OT: USA 3 Panama 2

[John]

Don't believe that to be true in CT unless it changed very, very recently. I've seen a female player play on both premier and ODP regional teams with international travel between junior and senior high school seasons? Are we talking two different things?

I might be confused too on what's "premier". I'm thinking organizations like Acedemia Futbol Club in Cheshire, etc. I'm prety sure those kids play on both AFC and High School teams.

 

[Carl Spackler]

http://ussda.demosphere.com/Profiles/index_E.html

THe only one I recognize is the one in Bridgeport. They play at the University of Bridgeport facilities - right down the road from the Webster bank arena we'll be playing some hoops at soon.

 

[Carl Spackler]

According to this 2013-2014, is the first inaugural year of a U13/U14 Academy season nationwide. 22 new clubs were added.

http://www.ussoccer.com/news/develo...-launch-of-2013-14-u13-14-academy-season.aspx

 

[FrostyNuggets]

But if we are all being honest about why the US, a country of over 300 million and with more resources / fields than any other country in the world, cannot compete for a World Cup, the answer is exactly what you just supplied us with. The fact that too many of our youth teams are not properly coached. It's not your fault, but it is exactly what it is...[/I]

Coaching is the least of the problems, much bigger issues are:

1-elite players in other countries are identified by the time they are 10 and sign with professional teams to develop.
2-The college model does not serve the international game well for player development. I know exceptions can be identified, but the American messi won't be developed in the NCAA structure
3-the mentality that soccer is a scholarship vehicle
4-Americans buck international rules (substitution, etc)
5-if we are all being honest, not enough of the 300 million give a f!ck about the game.

 

[BlueMAB]

Who says I wasted my time? Besides you, that is. I just ran into a kid I coached the other day. Actually not a kid, he's in his late-30's. We had a few laughs and went on our way. It was fun. Like rec sports should be.

Congratulations.

If you're done playing a martyr, maybe you'll realize you are still missing the point.

 

[UConnDan97]

I didn't say I believed or didn't believe it how well coached US youth soccer was compared to England, just passed along what a Brit friend shared with me from his experience when talking about the coaching his kids are getting in the US. I am sure with your experience coaching youth soccer in both the UK and the US you would know best though.... You're also talking about 15 and 16 year olds, he was referencing 8-9-10 year olds.

I love it. How about this; you take your anecdotal evidence from that one story you heard, and I'll take the rest of soccer (or footballing, if you like) history on my side. Which one do you think wins?

And yes, I was specifically talking about 15 year olds on the Juniors sides, but they also have even younger players, like on the Pulcini or Giovanissimi versions:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Juventus_F.C._Youth_Sector

What I'm telling you is that the top players in other major soccer countries are getting a higher level of technical training than our top players. And it's not even debatable....so I'm sorry if that upsets you...

 

[UConnDan97]

High School Fields??? So is it safe to say you've never heard of The Developmental Academy?

http://academy.demosphere.com/Clubs/index_E.html

It's safe to say that I HAVE heard of it. It's safe to say that you HAVEN'T heard of the junior club leagues that I'm talking about. See the aforementioned post for more info...

 

[UConnDan97]

Coaching is the least of the problems, much bigger issues are:

1-elite players in other countries are identified by the time they are 10 and sign with professional teams to develop.
2-The college model does not serve the international game well for player development. I know exceptions can be identified, but the American messi won't be developed in the NCAA structure
3-the mentality that soccer is a scholarship vehicle
4-Americans buck international rules (substitution, etc)
5-if we are all being honest, not enough of the 300 million give a f!ck about the game.

I agree with everything that you said, except for the first sentence. I would argue that your points numbered 1 and 2 are directly related to the fact that coaching is a big problem here. In other countries, coaches are the ones identifying the talent in the younger squads, and coaches are the ones that are developing players at ages younger than college.

But you are absolutely correct in all five points...

 

[Kgun7]

Nobody is arguing with you ... if your point is that the US is lagging behind the rest of the world when it comes to developing elite level soccer talent. That point is pretty obvious based on results.

However, when you mention the difference in developing talent as US high schools vs. Italian Junior sides ... without mentioning The Academy, I wasn't sure if you knew The Academy existed. I think it was a safe assumption since you never mentioned it.

Now that you've stated that you knew about the academy ... why would you say that it's US high schools vs Italian Junior sides? Nobody within US soccer is scouting high school games. And I'm pretty sure that SAMCRO's Brit was probably talking about academy ... as the development is pretty high level and the results are just beginning to be appreciated since it's inception in 2007.

My friend's son is a U13 with Oakwood and he travels to Jersey, Philly, or Baltimore almost every weekend. The playing scheduled is based on a 10 month model. If he stays on this pace he will never play for his high school. And if academy starts to phase in their residency plans in the next few years, he may not even be living at home while in his high school years. Of course those are big ifs ... and my friend openly admits his kid could end up in high school anyway ... which means he'll probably never be scouted by Claudio Reyna!

 

[RioDog]

When my brother and I were kids, we had a football, baseball gear, a soccer ball and hockey gear. We had a big field at the end of our street to play in, and a pond in the woods behind our house to play hockey on in the winter. I can without reservation say that our game of choice to play with our friends (even in the winter) was American football. Soccer was generally second, with the occasional baseball or hockey game.

I've been traveling to Brazil for 20 years and living here since 2010. My nephews, students and friends' kids play futebol. Period. It is team sport option 1, 2, 3 and 4.

Option 1- full field traditional futebol.
Option 2- beach soccer.
Option 3- Futsal- which has its own professional league and is very popular.
Option 4- fute-volei- volleyball using soccer skills (no hands). Very popular at the beach. Some guys who specialize in this sport have AMAZING skills.

AFTER these options come volleyball and basketball as far as team sports are comncerned. Really among my students the second sport after futebol is surfing. They are taught skills as well. Kids whose families have money send them to camps and academies to play. They learn in phys-ed in school. Poor kids play in local campos, and trust me on this, the formal and informal network of scouts is watching EVERY campo for potential talent. Promising kids are identified very quickly, regardless of their socio-economic level. The difference isn't skills being taught, and the development system is secondary. American kids go out the door to play one of 3 or 4 popular team sports. Brazilian kids go out to play futebol. That is the principal difference between Brazilian soccer and American soccer.

That having been said, there is no reason that the sport can't be developed in the U.S. to compete at the highest international level. The process started 20 years ago and hiring Klinsmann was a major step forward.

 

[DarthGrumpy]

I am referring to the ‘Academies’ that are now affiliated and directed by the US Soccer Federation. The link below has the list.

http://academy.demosphere.com/Clubs/index_E.html

HS Soccer in NNJ (Ramapo, Tenafly, Scotch Plains, etc.) is big where I am and it was all over the news last year.

 

[huskymedic]

I am referring to the ‘Academies’ that are now affiliated and directed by the US Soccer Federation. The link below has the list.

http://academy.demosphere.com/Clubs/index_E.html

HS Soccer in NNJ (Ramapo, Tenafly, Scotch Plains, etc.) is big where I am and it was all over the news last year.

These are male only - correct?

 

[UConnDan97]

Nobody is arguing with you ... if your point is that the US is lagging behind the rest of the world when it comes to developing elite level soccer talent. That point is pretty obvious based on results.

However, when you mention the difference in developing talent as US high schools vs. Italian Junior sides ... without mentioning The Academy, I wasn't sure if you knew The Academy existed. I think it was a safe assumption since you never mentioned it.

Now that you've stated that you knew about the academy ... why would you say that it's US high schools vs Italian Junior sides? Nobody within US soccer is scouting high school games. And I'm pretty sure that SAMCRO's Brit was probably talking about academy ... as the development is pretty high level and the results are just beginning to be appreciated since it's inception in 2007.

My friend's son is a U13 with Oakwood and he travels to Jersey, Philly, or Baltimore almost every weekend. The playing scheduled is based on a 10 month model. If he stays on this pace he will never play for his high school. And if academy starts to phase in their residency plans in the next few years, he may not even be living at home while in his high school years. Of course those are big ifs ... and my friend openly admits his kid could end up in high school anyway ... which means he'll probably never be scouted by Claudio Reyna!

You say that nobody is arguing with me, but I'm pretty sure there are a few in this thread who are arguing with me about developing elite level soccer talent. And one of them, you've already mentioned.

I'm well versed in all the options for soccer in this country, as well as being well versed in the options at Oakwood (that's where you'll find me on Sunday nights every week...I've been playing there since I was about 16...). Don't let the football avatar fool you; I've never played a single down of organized football (American). Just some tackle football at the park growing up. But I've played soccer for over 30 years, and I've coached as well, including a travel team. My point was, and still is, we are behind the leading countries in terms of technical development. I agree with RioDog that we have been making positive strides over the last 20 years, but we are not there yet. Anyone who tells you that we are is not being fully honest...

 

[Pudge]

Aren't some of you missing the point ...

You have 5-9 years running around on a field. Enjoying being on a Team. WTF. That is far better than a many of their alternatives. We don't have to be a nation that always has the BEST sports training because we want to compete at the World Cup level. I think its great that Waquoit is out there getting kids active and having fun.

How are we going to improve? The American way. Elite kids are going to be spotted (as I remember when I was coaching) at 5 and 6 and go to travel squads ... and go to a Regional training program ... and go to a NIKE sponsored network. We won't be Italy or England. But, we can get better. We are clearly seeing elements of that in the last few years.

 

[Pudge]

5 MLS teams that outdraw baseball

http://www.fidelity.mobi/fiw/GetNew...76443&IMG=&pageoff=0&CUR_STORYID=&cur_action=

That article is crap. I love that the MLS league is really doing well ... and many many franchises are exciting. But, please ... don't tell me that the LA Galaxy is like the Yankees. etc etc

 

[UConnDan97]

Aren't some of you missing the point ...

You have 5-9 years running around on a field. Enjoying being on a Team. WTF. That is far better than a many of their alternatives. We don't have to be a nation that always has the BEST sports training because we want to compete at the World Cup level. I think its great that Waquoit is out there getting kids active and having fun.

How are we going to improve? The American way. Elite kids are going to be spotted (as I remember when I was coaching) at 5 and 6 and go to travel squads ... and go to a Regional training program ... and go to a NIKE sponsored network. We won't be Italy or England. But, we can get better. We are clearly seeing elements of that in the last few years.

It can't be both??? Are you saying you can't have the casual people like Waquoit helping out youth to have some fun AND to also become great in the sport as a nation??

I'd argue that we CAN have both. I'd argue that we CAN be as good as Italy or England. In fact, I'm pretty sure we will be. Look at how we've handled CONCACAF in recent history. It used to be that we needed a miracle goal from Paul Caligiuri against Trinidad and Tobago to even get in the WC. Now, we expect to be the top team on the continent...

 

[Pudge]

No one should ignore the pure good thing that has happened. Parents get their kids running around with a soccer ball. Far easier at that young age than baseball or hoop ... and I still can't believe the Pop Warner stuff. Yes, YOU can have a good clean fun sport and training for elite levels.

Caligiuri? I was an athlete in HS; I could run and was never afraid of contact. One year (SOPH) I had a heart murmur and the doctor wanted me not to play football. When I got passed by the cardiologist, the Football coach told me it was too late in Sept. My Biology teacher was the Soccer coach of this very large NYS high school. He knew me from track. With little fanfare, he talked me into playing Soccer and put me on the field the first week (having never played). So ... from that - Varsity soccer having never played ... to Caligiuri (and a rather unimpressive 1990 roster) ... to Today: that's light years in 35 years. We are a big country and the capacity to have lots of elite athletes moving quickly to a USMNT.
My English friends tell me that there are 50 better Pro leagues than the MLS. I laugh. I see everything getting far better with the US in this sport. We will get to a great competitive level in a few World Cups.

 

[ZooCougar]

That article is crap. I love that the MLS league is really doing well ... and many many franchises are exciting. But, please ... don't tell me that the LA Galaxy is like the Yankees. etc etc

That's not what it said.

 

[ZooCougar]

Aren't some of you missing the point ...

You have 5-9 years running around on a field. Enjoying being on a Team. WTF. That is far better than a many of their alternatives. We don't have to be a nation that always has the BEST sports training because we want to compete at the World Cup level. I think its great that Waquoit is out there getting kids active and having fun.

How are we going to improve? The American way. Elite kids are going to be spotted (as I remember when I was coaching) at 5 and 6 and go to travel squads ... and go to a Regional training program ... and go to a NIKE sponsored network. We won't be Italy or England. But, we can get better. We are clearly seeing elements of that in the last few years.

That whole hope elite kids get spotted thing just doesn't work. You have to raise the overall level of play because it was too low, our elites just really aren't that elite otherwise.

 

[Waquoit]

Congratulations.

If you're done playing a martyr, maybe you'll realize you are still missing the point.

I get the point fine. You think kids playing soccer for fun is a waste of time. "Playing the martyr". What a douchy thing to say.