OT: - Play GM, fix my Celtics this season | The Boneyard

OT: Play GM, fix my Celtics this season

GemParty

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I think we’ve hit rock bottom on expectations vs results. You be the GM today. Help Danny win.
 

HuskyHawk

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The beatings will continue, until morale improves.

My simple view, Tatum and Brown don't trust their teammates, so the Celtics don't share the ball the way they should in that offense. Saw the same in the playoff vs Miami last year. Hayward was the one guy on the team who ran that offense as Stevens intends, even to the point of hurting his numbers. Kemba is still hurt and no longer commands the respect he did. Smart is the one guy who can and does take Brown and Tatum behind the woodshed and hold them to account when they play selfish basketball. He's been out.

I'd roll out a starting lineup of Kemba, Nesmith, Semi, Grant W and Time Lord. Make Brown and Tatum watch. If those aren't the right guys, then whatever combination of guys is most likely to play team basketball.
 
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I think we’ve hit rock bottom on expectations vs results. You be the GM today. Help Danny win.

Trade some of the younger guys & the trade exception via Hayward and get a quality big like Horford (been decent this year) or Kevin Love who is more of a risk but when he's playing well the shooting, rebounding, decision making and passing are elite.

Celts need a backup PG for Kemba. Kemba has been awful this season and he's actually hurting the team. I'd look for guys like Rubio who the wolves might want to sell because they stink too. Perhaps scooping George Hill from the Thunder along with Horford? Cory Joseph from the Kings could be an option as well.
 
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I think we’ve hit rock bottom on expectations vs results. You be the GM today. Help Danny win.

Give up all draft-night decisions outside the top 10 picks to someone other than Ainge. Problem solved. I've been pretty frustrated by how the front office has drafted outside of Tatum, Brown, Smart--all top 10 picks. The Celtics have a terrible bench because we have no home grown talent. Smart hurt and Kemba being a liability this season is a problem too, but I'm not sure either of those could've been predicted.

Hit:
- Payton Pritchard

Not sure yet:
  • Robert Williams (leaning towards hit)
  • Aaron Nesmith (leaning towards miss)
Miss:
  • Grant Williams
  • Semi Ojeleye
  • Romeo Langford
  • Tremont Waters
  • Carsen Edwards

I realize that the draft after the top 5 is a crapshoot in some ways, but there are 5 first round draft picks on this list. We've got Robert Williams who seems to have potential but is also almost 24 and just beginning to be a serviceable player, and Peyton Pritchard (who I actually really like as a bench piece for a long career) to show for it.
 

HuskyHawk

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Give up all draft-night decisions outside the top 10 picks to someone other than Ainge. Problem solved. I've been pretty frustrated by how the front office has drafted outside of Tatum, Brown, Smart--all top 10 picks. The Celtics have a terrible bench because we have no home grown talent. Smart hurt and Kemba being a liability this season is a problem too, but I'm not sure either of those could've been predicted.

Hit:
- Payton Pritchard

Not sure yet:
  • Robert Williams (leaning towards hit)
  • Aaron Nesmith (leaning towards miss)
Miss:
  • Grant Williams
  • Semi Ojeleye
  • Romeo Langford
  • Tremont Waters
  • Carsen Edwards

I realize that the draft after the top 5 is a crapshoot in some ways, but there are 5 first round draft picks on this list. We've got Robert Williams who seems to have potential but is also almost 24 and just beginning to be a serviceable player, and Peyton Pritchard (who I actually really like as a bench piece for a long career) to show for it.

I think Time Lord is a hit. Needs more playing time.
Nesmith is a TBD. He hasn't gotten a chance, and Tatum and Brown won't give him the ball when he plays. I think he will be a hit in time.
Grant was an opportunity cost miss, but was always just a depth piece.
Semi is a good player and should play more.

Langford, Waters and Edwards are misses. I'd say Danny needs to stay away from undersized guards except he hit on Pritchard.
 
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Can't understand unless it's cap that they don't try for Drummond. Can't imagine he costs much and he can give them some scoring, athleticism and rebounding inside they are lacking. He doesn't need a zillion touches either, what am I missing? Admittedly, I don't watch a ton of NBA esp before playoffs. But Theis isn't an answer.
 

nelsonmuntz

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Don't trade Enes Kanter for one thing. We all know he mails it in a lot but he is still an 11/11 guy this season in 26 minutes a game of semi-caring, and he shows up for the playoffs.

Theis is not close to good enough to start for a playoff team and the rest of the front court is mix-and-match role players.

Ainge should have also traded Tatum when his value was at its peak. Tatum is a good player that thinks he is one of the best in the NBA. He isn't.
 
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In my opinion, the Celtics were a relatively deep team with many veterans (2 years ago the bench was Heyward, Brown, Rozier, Baynes, Theis, Ojeleye, Wanamaker, and Robert Williams) and and they have become a top heavy team with almost no veterans with a very young bench. And, they do not have front court size.

As for the draft, I don't think the problem is who they drafted. When you are not picking in the top 10, you don't have many good options. When they did have top 10 picks, Ainge selected Brown, Tatum (in a great trade), and Smart. I would say that is pretty good.

Another issue this year has been injuries to key players. Kemba is not playing in back to back games. Tatum had COVID and he doesn't have his wind totally back. Smart tore a calf muscle. Langford was the #5 HS basketball recruit, but he has been injured so we don't know how good he is. Advancing to the Eastern Conference finals in the bubble provided little rest for the Celtics.

To fix the Celtics, they need a defensive big man and some veterans on the bench who can shoot and score. Unfortunately, the problems can't be solved this season
 
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the guy that i really hope we get is vucevic. i think the celtics could make it happen with a few picks and some of the young guys.

i am also hopeful that they will look a lot better when smart comes back. right now, they are playing tatum and brown almost exclusively at the 2 & 3 whereas they played and had success last year at the 3 & 4. smart gives them defense and more lineup flexibility. they can also close games with him at point when kemba is having an off night.
 
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Don't trade Enes Kanter for one thing. We all know he mails it in a lot but he is still an 11/11 guy this season in 26 minutes a game of semi-caring, and he shows up for the playoffs.

Theis is not close to good enough to start for a playoff team and the rest of the front court is mix-and-match role players.

Ainge should have also traded Tatum when his value was at its peak. Tatum is a good player that thinks he is one of the best in the NBA. He isn't.
Wut? Tatum isn’t even in his prime. He’s 22. He’s actually younger than Payton Pritchard.

You must have lofty expectations if you want to trade a 22 year old averaging 25 points 7 rebounds and 4.5 assists.
 

HuskyHawk

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Wut? Tatum isn’t even in his prime. He’s 22. He’s actually younger than Payton Pritchard.

You must have lofty expectations if you want to trade a 22 year old averaging 25 points 7 rebounds and 4.5 assists.

Agree but he has let it go to his head. It was so clear last year against Miami when he went 1 on 2 or 3 regularly and cost the team. This season, Brown got off to a scorching start and now it has gone to his head. They aren't playing team ball right now.
 
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Ainge should have also traded Tatum when his value was at its peak. Tatum is a good player that thinks he is one of the best in the NBA. He isn't.
This is a bad take. We really have to adjust our NBA expectation because many players come into the NBA as physically underdeveloped kids. Tatum was drafted after just turning 19. In comparison, Larry Bird had been in college for 5 years and he was almost 24 years old when his first Celtic season started.

Most of us remember Bird as a great outside shooter as he was a career 0.376 three point shooter. Well, that was not true when he first entered the league. His 3 point shooting his first 5 years in the league: 0.406, 0.270, 0.212, 0.286, 0.247.

Or, look at Kobe. He only started 7 games his first 2 years in LA and he didn't average >20 points per game until year 4. Giannis didn't average over 20 points a game until year 4. James Harden started 7 games his first 3 seasons and didn't average over 20 points per game until year 4.

Tatum is still developing and he will be a great NBA player. It must be frustrating for him to play on the current Celtics teams as the talent is not there.
 

HuskyHawk

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This is a bad take. We really have to adjust our NBA expectation because many players come into the NBA as physically underdeveloped kids. Tatum was drafted after just turning 19. In comparison, Larry Bird had been in college for 5 years and he was almost 24 years old when his first Celtic season started.

Most of us remember Bird as a great outside shooter as he was a career 0.376 three point shooter. Well, that was not true when he first entered the league. His 3 point shooting his first 5 years in the league: 0.406, 0.270, 0.212, 0.286, 0.247.

Or, look at Kobe. He only started 7 games his first 2 years in LA and he didn't average >20 points per game until year 4. Giannis didn't average over 20 points a game until year 4. James Harden started 7 games his first 3 seasons and didn't average over 20 points per game until year 4.

Tatum is still developing and he will be a great NBA player. It must be frustrating for him to play on the current Celtics teams as the talent is not there.
This is also why it is completely unfair to make any assumptions about what Aaron Nesmith will or won't become. The NBA is a developmental league.

Big guys take even longer to develop, and I really think Bob Williams should be playing more and more. Seems like he's been around forever, but he's 23. He's shooting over 70% and blocking 1.5 shots a game in just 15 minutes.
 
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Its a conundrum, the Celtics should be better than their record & Marcus Smart shouldn't be this important to their defense, but here we are. And Marcus Smart, given his contract is the most tradeable piece, so any move for a quality player may depend on giving up the player whose absence created the current need.
So...
1. The schedule post all-star is BRUTAL for everyone, this will favor young teams and teams with depth. The Celtics are young, but their depth sucks.
2. Play Nesmith - need to figure out what they have there, he is absolutely key to 2nd half performance.
3. I'd shop/package Grant W (over Semi) and Romeo + draft picks & trade exception, see if can get anything that'll help.
4. Shop Time Lord too, he's shown some nice upside that might return a viable '3&D' 4 man. I like his upside but it doesn't mean much to Celtics as they still give more PT to TT & Theis b/c team defense.
5. If can't trade without giving up someone of value, there are/will be scoring or D available in drops
6. Cut Jeff Teague, play Tremont Waters & Carson Edwards or if they aren't playable cut them and sign someone who can give reliable instant offense off bench. 2nd half schedule will wear on Kemba, so need punch from backup PG
7. Play Tacko Fall what have we got to lose at this point?
Back end of Celtics roster is currently filled with too many players that have potential but can't consistently contribute on NBA level. Given the already weak bench 7-9 & schedule demands that won't fly so need to play them to test/prove if viable & if not cut/trade/replace them.
 

nelsonmuntz

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This is a bad take. We really have to adjust our NBA expectation because many players come into the NBA as physically underdeveloped kids. Tatum was drafted after just turning 19. In comparison, Larry Bird had been in college for 5 years and he was almost 24 years old when his first Celtic season started.

Most of us remember Bird as a great outside shooter as he was a career 0.376 three point shooter. Well, that was not true when he first entered the league. His 3 point shooting his first 5 years in the league: 0.406, 0.270, 0.212, 0.286, 0.247.

Or, look at Kobe. He only started 7 games his first 2 years in LA and he didn't average >20 points per game until year 4. Giannis didn't average over 20 points a game until year 4. James Harden started 7 games his first 3 seasons and didn't average over 20 points per game until year 4.

Tatum is still developing and he will be a great NBA player. It must be frustrating for him to play on the current Celtics teams as the talent is not there.

I hadn't considered that Tatum is better than Larry Bird. That must be why the Celtics are in first place.
 

nelsonmuntz

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He's an idiot. Tatum is a star. Brown and Tatum should be 100% untradable.

There is a long NBA Playoffs thread from the summer where I point out that Stevens was wrong for not playing Kanter, and all the same morons blasted me. 6 months later, Kanter is starting for the #5 seed in the strong West, and the Celtics are currently on the outside of the playoffs looking in.

The next time one of you gets to say "I told you so" on basketball will be the first.
 

the Q

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Trade grant Romeo Edwards in a package for Larry nance jr. he’s hurt now but exactly what the Celtics need.

The tpe is harder. The Celtics are hard capped right now so they can’t use the full tpe anyway.

They can basically trade the tpe and 2 firsts. Probably not enough for Vuc.

Might be enough for Gordon and mle bamba and then deal the youngsters above for something else.

Funny how mahinmi is one of the guys who has a great defensive value against embiid. It’s basically using a roster spot just for that, but for the Minimum it’s something to do.

But the reality is that 28.5m isn’t getting you many stars.

Oladipo and Vuc are two who might be available who fit. Don’t forget the players salary has to fit the exception and cannot have others added to increase its value.
 
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1 easy fix is to tell Kemba to stop shooting so much and be more of a facilitator PG instead of a scoring PG. He's been awful this season and is killing them.
 

Fairfield_1st

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the Celtics don't share the ball the way they should in that offense.
That's it right there. Very little ball movement and passing/assists. The big 3 seem like black holes when it comes to sharing. They will get their shots off.
God I hate the NBA now.
 
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I think we’ve hit rock bottom on expectations vs results. You be the GM today. Help Danny win.

Trade away Tatum and Kemba to the Knicks you can have a 1st rounder just one ?.
 
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Marcus Smart. This team is just different without him. Their defense. Their attitude.

I know that's such a simple answer, but man do they miss this guy big time.
 

HuskyHawk

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Marcus Smart. This team is just different without him. Their defense. Their attitude.

I know that's such a simple answer, but man do they miss this guy big time.

Yes, partly defense. Partly because he calls out those scorers when they aren't moving the ball, or playing D, etc. He's the leader of that team. Thompson is trying to step up and do that too.
 

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