you know and we don't know what happened out there......if he has a capable staff to see things through on the court the time may have been right in this instance to address the miscommunication between he and the player!

Coaches get away with crap that people in other work settings wouldn't dare do without facing some consequence. It is either a matter of an adult with no self control or a wrong-headed idea about what it takes to motivate people.

 

[mauconnfan]

Coaches get away with crap that people in other work settings wouldn't dare do without facing some consequence. It is either a matter of an adult with no self control or a wrong-headed idea about what it takes to motivate people.

I don't think we can compare our work environment to coaching a game of any kind. Just a whole different set of rules and a different scope of work. While we need to teach our sales people or whomever, there is no reason to ever subject them to public humiliation mainly because there aren't 12K people watching us plus another 200K on TV!!! To me not a good comparison plus any kid who wants to get better will go to a school where the coach helps them learn the hard way.....that makes you a man as well as a better player!!!

The biggest question I have is why is football so much different than basketball?? Obviously football coaches mentality is much more acceptable than basketball and that push is nothing comparing it to the sidelines of a football game.......face mask pulling is an every day occurrence......

 

[cohenzone]

[quote="mauconnfan, post: 405006, member: 489"To me not a good comparison plus any kid who wants to get better will go to a school where the coach helps them learn the hard way.....that makes you a man as well as a better player!!!

The biggest question I have is why is football so much different than basketball?? Obviously football coaches mentality is much more acceptable than basketball and that push is nothing comparing it to the sidelines of a football game.......face mask pulling is an every day occurrence......[/quote]

I think that is macho BS. This isn't the Marines. It is acceptable only if people let it be. Did you ever see Dean Smith abuse a kid? Or Coach K? Or Bill Walsh? And I could name them on and on. Sports is their workplace and a highly visible one. We all know it can be done without that kind of stuff.

 

[mauconnfan]

[quote="mauconnfan, post: 405006, member: 489"To me not a good comparison plus any kid who wants to get better will go to a school where the coach helps them learn the hard way.....that makes you a man as well as a better player!!!

The biggest question I have is why is football so much different than basketball?? Obviously football coaches mentality is much more acceptable than basketball and that push is nothing comparing it to the sidelines of a football game.......face mask pulling is an every day occurrence......

I think that is macho BS. This isn't the Marines. It is acceptable only if people let it be. Did you ever see Dean Smith abuse a kid? Or Coach K? Or Bill Walsh? And I could name them on and on. Sports is their workplace and a highly visible one. We all know it can be done without that kind of stuff.[/quote]

Actually have seen Coach K visibly hammer on kids many times and worst yet, referees to a humiliating extent. The coaches put lots of time into their craft and expectations are high, I have no problem whatsoever if kids get criticized in front of thousands by their coaches for something they should be doing better. Have to toughen kids up and I think it is effective and makes the message clear...........guessing all the kids who felt the JC "passion" and most of Bobby Knights will agree.....it's all in who you are and what you can tolerate! Imagine I just named 2 coaches who made non-All American HS players better when they left their respective schools and they are similar in style?

 

[cohenzone]

I think that is macho BS. This isn't the Marines. It is acceptable only if people let it be. Did you ever see Dean Smith abuse a kid? Or Coach K? Or Bill Walsh? And I could name them on and on. Sports is their workplace and a highly visible one. We all know it can be done without that kind of stuff.

Actually have seen Coach K visibly hammer on kids many times and worst yet, referees to a humiliating extent. The coaches put lots of time into their craft and expectations are high, I have no problem whatsoever if kids get criticized in front of thousands by their coaches for something they should be doing better. Have to toughen kids up and I think it is effective and makes the message clear...........guessing all the kids who felt the JC "passion" and most of Bobby Knights will agree.....it's all in who you are and what you can tolerate! Imagine I just named 2 coaches who made non-All American HS players better when they left their respective schools and they are similar in style?[/quote]

Chewing a kid out and shoving them is not the same.

 

[mauconnfan]

Actually have seen Coach K visibly hammer on kids many times and worst yet, referees to a humiliating extent. The coaches put lots of time into their craft and expectations are high, I have no problem whatsoever if kids get criticized in front of thousands by their coaches for something they should be doing better. Have to toughen kids up and I think it is effective and makes the message clear...........guessing all the kids who felt the JC "passion" and most of Bobby Knights will agree.....it's all in who you are and what you can tolerate! Imagine I just named 2 coaches who made non-All American HS players better when they left their respective schools and they are similar in style?

Chewing a kid out and shoving them is not the same.[/quote]

I did not condone the shove..........should not have happened...........agree on that

 

[willinphilly]

Actually have seen Coach K visibly hammer on kids many times and worst yet, referees to a humiliating extent. The coaches put lots of time into their craft and expectations are high, I have no problem whatsoever if kids get criticized in front of thousands by their coaches for something they should be doing better. Have to toughen kids up and I think it is effective and makes the message clear...........guessing all the kids who felt the JC "passion" and most of Bobby Knights will agree.....it's all in who you are and what you can tolerate! Imagine I just named 2 coaches who made non-All American HS players better when they left their respective schools and they are similar in style?

Chewing a kid out and shoving them is not the same.[/quote]

Being positive and non-confrontational is very different than being intense. I think some people tend to lump intensity with physical outbursts, but generally the most effective leaders are those that fiery when they need to be, but are in control. Being fiery all the time tends to reduce its effectiveness.

 

[johnhuskies95]

[quote="mauconnfan, post: 405006, member: 489"To me not a good comparison plus any kid who wants to get better will go to a school where the coach helps them learn the hard way.....that makes you a man as well as a better player!!!

The biggest question I have is why is football so much different than basketball?? Obviously football coaches mentality is much more acceptable than basketball and that push is nothing comparing it to the sidelines of a football game.......face mask pulling is an every day occurrence......

I think that is macho BS. This isn't the Marines. It is acceptable only if people let it be. Did you ever see Dean Smith abuse a kid? Or Coach K? Or Bill Walsh? And I could name them on and on. Sports is their workplace and a highly visible one. We all know it can be done without that kind of stuff.[/quote]

Exactly. There are only two types of people who get away with this type of crap time after time: children and coaches.

 

[Excalibur]

I think the kid said something uncalled for on his way back quite honestly....check out the assistant coach who some think was trying to get in the middle,

I think he just took exception to being shoved.

 

[mauconnfan]

I think he just took exception to being shoved.

And he should have.....but he said something before getting back to the huddle as you can see by the assistants reaction......and that may have triggered an overreaction from Woods.....? Not sure.......

 

[Excalibur]

And he should have.....but he said something before getting back to the huddle as you can see by the assistants reaction......and that may have triggered an overreaction from Woods.....? Not sure.......

I'm not sure either, and the kid's history is suspect for sure. But in that situation you just tell the kid to sit his ass down, and then if you need to get into his face you do it in the locker room or your office later.

 

[mauconnfan]

I'm not sure either, and the kid's history is suspect for sure. But in that situation you just tell the kid to sit his ass down, and then if you need to get into his face you do it in the locker room or your office later.

I'm okay with the in the face stuff but he went above and beyond no doubt, most of which I'm sure needed to be behind closed doors because it was above the "what he did on the court" at that point.....!! Agreed

 

[Kitaman]

People can't be naive to think that this stuff doesn't happen in practices. Many coaches show more restraint during games (audiences) than closed practices. I would bet players have been 'chest' shoved and berated by the best of them, all in the name of love.

Teenagers can have that kind of impact on a coach who has a short fuse.

 

[DaddyChoc]

I think he just took exception to being shoved.

And he should have.....but he said something before getting back to the huddle as you can see by the assistants reaction......and that may have triggered an overreaction from Woods.....? Not sure.......

something like this
Player:"yo you didnt have to push me like that"...
Coach:"what?"
Player: You didnt need to put your hands on me like Im your child. I fouled out, my fault damn!

kid sits down, you come over and continue to yell "in his face"
this isnt a "coaching style"... this is him probably 24/7. frick all that "passion for the game BS". He has a "history" of this nonsense. I never heard of the guy so I guess his "coaching style" is all that effective.

 

[mauconnfan]

something like this
Player:"yo you didnt have to push me like that"...
Coach:"what?"
Player: You didnt need to put your hands on me like Im your child. I fouled out, my fault damn!

kid sits down, you come over and continue to yell "in his face"
this isnt a "coaching style"... this is him probably 24/7. frick all that "passion for the game BS". He has a "history" of this nonsense. I never heard of the guy so I guess his "coaching style" is all that effective.

He coaches Moorhead State (mostly known for kids wanting to buy their hats for obvious reasons) and they were in the game vs Kentucky so I'm just guessing he gets something out of his players as a head coach..........