OT - Lebron sticking up for Ray

[J-dog]

bottom line... The Celtics were not showing any loyalty to Ray Allen with all of the potential trades they were working, so why would he want to stay? He found the best situation with a team that wanted him... Who can fault him for that?

 

[uconndennis]

Stopped reading your post once I saw that to you, every player on the Jordan bulls roster was a "star"... You call kukoc a "star", really? As in... Really? A star??

really? that's the guy you pick on in that....fine, I dont care..throw Kukoc out...and of course he wasnt a "star"....throw the rest of the roster out, for all I care

Jordan still had Pippen and Rodman...hall of famers!!!!

I dont even care for Lebron, but the bitching and moaning that he chose to play with 1 other star and 1 other very good player is utterly ridiculous. For sake...your own Celtics had "The Big Three"...i dont see you crying about how they put that together

 

[SheemTheDream]

You don't get it. KG's a thug. And Rondo's a world-class . The Celtics are jerks. Understand now?

D-wade is a thug, so what? Both him and KG are lauded as great teammates. I think the rondo issue was more important to ray's decision.

 

[UCHuskies08]

Oh my god, you side with Lebron here?

If you don't understand how these are 2 completely different situations, you're an idiot.

Ray Allen chose to leave as a free agent and sign for less money than he could have made in order to play with the Heat (without a doubt his former team's #1 enemy) and have the best chance for a ring.
KG and Pierce left Boston by being traded... Pierce likely would have rather retired in green and white, KG had a no trade clause that he waived ended up waiving, but understand that it wasnt as if Pierce and KG came to Ainge and asked to be traded... They didn't ditch the team, the team moved in a different direction, which they understood, and would obviously rather not deal with a rebuild and be the focus of the team while aging and losing their prowess.

Ray Allen is a mushroom cap for going to the Heat, and I completely idolized Rayray growing up. Had he not won a ring with the celtics, he could go to the Heat and I wouldn't fault him for it. However, once you win a ring, taking less money to go to the top contender (or even A top contender) makes you a greedy , which is what I consider Ray from that move.

Watching Heat games, I 100% root for Ray to take and make every shot, I don't dislike the guy, but that was a greedy, whiny, petty move he made there.

What a piece of s*** post this is. Somehow taking less money makes you greedy. Wow. Classic butthurt Boston sports fan.

 

[MilliniumPrince]

You are, quite simply, out of your damn mind. Pierce was constantly the subject of trade rumors.

So was Ray.

 

[Gurleyman]

Oh my god, you side with Lebron here?

If you don't understand how these are 2 completely different situations, you're an idiot.

Ray Allen chose to leave as a free agent and sign for less money than he could have made in order to play with the Heat (without a doubt his former team's #1 enemy) and have the best chance for a ring.
KG and Pierce left Boston by being traded... Pierce likely would have rather retired in green and white, KG had a no trade clause that he waived ended up waiving, but understand that it wasnt as if Pierce and KG came to Ainge and asked to be traded... They didn't ditch the team, the team moved in a different direction, which they understood, and would obviously rather not deal with a rebuild and be the focus of the team while aging and losing their prowess.

Ray Allen is a mushroom cap for going to the Heat, and I completely idolized Rayray growing up. Had he not won a ring with the celtics, he could go to the Heat and I wouldn't fault him for it. However, once you win a ring, taking less money to go to the top contender (or even A top contender) makes you a greedy , which is what I consider Ray from that move.

Watching Heat games, I 100% root for Ray to take and make every shot, I don't dislike the guy, but that was a greedy, whiny, petty move he made there.

Out of curiosity, how do you feel about the Celtics getting Jason Terry before Ray left? Terry wasn't brought in to play 8 mpg backing up Rondo, as some C's fans tried to portray it. He was brought in to score.

I looked at it as a business decision - frankly Terry was probably a better fit, since he could create off the dribble better than Ray at that stage of his career and the Cs needed another breakdown the D guy. And they couldn't afford to wait and not have a scoring 2 guard at all. Once Terry was on board and Ray was looking at possibly slipping to the fringes of the rotation if Bradley moved into the starting lineup, the best business decision for him was clearly Miami (since Crawford was with the Clips at that point).

Sound business decisions by both, if you ask me. The Celtics weren't whiny greedy s for not waiting for Ray to decide on a deal. They have a business to run. Likewise, Ray wasn't any of things for weighing his options, and taking the best one he had.

 

[Kembacity]

I can't understand your logic at all here, are you saying because ray already had a ring he should have just said ok I'm good and waited to retire? Your legacy in pro sports is determined by a lot of factors, but the number of rings you have is the most important. Regardless of who the player is, if they leave city A for city B, and city B wins the title, it was the right move regardless of any other factors.

That's absolutely not true. No one considers Robert Horry a perennial Allstar, and no one will think that way of Derek Fisher no matter how many championships he played in.

I don't think Ray Allen should have waited to retire, but him going to the heat the first chance he got just basically is a slap in the face to the team that gave him the opportunity to win his first title. So maybe Ray is such a delicate baby that he felt so wronged by the celtics as an organization so he made that move, which by definition would be petty.

As I've said, I didn't hate on ray for leaving boston, only for the team he went to which represents all that is horrible with the NBA. The second they signed him, lebron and wade start acting like the biggest Ray Allen fans in the world. If he was still a Celtic and he broke his leg in half like Kevin ware, they'd mock him like they did Dirk Nowitzki.

Also... Ray whined about the fact that the celtics signed Jason terry, yet he went right to the team that already had a knock down 3 point shooter in mike Miller. So basically he was the Jason terry to mike miller, it's not like he whined about playing time and went to a team with good pieces but lacking a good SG or lacking a great 3point shooter.

 

[Kembacity]

really? that's the guy you pick on in that....fine, I dont care..throw Kukoc out...and of course he wasnt a "star"....throw the rest of the roster out, for all I care

Jordan still had Pippen and Rodman...hall of famers!!!!

I dont even care for Lebron, but the bitching and moaning that he chose to play with 1 other star and 1 other very good player is utterly ridiculous. For sake...your own Celtics had "The Big Three"...i dont see you crying about how they put that together

I've already responded to this moronic defense about the heat vs the celtics big 3's. The celtics big 3 was formed via trades, and contained 3 aging stars who were still effective, but past their primes.

The heat were built via free agency and guys reducing their pay so the team could sign tons of stars and basically just create an Allstar team. Their 3 stars were young and still are young. Maybe wade was slightly past his prime due to his knee troubles, but lebron and bosh were in their prime. 2 aspects that make the big 3s totally different

 

[ctchamps]

That's absolutely not true. No one considers Robert Horry a perennial Allstar, and no one will think that way of Derek Fisher no matter how many championships he played in.

I don't think Ray Allen should have waited to retire, but him going to the heat the first chance he got just basically is a slap in the face to the team that gave him the opportunity to win his first title. So maybe Ray is such a delicate baby that he felt so wronged by the celtics as an organization so he made that move, which by definition would be petty.

As I've said, I didn't hate on ray for leaving boston, only for the team he went to which represents all that is horrible with the NBA. The second they signed him, lebron and wade start acting like the biggest Ray Allen fans in the world. If he was still a Celtic and he broke his leg in half like Kevin ware, they'd mock him like they did Dirk Nowitzki.

Also... Ray whined about the fact that the celtics signed Jason terry, yet he went right to the team that already had a knock down 3 point shooter in mike Miller. So basically he was the Jason terry to mike miller, it's not like he whined about playing time and went to a team with good pieces but lacking a good SG or lacking a great 3point shooter.

Allen did what he felt was best for him. His move obviously was disturbing to you! I don't know if Ray was overly sensitive or not but I'm getting the impression that because you hate the Heat you are letting your emotions take over, which is making you act similar to the suggestion you have put on Allen!

I have a similar distaste to teams "buying" a franchise. The Heat didn't buy a franchise imo. Three super players chose to play together. They did so because they liked one another and felt the combination gave a great chance for success. Is that unfair? I don't feel that way. The sports world treats players like commodities and not human beings. So it doesn't bother me when the players can treat the franchises like commodities.

 

[UChusky916]

Some of the worst posts Ive ever seen on this board are in this thread... and THAT´S saying something!

Kembacity... you must be 12 years old or something. Your understanding of the whole situation reeks of immaturity and just plain stupidity.

Celtics homers can´t understand that Ray simply did what was best for him. End of story. Here´s the facts of Ray´s departure...

-Ray is an NBA veteran and had the right to sign with whoever he pleased.
-Ray had been traded multiple times in his career and was a constant subject of trade rumors in Boston. He didn´t want that to happen again by staying there.
-Rondo and Allen didn´t get along. Rondo wasn´t getting Allen the ball in the right spots.
-Celtics only offered Ray MORE money than the Heat AFTER he was linked to the Heat. The Celtics initial proposal to Ray was laughable. Ray knew he was disrespected by the offer and was smart enough to realize that throwing money at someone in desperation is not a sign of respect.

Delusional Celtics homers here need to put their NBA allegiance aside because they are coming across as ridiculous. No, I´m not a Heat fan.

Ray did what he had to do. And he helped his team win a championship. Good for him.

 

[nomar]

D-wade is a thug, so what? Both him and KG are lauded as great teammates. I think the rondo issue was more important to ray's decision.

I think you missed my point. Everybody who's trashing the Celtics...doesn't like the Celtics.

 

[nomar]

Some of the worst posts Ive ever seen on this board are in this thread... and THAT´S saying something!

Kembacity... you must be 12 years old or something. Your understanding of the whole situation reeks of immaturity and just plain stupidity.

Celtics homers can´t understand that Ray simply did what was best for him. End of story. Here´s the facts of Ray´s departure...

-Ray is an NBA veteran and had the right to sign with whoever he pleased.
-Ray had been traded multiple times in his career and was a constant subject of trade rumors in Boston. He didn´t want that to happen again by staying there.
-Rondo was a ty PG and by many accounts a ty person. They obviously didn´t get along.
-Celtics only offered Ray MORE money than the Heat AFTER he was linked to the Heat. The Celtics initial proposal to Ray was laughable. Ray knew he was disrespected by the offer and was smart enough to realize that throwing money at someone in desperation is not a sign of respect.

Delusional Celtics homers here need to put their NBA allegiance aside because they are coming across as ridiculous. No, I´m not a Heat fan.

Ray did what he had to do. And he helped his team win a championship. Good for him.

I'd like to know which "Celtics homers" you're talking about, specifically?

I think most of the Celtics fans here (me, Gurleyman) understand Ray's decision. The fact that we also understand why a guy like Pierce (who was on the block more times than Ray was, and that's a fact) was a little peeved when Ray left doesn't mean we're "homers." It means we're not UConn-only homers who can't see past defending our binkie Walter Ray. Ray made a business decision. It turned out to be right for him. I'm happy for him.

BTW, your "facts" are all opinions and conjecture except for #1. There are two sides to every story and there are a lot of people who'll never see both sides of this one. (I love when one textbook homer calls somebody else a homer because they disagree with him.)

 

[UChusky916]

Celtics fans are always so quick to say Ray took less money to go to the Heat.

What they forget to mention is that the Celtics initial offer was laughable and less than what the Heat offered later. Only after the Heat made an offer did the Celtics offer more.

Good for Ray realizing the games they were playing. He was tired of being disrespected.

 

[UChusky916]

I'd like to know which "Celtics homers" you're talking about, specifically?

I think most of the Celtics fans here (me, Gurleyman) understand Ray's decision. The fact that we also understand why a guy like Pierce (who was on the block more times than Ray was, and that's a fact) was a little peeved when Ray left doesn't mean we're "homers." It means we're not UConn-only homers who can't see past defending our binkie Walter Ray. Ray made a business decision. It turned out to be right for him. I'm happy for him.

BTW, your "facts" are all opinions and conjecture except for #1. There are two sides to every story and there are a lot of people who'll never see both sides of this one. (I love when one textbook homer calls somebody else a homer because they disagree with him.)

I´m not a Heat fan so I´m not a homer one way or another. I have lived in New England all my life and have come to know how delusional certain Boston sports fans can be.

 

[Gurleyman]

That's absolutely not true. No one considers Robert Horry a perennial Allstar, and no one will think that way of Derek Fisher no matter how many championships he played in.

I don't think Ray Allen should have waited to retire, but him going to the heat the first chance he got just basically is a slap in the face to the team that gave him the opportunity to win his first title. So maybe Ray is such a delicate baby that he felt so wronged by the celtics as an organization so he made that move, which by definition would be petty.

As I've said, I didn't hate on ray for leaving boston, only for the team he went to which represents all that is horrible with the NBA. The second they signed him, lebron and wade start acting like the biggest Ray Allen fans in the world. If he was still a Celtic and he broke his leg in half like Kevin ware, they'd mock him like they did Dirk Nowitzki.

Also... Ray whined about the fact that the celtics signed Jason terry, yet he went right to the team that already had a knock down 3 point shooter in mike Miller. So basically he was the Jason terry to mike miller, it's not like he whined about playing time and went to a team with good pieces but lacking a good SG or lacking a great 3point shooter.

Teams play with more than one three-point shooter on the floor, you know. "Three-point shooter" isn't a position. Miller is much too old and creaky to play the 2 - which is Ray's primary position. Miller plays the 3 and sometimes acts as a stretch 4 when the Heat go really small (as does Battier). Terry was direct competition for minutes backing up a Rondo-Bradley backcourt.

He also didn't go to the Heat the first chance he got. He came to the C's with a three-year deal and played five. First time his contract was up, he signed on for two more.

Nothing delicate about what Ray did. You're projecting your own feelings on to him.

 

[UConn990411]

I´m not a Heat fan so I´m not a homer one way or another. I have lived in New England all my life and have come to know how delusional certain Boston sports fans can be.

You act like being delusional is a Boston-only thing. It's not.

New York fans can also be delusional. So, too, can UConn fans. And fans of any team in any sport.

 

[nomar]

I´m not a Heat fan so I´m not a homer one way or another. I have lived in New England all my life and have come to know how delusional certain Boston sports fans can be.

Right, so you're a non-Boston fan living in New England. And that means that you have a clear, non-biased outlook on Boston sports teams and their fans. Got it.

Would you like to hear my thoughts on Yankee fans? I've lived in New York City for 14 years (and in Connecticut for the rest of my life) so that makes me an expert, right?

I didn't say you're a Heat homer. You're a UConn homer. And now, we find out, an anti-Boston guy.

 

[kyle]

This thread is what happens when you care about what that psycho KG says

 

[superjohn]

Kembacity is clearly a little kid so let's be easy on him.

 

[champs99and04]

Kembacity is on one of the worst runs of posts in the history of UConn message boards right now. Let's just stop arguing and bask in history being made.

 

[Dave Carlson]

how was it a greedy move when he took less money?

It is greedy (and almost cheating!) under Massachusetts logic, and there's a lot of Massachusetts thinking going on in this thread.

 

[Scoe]

We dont have to keep going down this road but Ray did what was best for him and thats all that matters. Of course Lebron will stick up for Ray without Ray Lebron would be this generation of Wilt Chamberlain.

 

[Scoe]

Another misinformed opinion....please tell me which "star" ever won a title by themselves?....They all team up and have been doing it forever.

Jordan had Pippen( a top 50 player) plus Rodman, Kukoc, Grant, Paxon, etc....
Bird had McHale, Parrish, etc...
Kobe and Shaq...
Magic had Kareem, Worthy, Perkins, etc..
Duncan has had Robinson, Parker, Ginobli, , etc..
Olajuwon had Drexler
The Bad Boys Pistons


it goes on an on.

The only thing Lebron ever did wrong in going to Miami was announcing it on TV the way he did. He gave Cleveland 7 years to try and help him win a title and they rewarded him with Delonte West and Boobie Gibson.

Hakeem is the only one to win a title without a future HOF, Drexler wasnt there for the Rockets 1st championship, he did have great 3 point shooters around him though like Kenny Smith, Horry, Cassell and Mario Ellie.

Dirk is the only other guy I could think of that won it without another star.

 

[Penfield]

The other thing people are ignoring...
Would Ray have made the Celtics a contender last year?
Would Ray have been on the Celtics this year? Definitely Not
The Celtics needed to clean house and Ray is just one more piece that would have been moved like PP and KG.

Everyone else has moved on at this point and I think it's time the fans did too.

 

[UCweCONN]

Ray is Husky royalty. Don't call him a head on this board. Our only Hall of Fame player and a class act, and you call him a head. Nice.

 

[Huskies4ever]

That's absolutely not true. No one considers Robert Horry a perennial Allstar, and no one will think that way of Derek Fisher no matter how many championships he played in.

I don't think Ray Allen should have waited to retire, but him going to the heat the first chance he got just basically is a slap in the face to the team that gave him the opportunity to win his first title. So maybe Ray is such a delicate baby that he felt so wronged by the celtics as an organization so he made that move, which by definition would be petty.

As I've said, I didn't hate on ray for leaving boston, only for the team he went to which represents all that is horrible with the NBA. The second they signed him, lebron and wade start acting like the biggest Ray Allen fans in the world. If he was still a Celtic and he broke his leg in half like Kevin ware, they'd mock him like they did Dirk Nowitzki.

Also... Ray whined about the fact that the celtics signed Jason terry, yet he went right to the team that already had a knock down 3 point shooter in mike Miller. So basically he was the Jason terry to mike miller, it's not like he whined about playing time and went to a team with good pieces but lacking a good SG or lacking a great 3point shooter.

Yo! Miami wanted him. The defending champs. He wasn't gonna play behind Mike Miller. Are you serious?

Sorry, but MM can knock down shots. Ray's one of the greatest shooters of all time, and is deadly clutch. See the difference?

 

[Chin Diesel]

Dumbest thread I've seen in a while.

How anyone can be critical of any NBA player who changes teams as a free agent is beyond me.

 

[Huskies4ever]

Ray is Husky royalty. Don't call him a head on this board. Our only Hall of Fame player and a class act, and you call him a head. Nice.

^This. And a . And then adds "I don't dislike Ray".......WTF??!!!

 

[Huskies4ever]

Dumbest thread I've seen in a while.

How anyone can be critical of any NBA player who changes teams as a free agent is beyond me.

Yeah, as a FREE agent, he could go wherever he so chose. He wasn't happy at his place of employment, so he chose to go where he felt wanted, and had a better chance at the ultimate goal in his profession. The writing was on the wall. The C's weren't going to get back to that elite level without starting all over again.

And now the C's are totally broken up (which was inevitable). I would say it looks like he made the right decision here.

I know there are some on here that would laud Ray if he left the C's for the TWolves. At least the best team in the league had all the respect in the world for him. Had Miami been courting him as they were and he chose the TWolves.........

Heaven forbid one of you leaves your current job for greener pastures.

 

[Scoe]

Another misinformed opinion....please tell me which "star" ever won a title by themselves?....They all team up and have been doing it forever.

Jordan had Pippen( a top 50 player) plus Rodman, Kukoc, Grant, Paxon, etc....
Bird had McHale, Parrish, etc...
Kobe and Shaq...
Magic had Kareem, Worthy, Perkins, etc..
Duncan has had Robinson, Parker, Ginobli, , etc..
Olajuwon had Drexler
The Bad Boys Pistons




not to nit pick but Perkins never was on any of the Lakers title teams, don't forget about Byron Scott, Michael Cooper, Macadoo (later in his career), Jamaal Wilkes in Magics rookie year.