Pitino on the state of recruiting

[Deleted at users request]

Dude you’re living in the past. Do you know how much college sports have changed in the last 2-3 years? It’s not the same sport.

When changes happen and the product isn’t better, including the overall state of American basketball, maybe those changes aren’t good?

 

[navery12]

You do know Shabazz was like 88th coming out of high school? He was rated lower than Ross and for sure lower than Nowell and was a plan D for us recruiting wise. He would not have developed to become who he was in this environment.

You’re talking in hindsight because of what they became even though you yourself didn’t even watch their careers here because you weren’t a fan at that time.

Yes, I'm aware of where they were ranked. And they came in and produced which is why they wouldn't be recruited over even in this environment.

And I have no idea what you're talking about with me not watching their careers because that's just not true. I was at UConn for Shabazz's career and followed UConn during Kemba's years

 

[RuffRuff]

When changes happen and the product isn’t better, including the overall state of American basketball, maybe those changes aren’t good?

Yes this has been much talked about and for many it’s not preferred, but it’s reality. If you don’t like it you don’t have to watch it.

Just as it wasn’t preferred that players could leave after their Freshman year vs Junior, the train keeps rolling.

Not sure what you want to happen? For the rules to change back, portal to go away? Coaches have to adapt to rules and resources, and that part is fascinating to me.

Navery pointed out a great benefit of the portal - to put kids in programs they’re best suited for to maximize, to get playing time. There are a ton of examples out there of how the portal is actually helping the athlete, not just the program.

 

[shizzle787]

Yup. Sounds more like lazy coaches than anything else

Work smart, not hard.

 

[UConnSportsGuy]

Going all in on high paid NIL upperclassmen transfers is a risky proposition. It can work. But it can also blow up in your face pretty quickly. Take a look at Kansas State and Indiana as downside of this strategy.

Ideally, you have a mix of homegrown players for culture development and then supplement with a few NIL transfers to fill holes. I don't think a full on transfer strategy is going to be successful in too many cases.

 

[RuffRuff]

Honestly we have no idea what Gaffney would’ve been if we never brought in RJ Cole and just gave him the keys. But it’s a deep hypothetical that’s not worth getting into too much.

Cam was a perfect pickup and match regardless.

To be clear, I’m not saying teams shouldn’t recruit portal talent over freshman when they have a need for big starter minutes. Cam being brought in to give young guys time to develop like last year is fine. Mahaney being brought in to put Nowell on the bench completely and take opportunities away from a sophomore Ross is not. I will also not be happy if some of our sophomores and freshman walk this summer for some transfers to replace them.

You’re making it sound like whoever we recruit we should commit and live or die by?

I’ll tell you what, we’d suck if Gaffney started. So you’re saying we should swallow that pill for the sake of development? .

These are some weird takes.

 

[RuffRuff]

Going all in on high paid NIL upperclassmen transfers is a risky proposition. It can work. But it can also blow up in your face pretty quickly. Take a look at Kansas State and Indiana as downside of this strategy.

Ideally, you have a mix of homegrown players for culture development and then supplement with a few NIL transfers to fill holes. I don't think a full on transfer strategy is going to be successful in too many cases.

Right now if you look at top teams it feels like what is working best is multi year portal guys, mixed in with senior portal gets and a splash of top frosh.

The fresh/soph that’s shown they could play at the college level heading into the portal is nice find as it rubber stamps they have the goods, but then you get 2+ more years out of them. Haggerty was a gold mine. Let’s see if Hard can keep him now.

 

[Deleted at users request]

You’re making it sound like whoever we recruit we should commit and live or die by?

I’ll tell you what, we’d suck if Gaffney started. So you’re saying we should swallow that pill for the sake of development? .

These are some weird takes.

The basis of a lot of your transfer portal takes are with the assumption that development guys will suck and transfer players will automatically be successful. Neither are true.

With Gaffney, he had a great freshman year and seemed prime to step into a starter role and carry that momentum of how we finished the COVID impacted season after a year of learning from Vital and Gilbert. That didn’t happen though so we don’t know what the case may have been. RJ Cole didn’t lead us anywhere either so it’s not like we replaced him for great reason.

Also, rules don’t need to be changed. But whatever coach is smart enough to realize the old school way of developing good recruiting classes is the best way long term will see lots of success.

Even though they should go back to one transfer per school for sure.

 

[uconnric]

Going forward I can’t imagine many freshmen, outside of 5 star players, getting much playing time on the biggest teams. Might actually help mid-majors by getting better recruits even if they are 1-2 year and gone.

This is already impacting football recruiting. Coaches are recruiting proven transfers rather than high school freshman. A lot of talent is falling into G5 schools. If they develop, they'll move on after a year or two.

 

[RuffRuff]

The basis of a lot of your transfer portal takes are with the assumption that development guys will suck and transfer players will automatically be successful. Neither are true.

The suggestion is that after year two it’s apparent you’re not cut out for the program, you move on. All coaches should know what they have in a player after their sophomore year, whether it’s potential or already contributing.

This is why I say your goal with HS recruits are kids that you know can contribute off bench year 1, start year two. Otherwise save it for the portal. I don’t want to be clogging up my roster with long term development projects in today’s world.

 

[superjohn]

The basis of a lot of your transfer portal takes are with the assumption that development guys will suck and transfer players will automatically be successful. Neither are true.

With Gaffney, he had a great freshman year and seemed prime to step into a starter role and carry that momentum of how we finished the COVID impacted season after a year of learning from Vital and Gilbert. That didn’t happen though so we don’t know what the case may have been. RJ Cole didn’t lead us anywhere either so it’s not like we replaced him for great reason.

Also, rules don’t need to be changed. But whatever coach is smart enough to realize the old school way of developing good recruiting classes is the best way long term will see lots of success.

Even though they should go back to one transfer per school for sure.

Good lord...

We know Gaffney, Diggins, Akok, Gilbert, Brendan Adams, Brown-Ferguson, Hasson, Romoglou weren't good enough at this level. They went to lower levels. We brought in guys like Tristen, Cam, Joey C, Diarra, Alleyne who were integral parts of us winning national championships. RJ Cole was damn good here (first team Big East) as was Tyrese. Transfers have been incredibly good for us and have brought us more national championships.

I don't know why you keep doing this to yourself in thread after thread.

 

[RuffRuff]

611 is either a glutton for punishment or nostalgic to a fault.

 

[Huskyforlife]

The basis of a lot of your transfer portal takes are with the assumption that development guys will suck and transfer players will automatically be successful. Neither are true.

With Gaffney, he had a great freshman year and seemed prime to step into a starter role and carry that momentum of how we finished the COVID impacted season after a year of learning from Vital and Gilbert. That didn’t happen though so we don’t know what the case may have been. RJ Cole didn’t lead us anywhere either so it’s not like we replaced him for great reason.

Also, rules don’t need to be changed. But whatever coach is smart enough to realize the old school way of developing good recruiting classes is the best way long term will see lots of success.

Even though they should go back to one transfer per school for sure.

You’re taking this way too far with this Gaffney stuff. I’m with you generally that Dan could be more loose with his freshmen, especially when the older players aren't getting it done. But gaffney was an okay freshman (at best) on a team with no aspirations, go back and look at his averages, if we committed to a player like that now, it would be malpractice.

He was also clearly not a good player at any point in his career, serviceable backup is being too charitable. He didn’t improve after moving down a level his final 2 seasons.

Hard committing to Gaffney would’ve cost Dan his job, and our program 2 championships, minimum.

 

[UConnTrumbull]

611 is either a glutton for punishment or nostalgic to a fault.

Great stat. And, without any research, I would guess that most of those are 5 stars…would love to be wrong

 

[Deleted at users request]

611 is either a glutton for punishment or nostalgic to a fault.

Nobody ever talked about freshmen being starters. This is a stupid post and narrative being pushed.

There are plenty of freshman who are contributing to these same teams in some fashion which will prepare them to have bigger roles next year.

 

[Deleted at users request]

You’re taking this way too far with this Gaffney stuff. I’m with you generally that Dan could be more loose with his freshmen, especially when the older players aren't getting it done. But gaffney was an okay freshman (at best) on a team with no aspirations, go back and look at his averages, if we committed to a player like that now, it would be malpractice.

He was also clearly not a good player at any point in his career, serviceable backup is being too charitable. He didn’t improve after moving down a level his final 2 seasons.

Hard committing to Gaffney would’ve cost Dan his job, and our program 2 championships, minimum.

I’m not going back and forth on the Gaffney stuff. It’s my opinion that people’s career can change when they have ideal situations.

I saw in real time Gaffney help us go on a run that COVID year as a starter in a Shabazz like role. We rewarded him by bringing in someone else to start over him killing his confidence. Who knows what happens if we build on that momentum and hand him the keys. Again, it’s not like RJ Cole won big with us. I’m not judging how the rest of his career elsewhere goes after having his confidence killed here. That stuff matters.

Even in terms of fit for that 2021-2022 season having a past first PG with built in chemistry with Boutknight would’ve made more sense than RJ Cole’s shoot first mentality. Would’ve also gave us room to get Diggins feet wet. But all that went down the drain for someone who never got us out the first round.

But I don’t expect people to agree with me there and that’s fine.

 

[BigErnMcCracken]

Good lord...

We know Gaffney, Diggins, Akok, Gilbert, Brendan Adams, Brown-Ferguson, Hasson, Romoglou weren't good enough at this level. They went to lower levels. We brought in guys like Tristen, Cam, Joey C, Diarra, Alleyne who were integral parts of us winning national championships. RJ Cole was damn good here (first team Big East) as was Tyrese. Transfers have been incredibly good for us and have brought us more national championships.

I don't know why you keep doing this to yourself in thread after thread.

I had to look up Gaffney because I wasn't sure if I had him confused with someone else.

 

[87Xfer]

You had more fun watching those guys than Kemba and Shabazz?

you missed the "just about" part

 

[caw]

Of the hundreds of players I've watched play at UConn I had more fun watching Cam and Tristen "than just about any of them." Only guys I can think of I enjoyed at the same level or more are Rip, El-Amin, Okafor, Ben, Bazz, Kemba, Donovan. I'll throw Caron, Ray, and Donyell in there as well even though they never won a national championship.

The point is they are two of my favorite players who ever played here despite being transfers who only played here 2 seasons and 1 season.

No Jackson, or Sanogo?

 

[Huskyforlife]

I’m not going back and forth on the Gaffney stuff. It’s my opinion that people’s career can change when they have ideal situations.

I saw in real time Gaffney help us go on a run that COVID year as a starter in a Shabazz like role. We rewarded him by bringing in someone else to start over him killing his confidence. Who knows what happens if we build on that momentum and hand him the keys. Again, it’s not like RJ Cole won big with us. I’m not judging how the rest of his career elsewhere goes after having his confidence killed here. That stuff matters.

Even in terms of fit for that 2021-2022 season having a past first PG with built in chemistry with Boutknight would’ve made more sense than RJ Cole’s shoot first mentality. Would’ve also gave us room to get Diggins feet wet. But all that went down the drain for someone who never got us out the first round.

But I don’t expect people to agree with me there and that’s fine.

Giving Gaffney credit for that run is pretty silly, we also don't know where or how that run would've ended. He started 10/11 games to end the season, he averaged 6 points and 3 assists, on 32/22/77 or a TS% of 43. All he did was stop Gilbert from shooting us out of a chance of finding a better shot.

He didn't have confidence because he was pretty bad most of the time, that's not the staffs fault, they gave him 3 years in the rotation to figure it out, and he couldn't. He played for a second creative offensive coach, who could only get a solid backup season out of him in year 5. I doubt Dan Hurley and Dusty May both just couldn't figure out Gaffney, some guys are just limited.

We would've missed the tournament in both of Coles seasons if Gaffney was in his role.

 

[RuffRuff]

Giving Gaffney credit for that run is pretty silly, we also don't know where or how that run would've ended. He started 10/11 games to end the season, he averaged 6 points and 3 assists, on 32/22/77 or a TS% of 43. All he did was stop Gilbert from shooting us out of a chance of finding a better shot.

He didn't have confidence because he was pretty bad most of the time, that's not the staffs fault, they gave him 3 years in the rotation to figure it out, and he couldn't. He played for a second creative offensive coach, who could only get a solid backup season out of him in year 5. I doubt Dan Hurley and Dusty May both just couldn't figure out Gaffney, some guys are just limited.

We would've missed the tournament in both of Coles seasons if Gaffney was in his role.

He came off the bench at FAU, not a keeper by any means.

 

[Deleted at users request]

Giving Gaffney credit for that run is pretty silly, we also don't know where or how that run would've ended.

Not credit. He just handled it well for a freshman and did his job of feeding our weapons.

He was not bad his freshman year. That starting stat line is actually not far off from Shabazz’s who averaged 8 pts 3 asts on 37/32/77. Not saying he could’ve been Shabazz.

We have differences on what role you have impacting your development. I think him being a starter would’ve been great for his confidence and caused him to play better, like we saw with Hawkins and like some are arguing for Reed.

You don’t think a players role impacts their play or development and that’s fine. Agree to disagree

 

[CTBasketball]

I’m not going back and forth on the Gaffney stuff. It’s my opinion that people’s career can change when they have ideal situations.

I saw in real time Gaffney help us go on a run that COVID year as a starter in a Shabazz like role. We rewarded him by bringing in someone else to start over him killing his confidence. Who knows what happens if we build on that momentum and hand him the keys. Again, it’s not like RJ Cole won big with us. I’m not judging how the rest of his career elsewhere goes after having his confidence killed here. That stuff matters.

Even in terms of fit for that 2021-2022 season having a past first PG with built in chemistry with Boutknight would’ve made more sense than RJ Cole’s shoot first mentality. Would’ve also gave us room to get Diggins feet wet. But all that went down the drain for someone who never got us out the first round.

But I don’t expect people to agree with me there and that’s fine.

Gaffney had some pretty big mental defensive lapses especially his freshman year, and also couldn’t shoot from 3 or 2 his entire career.

RJ Cole helped lead us back to the NCAAT, national rankings, and was BE 1st Team.

 

[Deleted at users request]

Gaffney had some pretty big mental defensive lapses especially his freshman year, and also couldn’t shoot from 3 or 2 his entire career.

RJ Cole helped lead us back to the NCAAT, national rankings, and was BE 1st Team.

You don’t think we would’ve made the tourney in that shutdown year?

 

[RuffRuff]

You don’t think we would’ve made the tourney in that shutdown year?