Our Ceiling

[Dove]

I think we have final four talent but I don't know if I'd say we have final four potential

Huh?

It's still mid-December. I see us as Elite 8 potential.

 

[Jimdish255]

I'd be extremely happy if we made the BE Final, OK with the semis. Should make the Tourney. If we are 6 seed or better 2 wins would seem to be the limit at this point. Above that probably 1 win. But it's way too early. Our limitations of outside shooting and guard play beyond RJ are obvious limiters.

 

[AZHuskiePop]

Today’s performance from a couple of guys got me thinking. If everything falls into place(which is rare), what is this teams ceiling. I mean if Polley returns to Junior year Polley and is an automatic bucket when open, if Hawkins becomes a legit 15 ppg threat every night, if Cole continues on his trajectory, Adama continues to be an all big East big, Tyrese continues to be a bully and a dog, Akok returns to Indiana MSG Akok, Gaffney plays to his potential, Whaley does dpoy Whaley things, and AJax channels his inner Draymond Green. My lord. I’ll preface this by saying, all of this coming to fruition is slim to none. But what if just most of it does. Where can we go?

Polley has a problem all shooters go through
First they think they can make every shot they throw up there.
It kinda of gets confirmed by a crazy game
Shot selection is thrown out the window
After a couple of bad games confidence is crushed an even open shots seem difficult
Dr AZ’s cure
Don’t stop shooting but become more disaplined at your selection ability
You have a great shot and they will fall
When they do stay disaplined in selection unless your forced
That’s advice for Hawkins also.
PS stay aggressive in your floor game especially going to the boards and offensive rebounds .
We want you to get to the line as many times as possible. Your 26-29 from the line a tad under 90%.
You can win as many games from the line as you can with the 3.

 

[Spaceman213J]

It's all about having the resume to get into the tourney and then having the hot hand. The team needs to avoid the shooting slumps, but hopefully with Sanogo, Cole, Polley and a somewhat developed Hawkins, they can avoid long droughts. If they continue to improve on defense, no team will feel comfortable matching this team.

 

[Huskyforlife]

How could we have final four potential if Dan Hurley is the worst in game coach to ever grace a top 15 job in college basketball? It was just last weak we couldn't overcome his horrid coaching, I doubt he improves that much over the course of 1 season.

 

[TheChamps990411]

Today’s performance from a couple of guys got me thinking. If everything falls into place(which is rare), what is this teams ceiling. I mean if Polley returns to Junior year Polley and is an automatic bucket when open, if Hawkins becomes a legit 15 ppg threat every night, if Cole continues on his trajectory, Adama continues to be an all big East big, Tyrese continues to be a bully and a dog, Akok returns to Indiana MSG Akok, Gaffney plays to his potential, Whaley does dpoy Whaley things, and AJax channels his inner Draymond Green. My lord. I’ll preface this by saying, all of this coming to fruition is slim to none. But what if just most of it does. Where can we go?

2011 and 2014 taught me a lesson. Ill NEVER doubt this programs ability to cut down the nets in April. If they are in the field then our ceiling is championship.

 

[bmayuc]

Final four talent and final four ready are worlds apart

The only gap between those two things is final 4 coaching

 

[dennismenace]

Protect the basketball and that begins with guard play. We have some good and tough upperclassmen but we have many young very talented guys. Need to stay calm but play very hard. That's not easy, especially for under experienced guys. I think the best bet is to use our depth and pressure/transition ball. We are not made (yet) for half court offense. it is going to be great watching them grow up this year. I haven't seen this much effort in many years. We're going in the right direction; stay with it. They can be very exciting when they are running on all cylinders.

 

[bmayuc]

I love you all but you're all mad hatters.

The tournament is all about guard play, teams that are great at situational play and closing out half/games, and teams that play with confidence.

Those are precisely our 3 biggest weaknesses. We play inefficiently and leave a lot of points in the board. We STRUGGLE big-time defending without fouling and getting stops, especially against good guards.

On talent, we can get to sweet 16 on talent alone, but we are just as likely to lose in Rd 1 cuz we lose our nerve and a 13 seed hits a bunch of 3s.

 

[navery12]

We STRUGGLE big-time defending without fouling and getting stops, especially against good guards.

This is a real opinion you have?

 

[UCPharma11]

Five Golden Rings

4 AKOK Blocks, 3 AJAX Steals and Breakaway Dunks, 2 ADAMA ROARing Baby hooks and a National Championship vs Duke!

 

[bendm]

Rutgers just beat the #1 team so Yes we could conceivably beat anyone on any given night and go on a run like in 2014 but we’re not on the same level as Duke, Baylor, Gonzaga, Purdue etc. Within the realm of realistic expectations the Sweet 16 would be a huge success

 

[AntG168]

Rutgers just beat the #1 team so Yes we could conceivably beat anyone on any given night and go on a run like in 2014 but we’re not on the same level as Duke, Baylor, Gonzaga, Purdue etc. Within the realm of realistic expectations the Sweet 16 would be a huge success

purdue almost lost again tonight to nc state

 

[superjohn]

Rutgers just beat the #1 team so Yes we could conceivably beat anyone on any given night and go on a run like in 2014 but we’re not on the same level as Duke, Baylor, Gonzaga, Purdue etc. Within the realm of realistic expectations the Sweet 16 would be a huge success

None of those teams are great, Baylor is the closest. Wide open year.

 

[bendm]

purdue almost lost again tonight to nc state

But Credit to Purdue for forcing OT and then closing them out that’s what elite teams do

 

[superjohn]

But Credit to Purdue for forcing OT and then closing them out that’s what elite teams do

They just lost to Rutgers who didn't even have Geo Baker. Rutgers is horrible.

 

[AntG168]

But Credit to Purdue for forcing OT and then closing them out that’s what elite teams do

Like we did against Auburn and VCU?

 

[Hans Sprungfeld]

The... gap between [Final 4 talent and Final 4 ready] is final 4 coaching

The tournament is all about guard play, teams that are great at situational play and closing out half/games, and teams that play with confidence.

... we can get to sweet 16 on talent alone.

I selectively quoted without putting words in your mouth by making changes.

Players come in as teenagers and leave in their young 20s. Coaches may last a few years or several decades. I've always regarded the Head Coach as the focal point within college basketball, and in contemplating this team's ceiling, everything is predicated on Danny Hurley having his best season ever. He and his staff are the agents who activate, harness, and guide the players to reach the various potentials that have been identified here, and to do so in a way that meshes their skills and temperaments individually and collectively.

It is very very difficult for any team to win 6 consecutive games against (mostly) unfamiliar competition that (by design and for the most part) gets increasingly more difficult with each game. Every year there's a team that does it, because, as has been said here many times, "Somebody has to do it." The most goofy, fun, and (at best) calming question is, "Why not us?"

I don't think there's anywhere near 75 teams that could ask that rhetorical question as though it's a literal one. And I do think that whatever a more realistic small number could pose such a question, we are rooting for one of those teams.

We go into Big East play realistically thinking that we're pretty good, versatile, currently compromised by significant injuries, and already demonstrating progress in addressing some of our already identified challenges and growth opportunities. The best teams are doing much the same.

The team looks very much worth watching. I can see great possibility, offer no predictions, and wish that I can feel confident within curious uncertainty 1 month, 2 months, and 3 months from now.

 

[bmayuc]

I selectively quoted without putting words in your mouth by making changes.

Players come in as teenagers and leave in their young 20s. Coaches may last a few years or several decades. I've always regarded the Head Coach as the focal point within college basketball, and in contemplating this team's ceiling, everything is predicated on Danny Hurley having his best season ever. He and his staff are the agents who activate, harness, and guide the players to reach the various potentials that have been identified here, and to do so in a way that meshes their skills and temperaments individually and collectively.

It is very very difficult for any team to win 6 consecutive games against (mostly) unfamiliar competition that (by design and for the most part) gets increasingly more difficult with each game. Every year there's a team that does it, because, as has been said here many times, "Somebody has to do it." The most goofy, fun, and (at best) calming question is, "Why not us?"

I don't think there's anywhere near 75 teams that could ask that rhetorical question as though it's a literal one. And I do think that whatever a more realistic small number could pose such a question, we are rooting for one of those teams.

We go into Big East play realistically thinking that we're pretty good, versatile, currently compromised by significant injuries, and already demonstrating progress in addressing some of our already identified challenges and growth opportunities. The best teams are doing much the same.

The team looks very much worth watching. I can see great possibility, offer no predictions, and wish that I can feel confident within curious uncertainty 1 month, 2 months, and 3 months from now.

Yea I think most of this is true - The part I don't agree with at all - and drives most of our difference here is that I'm not sure "already demonstrating progress in addressing some of our already identified challenges and growth opportunities" is true. Outside of Sanogo's offseason development, where is the growth? Where is the demonstrated progress?

This is biggest thing for me in assessing our chances this year, is to look after 10 games and see what progress has been made that makes me believe we leveled up. We have played the soft part of our calendar - the part where we would have 25 point games and give players chances to make mistakes or earn their spot - and the players who are going to separate/elevate themselves do it.

But we really haven't taken that step as a team and in our roles. I'm not sure what we've learned, and that is bad since we are 1/3 of the way through here.

RJ/Gaff are basically what they were last year - with Diggins getting no burn and Floyd RShirting, this is it - no playmaking calvalry coming, and we've seen our team be totally shut down a couple of times so far.

AJax/Hawk/Akok/Samson have been up and down. They've all flashed, and they've all disappeared. No consistency.

Tyrese is a beast, Whaley is a Wrench, Polley is streaky. No difference there.

We have a ton of talent. We lack guard play. We foul a lot. We knew that going in. I guess I just wished we knew more - or had made more of an effort to find out more from the unknown pieces.

Will be fun to watch this season play out!

 

[August_West]

Like we did against Auburn and VCU?

And didn’t do against West Virginia and Mich state?

 

[AntG168]

And didn’t do against West Virginia and Mich state?

Or Purdue didn’t do against Rutgers who is worse than both?

 

[JonnyRI]

Yea I think most of this is true - The part I don't agree with at all - and drives most of our difference here is that I'm not sure "already demonstrating progress in addressing some of our already identified challenges and growth opportunities" is true. Outside of Sanogo's offseason development, where is the growth? Where is the demonstrated progress?

This is biggest thing for me in assessing our chances this year, is to look after 10 games and see what progress has been made that makes me believe we leveled up. We have played the soft part of our calendar - the part where we would have 25 point games and give players chances to make mistakes or earn their spot - and the players who are going to separate/elevate themselves do it.

But we really haven't taken that step as a team and in our roles. I'm not sure what we've learned, and that is bad since we are 1/3 of the way through here.

RJ/Gaff are basically what they were last year - with Diggins getting no burn and Floyd RShirting, this is it - no playmaking calvalry coming, and we've seen our team be totally shut down a couple of times so far.

AJax/Hawk/Akok/Samson have been up and down. They've all flashed, and they've all disappeared. No consistency.

Tyrese is a beast, Whaley is a Wrench, Polley is streaky. No difference there.

We have a ton of talent. We lack guard play. We foul a lot. We knew that going in. I guess I just wished we knew more - or had made more of an effort to find out more from the unknown pieces.

Will be fun to watch this season play out!

Growth from last year besides Sanogo?

Cole
Tyrese
Polley
Gaff (slightly but still a better player overall)
Akok (call that cheating if you want)

Whaley is the only No that I see

 

[Rico444]

Cole has definitely shown growth. Defensively they as a unit are much better than last year too. It's hard since many are upperclassmen so you won't see the same level of growth as with a freshman, but we lost our best player to the lottery and yet we're better than last year. Don't know if that would be possible without there being growth.

 

[Hans Sprungfeld]

Yea I think most of this is true - The part I don't agree with at all - and drives most of our difference here is that I'm not sure "already demonstrating progress in addressing some of our already identified challenges and growth opportunities" is true. Outside of Sanogo's offseason development, where is the growth? Where is the demonstrated progress?

This is biggest thing for me in assessing our chances this year, is to look after 10 games and see what progress has been made that makes me believe we leveled up. We have played the soft part of our calendar - the part where we would have 25 point games and give players chances to make mistakes or earn their spot - and the players who are going to separate/elevate themselves do it.

But we really haven't taken that step as a team and in our roles. I'm not sure what we've learned, and that is bad since we are 1/3 of the way through here.

RJ/Gaff are basically what they were last year - with Diggins getting no burn and Floyd RShirting, this is it - no playmaking calvalry coming, and we've seen our team be totally shut down a couple of times so far.

AJax/Hawk/Akok/Samson have been up and down. They've all flashed, and they've all disappeared. No consistency.

Tyrese is a beast, Whaley is a Wrench, Polley is streaky. No difference there.

We have a ton of talent. We lack guard play. We foul a lot. We knew that going in. I guess I just wished we knew more - or had made more of an effort to find out more from the unknown pieces.

Will be fun to watch this season play out!

Others here have weighed in on off-season growth and pre-season preparation.

My "already being addressed" phrase was written with reference to what has been uncovered in the first month of the season.

I think that each season has its high anticipation in advance, wild mood swings between irrational exuberance & intractable despair during the unveiling of the team in competition, and, if the team is not a washout, a seasonal arc that responds to identified issues & challenges.

Many of the issues & challenges for this season are holdovers from prior seasons. Some people are impatient that these haven't always been settled once and for all. Others, like myself, aren't so surprised that this is the case. To that extent, closing out games was a massive issue 2 seasons ago, a continued though less massive issue last year, and a remaining issue today. Prior to the opening of the Big East season, the team is 3-2 in such games, including a P5 win. I believe that both the Michigan State and West Virginia losses were winnable games that were disappointing losses. But neither was a disaster, so much as they were confirmation that, yep, this is still a thing. Last Saturday's game was tense and imperfect, but the final 4 minutes were successful after the insecurities of the prior 4 minutes likely had many watchers going, "OMIGOD no, not again."

 

[Pudge]

I love you all but you're all mad hatters.

The tournament is all about guard play, teams that are great at situational play and closing out half/games, and teams that play with confidence.

Those are precisely our 3 biggest weaknesses. We play inefficiently and leave a lot of points in the board. We STRUGGLE big-time defending without fouling and getting stops, especially against good guards.

On talent, we can get to sweet 16 on talent alone, but we are just as likely to lose in Rd 1 cuz we lose our nerve and a 13 seed hits a bunch of 3s.

and I am going to agree ... and then go the other way

RJ Cole has given us hope. We win when a guard shows leadership and chutzpah to get those key points late in shot clocks and late in games. In a year that is simply chaotic, that's a puncher's chance. Baylor and Gonzaga and Duke and UCLA ... all good. But there is nothing there telling me that in a tight last 4 minutes, they have an RJ. Or anything comparable