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I think Serah has to be in the starting lineup.
Now that Serah is on Board. What is the starting 5 for next year?
- Thread starter jabstep
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Blanca is the big question for me. What does it mean if she cracks the starting lineup as a freshman?
One thing it would mean is she’s proven something to Geno in practice. And if she’s done that, she’d also have proven it to her teammates. I suspect none of them would want to feel like they have a starting spot for any other reason than this. If Blanca starts she’ll have their support. One of the effects of Geno’s coaching style is that it acquaints players with themselves: selfless team play requires a bit of self-knowledge. I expect this also makes winning even sweeter.
If Blanca starts she’ll have leapfrogged over Morgan, Allie, Carol and Ash. When any of them rotates in for her during games I’m sure they’ll congratulate her and play their hearts out both to support what the starters have accomplished and to supplant her as a starter in the next game. And if they succeed, she’ll congratulate them and continue the competition for that spot. This is the best kind of camaraderie.
One thing it would mean is she’s proven something to Geno in practice. And if she’s done that, she’d also have proven it to her teammates. I suspect none of them would want to feel like they have a starting spot for any other reason than this. If Blanca starts she’ll have their support. One of the effects of Geno’s coaching style is that it acquaints players with themselves: selfless team play requires a bit of self-knowledge. I expect this also makes winning even sweeter.
If Blanca starts she’ll have leapfrogged over Morgan, Allie, Carol and Ash. When any of them rotates in for her during games I’m sure they’ll congratulate her and play their hearts out both to support what the starters have accomplished and to supplant her as a starter in the next game. And if they succeed, she’ll congratulate them and continue the competition for that spot. This is the best kind of camaraderie.
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I think KK-- who just won Kelsey Plum's "Big Dawg" award for MVP at Plum's point guard academy-- has earned her spot. The idea that a transfer just comes in and is the heir apparent to the starting position makes me uncomfortable and seems really disrespectful to KK.
Additionally, team chemistry is so important, I'm not convinced that two transfers plus three first years (five new players to the team) is necessarily a good thing. Perhaps as important as Paige's basketball skill and acumen was the intangible value she brought to the entire team as support and team glue. She supported Caroline by flying to Florida to be with her during treatment; she was always Azzi's support during her injuries. Her team spirit absolutely found its way to the box score.
And finally, y'all are tempting the injury gods. Being happy with what we have seems to me to be the best way to placate those gods. (Just look at my avatar.)
Additionally, team chemistry is so important, I'm not convinced that two transfers plus three first years (five new players to the team) is necessarily a good thing. Perhaps as important as Paige's basketball skill and acumen was the intangible value she brought to the entire team as support and team glue. She supported Caroline by flying to Florida to be with her during treatment; she was always Azzi's support during her injuries. Her team spirit absolutely found its way to the box score.
And finally, y'all are tempting the injury gods. Being happy with what we have seems to me to be the best way to placate those gods. (Just look at my avatar.)
diggerfoot
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I often have played devil’s advocate, both in regards to length of rotation and newcomers starting. There are times when a #30 ranked recruit starts right away, as with Dolson, and when a #1-2 ranked recruit does not, as with Sales, Ralph, Taurasi and Moore. The difference seems to be more in terms of position of need than the ranking. Even in a positionless offense there is a lead guard who specializes in leading the offense and a Center who anchors the defense. These are the positions where newcomers are most likely to start right away if the need is there.
The portal has added a new wrinkle to “newcomer,” in that they may only be here for one year. When that is the case we have seen those newcomers starting so far, a la Chen and LLS. When they have more than one year available they have not, a la Stevens and Juhacz. While no one is guaranteed playing time, I expect that any accomplished player with just one year left would be reluctant to transfer in unless they thought their opportunity to start in their last year would be favorable. Those with more than one year ahead would be receptive to not starting, considering that even nonstarters in our program have gone on to WNBA careers.
S. Williams transferring in always made sense. While I think El-Affy has shown she can be a competent Center for us, she is still an underclassman with more years ahead to show she deserves to be our starting Center of the future. S. Williams can and likely will start with no adverse affects.
I previously argued against Kneepkens because she only had one year left and would need to start over guards who were now upperclassmen that had proven their championship worth. I did not think much good would come from Kneepkens joining us. However, Heckel as an underclassman is different. Transferring in but not starting still makes sense for her, just as it made sense for Stevens and Juhacz or, for that matter, the highly ranked recruits of Sales, Ralph, Taurasi and Moore coming in as freshmen. Plus Fudd will be gone next year and that spot open in the future for a determined guard.
Starting five prediction based on these factors:
Arnold
Fudd
Shade
Strong
Williams
The portal has added a new wrinkle to “newcomer,” in that they may only be here for one year. When that is the case we have seen those newcomers starting so far, a la Chen and LLS. When they have more than one year available they have not, a la Stevens and Juhacz. While no one is guaranteed playing time, I expect that any accomplished player with just one year left would be reluctant to transfer in unless they thought their opportunity to start in their last year would be favorable. Those with more than one year ahead would be receptive to not starting, considering that even nonstarters in our program have gone on to WNBA careers.
S. Williams transferring in always made sense. While I think El-Affy has shown she can be a competent Center for us, she is still an underclassman with more years ahead to show she deserves to be our starting Center of the future. S. Williams can and likely will start with no adverse affects.
I previously argued against Kneepkens because she only had one year left and would need to start over guards who were now upperclassmen that had proven their championship worth. I did not think much good would come from Kneepkens joining us. However, Heckel as an underclassman is different. Transferring in but not starting still makes sense for her, just as it made sense for Stevens and Juhacz or, for that matter, the highly ranked recruits of Sales, Ralph, Taurasi and Moore coming in as freshmen. Plus Fudd will be gone next year and that spot open in the future for a determined guard.
Starting five prediction based on these factors:
Arnold
Fudd
Shade
Strong
Williams
My view is that four of the starters are a given and that three are in contention for that last starter position. I start with KK, Azzi, Sarah, and Serah. In terms of overall play KK may not be the 4th best player on the team, but as the only experienced PG, she has less competition for her spot.
Of my three contenders for the last spot, I feel that in a way Ashlynn is the floor. We already know that she could be pretty good at the 3 if Geno decided to go that route. On the other hand her best position is the 2, and she cannot be expected to come anywhere close to what Paige gave us there in defense, rebounding, passing, and even a sizable drop off in scoring. Remember Paige was comfortable and could be an All American at 1-3 and maybe even the 4. Ashlynn is best at the 2, not big enough at the 3, and just not a PG.
Blanca appears to have tremendous upside, and looks like a natural 3 to me. She could be a better fit for that position than Ashlynn even in her first year, particularly since she has some valuable professional experience. Personally I hope she looks like a star and takes that 5th starting position.
My third candidate for the 5th starter is Jana. We know Sarah can play the 4 or5, but many including me think she would be great at the 3 as well. In that scenario Jana would be the 5, Serah would be the 4, and Sarah the 3 in a big lineup. For this to happen Jana would need to show some significant improvement, but she appears to have quite a bit of as yet untapped potential.
So I see the three options as going small with a proven player in Ashlynn, using a natural 3 with perhaps more upside in Blanca, or going big with another player with significant upside with Jana. I am rooting for Blanca and also think she might represent the biggest upgrade for the team if she wins this battle. It would mean she beat out a known very good player in Ashlynn, and one who was pretty good and expected to be much better this year in Jana.
Of my three contenders for the last spot, I feel that in a way Ashlynn is the floor. We already know that she could be pretty good at the 3 if Geno decided to go that route. On the other hand her best position is the 2, and she cannot be expected to come anywhere close to what Paige gave us there in defense, rebounding, passing, and even a sizable drop off in scoring. Remember Paige was comfortable and could be an All American at 1-3 and maybe even the 4. Ashlynn is best at the 2, not big enough at the 3, and just not a PG.
Blanca appears to have tremendous upside, and looks like a natural 3 to me. She could be a better fit for that position than Ashlynn even in her first year, particularly since she has some valuable professional experience. Personally I hope she looks like a star and takes that 5th starting position.
My third candidate for the 5th starter is Jana. We know Sarah can play the 4 or5, but many including me think she would be great at the 3 as well. In that scenario Jana would be the 5, Serah would be the 4, and Sarah the 3 in a big lineup. For this to happen Jana would need to show some significant improvement, but she appears to have quite a bit of as yet untapped potential.
So I see the three options as going small with a proven player in Ashlynn, using a natural 3 with perhaps more upside in Blanca, or going big with another player with significant upside with Jana. I am rooting for Blanca and also think she might represent the biggest upgrade for the team if she wins this battle. It would mean she beat out a known very good player in Ashlynn, and one who was pretty good and expected to be much better this year in Jana.
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Starting 5-KK, Azzi, Sarah, Serah, Ash; sometimes 1 person will come in because of foul trouble or an injury, but this past season, Geno has sent in groups of 2 and 3 players at a time. 2nd group in: Jana, Chelli, Ice.
Who is the backup Point Guard?
Who is the backup Point Guard?
KK, Azzi, Ash, Sarah, Serah to start off the season. Hoping KK improves her shot because this would give tons of space for Serah to play back to the basket.
Later in the year, I could see KK, Azzi, Blanca, Sarah, Serah depending on Blanca’s transitions defensively and the effectiveness of her shooting. Also dependent on how Shade performs offensively, defensively she’s all hustle and heart.
Later in the year, I could see KK, Azzi, Blanca, Sarah, Serah depending on Blanca’s transitions defensively and the effectiveness of her shooting. Also dependent on how Shade performs offensively, defensively she’s all hustle and heart.
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Your view is quite accurate and highlights the elephant in the room, namely the loss of 20-25 ppg and leadership from Paige. One has to hope that out of a cadre of 5'9" point guards (KK, Kelis and perhaps Kaleigh) one of them will stand out and take up some of the slack and that more will come from the addition of Serah up front. This still is not enough and highlights the importance of that 5th starter which I see as an open competition between Ash and Blanca - two totally different type of players. The choice here may be decided by the type of offense Geno chooses to run, perhaps less guard dominant and more post/wing leaning.
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I have not counted out "ICE" Brady despite the announcements
in this thread of her demise as a talented WBB player... GO ICE!
I may join this thread after "K9" 's response. Hopefully with
a canine Husky HOWL! COME, Kayleigh. You are more than
half a Husky already, K9!!!
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"How Shade performs offensively"? I do recall her crushing IOWA STATE
with 20 points IN THE FIRST QUARTER. That's the same game in which
the Huskies set the team record for three pointers... with Allie and Morgan
putting in # 19 and #20.
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Interest tread. A few thoughts:
-Morgan, once 100%, can play a number of positions so may surprise in earning minutes. If she can replicate her early season production for the past year, few players have the ability to move outside to shot 3's while also being an able rebounder.
-Projecting Blanca, a frosh who will have to acclimate to big time college games and the US in general, is so "Boneyard." Rarely does a "best case" happen this quickly for an unproven player but it does sometimes happen.
-The player with the most unknowns for gaining minutes next year is Jana. Given more experience and confidence, her offense and rebounding should go up. With so much talent on next year's team, status quo could mean she is squeezed for minutes.
-Morgan, once 100%, can play a number of positions so may surprise in earning minutes. If she can replicate her early season production for the past year, few players have the ability to move outside to shot 3's while also being an able rebounder.
-Projecting Blanca, a frosh who will have to acclimate to big time college games and the US in general, is so "Boneyard." Rarely does a "best case" happen this quickly for an unproven player but it does sometimes happen.
-The player with the most unknowns for gaining minutes next year is Jana. Given more experience and confidence, her offense and rebounding should go up. With so much talent on next year's team, status quo could mean she is squeezed for minutes.
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While many are projecting improved play for the returning players, some seem to forget that KK's offense flourished during pressure filled time of the championship. A KK that can average 10+ points per game, combined with her exceptional defense, is someone you will want on the floor most of the game.
This is a good summary of the entire thread.
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I think what people are referring to is consistency. You just never know with Ash. She is cerainly capable. Look at her stat lines the next 3-5 games after the Iow State game. I don't think she scored 8 points combined....
I think Geno will mix and match depending on the opponent but, I think KK, Azzi, Sarah, Serah and Jana will be starting with Blanca, Ash and Kayleigh coming off the bench first. I think Morgan, CAroline and Allie will be special use players for different purposes. Ayanna and Ice will be second team and interchangeable with Sarah and Serah.. The freshman Kelis and Gandy will be last this year.
So who is your starting 12? The way things have been going lately here, there will probably be 100 posts with other 12 player lineups.
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Does anyone...besides me...wish for college basketball as it was, probably a mere 7-8 years ago? And do you wish that 3rd & 4th year players...legitimately recruited, not as #1's, but recruited as being solid, smart players who fit the Geno mold...could work their way into significant minutes and contribute? 11 championships were won with a continuous mix of freshmen thru seniors, working their way into the lineup. There were many roll players who worked into the starting lineup for their dedication and hard work. Now, juniors, for example, solid players, are pushed down down a rung because of grad transfers and portals.
I really think that watching the progress and progression of all Geno's players for all 4 years was a testament to his coaching excellence, his player development excellence, and his coach-player relationship excellence, and that was a treat to watch.
I embraced #12, after 100 off years, but enjoyed the first 11 better.
BUT, you gotta do what you gotta do!
I really think that watching the progress and progression of all Geno's players for all 4 years was a testament to his coaching excellence, his player development excellence, and his coach-player relationship excellence, and that was a treat to watch.
I embraced #12, after 100 off years, but enjoyed the first 11 better.
BUT, you gotta do what you gotta do!
While that was a fantastic game and she was electric offensively, she averaged 4.7 points in 22.5 minutes per game this year against ranked opponents (13 games). I think it’s fair to assume the team will be looking for additional perimeter scoring out of her position next year, with leading scorer Paige Bueckers gone.
Shade brings experience, intangibles, hustle, defense, efficient long range shooting, and sneaky offensive rebounding. She’s a huge asset to the team. My post was intended to illustrate that she’ll need to become more consistent offensively to be the final starter in my opinion.
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PG = KK
SG = Azzi
SG = Ash
PF = Sarah
C/PF = Serah
First off the bench in order:
Guards = Blanca, Morgan, Kellis, Allie
Forwards = Jana, Ice Yannah
SG = Azzi
SG = Ash
PF = Sarah
C/PF = Serah
First off the bench in order:
Guards = Blanca, Morgan, Kellis, Allie
Forwards = Jana, Ice Yannah
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I think she gave Geno exactly what he wanted from her. If he'd wanted more scoring from her, she'd have been more offensive minded. What he seems to have wanted was a disruptive force on defense and the occasional buckets. This is exactly what she gave him. The fact is she played against all the top-ranked teams. He didn't keep her on the bench in any of those games, which is what I'd expect if he were disappointed in her production.
I think you're right that Geno will be asking more of her, mainly on the scoring side. I think she's already shown she can score. She can hit a clutch three and sink midrange jumpers with ease. But she may need to expand her arsenal of offensive moves, and especially how she gets open for that midrange shot. I imagine this is exactly what she'll be working on this summer.
The Big Three (SS/Serah Williams/Azzi) plus two more guards (TBD).
There's no need add another forward to the Big Three unless there is some unique situation.
Three point shooting proficiency supplemented by an inside game seems to be the prevailing strategy (or, maybe I've watched too many Celtics games)?
JoePgh
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I would assume that Sarah, Azzi, and Serah are almost assured of starting roles. (Jana could possibly beat out Serah for the starting center position if she has a "redshirt sophomore" leap, but most likely Serah's experience and post moves will win her the job.)
I would say that KK has the inside track to be the starting PG, given her high assist numbers and defensive disruptiveness. But there are other contenders, and I would name Ashlynn and Morgan as possibilities (leaving Heckel out of the picture for now).
The 3 position is the one with the greatest uncertainty, since there is no obvious "shoo-in" candidate. The contenders are Caroline, Blanca, Morgan, and Allie. I don't think Ashlynn will (or should be asked to) play the 3. She is the obvious choice as Azzi's primary backup at the 2, and she will get plenty of minutes there.
If Caroline really is the "old Caroline", then she will be a near shoo-in for the 3 spot -- unless Blanca proves to be fantastic. Caroline knows the offensive and defensive systems better than anyone except the coaches, and that alone gives her an edge on Blanca, even if Blanca is really talented and motivated. But if Caroline is physically limited, then the position is a battle among Blanca, Morgan, and Allie, and I don't think any of them can be considered "pre-season favorite". The summer and fall practices will determine the outcome of that battle.
The depth chart behind Serah at the 5 is Jana / Gandy -- no mystery there. Jana will get plenty of minutes.
The depth chart behind Sarah at the 4 is Ice / Ayanna -- not much mystery there either. If Caroline is limited in minutes, she could back up this position also.
The depth chart behind Azzi at the 2 is Ashlynn / Allie. But Azzi and Ashlynn will get 90% to 100% of the minutes before garbage time.
The depth chart at PG is KK (probable starter) / Kelis / Ashlynn. If Kelis is "really really" good,she might get significant minutes as KK's backup.
I think the above statements can be made with a reasonable level of certainty. What is noted as uncertain above cannot be made certain until Geno and the coaches see how the summer and fall practices go.
I would say that KK has the inside track to be the starting PG, given her high assist numbers and defensive disruptiveness. But there are other contenders, and I would name Ashlynn and Morgan as possibilities (leaving Heckel out of the picture for now).
The 3 position is the one with the greatest uncertainty, since there is no obvious "shoo-in" candidate. The contenders are Caroline, Blanca, Morgan, and Allie. I don't think Ashlynn will (or should be asked to) play the 3. She is the obvious choice as Azzi's primary backup at the 2, and she will get plenty of minutes there.
If Caroline really is the "old Caroline", then she will be a near shoo-in for the 3 spot -- unless Blanca proves to be fantastic. Caroline knows the offensive and defensive systems better than anyone except the coaches, and that alone gives her an edge on Blanca, even if Blanca is really talented and motivated. But if Caroline is physically limited, then the position is a battle among Blanca, Morgan, and Allie, and I don't think any of them can be considered "pre-season favorite". The summer and fall practices will determine the outcome of that battle.
The depth chart behind Serah at the 5 is Jana / Gandy -- no mystery there. Jana will get plenty of minutes.
The depth chart behind Sarah at the 4 is Ice / Ayanna -- not much mystery there either. If Caroline is limited in minutes, she could back up this position also.
The depth chart behind Azzi at the 2 is Ashlynn / Allie. But Azzi and Ashlynn will get 90% to 100% of the minutes before garbage time.
The depth chart at PG is KK (probable starter) / Kelis / Ashlynn. If Kelis is "really really" good,she might get significant minutes as KK's backup.
I think the above statements can be made with a reasonable level of certainty. What is noted as uncertain above cannot be made certain until Geno and the coaches see how the summer and fall practices go.