OT: LeBron

[willie99]

All of the LeBron hate is from the Decision/Pep rally. Time for people to get over it. I have.

you're right, but I have no reason to like him

 

[JaYnYcE]

All of the LeBron hate is from the Decision/Pep rally. Time for people to get over it. I have.

I'm a lifelong hater of the prior to Lebron ever playing a single minute of professional basketball. I will gladly continue to hate him and the rest of his team.

 

[JaYnYcE]

thats what the media has brainwashed you to believe your whole life. obviously its great to win and it makes a resume look better.

but, its a lazy and illogical way of looking at individual talent. if somehow the Heat lost the game last night, by your measures, it's held against him.

just as a point of reference... he put up a postseason in '09 that had game logs of the following (all the while shooting 51% and avg 9 reb and 7 assists): 38,29,25,36,34,27,47,27,49,35,41,44,37,25 ... they didn't win the title (obviously), you're blaming him? somehow thats a knock on him?

winning is a team accomplishment regardless of what the 'experts' tell you.

No one has brainwashed me to believe anything. The fact is you're playing to win championships. If your team comes up short and you're the best player on the team, people will look to you as not getting it done. Just because thats my opinion doesn't mean its wrong.

 

[Dogdeacon]

fair post Dogdeacon.

i have one question tho. other than the 'decision' and the 'welcome celebration' (which obviously were both idiotic) when has he ever done anything 'look at me' off the court. I live in Miami and he's NEVER out in public like Wade or other guys are, he doesn't do much in terms of media spots and he's not really a loud guy. its another thing i don't get about the hatred.

as for OKC, if that happens (big if)... i think their 4 are greater than Miami's 3. especially with Bosh limited and Wade playing like this. Lebron and Wade will both need to be on top of their games to pull that series off. will be fun to watch as a basketball fan first.

The look at me stuff isn't anything beyond what that most athletes do these days, the unnecessary glasses, a twitter feed, the very obvious 'brand' management and consciousness. These things don't inspire anything near hate and are perhaps unavoidable or even smart business decisions. So more why almost all athletes are less likable personally these days.

The other thing with "The Decision" is it did give the public what WE THINK is the one true window into LeBron's judgement and true self. It showed poor decision making, surrounding himself with yes men or bad advisers and a high degree of vanity and self aggrandizement. So until we see concrete evidence of something else people are convinced this is who he truly is. Kind of like Tiger Woods. Tiger's got no other misteps other than one even more massive reveal of a selfish liar. Opinions of LeBron should be much higher than Woods (mine certainly are) but its a similar dynamic.

At this point I don't think too many pure basketball fans are hating on LeBron or the Heat for the decision. Now I think its more being anti-favorites (rooting against Dook or Yankees) combined with not liking the violation of pickup basketball rule that you try and spread out the talent. I literally don't want the Heat to win because I think combining 2 of the best 5 players is somehow unfair AND it was a poor choice in that their games overlap too much. The whole is less than sum of parts vs say the Celtics or Spurs where its much greater. That's kind of a purity of basketball thing where you want to see good team play win out. Can argue that happened last year but the Mavericks also very clearly needed the 'best player' and at the time Dirk was at least some variation of best player (most reliable 4thQ scorer?).

 

[JaYnYcE]

I hope he got it out of his system, don't want to see a game like that on Saturday

conversely, were the Celtics drugged up?

Same here. Boston had all the momentum and he just snatched it back singlehandedly. Lets hope the C's can do Knick fans and possibly the world a favor and win game 7 in Miami.

 

[nomar]

Let's see what he does in Game 7. Because if the Celtics win then people are still going to regard him as a choker, regardless of how unfair that may be.

I really don't see either of these teams beating the Thunder, but who knows.

 

[HuskyHawk]

and it wasn't even his best playoff performance. his game in Detroit and arguably Orlando were at least as impressive.

he's a monster. and unlike many of our faux-stars that people love to praise, he is efficient.

On a numbers basis, perhaps not. But in terms of coming at the right time, at a crucial juncture, I think it was his finest moment.

 

[JaYnYcE]

fair post Dogdeacon.

i have one question tho. other than the 'decision' and the 'welcome celebration' (which obviously were both idiotic) when has he ever done anything 'look at me' off the court. I live in Miami and he's NEVER out in public like Wade or other guys are, he doesn't do much in terms of media spots and he's not really a loud guy. its another thing i don't get about the hatred.

as for OKC, if that happens (big if)... i think their 4 are greater than Miami's 3. especially with Bosh limited and Wade playing like this. Lebron and Wade will both need to be on top of their games to pull that series off. will be fun to watch as a basketball fan first.

You're disqualified from partaking in any Lebron disscussion.

 

[21Huskies]

On a numbers basis, perhaps not. But in terms of coming at the right time, at a crucial juncture, I think it was his finest moment.

which is because it happened last night and against a team (which i'm guessing, but have no idea) you like.

by one objective measure, it was his 8th best postseason performance. i'd never put last night over scoring 29 of the last 30 points in a game 5 in Detroit. That was his finest moment and there are many who'd say his effort in Orlando was even better than Detroit.
http://espn.go.com/blog/truehoop/miamiheat/post/_/id/14723/where-does-gm-6-rank-among-james-best

 

[UChusky916]

I'm a Celtics fan but by the end of that game I was rooting for LeBron to get to 50, that's how good he was. Easily among the best basketball games I've ever seen anyone play.

Its not relevant to me to constantly evaluate & dissect LeBron on a historical basis. What is interesting is that even though I'm a Celtics fan I think an NBA finals of OKC - Heat would be far more entertaining basketball so I'm clinging to that as a bright side if the Celtics throw out another clunker like they did last night.

In this playoffs I've come to dislike Wade a little more as his body of chippy play (Rondo last year, Kobe in the all-star game) reached a tipping point for me. I still hate the Heat's lame supporting cast & Bosh. But I won't be rooting against Miami with the same vitrol as I had last year mostly because at least basketball-wise LeBron is awfully tough to dislike. And LeBron is kind of putting up a Shaq style off the court resume = maybe too much look at me stuff but given the attention level easy to see how one succumbs to that and he's kept his nose 100% clean off the court. Ultimately though it'd still be nice to see Durant triumph over a fully actualized LeBron James and hoist the symbolic belt of 'best of 2012'.

Holy , a rational Celts fan!?!!?!

 

[Dogdeacon]

You're disqualified from partaking in any Lebron disscussion.

No that's not fair. We'd also have to throw out anyone who lives in Ohio. Both opinions are relevant, doesn't every basketball fan hate the Dennis Rodman, Kevin Garnett, Stephen Jackson, etc.. type until that guy is on their team?! So its definitely worth hearing how Miami fans or residents feel about LeBron. Now I do think we'd have to recuse 21huskies on any discussions regarding wearing massive gold chains or pastel sports jackets

 

[JaYnYcE]

Your team is on the brink of playing for an NBA Championship and this might be the final year of your core group. And you were you rooting for James to score more points? Call me crazy but I don't see how you're a fan. This isn't a regualar season game, or a preseason game. This was a CLOSEOUT game, how in the world do you root for the best player on the other team to keep scoring? Holy crap!

 

[JaYnYcE]

No that's not fair. We'd also have to throw out anyone who lives in Ohio. Both opinions are relevant, doesn't every basketball fan hate the Dennis Rodman, Kevin Garnett, Stephen Jackson, etc.. type until that guy is on their team?! So its definitely worth hearing how Miami fans or residents feel about LeBron. Now I do think we'd have to recuse 21huskies on any discussions regarding wearing massive gold chains or pastel sports jackets

Whats the difference between a rational Miami fan living in Miami and a rational Duke fan in living in NC? Would you be so cordial and accepting of his/her opinions as well?

 

[21Huskies]

Whats the difference between a rational Miami fan living in Miami and a rational Duke fan in living in NC? Would you be so cordial and accepting of his/her opinions as well?

i'd listen to anyone who makes a rational point thats defended with data. just like i'd bash a UConn fan for making an irrational, subjective point that has no basis.

 

[JaYnYcE]

i'd listen to anyone who makes a rational point thats defended with data. just like i'd bash a UConn fan for making an irrational, subjective point that has no basis.

Listen Bill Nye, being irrational and hating another team is part of being a fan. Sometimes its just not about the numbers or data. I'll be sure to look for you on this board if UConn and Duke ever make to a national title game in the future and Duke has the player of the year playing for them.

 

[Excalibur]

Your team is on the brink of playing for an NBA Championship and this might be the final year of your core group. And you were you rooting for James to score more points? Call me crazy but I don't see how you're a fan. This isn't a regualar season game, or a preseason game. This was a CLOSEOUT game, how in the world do you root for the best player on the other team to keep scoring? Holy crap!

I believe he qualified it to say he felt that way once it was obvious the Heat would win.

 

[21Huskies]

look back thru the hoops board when Kemba was playing horribly midseason and before the Big East tournament and was killing us shooting 30% and jacking up 20 shots per game. i was crushing him and calling for his head. Then he went on an insane run and won us a championship. I loved every second of it even tho he made me look like an idiot.

I believe in the data and i cheer with my heart.

 

[Kitaman]

All of the LeBron hate is from the Decision/Pep rally. Time for people to get over it. I have.

Exactly. It was an immature move and certainly a bad decision. Nothing more.

I would bet if he would do it again it would be done differently. There are other players that are adored more who produce less (and more chaos) for their team than Lebron. He's a good kid that became an adult ,or thrust into the adult world, too fast and seemingly without counsel.

 

[JaYnYcE]

I believe he qualified it to say he felt that way once it was obvious the Heat would win.

There is no way to qualify a statement like that if you're team is less than 48 minutes from the Finals, I'm sorry.

 

[JaYnYcE]

look back thru the hoops board when Kemba was playing horribly midseason and before the Big East tournament and was killing us shooting 30% and jacking up 20 shots per game. i was crushing him and calling for his head. Then he went on an insane run and won us a championship. I loved every second of it even tho he made me look like an idiot.

I believe in the data and i cheer with my heart.

I'll take your word for it. I guess every fanbase has at least one.

 

[ZenConn]

Just got home and flipped on the game...

Ah, who made him mad? That stat line is berserk.

Great game. If he wants to disappear in the 4th quarter like he normally does, he has to play like this for a half.

 

[HuskyHawk]

Exactly. It was an immature move and certainly a bad decision. Nothing more.

I would bet if he would do it again it would be done differently. There are other players that are adored more who produce less (and more chaos) for their team than Lebron. He's a good kid that became an adult ,or thrust into the adult world, too fast and seemingly without counsel.

Agreed. Never had a problem with him in Cleveland. I thought he should leave Cleveland, but quietly, with no fanfare. I also think he made a huge mistake and should have gone to Chicago, where the existing personnel were much more complementary to his game. D-Wade plays like a shorter Lebron....they are mismatched as teamates.

 

[BigErnMcCracken]

I dont have any allegiance to Lebron but it seems like, for a kid who's been called the second coming since he was 16 and who is without question the most scrutinized athlete in America, whose day to day is basically on display in the age of twitter and social media and 24 hour news cycles, he's handled all the attention remarkably well. Almost frighteningly well. He gets talked into the occasional misstep like The Decision but how is that any worse than Harrison Barnes calling a press conference to Skype his college announcement?

And, beyond that, he is an absolute freak of nature on the basketball court. That team is horrific without him. And he plays more minutes than anyone. And he guards all 5 positions on the court. Give him Ibaka, Perkins, Harden and Westbrook and see what he could do.

 

[JaYnYcE]

How old is Harrison Barnes and how old is LeBron James?

 

[ZenConn]

And, beyond that, he is an absolute freak of nature on the basketball court. That team is horrific without him. And he plays more minutes than anyone. And he guards all 5 positions on the court. Give him Ibaka, Perkins, Harden and Westbrook and see what he could do.

OKC shows that you don't need 3 stars making ridiculous money to make it to the finals. All 3 of their contracts has handcuffed the team on what moves they can make to improve their bench.