ROY: Two Player Race?

[wallman]

As ETT points out, these are 3 different players on 3 different teams, so I don't get the angst toward differing opinions. I personally look at the match ups. Kmac is on a team where she can take her time and develop, Sims had to learn quickly and learned to coexist with Diggins which has been a positive in my books.

 

[easttexastrash]

And don't get me wrong, I think McBride is a tremendous player, but she simply has not been asked to do as much as Sims and Chiney. Could she do more? I'm sure she could, but at this time she is not. And the ROY award should be awarded to the players who are putting up the numbers, not who we "think" is better.

 

[Fightin Choke]

And don't get me wrong, I think McBride is a tremendous player, but she simply has not been asked to do as much as Sims and Chiney. Could she do more? I'm sure she could, but at this time she is not. And the ROY award should be awarded to the players who are putting up the numbers, not who we "think" is better.

McBride is putting up numbers. She's just not putting up numbers in the categories you chose to cite. McBride is 5th in the league in 3FG made and 8th in 3FG%. She is also second among rookies with a PER of 18, while Sims is third with a PER of 17.4 (Chiney leads all rookies in PER: 24.0, which is 5th in the WNBA!) McBride plays far fewer minutes than Sims, and is scoring more points per minute. I guess this is consistent with your comment that Sims is asked to do more than McBride, but it's REALLY hard to score from the bench. McBride also has a higher shooting percentage than Sims (41.6% to 40.3%).

Sims has been on an absolute TEAR lately, but I think she's too far behind Chiney to win the award, as the Shock only have 4 more games to play.

 

[easttexastrash]

McBride is putting up numbers. She's just not putting up numbers in the categories you chose to cite. McBride is 5th in the league in 3FG made and 8th in 3FG%. She is also second among rookies with a PER of 18, while Sims is third with a PER of 17.4 (Chiney leads all rookies in PER: 24.0, which is 5th in the WNBA!) McBride plays far fewer minutes than Sims, and is scoring more points per minute. I guess this is consistent with your comment that Sims is asked to do more than McBride, but it's REALLY hard to score from the bench. McBride also has a higher shooting percentage than Sims (41.6% to 40.3%).

Sims has been on an absolute TEAR lately, but I think she's too far behind Chiney to win the award, as the Shock only have 4 more games to play.

All good points, and I always appreciate a person who provides statistics instead of debathing based on emotion. McBride has a tremendously beautiful jumper and I love watching her on offense. She is one of my favorites.

I agree that Sims slower start put her way too far behind Chiney and that Chiney will walk away with the trophy. But at this point of the season, Sims has developed into the most impactful player of all rookies.

 

[iamcbs]

All good points, and I always appreciate a person who provides statistics instead of debathing based on emotion. McBride has a tremendously beautiful jumper and I love watching her on offense. She is one of my favorites.

I agree that Sims slower start put her way too far behind Chiney and that Chiney will walk away with the trophy. But at this point of the season, Sims has developed into the most impactful player of all rookies.

Not like you're debathing based on emotion with that last statement.

 

[easttexastrash]

Not like you're debathing based on emotion with that last statement.

Stastics seem to be lost on you. You haven't cited any statistical data to support your choice.

I am debating on statistics...basically every major statistic among rookies, other than rebounding. Sims is in the top 10 in three major categories...McBride is not. And I am not talking about top 10 among rookies, I am talking top 10 in the league.

McBride is an auxiliary component for SA, whereas Sims is the point guard with much more pressure on her. She also receives the assignment to guard the top guard on the opposing team, a role with McBride is not asked to fill.

Once again, I think McBride is a tremendous player, but not a serious candidate for ROY.

 

[rocky rococo]

Chiney, a rookie, is undisputed leader of her team and is up to the job. Can't ask more of a player than that, never mind a rookie.

 

[bballnut90]

I might give it to Sims at this point, especially if she continues to impress. In terms of who projects to be the best WNBA player, I'd go with Sims and McBride. Chiney is a fantastic player who will consistently be a double double threat, but Sims and McBride have the ability to take over and absolutely dominate a game.

 

[easttexastrash]

I might give it to Sims at this point, especially if she continues to impress. In terms of who projects to be the best WNBA player, I'd go with Sims and McBride. Chiney is a fantastic player who will consistently be a double double threat, but Sims and McBride have the ability to take over and absolutely dominate a game.

For Chiney I think the only way she is going to get much better is to add a better mid-range and a three pointer if she can do that she has considerable upside.

 

[MarieYLee]

Chiney. Sims has been playing amazing, but Chiney as well (23pts 13 boards and 24/12 all at above 50% shooting). Also, its a season award, and Sims shooting % is not great 40/33.

While I think Sims has more upside (plus she plays PG, and great PG's are rare), I have to give to Chiney. Also, I don't think it unrealistic for Chiney to average 20-10. If she can work on a jumper (doesn't have to be great, just good), improve her FT% a bit (71% now isn't great, but not bad...if she can shoot high 70's/low 80's), than 20 pts is not the far. She really uses her quickness really well on the offensive end, and her ability to grab offensive rebounds will give her the opportunity to score easy baskets or get to the line. I expect Chiney to be among the league leaders in rebounds as she continues to play.

There are only a handful of players that have EVER averaged 20-10. IF she does, she'll be in elite company.

 

[iamcbs]

Stastics seem to be lost on you. You haven't cited any statistical data to support your choice.

I am debating on statistics...basically every major statistic among rookies, other than rebounding. Sims is in the top 10 in three major categories...McBride is not. And I am not talking about top 10 among rookies, I am talking top 10 in the league.

McBride is an auxiliary component for SA, whereas Sims is the point guard with much more pressure on her. She also receives the assignment to guard the top guard on the opposing team, a role with McBride is not asked to fill.

Once again, I think McBride is a tremendous player, but not a serious candidate for ROY.

As a famous coach once said, "statistics are for losers," I can cite stats, 'chapter and verse', but I also know what my eyes tell me. Sims will always put up big numbers, because that's the nature of her game. It always has been, but does she make her team better? I liken this debate to the NBA debate about LBJ and Kevin Durant. They are both tremendous players, and Durant puts up eye-popping numbers, but LBJ wins. He could produce the numbers, as well, if that were his aim. For some players winning is more important than stuffing the stat sheet. Oguwmike will ultimately be ROY based on the hype, but I look forward to the McBride/Sims comparisons in the future. If the WNBA has a future?

 

[easttexastrash]

As a famous coach once said, "statistics are for losers," I can cite stats, 'chapter and verse', but I also know what my eyes tell me. Sims will always put up big numbers, because that's the nature of her game. It always has been, but does she make her team better? I liken this debate to the NBA debate about LBJ and Kevin Durant. They are both tremendous players, and Durant puts up eye-popping numbers, but LBJ wins. He could produce the numbers, as well, if that were his aim. For some players winning is more important than stuffing the stat sheet. Oguwmike will ultimately be ROY based on the hype, but I look forward to the McBride/Sims comparisons in the future. If the WNBA has a future?

Yeah, that is all Sims is...a stat sheet stuffer. She doesn't care at all about winning, just getting her numbers. But I have noticed that when a PG stuffs the stat sheet with both points and assists, their teams seem to benefit.

We will get a good look at McBride and Sims on the same floor tonight. Should be fun to watch.

 

[easttexastrash]

As a famous coach once said, "statistics are for losers," I can cite stats, 'chapter and verse', but I also know what my eyes tell me. Sims will always put up big numbers, because that's the nature of her game. It always has been, but does she make her team better? I liken this debate to the NBA debate about LBJ and Kevin Durant. They are both tremendous players, and Durant puts up eye-popping numbers, but LBJ wins. He could produce the numbers, as well, if that were his aim. For some players winning is more important than stuffing the stat sheet. Oguwmike will ultimately be ROY based on the hype, but I look forward to the McBride/Sims comparisons in the future. If the WNBA has a future?

McBride stuffed the stat sheet last night...with a lot of missed shots, going 3-14.

 

[iamcbs]

McBride stuffed the stat sheet last night...with a lot of missed shots, going 3-14.

What were DT3's stats in that game last night, albeit a win for her team, she played 39 minutes, she was 1-5 from the floor, including 0-4 from 3. She had 4 rebs and 3 assists. This from the player who'll finish 2nd in the MVP race. So lets not base our opinions on a single game. As you said Sims and McBride will be on the same floor tonite, so we shall see.

 

[easttexastrash]

What were DT3's stats in that game last night, albeit a win for her team, she played 39 minutes, she was 1-5 from the floor, including 0-4 from 3. She had 4 rebs and 3 assists. This from the player who'll finish 2nd in the MVP race. So lets not base our opinions on a single game. As you said Sims and McBride will be on the same floor tonite, so we shall see.

Look, I like McBride. I really have nothing ugly to say about her. She is a very good player with a beautiful offensive game. I do not believe her to be a serious candidate for ROY but that does not mean that I do not have the utmost respect for her. She is in a different situation from Sims where she is not asked to carry the team. It is not her fault that her role limits her from ROY contention, it's just the situation that she is in.

And yes, DT will finish second in the MVP balloting. Her recent performances have knocked her out of contention, IMO, starting with the Minny game and followed up by the SA game last night. Maya has proven herself to be the MVP.

 

[easttexastrash]

What were DT3's stats in that game last night, albeit a win for her team, she played 39 minutes, she was 1-5 from the floor, including 0-4 from 3. She had 4 rebs and 3 assists. This from the player who'll finish 2nd in the MVP race. So lets not base our opinions on a single game. As you said Sims and McBride will be on the same floor tonite, so we shall see.

Wait for it, wait for it....Sims' team wins behind Odyssey's 22 points (9-16 shooting), 4 assists and 2 rebounds. She's such a stat stuffer!

McBride chips in 10 points, 2 rebounds and 1 assist for San Antonio.

 

[Fightin Choke]

Wait for it, wait for it....Sims' team wins behind Odyssey's 22 points (9-16 shooting), 4 assists and 2 rebounds. She's such a stat stuffer!

McBride chips in 10 points, 2 rebounds and 1 assist for San Antonio.

Sims shot 56.3% in 38 minutes, scoring .58 pts/min.

McBride shot 55.6% in 21 minutes, scoring .48 pts/min.

The difference in minutes also makes the assist and rebound numbers basically even (on a per minute basis).

Because of Bebe's injury, Sims has played tons of minutes this season, and her body has not shown any signs of fatigue, as her quality and quantity of her contributions has actually improved as the season has progressed. She's a remarkable specimen, that's for sure! If the season had 10 more regular season games, I think she could catch Chiney for ROY. It still may happen with 3 more incredible games possible, unless she was seriously injured in that Adams collision that caused her to leave the game near the end.

 

[easttexastrash]

Sims shot 56.3% in 38 minutes, scoring .58 pts/min.

McBride shot 55.6% in 21 minutes, scoring .48 pts/min.

The difference in minutes also makes the assist and rebound numbers basically even (on a per minute basis).

Because of Bebe's injury, Sims has played tons of minutes this season, and her body has not shown any signs of fatigue, as her quality and quantity of her contributions has actually improved as the season has progressed. She's a remarkable specimen, that's for sure! If the season had 10 more regular season games, I think she could catch Chiney for ROY. It still may happen with 3 more incredible games possible, unless she was seriously injured in that Adams collision that caused her to leave the game near the end.

Good point that Sims should also be commended for playing almost the entire game. She runs the point and chases the opposing teams best guard for almost the entire game without ever getting tired.

Odyssey loves to play the game just about as much as any other player I've watched.

 

[bballnut90]

As a famous coach once said, "statistics are for losers," I can cite stats, 'chapter and verse', but I also know what my eyes tell me. Sims will always put up big numbers, because that's the nature of her game. It always has been, but does she make her team better? I liken this debate to the NBA debate about LBJ and Kevin Durant. They are both tremendous players, and Durant puts up eye-popping numbers, but LBJ wins. He could produce the numbers, as well, if that were his aim. For some players winning is more important than stuffing the stat sheet. Oguwmike will ultimately be ROY based on the hype, but I look forward to the McBride/Sims comparisons in the future. If the WNBA has a future?

Not quite accurate--until her senior year, Sims never averaged more than 15ppg. When she was a 1st Team All American she only averaged 12-13ppg.

 

[easttexastrash]

Not quite accurate--until her senior year, Sims never averaged more than 15ppg. When she was a 1st Team All American she only averaged 12-13ppg.

This is accurate. She was never a high volume shooter/scorer until her senior year when that is what Mulkey asked of her. Before that her numbers were very modest as her role was to get the ball to BG and the rest of that senior class. Sims took an overall average team to the Elite 8 where Baylor lost to a better team.

The Shock also has more wins than they have had since moving to Tulsa. It is no coincidence that this happened with Sins on the roster.

I'm not sure where IAMBCS's dislike/disrespect comes from but it is clouding your ability to recognize what a great player she is.

 

[iamcbs]

This is accurate. She was never a high volume shooter/scorer until her senior year when that is what Mulkey asked of her. Before that her numbers were very modest as her role was to get the ball to BG and the rest of that senior class. Sims took an overall average team to the Elite 8 where Baylor lost to a better team.

The Shock also has more wins than they have had since moving to Tulsa. It is no coincidence that this happened with Sins on the roster.

I'm not sure where IAMBCS's dislike/disrespect comes from but it is clouding your ability to recognize what a great player she is.

I don't disrespect or dislike Sims, I recognize her talents and abilities, based on the eye test I simply believe Kayla McBride is a superior player. If you believe that to be disrespect then that's not my issue. This continuing debate won't be settled in this Forum, you will always believe Odyssey Sims to be a better player than McBride. I believe the opposite, let us agree to disagree and move on?

 

[easttexastrash]

I don't disrespect or dislike Sims, I recognize her talents and abilities, based on the eye test I simply believe Kayla McBride is a superior player. If you believe that to be disrespect then that's not my issue. This continuing debate won't be settled in this Forum, you will always believe Odyssey Sims to be a better player than McBride. I believe the opposite, let us agree to disagree and move on?

I love moving on. All of my exes made me get used to that concept.