Rothstein: UConn and Big East have had discussions

[FDNY99]

I'm not comparing UConn to ND - you are... If you read closely I assume nothing about ND (nor BYU for that matter).
In terms of the other schools, I don't think this is a dream as you state it. Schools have to play other FBS schools (no matter if conference affiliated or not) to up their RPI to get to bowl games/better bowl games - of which there will be less of in the future not more, so playing the sisters of the poor will no longer cut it like it has for the past few decades. Perhaps you could do some of your own research before using broad statements.
Again, I am not saying that UConn will go Indie, I am just saying it is more viable than some people think.

You most certainly did mention ND..you put them in your group of "Indie" schools! It's Indy by the way. I'm not doing anything...you put ND on your list...you get my response! Here is the deal..if UConn leaves the AAC there is no way in hell that they get "qualified" as a opponent for the P-5 conferences. That means they basically get classified as a non-P-5 or FCS level opponent. It also means it will be hard to fill in a schedule...don't believe me take a close look at how hard it is for UMass and BYU. I don't get guys like you..let's go Indy in football...leave the AAC and not come up with a solid plan where the buyout $$ will come from. But hey it makes for good posts in here so it may as well be a good idea. You sound like a disgruntled hoops fan who wants nothing more than to get back old rivalries even if it means getting back into bed with the exact same schools that left the football playing schools. And for the record I too and a season ticket holder.

 

[coachcap]

They are not wrong... I think pretending to be a football school is jeopardizing basketball. UConn cannot risk becoming a non factor in basketball.

You have to listen to the segment. Childers ended his spew with "UConn wasn't even playing FBS 1-A football 10 years ago". He is a lifelong avowed Notre Dame fan who attended Middle Tennessee State for college. His ongoing agenda is to push for separation of the P-5 from the G-5 with G-5 having its own playoffs and, in essence, becoming the new Division 1-AA.

 

[coachcap]

They are not wrong... I think pretending to be a football school is jeopardizing basketball. UConn cannot risk becoming a non factor in basketball.

And it's not pretention. UConn wants to become an excellent football school. Your assumption that football will jeopardize basketball is grossly inaccurate.

 

[brasssbonanzaa]

Indy in football is a 100% nonstarter as is the MAC/C-USA. If we have to go either route, moving to the Big East is a terrible idea.

 

[CTFAN4LIFE]

You most certainly did mention ND..you put them in your group of "Indie" schools! It's Indy by the way. I'm not doing anything...you put ND on your list...you get my response! Here is the deal..if UConn leaves the AAC there is no way in hell that they get "qualified" as a opponent for the P-5 conferences. That means they basically get classified as a non-P-5 or FCS level opponent. It also means it will be hard to fill in a schedule...don't believe me take a close look at how hard it is for UMass and BYU. I don't get guys like you..let's go Indy in football...leave the AAC and not come up with a solid plan where the buyout $$ will come from. But hey it makes for good posts in here so it may as well be a good idea. You sound like a disgruntled hoops fan who wants nothing more than to get back old rivalries even if it means getting back into bed with the exact same schools that left the football playing schools. And for the record I too and a season ticket holder.

We can agree to disagree... I did list ND as an Indie (to me Indy is the 500 or the city in Indiana, lol) but I did not assume we would be able to schedule them at all. And, yes, I did look into the BYU and UMass schedules and because I believe is more comparable to BYU than UMass I think they can schedule more like BYU than UMass.

You make a lot of assumptions about scheduling classifications and base everything off of that. Can you enlighten me about how classifications work?

Buyouts can happen in various ways (e.g. MD and others) and if there is motivation/$$ down the road then they can happen easily than what appears on the surface.

I am not disgruntled at all - I have UConn at a whole (athletically and academically) in my heart. We need to protect and grow the entire AD and I think the better outcome is ACC or B10 but those are not imminent and so I am thinking of alternative pathways to getting into one of them before I die, lol.

 

[brasssbonanzaa]

And it's not pretention. UConn wants to become an excellent football school. Your assumption that football will jeopardize basketball is grossly inaccurate.

I don't think the thought is (or it at least shouldn't be) that football is the one jeopardizing basketball, it's the league we're in that's jeopardizing basketball. The AAC is a good home for our football program right now and one where we can build a solid reputation against good competition in the hopes of snagging a P5 spot down the line.

The AAC is a terrible home for our basketball program and has moved us back in stature to a glorified mid-major. It's harmed attendance, likely hindered recruiting, and has definitely affected our NCAA Tournament seeding. At best, the AAC is the 7th best league in the country. The previous three years it finished 8th in conference RPI. Realistically, SMU, Temple, Memphis, and Cincinnati are good but unspectacular programs. The rest of the league is complete garbage. ECU, Tulane, Houston, USF, UCF, and Tulsa are horrible programs that are no better than those you'd find in the CUSA or WCC. This isn't the competition UConn basketball deserves to be playing against regularly. That's not to say we haven't shot ourselves in the foot a bunch of times losing to them, but playing those teams regularly without any true blue blood programs who are regular national contenders at the top of the league devalues our place in the college basketball world and is moving us back to the level of a formerly great program in a mid-major conference.

 

[FDNY99]

We can agree to disagree... I did list ND as an Indie (to me Indy is the 500 or the city in Indiana, lol) but I did not assume we would be able to schedule them at all. And, yes, I did look into the BYU and UMass schedules and because I believe is more comparable to BYU than UMass I think they can schedule more like BYU than UMass.

You make a lot of assumptions about scheduling classifications and base everything off of that. Can you enlighten me about how classifications work?

Buyouts can happen in various ways (e.g. MD and others) and if there is motivation/$$ down the road then they can happen easily than what appears on the surface.

I am not disgruntled at all - I have UConn at a whole (athletically and academically) in my heart. We need to protect and grow the entire AD and I think the better outcome is ACC or B10 but those are not imminent and so I am thinking of alternative pathways to getting into one of them before I die, lol.

The P-5 schools have approved schools from the AAC and other G-5 schools as opponents because they are eligible to make the Playoff (will it ever happen...I don't think so...IMHO Houston had the lone shot this year and couldn't pull it off by going undefeated). BYU has had a tough time with this. Bowl tie-in's are also going to be a major issue as well. Look the AAC isn't a ideal conference what-so-ever. But it is what it is. Football wise it is better top to bottom than the old BE except aside from Temple and Navy it lacks regional rivals. The Catholic schools bailed on the football schools and created this issue not the other way around. Going Indy, joining the NBE and paying buyout $$ to the AAC isn't the way to solidify the AD for the future. The way to do that is what DB is doing now, hire a coach who has had success on the football field and knows how to win at a school like UConn, invest in facilities that haven't had a dime put into them, and use basketball to schedule high end doc opponents.

 

[CTFAN4LIFE]

The P-5 schools have approved schools from the AAC and other G-5 schools as opponents because they are eligible to make the Playoff (will it ever happen...I don't think so...IMHO Houston had the lone shot this year and couldn't pull it off by going undefeated). BYU has had a tough time with this. Bowl tie-in's are also going to be a major issue as well. Look the AAC isn't a ideal conference what-so-ever. But it is what it is. Football wise it is better top to bottom than the old BE except aside from Temple and Navy it lacks regional rivals. The Catholic schools bailed on the football schools and created this issue not the other way around. Going Indy, joining the NBE and paying buyout $$ to the AAC isn't the way to solidify the AD for the future. The way to do that is what DB is doing now, hire a coach who has had success on the football field and knows how to win at a school like UConn, invest in facilities that haven't had a dime put into them, and use basketball to schedule high end doc opponents.

I hear what you are saying and agree with a good bit of it, but where we differ is that I don't believe we can afford to risk decay of the men's BB program much longer because it has the greatest upside potential of any of our athletic programs to generate national prominence/respect/dollars. If we let that slip away (and it is certainly slipping to a very noticeable degree) in lieu of the AAC being the best place to park our FB program (which is debatable), then I think we risk seeing our greatest asset tumble and our FB program also being pedestrian as well. To get out of the predicament, we have to be willing to take a bit of a risk with FB and make sure that BB is on very solid ground. It's ok if we disagree.

 

[FDNY99]

I hear what you are saying and agree with a good bit of it, but where we differ is that I don't believe we can afford to risk decay of the men's BB program much longer because it has the greatest upside potential of any of our athletic programs to generate national prominence/respect/dollars. If we let that slip away (and it is certainly slipping to a very noticeable degree) in lieu of the AAC being the best place to park our FB program (which is debatable), then I think we risk seeing our greatest asset tumble and our FB program also being pedestrian as well. To get out of the predicament, we have to be willing to take a bit of a risk with FB and make sure that BB is on very solid ground. It's ok if we disagree.

My issue with hoops is this...outside of his NC run..Ollie hasn't been anything more than average. He needs to step it up. This year can be chalked up to the injury bug and is an aberration. Let's hope next year is another story.

 

[brasssbonanzaa]

My issue with hoops is this...outside of his NC run..Ollie hasn't been anything more than average. He needs to step it up. This year can be chalked up to the injury bug and is an aberration. Let's hope next year is another story.

That's not an unfair assessment - though his first year has to be thrown out, if not a feather in his hat for snagging 20 wins out of that team. 14-15 was definitely way below expectations, 15-16 was good but unspectacular. Though you have to wonder what our seed is if we have the same record coming out of the Big East instead of the AAC, I have to believe it's on the 6-7 line and we're not playing Kansas in the second round. Show me a 24-win Big East Tournament champion who was seeded ninth, I can't think of one. We'll see what he can pull out of the 7-8 guys he has this year, but the sum of all years comes out to on par with a lot of Calhoun's late 2000s-2010 teams. One enormous result, a couple of good ones, a couple of substandard ones.

 

[CTFAN4LIFE]

That's not an unfair assessment - though his first year has to be thrown out, if not a feather in his hat for snagging 20 wins out of that team. 14-15 was definitely way below expectations, 15-16 was good but unspectacular. Though you have to wonder what our seed is if we have the same record coming out of the Big East instead of the AAC, I have to believe it's on the 6-7 line and we're not playing Kansas in the second round. Show me a 24-win Big East Tournament champion who was seeded ninth, I can't think of one. We'll see what he can pull out of the 7-8 guys he has this year, but the sum of all years comes out to on par with a lot of Calhoun's late 2000s-2010 teams. One enormous result, a couple of good ones, a couple of substandard ones.

I have my doubts about the Assistants on this staff. Jury is out on Kevin. The next 18 months will be very key to knowing.

 

[FDNY99]

I have my doubts about the Assistants on this staff. Jury is out on Kevin. The next 18 months will be very key to knowing.

Cant be put any better than this!

 

[gampelcrazies]

Not saying it's going to happen but I believe that UConn will be in the New Big East for basketball and AAC for football in the future.

 

[upstater]

I have my doubts about the Assistants on this staff. Jury is out on Kevin. The next 18 months will be very key to knowing.

To knowing what? KO just signed a new 5 year contract.

 

[CTFAN4LIFE]

To knowing what? KO just signed a new 5 year contract.

To knowing whether he can sustain national prominence (given the uphill battle of being in the AAC).

 

[upstater]

To knowing whether he can sustain national prominence (given the uphill battle of being in the AAC).

18 months aren't going to tell you anything other than whether or not they can rebound from next year. As for national prominence, they could be 26-4 and ranked 8 next year, then fall off the next year when Jalen Adams leaves.

Regardless, Ollie is going to cycle through his classes and have breakout years when they stick together. So far, Caliparis one-and-dones haven't done anything for the fanbase than that 1 national championship with the superstar stud of a player. UConn is going to make a run every 3 or 4 years as always.

 

[CTFAN4LIFE]

18 months aren't going to tell you anything other than whether or not they can rebound from next year. As for national prominence, they could be 26-4 and ranked 8 next year, then fall off the next year when Jalen Adams leaves.

Regardless, Ollie is going to cycle through his classes and have breakout years when they stick together. So far, Caliparis one-and-dones haven't done anything for the fanbase than that 1 national championship with the superstar stud of a player. UConn is going to make a run every 3 or 4 years as always.

18 months will tell us whether KO and the staff can coach players "up" - I have seen little evidence of this in his tenure (yes, there have been a few examples, but this is not a strength of this staff). Personally I think a few staff changes need to be made and at least bring in someone with success improving big men.

18 months will give us one more crank of the wheel to see if we can overcome brutal AAC SOS/RPI issues.

18 months will tell us whether we can get back to winning percentages in the range of the low-700's versus where we have been in the 680's under KO.

18 months will inform us of another recruiting class and whether we can get another top-25 recruiting class. I think we can and we need it, but let's see. Top players want to play in top leagues and the AAC is not that.

18 months will tell us about home game AAC attendance. Can supposed winning overcome lame opponents?

They could, as you noted above, be 26-4 next year, but they also could be 21-9 (which is a .700 clip and not bad). I love Jalen and I think he can be a decent NBA'er but I don't think his departure will create a deep drop off (given what else they will have on the roster).

The next 18 months may cement whether we are operating as a top-40 program in a very pedestrian BB conference or operating as a top-20 program in a very pedestrian BB conference. Big difference in my book. And as fickle as the many within the CT sports crowd can be with many "local"pro sports options, we can't slip into top-40 level.

 

[upstater]

18 months will tell us whether KO and the staff can coach players "up" - I have seen little evidence of this in his tenure (yes, there have been a few examples, but this is not a strength of this staff). Personally I think a few staff changes need to be made and at least bring in someone with success improving big men.

18 months will give us one more crank of the wheel to see if we can overcome brutal AAC SOS/RPI issues.

18 months will tell us whether we can get back to winning percentages in the range of the low-700's versus where we have been in the 680's under KO.

18 months will inform us of another recruiting class and whether we can get another top-25 recruiting class. I think we can and we need it, but let's see. Top players want to play in top leagues and the AAC is not that.

18 months will tell us about home game AAC attendance. Can supposed winning overcome lame opponents?

They could, as you noted above, be 26-4 next year, but they also could be 21-9 (which is a .700 clip and not bad). I love Jalen and I think he can be a decent NBA'er but I don't think his departure will create a deep drop off (given what else they will have on the roster).

The next 18 months may cement whether we are operating as a top-40 program in a very pedestrian BB conference or operating as a top-20 program in a very pedestrian BB conference. Big difference in my book. And as fickle as the many within the CT sports crowd can be with many "local"pro sports options, we can't slip into top-40 level.

He has coached many players up. In the past. On this team. You think Jalen Adams isn't getting great coaching? Really? Kid is improving leaps and bounds. AND, you're not going to get a top 25 recruiting class with 2 scholarships and a stacked team. Ain't going to happen. Calhoun was similar in that regard. Go back and look at the rankings in the 2000s. There were many off years. And attendance? How is that relevant?

 

[uchusky32]

He has coached many players up. In the past. On this team. You think Jalen Adams isn't getting great coaching? Really? Kid is improving leaps and bounds. AND, you're not going to get a top 25 recruiting class with 2 scholarships and a stacked team. Ain't going to happen. Calhoun was similar in that regard. Go back and look at the rankings in the 2000s. There were many off years. And attendance? How is that relevant?

CV and VJ seem to to getting much better. I guess KO has nothing to do with that.

 

[CTFAN4LIFE]

He has coached many players up. In the past. On this team. You think Jalen Adams isn't getting great coaching? Really? Kid is improving leaps and bounds. AND, you're not going to get a top 25 recruiting class with 2 scholarships and a stacked team. Ain't going to happen. Calhoun was similar in that regard. Go back and look at the rankings in the 2000s. There were many off years. And attendance? How is that relevant?

My eye test tells me that too many important players in the past few years have not improved much/at all (i.e. Brimah, Purvis)... Guys come in with varying levels of upside - I and most other observers could tell from day one that Adams was one of those guys with a very large amount of natural ability, length, and basketball IQ that would improve over his 3/4 years here almost regardless of who was coaching. Usually 75% of the roster needs to be coached up - and I cannot tell you I am comfortable with this staff's ability to do that especially with the non-point guards.

Agreed that he does not have the chance to bring in 4-5 bodies to get into the top 25 ranking, but you get my drift in terms of the top-25 quality players... What top 75 overall recruit will want to come somewhere where they are unsure about improvements (again, especially the non-guards)? Attendance is related - what top-75 recruit will want to play in front of 7,500 people at XL Center?

My point is that the Assistants are going to be under extreme scrutiny. And KO is the man at the helm. AD Dave is going to make sure that the Assistants can get it done. KO can go into anyone's living room and recruit mom/dad/the recruit, but if the Assistants cannot improve the raw material then we have a very large problem.

But, I am going to stop now b/c I think we might have hijacked the original topic.

 

[upstater]

My eye test tells me that too many important players in the past few years have not improved much/at all (i.e. Brimah, Purvis)... Guys come in with varying levels of upside - I and most other observers could tell from day one that Adams was one of those guys with a very large amount of natural ability, length, and basketball IQ that would improve over his 3/4 years here almost regardless of who was coaching. Usually 75% of the roster needs to be coached up - and I cannot tell you I am comfortable with this staff's ability to do that especially with the non-point guards.

Agreed that he does not have the chance to bring in 4-5 bodies to get into the top 25 ranking, but you get my drift in terms of the top-25 quality players... What top 75 overall recruit will want to come somewhere where they are unsure about improvements (again, especially the non-guards)? Attendance is related - what top-75 recruit will want to play in front of 7,500 people at XL Center?

My point is that the Assistants are going to be under extreme scrutiny. And KO is the man at the helm. AD Dave is going to make sure that the Assistants can get it done. KO can go into anyone's living room and recruit mom/dad/the recruit, but if the Assistants cannot improve the raw material then we have a very large problem.

But, I am going to stop now b/c I think we might have hijacked the original topic.

You are exaggerating things.

Look up the real attendance #s. It is not near 7500.

As for the development of non-guards, it's overblown, especially because of Brimah.

Look at Daniels. He developed under Ollie. This year we've seen Vance develop. Giffey developed.

With the guards, we saw Boatright become a player, Napier, etc.

Someone just posted the recruiting classes. Have a look. For every Hilton Armstrong, there were guys who DIDN'T develop. Not every player is going to develop.

 

[dayooper]

18 months will inform us of another recruiting class and whether we can get another top-25 recruiting class. I think we can and we need it, but let's see. Top players want to play in top leagues and the AAC is not that.

The top players want to play where they get to the NBA, nothing more, nothing less. If a kid thinks his best shot at getting to the NBA is to play at UConn, they will go there. Kentucky consistently has the one of top recruiting classes despite being in the worst P5 basketball conference year in and year out. Why? Because Kentucky's kids go to the NBA. The perception is that Calapari prepares those kids for the NBA in one year and they will be first round locks.

If playing the best competition is what these kids want, than the other ACC schools besides UNC and Duke would be loaded, but they aren't.

 

[billybud]

The ACC is competitive this year...Kenpom has five conference teams in the Top 20 in RPI....