Positives from the Tulsa Game

[whaler11]

I understand that he is stuck with Anderson because of himself. That doesn't mean we need to criticize him twice for the same mistakes. The roster is what it is and at this point if we're going to evaluate him on this portion of the job then we need to clean the slate of any variables that might distort that picture.

My impression was that the opening lines are typically more accurate than the closing lines. I could be wrong, but either way they were ranked some 20 spots ahead of us on KenPom and those rankings tend to correlate strongly with where the line is opening. I don't think it's unreasonable to assume, especially given how we've plummeted after the Gilbert injury, that the computers were less fond of our chances than that spread might indicate. Now I'll take Vegas over all of them, but the other variables that factored into that spread can't be fully separated from human expectation which brings us back to the idea that people are counting double against Ollie.

The 3 million dollars is just another thing that distracts from the ability to accurately assess his performance as coach. When you start quibbling with how a coach uses a timeouts you're really belaboring the point because although that criticism may be valid in a vacuum it is going to influence your win probability in the long haul by a matter of decimal points. (Incidentally, I remember thinking the same thing as you at the time, but even if we are to assume that Ollie screwed up there it does not diminish the role that luck and variance played in that game). Nobody keeps track of which coaches use timeouts the best. He is bad at other aspects of his job that cause people to displace onto small things like that which is exactly my point. We can think he's guilty and he can be guilty but that doesn't mean he doesn't get a fair trial. He's not getting a fair trial from this board.

You are a good poster even when I’m busting your chops.

I’ll read the rest of your post closer later but as far as lines go: closing line >>>> any line before close.

For a lazy comparison think about a movie released to 3 expert critics versus a movie released to 200 expert critics.

 

[mauconnfan]

we still can't inbound the basketball. it's been five years of not being able to do the simplest thing

We all know that they are awful getting the ball in bounds, totally agree. But when things are good, which they aren't, most fans would be bitching about Jalen being pushed out of bounds, which he was. Everyone gets the ball to the guy they want on the line they did, and he was fouled. Problem also is they got it to him in a bad spot because they don't have good in bounds plays. But the refs make the right call, no one is even talking about any of this.

 

[mauconnfan]

Here are a couple more positives....UConn managed to score only 88 points in 50 minutes of basketball. Jalen Adams, Vital, and Larrier, altogether missed 37 shots during the game. Adam's was 10-25, Vital 8-20, Larrier 7-17. Great shooting guys!!! I hope all three are getting good grades in class and each gets his degree, because at this rate each will need that degree after UConn.

Really? I mean Jalen was really good in this game despite the 15 missed shots, he has to take shots we all wished he would make a higher % but please look at the assists and rebounds especially. Vital worked his tail off and made a couple big shots/plays and Larrier kept us alive in the first half while they were hammering down 3's at a crazy rate. Wished he din't disappear a little late in the game but still, he was the lone reason we were only down 6 at the half and had a fighters chance. Need to be smart about picking your fights rob, you lose this one on this night.

 

[Hankster]

Of course there was positive growth from the players tonight.

Of course the team is getting killed on this board because we came up on the wrong end of a double overtime game.

They played good ball tonight, and I'm sick to my stomach because they deserved to be rewarded for that effort...

Thank you.

 

[Huskymagic]

Ollie makes losing an art form. Then right after he come out with the we're getting better and stronger after each defeat line.

Instead of being honest and humble like a normal person, Pollyannas lie and obfuscate the reality as though they can convince anyone to see their perspective.

Pollyanna coaches produce players who make boneheaded plays and find ways to lose games. Not to mention they get zero respect from officials.

PS: Nothing rings truer than Kelvin Sampson last year, who said "Good Coaching That's What UCONN had"

 

[Hankster]

Really? I mean Jalen was really good in this game despite the 15 missed shots, he has to take shots we all wished he would make a higher % but please look at the assists and rebounds especially. Vital worked his tail off and made a couple big shots/plays and Larrier kept us alive in the first half while they were hammering down 3's at a crazy rate. Wished he din't disappear a little late in the game but still, he was the lone reason we were only down 6 at the half and had a fighters chance. Need to be smart about picking your fights rob, you lose this one on this night.

Hammering down three's is mild. Averaging 7 points a game and you decide..."what the hell, let me go insane on three's" Over 30 points. Also knocked down that 3 to tie the game. Our boys held their top scorer under 10 points all the way to the last couple of minutes and OT. WE should of won that game. If he had played his average for the year, we dominate the game. This seems to be a curse on our boys for a couple of years now. Sure their are problems to resolve, but that 3 point plague seems to hang onto our boys.

 

[Paesano]

Yes, it's a loss, and the W/L is what matters most. Yet, we can see progress in both coaching and playing.

A few items:
- Overall performance: Entering the game, Tulsa was a heavy favorite. Pregame they were about #90 in kenpom. We had been in the 80s before Gilbert went down and were plummeting ever since to #127 pre-game. If you just count the games since Gilbert re-injured the shoulder, we were probably playing Kenpom #180 basketball. With Tulsa having homecourt, you would expect another 10 point loss. But we played them even and had opportunities to win in the final seconds of each period.
- Possibly the coaches take advice from the Boneyard, since much of the gratuitous advice following Wichita State was implemented. Onuorah didn't play, Anderson's minutes were cut in favor of an Adams/Vital/Larrier perimeter, and the young guys Carlton, Whaley, and Diarra benefited with more minutes. Finally, the best players were on the floor and the young forwards were given a chance to develop.
- Some additional offensive plays were introduced and they seemed to help, the team shot 38% from 3 and 43% overall.
- 18 assists, only 7 turnovers. They protected the ball and shared it.
- Whaley! 4-6 from the floor, 7 rebounds, 2 blocks, 1 assist, 0 turnovers, only 2 personal fouls. If he hits his free throws we win. With a year's experience and some muscle, he will be a player. Needs better conditioning, he played 41 minutes and his first 20 were much more productive than his last 20.
- If Carlton and Diarra can cut down the fouls, they'll be much more positive players.
- We are closing in on a 7 player rotation of Adams/Vital/Larrier/Anderson on the perimeter, Whaley/Carlton/Diarra on the interior. A shortened rotation was another fan request and gives them a better chance to develop chemistry.
- If we improve the rebounding and maintain the recent progress, gotta believe this team gets back to the 80s in kenpom which would assure a winning record and an NIT bid. That would be a huge step forward with an infusion of talent coming in next year. (Gilbert, Sid Wilson, Akinjo primarily; probably a new center recruit in the spring; Matthews a good shooter; Kisunas another piece adding depth inside.)

We're on our way forward. Keep faith.

Remember the Columbia "win"? A loss is a loss.

 

[HuskyHawk]

Really? I mean Jalen was really good in this game despite the 15 missed shots, he has to take shots we all wished he would make a higher % but please look at the assists and rebounds especially. Vital worked his tail off and made a couple big shots/plays and Larrier kept us alive in the first half while they were hammering down 3's at a crazy rate. Wished he din't disappear a little late in the game but still, he was the lone reason we were only down 6 at the half and had a fighters chance. Need to be smart about picking your fights rob, you lose this one on this night.

Mostly true. His defense on the perimeter was abysmal. I loved the improvements I saw on offense. More off the ball motion, more cuts and passes, and more open looks knocked down. Still way too many midrange jumpers.

My overall conclusion is the same. Kevin does not really grasp the extent to which college basketball has changed. Not on offense or defense. Tulsa built a lead as we traded 3 points for 2, over and over. We effectively limited Etou on the interior, while consistently over helping and abandoning our man on the perimeter. You simply can’t do that anymore. Priority 1 in every game needs to be to take away the three point shot. Stop sagging! Get your feet on or beyond the line at all times. If they beat you, fine, they will end up with a pull up 2 like we always do. Give it to them. The rebounds don’t bounce out as far and the make rate is about the same as longer shots.

 

[mauconnfan]

Remember the Columbia "win"? A loss is a loss.

Solid response. LOL

 

[mauconnfan]

Mostly true. His defense on the perimeter was abysmal. I loved the improvements I saw on offense. More off the ball motion, more cuts and passes, and more open looks knocked down. Still way too many midrange jumpers.

My overall conclusion is the same. Kevin does not really grasp the extent to which college basketball has changed. Not on offense or defense. Tulsa built a lead as we traded 3 points for 2, over and over. We effectively limited Etou on the interior, while consistently over helping and abandoning our man on the perimeter. You simply can’t do that anymore. Priority 1 in every game needs to be to take away the three point shot. Stop sagging! Get your feet on or beyond the line at all times. If they beat you, fine, they will end up with a pull up 2 like we always do. Give it to them. The rebounds don’t bounce out as far and the make rate is about the same as longer shots.

Again agree to disagree. If you don't think KO and the staff teaches them defense and where they need to be when the ball is on top, opposite etc etc than you're crazy. Every one of these guys get stuck too far from their man, some knowing they are great shooters. Players need to held accountable when on the floor and they all overextend when the ball is opposite, time and time again and get out too late to their guy. Whether it's Adams, Vital or LArrier and Anderson they all suffer from wanting to make plays off their man and getting sucked in. Not a brilliant group of defensive guards for sure. Also why try to block 3's? Best defense outside of being Emeka is standing in his face and getting a hand in his face period. You leave your feet the shooter has all the advantage, they all do it too much. Agree they need to be better but it's been pointed out to them they're just not good students. Should they be punished, sure they should.

 

[pj]

Remember the Columbia "win"? A loss is a loss.

If a loss is a loss, why isn't a "win" a win?

You could argue that luck favored us against Columbia and disfavored us against Tulsa. But if you count those as equivalent game outcomes, we did as well against kenpom (now) #104 Tulsa as we did against #234 Columbia. That's improvement.

I've said this before but it bears repeating: We don't have a point guard (sans Gilbert), we don't have a center, we have freshman forwards and only two guys have played together prior to this season. You don't win in college basketball with such a roster -- it takes experience to build chemistry, big men take time to develop, and you need distributors and shooters and rim protection because the efficient shots are at the rim, 3 pointers, and after breaking down the defense or in transition. Given those roster deficiencies, what we can hope for is to see steady progress in both team execution and player capabilities. We're seeing that. If it continues, next year's team which will have a much more complete roster will be much improved.

 

[huskyrob1]

Really? I mean Jalen was really good in this game despite the 15 missed shots, he has to take shots we all wished he would make a higher % but please look at the assists and rebounds especially. Vital worked his tail off and made a couple big shots/plays and Larrier kept us alive in the first half while they were hammering down 3's at a crazy rate. Wished he din't disappear a little late in the game but still, he was the lone reason we were only down 6 at the half and had a fighters chance. Need to be smart about picking your fights rob, you lose this one on this night.

Yeah really!!! You can spin it anyway you want. 37 missed shots against awesome Tulsa by our three best players are the facts. If they each make two more shots we win easily. This is the worst shooting UConn men's team ever, and if you still think we're are improving, let's talk about Antoine Anderson.

 

[Stinger92860]

Losing to Tulsa again is now a positive for the program. I'm dying here.

 

[KembaStepback]

It closed 2.5 - we don’t need to go by what you ‘saw’.

If you are expecting a ten point game that closes at 2.5 - rest assured you are wrong way more often than right. If your entire premise is built upon the this conceit it can go straight in the trash.

Ollie is stuck with Anderson because of Ollie. Oh poor Kevin has no options: Having a crappy roster isn’t an excuse it’s an indictment.

You can keep trying to tell me I’m not watching a terrible coach with a terrible team in a terrible building - the problem is all the evidence points against you.

Ollie coached them out of a win because he can’t even figure out when to take timeouts. The game turned because he burned a timeout and all he came up with for an inbounds play was turning it over under the basket.

3 million dollars a year to be an anchor to your team, call a stupid timeout, not draw up something that can even get the damn ball inbounds and then have people defend it.

A frigging idiot like me can post in the game thread than calling time out in that spot is a huge mistake and he is so bad it played out that decision cost them the game. Sure I didn’t play college basketball or in the NBA - but I somehow picked up on the value of timeouts.

The inbounds play is on no one but Anderson. It was a bad pass. Period. Blaming Ollie is foolish.

 

[The Funster]

The inbounds play is on no one but Anderson. It was a bad pass. Period. Blaming Ollie is foolish.

Was there any kind of set play called? If not, shame on Ollie. I mean, cmon, he could have just yelled "stack" and they could have run a stack play to get the ball into someone's hands.

 

[DMIL]

Mostly true. His defense on the perimeter was abysmal. I loved the improvements I saw on offense. More off the ball motion, more cuts and passes, and more open looks knocked down. Still way too many midrange jumpers.

My overall conclusion is the same. Kevin does not really grasp the extent to which college basketball has changed. Not on offense or defense. Tulsa built a lead as we traded 3 points for 2, over and over. We effectively limited Etou on the interior, while consistently over helping and abandoning our man on the perimeter. You simply can’t do that anymore. Priority 1 in every game needs to be to take away the three point shot. Stop sagging! Get your feet on or beyond the line at all times. If they beat you, fine, they will end up with a pull up 2 like we always do. Give it to them. The rebounds don’t bounce out as far and the make rate is about the same as longer shots.

Kevin coaches perimeter defense. You simply have a young group of guys that are learning to play together also learning how to play perimeter defense. Lack of consistent player execution is the issue. When you have depth you can yank players out. Unfortunately we do not specifically defensively. These guys are learning.

 

[HuskyHawk]

Again agree to disagree. If you don't think KO and the staff teaches them defense and where they need to be when the ball is on top, opposite etc etc than you're crazy. Every one of these guys get stuck too far from their man, some knowing they are great shooters. Players need to held accountable when on the floor and they all overextend when the ball is opposite, time and time again and get out too late to their guy. Whether it's Adams, Vital or LArrier and Anderson they all suffer from wanting to make plays off their man and getting sucked in. Not a brilliant group of defensive guards for sure. Also why try to block 3's? Best defense outside of being Emeka is standing in his face and getting a hand in his face period. You leave your feet the shooter has all the advantage, they all do it too much. Agree they need to be better but it's been pointed out to them they're just not good students. Should they be punished, sure they should.

I'm not saying he and the staff aren't coaching them. I am sure he tells them what JC would have told them. If you don't have a shot blocker under the hoop, you hedge on the 3, and avoid getting beat going to the hole. Now, Calhoun tried to have shotblockers, and I think he did it because it allowed him to tighten the D on the perimeter.

What I'm saying is that with or without a rim protector, let them get by you if you must, but push them out further and stay closer to the 3 point shots. It is the primary thing you need to take away, not the layups or close shots. It's a philosophical change, in the same way you are seeing NFL teams play mostly nickel now. They used to say "take away the run", force them to throw. It's the opposite now against most teams. And sure, you adjust. Against some teams you will need to guard the rim and give up outside shots. But against 80% of them now, the 3 point shot is the main thing you take away if you can. We did a better job in the second half, and they hit some long and contested shots, but we also gave them some easy ones.

 

[KembaStepback]

Was there any kind of set play called? If not, shame on Ollie. I mean, cmon, he could have just yelled "stack" and they could have run a stack play to get the ball into someone's hands.

Im sure there was a set play called...but there is a defense trying to stop them, you know. Anderson made a bad descision with that pass. It's not on Ollie.

 

[Huskybass]

Kevin coaches perimeter defense. You simply have a young group of guys that are learning to play together also learning how to play perimeter defense. Lack of consistent player execution is the issue. When you have depth you can yank players out. Unfortunately we do not specifically defensively. These guys are learning.

That lack of depth on the perimeter is squarely on KO. He filled 13 scholarships with only 4 guards, with full knowledge that one of those guards has a lengthy history of shoulder issues. So we now play with 3 guards who are likely to be gassed at crunch time.

 

[The Funster]

Im sure there was a set play called...but there is a defense trying to stop them, you know. Anderson made a bad descision with that pass. It's not on Ollie.

He made the only decision he could. That was the problem. Everyone knew JA was getting the ball and everyone watched while it was passed to him. No one set a screen to help JA and there was no 2nd option. All JA could do was move towards the baseline. Major fail, IMO.

 

[KembaStepback]

He made the only decision he could. That was the problem. Everyone knew JA was getting the ball and everyone watched while it was passed to him. No one set a screen to help JA and there was no 2nd option. Major fail, IMO.

Disagree. No way was the only decision to pass it to a double teamed Adams under the basket.

 

[The Funster]

Disagree. No way was the only decision to pass it to a double teamed Adams under the basket.

Look at the video. Larrier and Vital were standing out beyond the 3 point line with a man on him. Neither moved. Another Husky was in the lane with a man on him. He never moved and his guy collapsed on JA when he got the ball. Complete and utter fail.

 

[champs99and04]

Remember the Columbia "win"? A loss is a loss.

I think that's the point. Nobody felt good about the Columbia win because we played poorly. Nobody feels good about any game that results in a loss, but that doesn't mean we can't take anything good from it. If we played the Spurs and lost by three, I'm sure we'd find plenty to be happy about. Obviously Tulsa is not the Spurs or even a good college team by our usual definition, but we are playing better than we were a month ago. Sometimes that is all you can cling to in a depressing season.

 

[Danzz]

Still plenty of flaws but we are playing better.

 

[whaler11]

The inbounds play is on no one but Anderson. It was a bad pass. Period. Blaming Ollie is foolish.

You can’t blame Ollie for not wasting the timeout that would have bailed them out?

That’s absurd.