OT - Lebron sticking up for Ray

[BigErnMcCracken]

Garnett is not a good dude, it was really lousy the things they said about Ray.

This is what is "really lousy" to you?

"I don't have Ray's number anymore. I'm not trying to communicate. I'm just being honest with everybody in here. ... It's just what it is. I told you all, I'm very close to Ray. I know his family. I wish nothing but the best for him and his family. I'm just making a choice on my own. That's all. When a guy makes a decision based on him and his family, you can't ever get upset at that. My personal feeling, I won't put into it. The only thing I'll say is I wish Ray the best. That's where it's at. I'm focusing on Jason Terry and Courtney Lee, the new guys that are here. I wasn't going to come here and answer a bunch of Ray Allen questions, I was going to answer one time and then focus on what's right here in this gym, what's present. And that's where I'm at."

 

[Kembacity]

bordering on the worst post I have ever seen on this board.

Ainge tried to trade Ray multiple times over his last couple years, including the deal to Memphis that fell apart at the last minute in April 2012. So you think he should have re-upped with the C's when he knows that a) they cant win and b)they'll try to deal him again...most likely to a team he doesn't want to go to.

In a professional sports league where careers are limited and free-agnecy only comes around a few times. The ability to play where you're wanted is huge. The Celtics didn't really want Ray, regardless of their offer. He knew it, everyone knew it....except the Celtic fan boys still bitching

Your whiny ass should just say thank you for the title and move on.

I don't think that Ray Allen is a jerk for "leaving Boston"... I think he's a jerk because he already had a ring, and he left Boston for Miami. Its a low move, the same way Lebrons move of teaming up with Wade/Bosh was low. All the old guard said the same thing, if you are the best, you want to beat the best, not team up with the best so you don't have to face them anymore.

 

[Walker11]

So players are greedy when they take less money to play for a contender and greedy when they get a big contract to play for a crap team. I hate the Heat, rooted for them to lose every time I watched, but can't see how Ray can be at fault. Sure, I wish he went to a different team but people here are ridiculous.

 

[aceboon]

ugh, the Lakers 'were' the celtics biggest rival from the old old old days. The Celtics had to play the Heat every year in the playoffs, before having the chance to play the lakers. During the Celts 'big 3' era, the Heat were basically the number 1 and only real competition in the East. Historically, the lakers are still the big rival, because if Lebron went back to Ohio, the Heat would probably not be the stick in the celtics butt they are now, but for now, and for the time when Ray went from the celtics to the heat, the Heat were the Celtics #1 rival.

That's not true, they played in Bron's 1st and 2nd year with the Heat, in the 2nd round and then the ECF, back when the Cs were true title contenders Bron was still with the Cavs.

 

[BigErnMcCracken]

We are discussing Ray Allen's situation here, stop pulling out random scenarios that don't have anything to do with this. Lets look at all the reasons that led to Ray leaving. 1)Ray didn't like Rondo, who on the surface appears to be an ### and reportedly almost got into a fist fight with Doc Rivers, on top of the run ins he's already with Ray, KG, and Pierce. 2)Ray was included in trade scenarios that ultimately led to some bad blood between him and mgmt. 3)Ray was also having his role in the offense reduced, and was becoming reliant on a ball dominant PG who he didn't get along with. With all of these factors brewing, at the end of your career, why would you want to return to a situation that is no longer best for you, on top of playing on a team with no chance to win a title? He put himself in the situation he thought was best for him, as a grown ass man and someone who's put in 15+ years in the league, he earned that right.

That's fine, and I don't disagree with any of that. (Although Paul Pierce probably has a hell of a lot more to say than Ray about what #2 is like.) The issue i have with this board is the martyr treatment that Ray gets; like he was somehow treated unfairly. Both sides made a decision that was in their best interest. Why can't people leave it at that without all the "they were so mean to poor Ray."

 

[BarkingDog]

What comes to mind is Michael Corleone in Vegas trying to make a deal and then telling Fredo "Don't ever speak against the family again."

 

[superjohn]

No two situations are the same, Ray was constantly on the trading block the last couple of years and he and Rondo hated each other. Garnett and Pierce loved their situation because they had security and always got the ball in their spots to be successful, Ray didn't have either of these things.

 

[7774]

Kembacity, I hope you are a little kid, or an adult with a legitimate mental disability.

I really, really need one of those things to be true.

 

[nomar]

Agree with Ern. Needless to say, I love Ray. But it's funny how only the Celtics fans on this board can see the other side of things. I'm more of a Husky fan than I am a Celtics fan, but being on both sides of this I can see how ridiculously partisan both sides are. Celts fans think Ray's a jerk and Husky fans think he was horribly wronged by the Celts. Neither is true.

In any event, as to what LeBron said, it's a laughably terrible comparison. I understand sticking up for your teammate, but it's night and day.

The Celts asked PP and KG to leave. It was mutually beneficial and it was on good terms.

 

[Penfield]

 

[superjohn]

Ray Allen would have to be an absolute idiot to have signed with the Celtics.

 

[OklahomaUconn]

I had a job with one insurance company and later applied and went to a different one because I was unhappy at the first. Am I a cheater too?

If insurance companies played for championships and the insurance company you went to had the best chance to win that championship, then yes, you are greedy. He left to a team for less money for obvious reasons it wasnt a coincidence he went to the best team to win it all.

 

[superjohn]

We are discussing Ray Allen's situation here, stop pulling out random scenarios that don't have anything to do with this. Lets look at all the reasons that led to Ray leaving. 1)Ray didn't like Rondo, who on the surface appears to be an ### and reportedly almost got into a fist fight with Doc Rivers, on top of the run ins he's already with Ray, KG, and Pierce. 2)Ray was included in trade scenarios that ultimately led to some bad blood between him and mgmt. 3)Ray was also having his role in the offense reduced, and was becoming reliant on a ball dominant PG who he didn't get along with. With all of these factors brewing, at the end of your career, why would you want to return to a situation that is no longer best for you, on top of playing on a team with no chance to win a title? He put himself in the situation he thought was best for him, as a grown ass man and someone who's put in 15+ years in the league, he earned that right.

This sums it up perfectly.

 

[Kembacity]

Kembacity, I hope you are a little kid, or an adult with a legitimate mental disability.

I really, really need one of those things to be true.

Nope, I'm a grown ass man who understands an awful comparison when I see one, and I hate the new NBA, where everyone flocks to about 10 teams tops and the others all have to wait for the perfect situation to be relevant again. It's awful, the NBA is mostly useless, the vast majority of teams have no shot, and they won't have a realistic shot for a decade.

If I was a little kid, I'd be a celtics fan while Ray was there and then applaud his moving to Miami so he could win more, and I'd be cheering from the rooftops for the Miami heat even though I was just rooting for their former rival. Kids don't have loyalty in their fandom, moron

 

[MilliniumPrince]

Yeah, you're right, leaving as a free agent and going to your previous teams #1 rival is the exact same thing as being traded by the franchise to a different team and simply not making a big stink about it.

Do you understand the NBA? at all? a player going from 1 team to another isnt the same thing all the time. Case in point, Dwight Howard is a total jerk, Rudy Gay is not. They both changed teams recently... so how could it not be the same exact thing!?

Do you know what a no trade clause is? Clearly, you do not. And maybe you are new to basketball or sports in general, but the Celts biggest rival is and shall always be LA. The Celtics had a rivalry with LeBron, if he leaves next year Boston fans won't remember which city the Heat represent.

Bottom line: KG is at best a hypocrite. He could have denied the trade and stayed loyal to Boston. ...which would have been stupid. Instead, he allowed the trade for one more realistic shot at a ring. So again, he did the same thing Ray did....just not lucky enough to end up with Lebron.

 

[Gurleyman]

Ray Allen would have to be an absolute idiot to have signed with the Celtics.

This - a thousand times this.

Ray was traded on draft day, and was traded from two places he didn't want to leave (Milwaukee, Seattle). Why should he be loyal to Boston when they were phasing him out (as they had every right to)?

Ray also did not have many serious bidders for his services - it was just the Clips, Heat and Celtics at the start of the process. Then the Clips got Crawford, and the Celtics got Terry. That left Miami as his best option basketball-wise, leaving aside any issues with Rondo, etc.

I suppose he could have re-opened his search and seen what Sacramento or Toronto were offering, but he had a good fit.

 

[Hoophound]

All I got out of this thread is:

1. that some people think Ray is greedy for wanting to be happy because if he chose to be unhappy it would be better for the Celtics.

and

2. that other people question whether or not Miami is a major market. (Metro area 5,000,000+)

Consider me dumber for having read it.

 

[superjohn]

Nope, I'm a grown ass man who understands an awful comparison when I see one, and I hate the new NBA, where everyone flocks to about 10 teams tops and the others all have to wait for the perfect situation to be relevant again. It's awful, the NBA is mostly useless, the vast majority of teams have no shot, and they won't have a realistic shot for a decade.

If I was a little kid, I'd be a celtics fan while Ray was there and then applaud his moving to Miami so he could win more, and I'd be cheering from the rooftops for the Miami heat even though I was just rooting for their former rival. Kids don't have loyalty in their fandom, moron

You would have switched teams as a kid and become a fan of the team you consider a rival??? Talk about fair weather, every team I'm a fan of I was a fan of them as a little kid. You stick with your teams through the good and bad, it's called being a fan.

 

[uconndennis]

I don't think that Ray Allen is a jerk for "leaving Boston"... I think he's a jerk because he already had a ring, and he left Boston for Miami. Its a low move, the same way Lebrons move of teaming up with Wade/Bosh was low. All the old guard said the same thing, if you are the best, you want to beat the best, not team up with the best so you don't have to face them anymore.

Another misinformed opinion....please tell me which "star" ever won a title by themselves?....They all team up and have been doing it forever.

Jordan had Pippen( a top 50 player) plus Rodman, Kukoc, Grant, Paxon, etc....
Bird had McHale, Parrish, etc...
Kobe and Shaq...
Magic had Kareem, Worthy, Perkins, etc..
Duncan has had Robinson, Parker, Ginobli, , etc..
Olajuwon had Drexler
The Bad Boys Pistons


it goes on an on.

The only thing Lebron ever did wrong in going to Miami was announcing it on TV the way he did. He gave Cleveland 7 years to try and help him win a title and they rewarded him with Delonte West and Boobie Gibson.

 

[Penfield]

All I got out of this thread is:

1. that some people think Ray is greedy for wanting to be happy because if he chose to be unhappy it would be better for the Celtics.

and

2. that other people question whether or not Miami is a major market. (Metro area 5,000,000+)

Consider me dumber for having read it.

That being said, some NBA markets are certainly smaller than others. Take as an example Miami-Ft. Lauderdale, the nation’s #16 market. With its 1.581 million TV homes, Miami is nowhere close to New York (#1, 7.515M), Los Angeles (#2, 5.667M) or Chicago (#3, 3.503M). It is, however, barely ahead of Cleveland (#18, 1.526M), Orlando (#19, 1.453M), and Sacramento (#20, 1.409M).
In fact, LeBron James, Dwyane Wade and company play in a smaller market than the Timberwolves (#15 Minneapolis has 1.754 million homes) and Pistons (#11 market Detroit has 1.884 million).

 

[Northbound]

Once these guys are professionals the only loyalty these guys should have is to themselves not some dumb ass franchise or fan base. If they want money they should go and get it, if they'd rather have a championship they should find a place to go and get one.

How fans can't wrap their heads around that always amazes me.....it's a business that just has their most high profile employees in short pants versus suits.

 

[FeedTheDove]

Hey sour Celtics fans, I bet this hurts doesn't it?



Stfu and respect greatness. Especially husky greatness. Jesus what a disgrace these guys are.

 

[tcf15]

http://espn.go.com/nba/truehoop/mia...heat-call-former-boston-celtics-players-coach

 

[ctchamps]

I'm not sure there has been a better thread that exemplifies perspective and it's relationship to a topic!

 

[Hoophound]

That being said, some NBA markets are certainly smaller than others. Take as an example Miami-Ft. Lauderdale, the nation’s #16 market. With its 1.581 million TV homes, Miami is nowhere close to New York (#1, 7.515M), Los Angeles (#2, 5.667M) or Chicago (#3, 3.503M). It is, however, barely ahead of Cleveland (#18, 1.526M), Orlando (#19, 1.453M), and Sacramento (#20, 1.409M).
In fact, LeBron James, Dwyane Wade and company play in a smaller market than the Timberwolves (#15 Minneapolis has 1.754 million homes) and Pistons (#11 market Detroit has 1.884 million).

Something is askew there in terms of how TV market size is determined. Miami is the 4th largest urban area and I think the 7 or 8th largest metro in the country. It is a major market by any measure. TV markets can be misleading depending on what areas each so called market gets credited with.