Roscoe or Daniels at 3 ? | The Boneyard

Roscoe or Daniels at 3 ?

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gibhunter

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From what I've read about Daniels it appears he is an instant impact, game changing scorer to be likely 1 and done. Then ProAm came and I read that he is a role player on this year's team. Has anyone seen him scrimmage? What kind of player is he?
 
I have watched a few of his games online and he is so far from a role player it is stupid. He could be talented enough that R Smith is is fighting for time by mid-season and you would have to be a future NBA player to take any big minutes away form R Smith this year. He can shoot the ball well from any range- very good at creating his own shot and has a great handle. He MAY be good enough to give J Lamb some time off at the two- that's how good he could be. Really there is no weakness but youth- that why Dook, Uk and Texas were all over this kid for several years before he came to UCONN.

Roscoe will start- I would be very very surprised if DD started over RS unless RS was hurt or had a really bad few games but last year he had to be one of the hardest working players on the floor every game- love the kid.

I might add that while Boat will not start this year- just like Bazz did not start last year- he really looks a lot like Kemba in his HS tapes. We picked up 2 errrrrrrr 3 really good players.
 
having an offensive weapon off the bench is huge.

Boatright can really pass.
 
I think Daniels will start when all is said and done. He will prove to be a more versatile player.
 
gibhunter said:
From what I've read about Daniels it appears he is an instant impact, game changing scorer to be likely 1 and done. Then ProAm came and I read that he is a role player on this year's team. Has anyone seen him scrimmage? What kind of player is he?
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I have said it before that ballhandling could be an issue with this team. I would not write Giffey off just yet.
 
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nelsonmuntz said:
I have said it before that ballhandling could be an issue with this team. I would not write Giffey off just yet.
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ball handling? Shabazz, boatright, Lamb, potentially Giffey can all ball handle, dont see much issue
 
I think Daniels will have a slightly better handle then Scoe but I wouldn't be expecting him to beat people off the dribble at least not this year. Keep in mine that some of the recruiting sites listed him as a Power Forward.
 
I love the idea of Daniels coming off the bench and giving us a scoring lift and size. He will be a match-up nightmare for the competition - replace length with length
 
gibhunter said:
From what I've read about Daniels it appears he is an instant impact, game changing scorer to be likely 1 and done. Then ProAm came and I read that he is a role player on this year's team. Has anyone seen him scrimmage? What kind of player is he?
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Roscoe will likely start at the beginning of the season, he earned that last year. In fact he may start all season no matter how good Daniels is. However, that doesn't mean Daniels won't earn "starter minutes". Roscoe can be a bit erratic from the three point line and hasn't shown he can beat his man off the dribble. Daniels may be better in both these areas. We'll see.
 
Roscoe will start...his toughness, defense, rebounding will be needed...DD will have to earn minutes and it usually takes frosh a month or so to adjust to college speed etc. I think by Jan he'll be a factor, but off the bench, maybe he and Boat coming off bench, both getting 18-20 min.
 
Roscoe should start, there is nothing wrong with coming off the bench, there are alot of notable freshmen that came of the bench before, Marvin Williams 05 UNC, Maggette 99 Duke, for us Ray, Charlie, Rudy, Kemba. We have enough scorers in the starting lineup we need some scorers off the bench which we would have in Boat and DD, and whos to say AD wont come off the bench at all this year I doubt it though.
 
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From what I heard Giffey did very well in Europe if he can get his confidence back then you never know he could get big minutes at the three.
 
I'm guessing Roscoe starts at the three and divides his time between the 3 and 4. DD and NG will be behind RS and will also play the 2.

But this is situational, like the QB situation with UConn football. The staff will be experimenting with this team well into mid season. The situation was much more predictable when Ryan was the only incoming freshman. Things have changed dramatically with the addition of DD and AD.
 
Roscoe will start, but his shot needs to be more consistent and his handle needs to get much better if he is to keep playing the three. He's a 3/4 tweener right now. Defense, effort, rebounding, his length, and hopefully a more consistent jumper keep him on the court.
 
Letsgohuskies11 said:
ball handling? Shabazz, boatright, Lamb, potentially Giffey can all ball handle, dont see much issue
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Lamb was getting defended by the other team's 3 or big 3rd guard most of the time. He didn't have to handle the ball against tough on the ball defenders or help out much on traps, because there were 2 points on the court most of the time. Handling the ball against Jimmy Butler, who would be more concerned by the blow by, or against Johnson-Odom, who is going for the steal off the dribble, are two very different things.

We also lose Jamal Coombs-McDaniel, who generally made good decisions with the ball once he got it. Giffey doesn't need to be a point forward, but Scoe, Oriakhi and Drummond on the court at once will lead to some turnovers unless one or more of them has stepped up their game over the summer. Once again, we are going to see a steady diet of zone defenses unless our forwards make good decisions with the ball in the half court.
 
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Roscoe is the over looked man. Hopefully, he uses it as motivation and has a great year. I think he will. He definitely will have an integral role.
 
nelsonmuntz said:
I have said it before that ballhandling could be an issue with this team. I would not write Giffey off just yet.
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I like Giffey, and think he will be a good player for us, but he was terrifying to watch at times with the ball in his hands. I wouldn't say he's any better handling the ball than Lamb, Daniels, Boatright, or Shabazz.
 
UCweCONN said:
I think Daniels will start when all is said and done. He will prove to be a more versatile player.
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I don't but I think that he'll get "starter's minutes" which is more important when all is said and done. That, by the way. is the much tougher question. How do you divide the minutes? I haven't tried, yet, but I think that could be in a situation where our guys are going to be pretty fresh come "winning time." I also think that this team would be vulnerable due to one players slump. There are just too many weapons.
 
What people seem to be forgetting a bit here, and what everybody who is trying to say Kentucky or UNC is clearly better than Uconn is forgetting, is the defensive side of things. Roscoe was terrific defensively last year, whether he was asked to play the 3 against a traditional small forward, cover a point forward in Tobias Harris, or defend the paint against a bruiser. He had the strength to defend the 4s and the quickness to defend the 3s. He is, quite possibly, our best defender.

If DD doesn't defend quite as well, I'd be willing to bet Roscoe gets the majority of minutes. With him in the lineup, our defense is going to be even better than it was at the end of last season, when we were probably the best defensive team in the nation.
 
Rico444 said:
What people seem to be forgetting a bit here, and what everybody who is trying to say Kentucky or UNC is clearly better than Uconn is forgetting, is the defensive side of things. Roscoe was terrific defensively last year, whether he was asked to play the 3 against a traditional small forward, cover a point forward in Tobias Harris, or defend the paint against a bruiser. He had the strength to defend the 4s and the quickness to defend the 3s. He is, quite possibly, our best defender.

If DD doesn't defend quite as well, I'd be willing to bet Roscoe gets the majority of minutes. With him in the lineup, our defense is going to be even better than it was at the end of last season, when we were probably the best defensive team in the nation.
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cough, cough, agreed. ;)

WingU-Conn said:
Roscoe will start, but his shot needs to be more consistent and his handle needs to get much better if he is to keep playing the three. He's a 3/4 tweener right now. Defense, effort, rebounding, his length, and hopefully a more consistent jumper keep him on the court.[/quote]
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i'm not sure that starting makes that much of a difference. we all know JC can have a pretty quick hook. unless DD substiantially outplays RS in practices, i can't see JC switching it up much. then again, he flipped starting Okwandu or Olander several times until he felt he got it right.

i think it will be more telling come January who gets more minutes. and it can only help Roscoe and the team. if Roscoe improves more by having to play against DD and having him look over his shoulder, they it's great for Roscoe. if DD ends up being that good that he takes the starters job away from RS, then it's an indication of just how good DeAndre is...
 
nelsonmuntz said:
Lamb was getting defended by the other team's 3 or big 3rd guard most of the time. He didn't have to handle the ball against tough on the ball defenders or help out much on traps, because there were 2 points on the court most of the time.
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I think you are off here. There were many times that Lamb got the ball when teams were trapping and had to bring the ball up against the 1 or 2 guard or a combination of the 1, 2 or 3 and he almost never turned it over. It never looked pretty and while I would say visually, he doesn't have the chops to handle the ball, he got the job done on a very regular and consistant basis against 1 or 2 or combinations. Lamb can handle. 52 turnovers to 66 assists from a 2 guard is something we could only have hoped for with Dyson (and I really liked Dyson).
 
jleves said:
I think you are off here. There were many times that Lamb got the ball when teams were trapping and had to bring the ball up against the 1 or 2 guard or a combination of the 1, 2 or 3 and he almost never turned it over. It never looked pretty and while I would say visually, he doesn't have the chops to handle the ball, he got the job done on a very regular and consistant basis against 1 or 2 or combinations. Lamb can handle. 52 turnovers to 66 assists from a 2 guard is something we could only have hoped for with Dyson (and I really liked Dyson).
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I agree. I think a lot of people don't understand how good Lamb's handle is, especially for his size.
Also ( sort of a tangent here) some of the draft "experts" have questioned Lamb's dribble (as though it was actually a liability) because they saw how much he was used off the ball. They operated on the assumption that his handle wasn't very good because of how he was used in the offense. These same people applied this logic to question Kemba's point guard skills (because of how much time he played off the ball last season).
Lamb has rapidly become more comfortable off the bounce and I think people are going to be extremely surprised with the progress he's made on this front.
 
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jleves said:
I think you are off here. There were many times that Lamb got the ball when teams were trapping and had to bring the ball up against the 1 or 2 guard or a combination of the 1, 2 or 3 and he almost never turned it over. It never looked pretty and while I would say visually, he doesn't have the chops to handle the ball, he got the job done on a very regular and consistant basis against 1 or 2 or combinations. Lamb can handle. 52 turnovers to 66 assists from a 2 guard is something we could only have hoped for with Dyson (and I really liked Dyson).
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I agree with your assessment of Jeremy.

Jerome actually had an A/T ratio of 76/49 his junior year when he played the 2 and AJ was the 1. Those were very good numbers. Your argument still holds. Jeremy as a freshman was not much worse than a very good junior JD.
 
People forget that Roscoe was our big recruit one year ago. He had streaks last year when he made bunches of 3's at a clip. He's 1 year into his career with a huge upside. Now I bet he spent a lot of time on his shot and we could see a different shooter this year. Defensively he's tenacious, so until I see what Daniels is I give the nod to a seasoned Roscoe for both starting and minutes. How do you let a freshman get minutes over a guy who has performed as well as Roscoe unless he's superman? It might mess with his psyche.
 
jibsey said:
People forget that Roscoe was our big recruit one year ago. He had streaks last year when he made bunches of 3's at a clip. He's 1 year into his career with a huge upside. Now I bet he spent a lot of time on his shot and we could see a different shooter this year. Defensively he's tenacious, so until I see what Daniels is I give the nod to a seasoned Roscoe for both starting and minutes. How do you let a freshman get minutes over a guy who has performed as well as Roscoe unless he's superman? It might mess with his psyche.
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Good point about Roscoe. Additionally he was the freshmen who demonstrated the best play for the first half of the season. And I believe he played the three during that span. If someone with a better recollection can confirm this, i believe he was shifted over to the four about mid season. At this time JC determined the best combo on the floor was Kemba, Shabazz, Jeremy, Roscoe and Alex. So much of the last part of the season Roscoe was playing out of his natural position. That probably won't be the case this season.
 
jleves said:
I think you are off here. There were many times that Lamb got the ball when teams were trapping and had to bring the ball up against the 1 or 2 guard or a combination of the 1, 2 or 3 and he almost never turned it over. It never looked pretty and while I would say visually, he doesn't have the chops to handle the ball, he got the job done on a very regular and consistant basis against 1 or 2 or combinations. Lamb can handle. 52 turnovers to 66 assists from a 2 guard is something we could only have hoped for with Dyson (and I really liked Dyson).
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If you were right, Jeremy would be waiting for the lockup to end right now.
 
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nelsonmuntz said:
If you were right, Jeremy would be waiting for the lockup to end right now.
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He actually considered going pro last season and was told by the NBA grape vine he could have been a lottery pick. He didn't feel ready to go to the NBA and wanted one more year of development.
 
fleudslipcon said:
He actually considered going pro last season and was told by the NBA grape vine he could have been a lottery pick. He didn't feel ready to go to the NBA and wanted one more year of development.
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Chris Smith barely had an NBA handle, and he could probably still dribble circles around Jeremy Lamb at 41 years old and his current weight. Lamb will get better, and may get there one day, but we should recognize the gap between where Lamb is now and where he needs to be to get to the League as a 2. 2 Guards are not drafted on potential. They have to come ready to play.
 
nelsonmuntz said:
Chris Smith barely had an NBA handle, and he could probably still dribble circles around Jeremy Lamb at 41 years old and his current weight. Lamb will get better, and may get there one day, but we should recognize the gap between where Lamb is now and where he needs to be to get to the League as a 2. 2 Guards are not drafted on potential. They have to come ready to play.
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Smith was a 1. Jeremy is a 2. I would hope Smith's handle is better than Jeremy's. That said, I lean to your way of thinking that the ball handling could be a potential problem for this team if Bazz and Boatright get in foul trouble. However I support jleves argument that Jeremy is a very decent ball handler for a 2g and when he has the support of good 1g's on the floor such as Kemba and/or Shabazz he does a lot of good in creating offense.
 
nelsonmuntz said:
Chris Smith barely had an NBA handle, and he could probably still dribble circles around Jeremy Lamb at 41 years old and his current weight. Lamb will get better, and may get there one day, but we should recognize the gap between where Lamb is now and where he needs to be to get to the League as a 2. 2 Guards are not drafted on potential. They have to come ready to play.
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One additional thing, you may like Nelson more, my son loves Nelson, but your writing astuteness belies the character. You will always be Waylon to me.
 
fleudslipcon said:
Smith was a 1. Jeremy is a 2. I would hope Smith's handle is better than Jeremy's. That said, I lean to your way of thinking that the ball handling could be a potential problem for this team if Bazz and Boatright get in foul trouble. However I support jleves argument that Jeremy is a very decent ball handler for a 2g and when he has the support of good 1g's on the floor such as Kemba and/or Shabazz he does a lot of good in creating offense.
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Chris Smith had a nice handle, but he didn't actually play tons of minutes at the point in Storrs until he had to, which was his senior year. Up 'til then he played beside Tate and then Steve Pikiell. As a Jr., Smith did play some point when Pikiell was not on the floor.
 
alexd. said:
Chris Smith had a nice handle, but he didn't actually play tons of minutes at the point in Storrs until he had to, which was his senior year. Up 'til then he played beside Tate and then Steve Pikiell. As a Jr., Smith did play some point when Pikiell was not on the floor.
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I actually remembered that. I'm just wondering how much his 2g role was a formality. He was a better shooter than Tate. Chris struck me as someone who could have played both positions well. Jeremy strikes me as only being a 2g.
 
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Smh @ there still being a portion of UConn fans who think Jeremy has a poor handle, I can't wait for this season to start so that myth can be put to bed.
 
fleudslipcon said:
Smith was a 1. Jeremy is a 2. I would hope Smith's handle is better than Jeremy's. That said, I lean to your way of thinking that the ball handling could be a potential problem for this team if Bazz and Boatright get in foul trouble. However I support jleves argument that Jeremy is a very decent ball handler for a 2g and when he has the support of good 1g's on the floor such as Kemba and/or Shabazz he does a lot of good in creating offense.
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Smith was definitely a 2 guard more than point. I actually thought he would have a great shot at the pros because of his handle. In college the ball seemed like it was on a string when he dribbled (much to Billy Packer's chagrin at times), but that was at the college level. The pros were a whole different story. Lamb isn't even where Smith was as a college player. He is 5-6 inches taller, which is huge, but he has some work to do.

When I talk about ball-handling, I am thinking in terms of what it will take to get to the Final Four and win a NC with the other tools this team has. If we were just hoping to get a bid, the ball-handling is fine. To win 25 games in the regular season/BET and get a 1 or 2 seed, every aspect of the team has to be very good, or there has to be some outstanding aspects to compensate. The 2006 team only had 1 guy that could even dribble, but it was the best team in the country until the unspeakable happened because it had talented, experienced, prototypes at every position but 2 guard. The team was flirting with disaster because of the ballhandling all season though, and when the interior defense broke down against the Team Which Will Not Be Named, UConn couldn't overcome it.

There are a lot of teams in the Big East that play very good perimeter defense, and Lamb doesn't have two supreme ball handlers like Walker and Napier to carry the load for him anywmore. Much like with the 2006 team, opposing defenses will focus on getting the ball out of our point guard's hands. Marcus Williams was a great college point guard in 2006. Napier is just a good one, and will need some help.

Other than some bizarre assessment earlier in the thread that Giffey is a terrible ballhandler, I think most of us are in agreement that Giffey makes better decisions with the ball than Smith, Oriakhi and (most likely) Drummond. Oriakhi and Drummond will most likely be down low, so it won't matter with them, but Smith is going to be in the Jamal Coombs-McDaniel role (flash to the top of the key or even to the 3 line, catch, and look for the cutter) at times, and against teams like Syracuse, that role is critical. Smith is the same guy that took an 80 foot shot with 10 seconds left on the clock against Texas. Either he has to get a lot smarter in moving the ball around, or Giffey is going to see a lot of playing time.

I will be disappointed if we see a lot of 3 guard, because we have too much talent up front, and I also think that any 3 of Giffey/Smith/Daniels/Oriakhi/Drummond plus Napier and Lamb is our best defensive lineup.
 
nelsonmuntz said:
Smith was definitely a 2 guard more than point. I actually thought he would have a great shot at the pros because of his handle. In college the ball seemed like it was on a string when he dribbled (much to Billy Packer's chagrin at times), but that was at the college level. The pros were a whole different story. Lamb isn't even where Smith was as a college player. He is 5-6 inches taller, which is huge, but he has some work to do.

When I talk about ball-handling, I am thinking in terms of what it will take to get to the Final Four and win a NC with the other tools this team has. If we were just hoping to get a bid, the ball-handling is fine. To win 25 games in the regular season/BET and get a 1 or 2 seed, every aspect of the team has to be very good, or there has to be some outstanding aspects to compensate. The 2006 team only had 1 guy that could even dribble, but it was the best team in the country until the unspeakable happened because it had talented, experienced, prototypes at every position but 2 guard. The team was flirting with disaster because of the ballhandling all season though, and when the interior defense broke down against the Team Which Will Not Be Named, UConn couldn't overcome it.

There are a lot of teams in the Big East that play very good perimeter defense, and Lamb doesn't have two supreme ball handlers like Walker and Napier to carry the load for him anywmore. Much like with the 2006 team, opposing defenses will focus on getting the ball out of our point guard's hands. Marcus Williams was a great college point guard in 2006. Napier is just a good one, and will need some help.

Other than some bizarre assessment earlier in the thread that Giffey is a terrible ballhandler, I think most of us are in agreement that Giffey makes better decisions with the ball than Smith, Oriakhi and (most likely) Drummond. Oriakhi and Drummond will most likely be down low, so it won't matter with them, but Smith is going to be in the Jamal Coombs-McDaniel role (flash to the top of the key or even to the 3 line, catch, and look for the cutter) at times, and against teams like Syracuse, that role is critical. Smith is the same guy that took an 80 foot shot with 10 seconds left on the clock against Texas. Either he has to get a lot smarter in moving the ball around, or Giffey is going to see a lot of playing time.

I will be disappointed if we see a lot of 3 guard, because we have too much talent up front, and I also think that any 3 of Giffey/Smith/Daniels/Oriakhi/Drummond plus Napier and Lamb is our best defensive lineup.
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Absolutely agree with your assessment of the 2006 team.

It appears that most of your concerns for this years team could be addressed if Boatright can step up and either Giffey/DeAndre or Smith can play the three better than was the case last season. If that happens JC can chose which line up to employ depending on opposing teams and what they demonstrate. I agree the default lineup with Shabazz, Jeremy and AO plus any combo of two others is the best line up defensively. UConn will be in a lot of games this season because of defense. It is the offense that has the question marks.
 
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