Scheduling - time for a rethink?

[polycom]

We play *1* good opponent at XL this year.

Does that make that much of a difference?

So which one isn't good W State or Nova?

 

[August_West]

Wichita State or Villanova?

Witchita St is in our conference

 

[8893]

Wichita State or Villanova?

So which one isn't good W State or Nova?

I believe he meant OOC.

 

[August_West]

I believe he meant OOC.

Because a conference mate is coming either way.

LOL @ "people"

 

[tdrink]

Witchita St is in our conference

Witchita St. runs it’s program like a high mid- major.

We are a mid- major now but still act like a P5 in many respects.

High mid - majors can schedule tough early because they return players who understand their role from the previous year.

We are turning over the lineup every year and have fresh faces that aren’t used to playing together so we lose while working on gelling and the season seems lost by the time things should be coming together.

Need to recruit program guys and rebuild from the ground up.

 

[August_West]

Sure I suppose you could have that opinion.

What weight do you give it? 5%?

Thank you.

Thats a fair question. But a tough one to answer.

I think 5% is in the range on the low end on the high end I might put it as high as 20% for the mental make up of this years team and all the frosh.

Somewhere between 5-20%.

Its easier to say in retrospect, Ill grant that.

But I think no matter what your opinion of this team and Kevin Ollie is, I think we can all universally agree that this team is shell shocked.

 

[whaler11]

Its not THE problem. we have LOTS of problems. In my opinion its A problem. Thats OK to have that opinion right?


Man people are so stupid these days.

Scaling it back a bit wouldn’t hurt results.

Especially since they get none of these games at home.

 

[Travelman6]

How many OOC does Uconn typically have per season? 12 to 13 games?

Maybe make the first 8 or 9 games super "easy" Coppin St. level games, maybe going up slightly in challenge every 2 games. Similar to what Gtown did. When you are 8-0 or 9-0, regardless of who you play, sometimes it just allows you to have that "swagger" even if unwarranted, that you can carry with you the rest of the season. It is a good way to start the season. Next schedule Cuse or Nova, maybe one other tough OOC, one last tune up and on to AAC play.

Imagine being 10-3 or even 9-4 (even with one bad loss) or 11-2 (beating one of the tough OOC) going into AAC play. It could actually help confidence.

 

[John]

We play *1* good opponent at XL this year.

Does that make that much of a difference?

2 good ones

 

[Waquoit]

Blaming this schedule as "too hard" is just more excuse making for the HC.

 

[ConnHuskBask]

Thank you.

Thats a fair question. But a tough one to answer.

I think 5% is in the range on the low end on the high end I might put it as high as 20% for the mental make up of this years team and all the frosh.

Somewhere between 5-20%.

Its easier to say in retrospect, Ill grant that.

But I think no matter what your opinion of this team and Kevin Ollie is, I think we can all universally agree that this team is shell shocked.

I'm usually a believer that basketball gives you enough games that you can schedule a difficult OOC, but still have enough cupcakes to learn how to win with.

I didn't have high hopes for the squad this season going into the year, but as thin as the roster is and as tough as some of the OOC has been, there's no excuse for all the blow outs. I anticipate we'll see another 20 plus point drubbing this Saturday as well.

 

[Tenspro2002]

How many OOC does Uconn typically have per season? 12 to 13 games?

Maybe make the first 8 or 9 games super "easy" Coppin St. level games, maybe going up slightly in challenge every 2 games. Similar to what Gtown did. When you are 8-0 or 9-0, regardless of who you play, sometimes it just allows you to have that "swagger" even if unwarranted, that you can carry with you the rest of the season. It is a good way to start the season. Next schedule Cuse or Nova, maybe one other tough OOC, one last tune up and on to AAC play.

Imagine being 10-3 or even 9-4 (even with one bad loss) or 11-2 (beating one of the tough OOC) going into AAC play. It could actually help confidence.

The 2007 team started 11-0 and was ranked about #12 after beating a bunch of nobodies in OOC.

Then they started playing real opponents, went 6-14, and never figured it out. A lot of good the cupcake schedule did them...

 

[August_West]

The 2007 team started 11-0 and was ranked about #12 after beating a bunch of nobodies nobodies in OOC.

Then they started playing real opponents, went 6-14, and never figured it out. A lot of good the cupcake schedule did them...

Yeah it did.

We went 17-14 instead of 10-21.

See the point?

 

[auror]

I think finishing top 3 in league with no bad OOC losses gets you in every year. We should be able to do that regardless of Non conference schedule.

Hi from SMU!

Green Bay, SMU headline list of NCAA tournament snubs

"As we looked at SMU, they certainly passed the eye test," Wellman said. "They're a very good team, and they've had a very good year. When you're making these selections, you're looking for differentiators. Is there anything that stands out, either on the positive side or the negative side of the ledger that will cause you to absolutely take that team or really look at prioritizing and selecting other teams? In SMU's case, their downfall, their weakness, was their schedule.

"Their non-conference strength of schedule was ranked No. 302 out of, what do we have, 350 teams eligible for the tournament. It's one of the worst non-conference schedules. Their overall strength of schedule was 129. That would have been by far the worst at-large strength of schedule. The next-worst was 91. Really, the glaring weakness about SMU was their schedule."

...

SMU was ranked in both polls this past week, and it has four victories against top-25 teams this season. But the committee decided to make an example of the Mustangs; its weak non-conference schedule would not be rewarded.

It didn't help, either, that the committee showed little reverence for their conference. Fellow AAC member Louisville is one of the hottest teams in the nation having won 29 games including the AAC championship game, and the Cards earned a No. 4 seed.

SMU finished tied for 3rd in conference W/L record in the strongest year of the conference (by a lot, 5 top 50 KenPom teams, 4 top 30 RPI teams) and didn't get in. Our conference is now worse. This plan will not work.

 

[August_West]

Hi from SMU!

Green Bay, SMU headline list of NCAA tournament snubs



SMU finished tied for 3rd in conference W/L record in the strongest year of the conference (by a lot, 5 top 50 KenPom teams, 4 top 30 RPI teams) and didn't get in. Our conference is now worse. This plan will not work.

Yeah.

Seeing as weve never finished higher than 4th (or is it 5th?) in the AAC, how about we climb that mountain first before worrying about non-conference RPI tournament snubs.

 

[Caronimo]

If anything we need a tougher schedule, especially the home slate.

 

[TouchdownHusky]

The 2007 team started 11-0 and was ranked about #12 after beating a bunch of nobodies in OOC.

Then they started playing real opponents, went 6-14, and never figured it out. A lot of good the cupcake schedule did them...

The '07 team had a bunch of young guys who were not good that first year, but ended up getting UConn to a Final Four. That team had better players period, they ould destroy this year's team. Confrence realignment is what has screwed UConn, not the AAC. And, maybe UConn should get itself back to being a premier progam in the AAC.

 

[VAHuskyFan]

We should absolutely continue scheduling top teams.

It’s the only reason our RPI is as high as it is. Losing to a Top 10 team is actually better than beating an RPI 300 team.

It’s the only thing that gives us a chance for a decent seed in years when we’re good enough to make the tournament.

If our team is terrible, the schedule doesn’t really matter. There’s no non-conference schedule you could draw up to somehow cobble together an at-large resume this year.

It’s a positive for recruiting. And it sells tickets.

The problem is that we are not a good team and there’s just no way to paper that over.

 

[Tenspro2002]

Yeah it did.

We went 17-14 instead of 10-21.

See the point?

Which accomplished what, exactly? The team was still horrible by the end of the year and didn't play in a postseason tournament.

 

[Husky68]

How many OOC does Uconn typically have per season? 12 to 13 games?

Maybe make the first 8 or 9 games super "easy" Coppin St. level games, maybe going up slightly in challenge every 2 games. Similar to what Gtown did. When you are 8-0 or 9-0, regardless of who you play, sometimes it just allows you to have that "swagger" even if unwarranted, that you can carry with you the rest of the season. It is a good way to start the season. Next schedule Cuse or Nova, maybe one other tough OOC, one last tune up and on to AAC play.

Imagine being 10-3 or even 9-4 (even with one bad loss) or 11-2 (beating one of the tough OOC) going into AAC play. It could actually help confidence.

Yeah that really helped the Thabeet freshman year 2006-07 team, until UConn ran into WVU. Were 11-0 OOC and ended up 17-14. The team on the court vs. Memphis could not rebound or pass in addition to not being able to shoot adequately; not sure how easier OOC would have helped. Players on court against Memphis may be capable of playing better but proved they are capable of playing that bad.

 

[Travelman6]

Yeah that really helped the Thabeet freshman year 2006-07 team, until UConn ran into WVU. Were 11-0 OOC and ended up 17-14. The team on the court vs. Memphis could not rebound or pass in addition to not being able to shoot adequately; not sure how easier OOC would have helped. Players on court against Memphis may be capable of playing better but proved they are capable of playing that bad.

Well, when does anything ever work perfectly? Hm? But with this team, or these types, it does generally help to build confidence and beats getting stomped by 15 to 25 practically every other game.

 

[ZenConn]

exactly.

Downgrading the opponents will help.

I see what you are saying - lets play more cup cakes, get an invite, and then let Ollie do his magic and reel off 6 straight!

If we're a blue blood, we'll fill the XL and Gampel no matter who we play. Look at Kentucky's death penalty years and UNCs year that went 8-20.

 

[HuskyHawk]

Ok @August_West , I'll agree that we set a schedule to allow us to, if we won the league, show the committee that we deserved a high seed despite our weaker league. This year it was extra tough because nobody expected Arkansas or Auburn to be this good. We will end up playing two of what I think are the best four teams in the country out of conference.

Clearly, our current goal is not to get a high seed, but to win more than we lose and perhaps qualify for post season play. So yes, until we show that we can do that regularly, we need to dial it back. But, I caution against doing it too much. UConn vs a strong P5 is still a big TV and exposure game, and we need to remain as relevant as we can. It would help if we didn't tank in the actual games of course. So I'd favor a slight adjustment at most.

 

[FfldCntyFan]

How about this. Instead of the geniuses in this thread who say "we can barely beat stony brook" (and dont you realize by saying that you are MAKING MY CASE FOR ME?)

how about someone takes the position on why in our current state of affairs we should be playing such a brutal non conference. explain to me how that has benefited us .

Auggie,

When the schedule was made I doubt those in power thought we would be an inexperienced team. I imagine the thought process was a) the exposure from PK80 would be invaluable and that we would also have been better than most other participants. b) teams like Nova, Cuse, Auburn & even Zona shouldn't be an unreasonable set of non- conference opponents and c) a better non-conference schedule would be necessary considering the current conference.

Obviously things have not worked out as expected.

 

[shizzle787]

Totally disagree. We should do the exact opposite. Out of 13 OOC games, 8-9 should be against big-time competition. You don't become good by playing cupcakes, and you certainly don't bring people into the arena. Oh, and the committee will use playing cupcakes against you. That worked in the Old Big East when we played murderer'a row. We're in the AAC. Enough said.

 

[August_West]

Auggie,

When the schedule was made I doubt those in power thought we would be an inexperienced team. I imagine the thought process was a) the exposure from PK80 would be invaluable and that we would also have been better than most other participants. b) teams like Nova, Cuse, Auburn & even Zona shouldn't be an unreasonable set of non- conference opponents and c) a better non-conference schedule would be necessary considering the current conference.

Obviously things have not worked out as expected.

The way they are front loaded is unreasonable with an inexperienced team.

Notice in OP Im not complaining about Nova scheduling.

PK80 was scheduled two years in advance. I still was all for going, but it didnt help us. It really hurt us. Patrick Ewing pulled out of that tournament. I dont think we shouldve, but I get that thinking.

The rest of the stuff is open ended as far as dates go on home and homes. And while the schedule was the schedule this year, and I get it, my premise is maybe we should look at the overall philosophy of it for a period to help us get back on track. (along with 100 other items)

 

[August_West]

UConn vs a strong P5 is still a big TV and exposure game, and we need to remain as relevant as we can. It would help if we didn't tank in the actual games of course.

Thats the thing.

The waxings we are taking the few times we are in "exposure" games work against the relevancy factor you are referencing. They in fact accelerate its decline.

 

[August_West]

Totally disagree. We should do the exact opposite. Out of 13 OOC games, 8-9 should be against big-time competition. You don't become good by playing cupcakes, and you certainly don't bring people into the arena. Oh, and the committee will use playing cupcakes against you. That worked in the Old Big East when we played murderer'a row. We're in the AAC. Enough said.

Youre insane.


Next poster please.

 

[AdamaNation]

Ive been thinking this for a while, and now that we are in conference it is kind of academic, but something pumpkin head Gillen said made me think it again.

Im wondering if we are actually screwing ourselves by scheduling out of conference so tough with such young, new teams every year.



The original premise behind scheduling a murderers row early every year when we first joined the AAC was the assumption that we were projected to be top of the heap in conference every year and that we would need the non conference RPI bump for tourney seeding. Talk about putting the cart before the horse. That obviously never worked out and has been nothing but a detriment to us because we simply arent good enough early to take anything but a confidence beating out of these games.

Jim Boeheim (and you won't hear me quote this idiot much, but I think it is something I agree with him on, and I think Calhoun did too) has a saying when people criticize Syracuses easy early schedules:

" You don't learn anything by losing except how to lose"

I think back to Calhoun teams especially in the 90's. We feasted on Cupcakes until the conference schedule. We might get one high profile game before conference and then maybe one or two non conference snuck into conference . Dont believe me? go back and look at the schedules. Calhoun very much 'protected' his teams early in season. When Calhoun projected that he would have a team with experience that could benefit from tough early season he would schedule tougher to see where we were at. When he had a young team with new pieces, he preferred cupcakes early. I think that helps a young team. I dont think we gained anything from Michigan St, Arizona, Auburn, Arkansas etc. Villanova is going to wax us, but Im OK with a late January high profile matchup. We used to do late HJan. early Feb matchups all the time under Calhoun. That is an appropriate time to test yourself and always a good break from conference grind. We've had time to gel. We havent gelled, but if we were going to we should've by now. Its being in a hole on December 5th that I find to be a detriment to team development.

Let the kids make mistakes in games we can still win despite mistakes and I think they are a better team in January. I think winning can breed winning. Now here is a major difference between JC and where KO needs to get right or get gone. If we make a mistake in a cupcake game we win, KO needs to be fierce about correcting mistakes. If KO is just content for wins over cupcakes without instilling a system and culture, then it is all for naught. I'v seen KO be content with cupcake wins this year. Not good.


No matter who the coach is next year, Im of the opinion that we should very much lighten our load early season to start rebuilding this team from the ground up. Until we can reach the cycle of sustained success and returning veteran players who have already shown success.

Patrick Ewing was right to clear Georgetown out of PK80 and to start slow with Georgetown this year. While Georgetown is not a good team this year, theyve maximized what they have and have won a couple they shouldnt have and played some decent teams a lot closer than we have and I think that is a direct result of getting some wins under their belt against some bad teams early.

Was the schedule made prior to the revamped roster? I am just asking.

 

[August_West]

Was the schedule made prior to the revamped roster? I am just asking.

Some yes, some no.