OT: Kevin McHale | The Boneyard

OT: Kevin McHale

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RichZ

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Dumped by Houston? 11 games into the season after taking them to the western Conference finals, and after signing a 3 year 12 mil contract.

I guess you'd better bring your a-game if you're going to work for them.
 
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Maybe he'd be interested in the available big's coaching position at UConn.
haha

jokes aside mchale isn't a 'great' coach but he was definitely just a scapegoat here; he's not the one who brought in that alcoholic pg who has beyond regressed. maybe they weren't responding to mchale, but the fact remains harden and co. have been playing w/ piss poor effort this season. I almost think harden wasn't playing defense to try to get mchale fired the whole time.
 

BUConn10

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I actually agree with Stephen A. here, Dwight isn't carrying his weight relative to his role and paycheck for that team. Much of their woes both offensively and defensively lie on him, and if they were winning McHale probably wouldn't have been fired. I'll be interested to see if the Rockets make a run at Thibs.
 
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I actually agree with Stephen A. here, Dwight isn't carrying his weight relative to his role and paycheck for that team. Much of their woes both offensively and defensively lie on him, and if they were winning McHale probably wouldn't have been fired. I'll be interested to see if the Rockets make a run at Thibs.

sounds like a redundant story
 

polycom

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Dwight isn't as much the problem as it is James Harden. As a Rocket's fan I can tell you, that James Harden is allergic to defense. How do you have a "star" who is 100% allergic to defense and think their team is a NBA finals caliber team he has to be drunk. Defense wins championships and the Rockets are allergic to it. I don't care if you can score 50 points if you give up 51 you lose. People will say Steph Curry is a bad defender as well, I will argue the key difference between Curry and Harden is that Curry will give an effort on defense versus James Harden who will let Deron Williams blow by him. /rant
 
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Dwight isn't as much the problem as it is James Harden. As a Rocket's fan I can tell you, that James Harden is allergic to defense. How do you have a "star" who is 100% allergic to defense and think their team is a NBA finals caliber team he has to be drunk. Defense wins championships and the Rockets are allergic to it. I don't care if you can score 50 points if you give up 51 you lose. People will say Steph Curry is a bad defender as well, I will argue the key difference between Curry and Harden is that Curry will give an effort on defense versus James Harden who will let Deron Williams blow by him. /rant

Steph has been steadily improving on D for his entire career, with a career-best 97 DRtg so far this season (SSS, obviously). Harden, on the other hand, is currently posting a career-worst 109 DRtg and a career-worst 104ORtg, so he's been pretty bad on both ends of the court.
 
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Houston will never win a championship as long as Harden is the "star". He is a good offensive shooter that does not play a lick of defense. His liabilities will be shown in the playoff where teams actually D him up. There are many players who shoot 20 times a game can score 30+ on a given night. He is one of those NBA promotes but is not a complete player by a long stretch. Also, the PG Ty Lawson is another one of those ball hogs so he does not work well with Harden. Harden thinks he is both the PG and SG. He plays 30+ mins a game and does not play any D. Guys like Harden who get MVP considerations simply because they score a lot of points but no one ever mentions the fact these guys shoot like 20+ times a game at under 40% FG.

They should never got rid of Jeremy Lin. Frankly, he is way better fit for them than Lawson. Lin is a team player where Harden is all about his "stats".
 
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Harden is actually a good defender, he just isn't defending. In OKC he was one of their best perimeter defenders. In Houston he has to carry the offense, so he has become lazy on defense. Howard is just a waste of talent. I am not sure how many teams and coaches will get burned before they figure it out.

To fire McHale now makes me believe a coach killing occurred.
 

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I think you can win with James Harden and you can win with Dwight Howard - just not sure you can win with both of them.

Ideally, both guys would be in that third star role, like Chris Bosh/Heat.
 

BUConn10

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I think you can win with James Harden and you can win with Dwight Howard - just not sure you can win with both of them.

Ideally, both guys would be in that third star role, like Chris Bosh/Heat.
Agree with that for Dwight, not so much for Harden. He has shown he can carry a team offensively, and he's not too shabby as a primary ball handler. I think Beverly compliments his skill set a lot more than Lawson, moving him to the bench should help them out.
 
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http://espn.go.com/nba/story/_/id/14167741/boston-celtics-president-danny-ainge-reaches-kevin-mchale

It looks like Ainge wants McHale as the Celtics big man coach. I like the following quote from Ainge.

"Maybe when the dust settles, I can get him out to teach the 'slippery eel' to Kelly [Olynyk] and Sully [Jared Sullinger] andAmir [Johnson]," Ainge told the Herald.

I have never heard the term "slippery eel", but it's not a horrible way to describe Mchale's low post game. I don't think McHale's style/moves are coach able. I only say that because I've never seen anyone with the same types of skills or low post game. Bill Curly at BC sorta did at the college level, but it didn't translate to the NBA.
 
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I guess Duncan has a pretty similar set of moves. Maybe not as many, but Duncan definitely has a lot. They both run sorta funny as well.
 

RipCity

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Harden is a good defender when he wants to be, but never wants to be. That's one thing when you're Kevin Martin, a scoring threat primarily, but when you're a star, your teammates feed off of your energy. Hence the Rockets abysmal defense.

The rockets should've gotten a great defensive PG rather than someone like Lawson, who needs the ball in his hands much like Harden.
 
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Absolutely Harden quit on McHale and helped get him fired, whether it was deserved or not I don't watch them enough to know. I've always thought McHale was just an average coach until he got the Rockets past the Clips last year, which comeback not coincidentally was ignited when he benched Harden. Nonetheless, Harden was within a hair of being the NBA's MVP last year, so he's a first option on almost any team AND his defense was much improved last year.

As for Dwight, I'm irrationally biased against him because he proved me wrong in being the better pick over Emeka, but;
1) he could have saved McHale's job and didn't.
2) alleged improvements in his post-up game haven't occurred despite access to McHale (mutual culpability there)
3) he's already taking days off when they start 4-7?! Don't care if he's old/partially hurt, this illustrates that basketball isn't as important to him as it is to guys that lead teams to championships. Unless Dwight is standing next to LeBron he is a 3rd wheel at best on a championship team.

Houston''s GM has to take some blame here.
1) He extended McHale in the offseason despite knowing that Harden-McHale- Howard was a dysfunctional threesome.
2) Lawson signing - I read a quote by Lawson this summer saying he doesn't have an alcohol problem it was just situational. From 2,000 miles away you can smell denial there. Knew from there he would struggle in Houston and it was irresponsible to sign him without trying to get some sort of no-alcohol clause.
3) So now Harden is running the show. There is no way in HELL that Tibs is coming here to make Harden play harder on defense than on offense. Bickerstaff Jr seems to be a good choice for a coach that can be a collaborator with Harden, but unless they make a major trade or get lucky injury breaks they are a distant 4th contender in the west behind Warriors, Spurs and Clips (I think something may be flawed with OK St too, but that's a TBD story for another day pending healthy Durant)
 
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Dwight isn't as much the problem as it is James Harden. As a Rocket's fan I can tell you, that James Harden is allergic to defense. How do you have a "star" who is 100% allergic to defense and think their team is a NBA finals caliber team he has to be drunk. Defense wins championships and the Rockets are allergic to it. I don't care if you can score 50 points if you give up 51 you lose. People will say Steph Curry is a bad defender as well, I will argue the key difference between Curry and Harden is that Curry will give an effort on defense versus James Harden who will let Deron Williams blow by him. /rant

The thing that offends me about Harden is that to me he isn't allergic to defense, sometimes he racks up 5 steals in a game! It's that he literally blatantly takes plays off on D, where his guy runs back door and he just watches him go, get the pass, and score. He's AWFUL as a basketball idol for any kid, I really hope there aren't many kids who love him...
 
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James Harden @ the 18 second mark. He plays D when he feels like it, is the most egregious flopper in the game and is involved with a Kardashian. What is there to like? Honestly, I don't think you can win with him as your Alpha. I know they made the WCF finals with him, but that Clippers series was an absolute fluke.

 
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http://espn.go.com/nba/story/_/id/14167741/boston-celtics-president-danny-ainge-reaches-kevin-mchale

It looks like Ainge wants McHale as the Celtics big man coach. I like the following quote from Ainge.

"Maybe when the dust settles, I can get him out to teach the 'slippery eel' to Kelly [Olynyk] and Sully [Jared Sullinger] andAmir [Johnson]," Ainge told the Herald.

I have never heard the term "slippery eel", but it's not a horrible way to describe Mchale's low post game. I don't think McHale's style/moves are coach able. I only say that because I've never seen anyone with the same types of skills or low post game. Bill Curly at BC sorta did at the college level, but it didn't translate to the NBA.
McHale was a combo of footwork, slippery eel and long-arms. Theoretically it could be taught, but just b/c McHale could do it that doesn't mean he can teach it. Just b/c he won the tri-valley Daniel-San isn't Mr. Miyagi. Real answer is who taught McHale?

I think Danny was just being a good friend and throwing a compliment Kevin's way when the Slippery Eel was down in the dumps about getting paid $11M over the next 3 years to do nothing.

Also, all eels are slippery.
 

gtcam

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Tibs would shoot harden or vice versa in the first 10 days
Tibs doesn't need to be with an arrogant DB like Harden - he had dealt with Jalen Rose - thats enough at times
 

RipCity

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When you're a players coach like McHale, you run the risk of stars getting too comfortable and giving up when times get tough. Harden gave up. I think he comes out of this looking worse than McHale though honestly. He's just embarrassing himself with the lack of effort and relentless flopping. Where is your passion for the game? I know that's cliche, but if you're frustrated with losing, as a star it's on ou to pull your team up by the bootstraps.

College basketball is so much more enjoyable it's not even close.
 

nomar

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Low-post moves are teachable. Al Jefferson learned them from somebody.
 
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When you're a players coach like McHale, you run the risk of stars getting too comfortable and giving up when times get tough. Harden gave up. I think he comes out of this looking worse than McHale though honestly. He's just embarrassing himself with the lack of effort and relentless flopping. Where is your passion for the game? I know that's cliche, but if you're frustrated with losing, as a star it's on ou to pull your team up by the bootstraps.

College basketball is so much more enjoyable it's not even close.

yeah those warriors man, maybe they can play some 2-3 zone or full court press! b-o-r-i-n-g
 
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The thing that offends me about Harden is that to me he isn't allergic to defense, sometimes he racks up 5 steals in a game! It's that he literally blatantly takes plays off on D, where his guy runs back door and he just watches him go, get the pass, and score. He's AWFUL as a basketball idol for any kid, I really hope there aren't many kids who love him...
Harden's basic MO is to conserve energy on the defensive end. We can't be too critical of that as plenty of UConn alphas have employed that strategy. But Harden takes it to a Loyola Maramount-ian extreme where he makes no effort to stop layups.

I would guess that's the philosophical split with McHale. McHale wanted full defensive effort from Harden and Harden contends that if he does that the offense suffers too much. To prove his point Harden then chooses to play no defense whatsoever and by-bye McHale. Nevermind that Harden's offense has mostly stunk this year too b/c he's not in shape. But I'm sure that was because the coach didn't properly motivate him :confused:
 
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