Non-Key Tweets

[TruDomGopher]

Yeah, it gives you a huskie...

 

[TruDomGopher]

BTW, I thought I should add this: Sometimes things get shortened, as in, "The B1G blew off Mizzoo" or "The B1G didn't want Missouri." It's my understanding that Missouri and B1G actually had talks and Missouri balked hard at the idea of having to buy into the B1G Network and not getting full share right away. If I was looking from Missouri's perspective, the whole idea might have looked and smelled a little "Texas/Big12" to me, too. Remember, at that time, the whole network thing was new and had everyone a little befuddled. They seem happy enough now with the SEC, so who knows?

 

[junglehusky]

BTW, I thought I should add this: Sometimes things get shortened, as in, "The B1G blew off Mizzoo" or "The B1G didn't want Missouri." It's my understanding that Missouri and B1G actually had talks and Missouri balked hard at the idea of having to buy into the B1G Network and not getting full share right away. If I was looking from Missouri's perspective, the whole idea might have looked and smelled a little "Texas/Big12" to me, too. Remember, at that time, the whole network thing was new and had everyone a little befuddled. They seem happy enough now with the SEC, so who knows?

Interesting, I've not seen that perspective but it sounds plausible.

I don't think any P5 schools will be seriously pursued for a few years. Maybe an outside chance of Texahoma and the B12 implosion scenario, but I would put that pretty low and Mizzou leaving the SEC for the B1G even lower.

 

[TruDomGopher]

The joker in the deck is TV...I can imagine the conversation goes something like this:

FOX: Delany? Listen, we've got to get some better programming on B1G Network. Need to make some money here, this Big East contract is killing us.
DELANY: What do have in mind?
FOX: Basketball, good basketball, every night of the week. Just last night we wasted a prime basketball slot with women's volleyball. Only ads we could sell were Viagra and Cialis--got the dirty old men and adolescent boy demographic locked up with women's volleyball. (Pause) That reminds me, I should refill my prescription.
DELANY: (Pause) Me, too.
FOX: Get me more programming. With a winter like this, everyone's watching tv and we've got to have better product.
DELANY: This winter's an anomaly.
FOX: No, it's not. Every winters going to be like this from now on. Global warming--that's what Brian Williams said on Nightly News.
DELANY: He's lying. Or he's still in shock from getting shot down...There's no science to support that.
FOX: Yes there is--every Big Ten school has a study saying global warming's real.
DELANY: Whatever. There's no candidates for expansion right now. GoR's have stopped us cold.
FOX: Bust 'em. I need content now.
DELANY: That means going to court...
FOX: So?
DELANY: and going through discovery.
FOX: (Pause) I see your point. What about UConn? They're available--great brand and UConn's women would probably outdraw this turkey Big East package...
DELANY: Not AAU. Don't know if I can get the votes.
FOX: Those old farts still harping on that? Like you need to be Einstein to dribble a ball?
DELANY: I didn't say it's a bad idea--it's a great idea, but I'm the one that has to figure out how to sell those old farts.
FOX: So do it. You're the frigging genius. Read it in Sports Illustrated. Work on UConn. They're not doing nothing--I'm looking out my window toward Connecticut now and Warde's just standing in the window flipping off somebody--Bristol, Boston, not sure what direction that is...
DELANY: Anything else?
FOX: What about Dakota for hockey? Great team.
DELANY: (Pause) Let's see what works out with American schools before we consider Canada...
FOX: Okay, talk to you later.

 

[CL82]

To use a rather more crude metaphor: Delany at the dance eyeing that sweet young thing from Texas holding court with her suitors, all smiles in her tiara and billowing pink dress. So Delany asks for a dance and she just says, "Maybe the next dance, but not tonight." Delany approaches the Virginia dogwood queen and gets shot down. So Delany wanders over to the punch bowl and some girl from Connecticut wanders over and say, "You're cute. Listen, I know I might not be the prettiest girl here but if you dance with me you're gonna get laid tonight."

Dom, that's an entertaining but false analogy. CR isn't about finding one optimal partner it's about controlling the playing field. Think of the board game Risk rather than a school dance. Sometimes the strategy to world domination isn't to acquiring the biggest countries or continent. It is often preferable to take smaller but attractive targets to position yourself well for the future, and make your opponents current possessions more difficult to defend down the road. Connecticut does just that for the B1G. I'm sure Delaney is aware of it.

 

[TruDomGopher]

CL82, I prefer to think of it as entertaining but grossly over-simplified. Delany has a strategy and he's been quite clear about what it is--I think Detroit Free Press posted a video of an interview about a week ago that essentially reiterated what he's been saying all along. The targets are the power centers that money flows through--NYC, DC--and "establishing a presence" which I take to mean implanting a B1G meme in the collective zeitgeist of those power centers. (In the crude analogy, there are lots of potential partners that would 'put out' but don't live in the right location.) The closer a school is to those power centers, the more attractive they are to the B1G.

That's why, all factors considered, I think the highest probability targets based on known factors now are UConn and VTech. But it always raises interesting questions: If Mizzoo wanted in now, do you take them, or do you wait for a higher priority that fits the strategic vision?

The longer you wait, the greater the probability of an unforeseen extraneous event. For example, what if Texas and Oklahoma called Delany tomorrow and said, "We want into the B1G--package deal. Take it or leave it." What would the B1G do? Personally, I would prefer Delany tell 'em to pound sound in that situation, but realistically that combo would probably be irresistible.

That's why I find it so interesting. Like my wife's mind, it's an endless puzzle.

 

[whaler11]

Is Fluguar losing his mind over carry/conceal key or non-key? TIA.

 

[NEforceUConn]

..................-I'm looking out my window toward Connecticut now and Warde's just standing in the kitchen window flipping off somebody--Bristol, Boston, not sure what direction that is...........
.

Too funny! I had to add that small correction for you

 

[CL82]

CL82, I prefer to think of it as entertaining but grossly over-simplified. Delany has a strategy and he's been quite clear about what it is--I think Detroit Free Press posted a video of an interview about a week ago that essentially reiterated what he's been saying all along. The targets are the power centers that money flows through--NYC, DC--and "establishing a presence" which I take to mean implanting a B1G meme in the collective zeitgeist of those power centers. (In the crude analogy, there are lots of potential partners that would 'put out' but don't live in the right location.) The closer a school is to those power centers, the more attractive they are to the B1G.

That's why, all factors considered, I think the highest probability targets based on known factors now are UConn and VTech. But it always raises interesting questions: If Mizzoo wanted in now, do you take them, or do you wait for a higher priority that fits the strategic vision?

The longer you wait, the greater the probability of an unforeseen extraneous event. For example, what if Texas and Oklahoma called Delany tomorrow and said, "We want into the B1G--package deal. Take it or leave it." What would the B1G do? Personally, I would prefer Delany tell 'em to pound sound in that situation, but realistically that combo would probably be irresistible.

That's why I find it so interesting. Like my wife's mind, it's an endless puzzle.

I think we agree. It not about the ideal target. It is about strategic acquisitions. The B1G has a presence in DC, and NYC. It will to strengthen and expand upon those footholds. That positions GOR free UConn well.

 

[TruDomGopher]

The figures I last heard are at least a couple of years out of date, but the CIC was pulling down somewhere north of $10 Billion in funded research and $3.5 Billion of that or so came through DC. Presumably, a large portion of the balance came through NY. As of now, the primary competition for research dollars are the Ivy League and U of California system. The B1G strategy isn't really a mystery. Have the Big Ten discussed at the water cooler and it should filter to the appropriations meetings--but only if you're in right markets.

When the expansion thing started, the schools I had tabbed were Syracuse, Rutgers, and UConn (which is how I ended up coming to this board). For all the yacking on boards, I never thought UT or ND were serious entries for a variety of reasons. In many ways, the Big 12 meltdown and Nebraska/Missouri period were a huge distraction and seemed to confuse the B1G leadership--they couldn't seem to figure out how all the pieces were going to come together, how tv really fit, how important AAU was, etc. I was surprised they took Nebraska and skipped Missouri, but figured maybe they wanted that slot for BC, pushing through NYC into New England for 16. Say what you will about Swofford, but he's made some shrewd moves and when the history of expansion is finally written, he may end up looking pretty good. I never saw Maryland coming at all.

So...basically, I'm mostly wrong about this stuff and I think--but am far from sure--that the B1G stays more focused on executing the strategy. And that should be good news for UConn.

 

[Ldandy]

Swofford made some shrewd moves? When exactly did that start?

 

[billybud]

Swofford's moves?

Compared to whom? To former Big East Commissioners? Swofford looks pretty good. To Big 12 Commissioners? Still looks pretty good.

I still do not think that Swofford is any CR savant, but he has done fairly well with the hand that he was dealt.

 

[pj]

Swofford made some shrewd moves? When exactly did that start?

He managed to keep his job a long time, and managed to get his son a good job.

 

[billybud]

Swofford's ordering ESPN to cut in Raycom borders on criminal...considering little Chuckie needed that to survive at Raycom.

But..Swofford held the ACC together, and has done pretty well with his hand. He has played a hand that was not one of the better hands at the table and is still in the game.

 

[TruDomGopher]

For a guy on the defensive, Swofford managed to block Delany, organize and get the wagon's circled.

Q: Am I the only guy in the room that thinks there are a lot of names bandied about as B1G targets that have never been realistic? I'm thinking specifically of some of the Southern schools (or schools that perceive themselves Southern) like UVa and UNC. I just can't imagine them joining "that Yankee conference" anymore than I can imagine a Catholic school joining hands with those "stem-cell researchers." Pretty much no matter how much money gets thrown at them.

 

[Seaa Blue]

For a guy on the defensive, Swofford managed to block Delany, organize and get the wagon's circled.

Q: anymore than I can imagine a Catholic school joining hands with those "stem-cell researchers."

I think BC would take the bait.

 

[TruDomGopher]

I think BC would take the bait.

That's the one Catholic school where I think you might be right...

 

[Seaa Blue]

Swofford's ordering ESPN to cut in Raycom borders on criminal...considering little Chuckie needed that to survive at Raycom.

But..Swofford held the ACC together, and has done pretty well with his hand. He has played a hand that was not one of the better hands at the table and is still in the game.

With an insane market basket, this game is not just about being at the table.

Someone landed on "Maryland" when he wasn't looking and instead of paying rent, they bought it.

 

[DarthGrumpy]

I think BC would take the bait.

If it meant blocking UConn from joining the B1G, BC would join in a heartbeat

 

[billybud]

if only BC would go....

Delaney...they would be a decent fit...they play hockey and make great small talk about snow.

 

[Kolumbo]

Dom, that's an entertaining but false analogy. CR isn't about finding one optimal partner it's about controlling the playing field. Think of the board game Risk rather than a school dance. Sometimes the strategy to world domination isn't to acquiring the biggest countries or continent. It is often preferable to take smaller but attractive targets to position yourself well for the future, and make your opponents current possessions more difficult to defend down the road. Connecticut does just that for the B1G. I'm sure Delaney is aware of it.

I think the "Risk" period is mostly over. Pac 12. B1G. SEC. Those three could stand pat and nothing will change for them. They don't have to outflank each other, they will all get paid. The ACC won't just fold because it's not like those members will just go to the other P conferences. How big can the other conferences get? 64 programs, give or take a few. Perhaps the Big 12 and/or ACC eventually shift but there will be those 64 programs and not a whole lot more. I really don't think it's like a conference needs to "defeat" another conference. The Big East was destroyed, and that's that. Plenty of money to be split among the current P5.

 

[btstimpy]

For a guy on the defensive, Swofford managed to block Delany, organize and get the wagon's circled.

Q: Am I the only guy in the room that thinks there are a lot of names bandied about as B1G targets that have never been realistic? I'm thinking specifically of some of the Southern schools (or schools that perceive themselves Southern) like UVa and UNC. I just can't imagine them joining "that Yankee conference" anymore than I can imagine a Catholic school joining hands with those "stem-cell researchers." Pretty much no matter how much money gets thrown at them.

"Yankee" doesn't have anything to do with it at UVA and probably UNC as well. At UVA we spent the first half of the last century playing the Eastern Schools that eventually formed the Ivy League on a regular basis in football and now do so in Lacrosse. The rolls are full of students from New York, New Jersey, and Pennsylvania. We actually enjoy playing in the East. But there isn't much desire to go join a Midwestern League. Bolting on Maryland, Rutgers, and Penn State to an 11 school midwestern league won't give it an eastern feel. That is an illusion. And yes there is still a desire to maintain a southern connection. Pulling southern schools into the Big Ten would be even more awkward than pulling mid-atlantic ones in. It's much easier to pull the northern schools into the southern league. That's following the country's population migration rather than going against the grain.

 

[Fishy]

The ACC is a southern conference. The Big Ten is a midwestern conference.

But the Big Ten did a far better job of moving east than the ACC did of moving north.

 

[Kolumbo]

"Yankee" doesn't have anything to do with it at UVA and probably UNC as well. At UVA we spent the first half of the last century playing the Eastern Schools that eventually formed the Ivy League on a regular basis in football and now do so in Lacrosse. The rolls are full of students from New York, New Jersey, and Pennsylvania. We actually enjoy playing in the East. But there isn't much desire to go join a Midwestern League. Bolting on Maryland, Rutgers, and Penn State to an 11 school midwestern league won't give it an eastern feel. That is an illusion. And yes there is still a desire to maintain a southern connection. Pulling southern schools into the Big Ten would be even more awkward than pulling mid-atlantic ones in. It's much easier to pull the northern schools into the southern league. That's following the country's population migration rather than going against the grain.

The Big East pulled schools from North Carolina, Florida, Louisiana, Oklahoma, Texas, and Tennessee into a Northeast conference. Pretty easily.
What do feel and illusion have to do with anything anyway? Geographical location means little in CR. It's all about markets.

 

[btstimpy]

The Big East pulled schools from North Carolina, Florida, Louisiana, Oklahoma, Texas, and Tennessee into a Northeast conference. Pretty easily.
What do feel and illusion have to do with anything anyway? Geographical location means little in CR. It's all about markets.

On paper perhaps you're right, but I run into West Virginia fans that complain about Geographical location every time I see them and talk about the Big XII.

The Big East did pull members from everywhere as did the Conference USA. Can it be forced? Sure. Does it have a sense of cohesion? I'm not so sure about that.

 

[jostar1]

Christopher Lambert ‏@theDudeofWV · 7h7 hours ago
Fox and ESPN want the Big 12 to expand into the Eastern time zone if expansion occurs.

Greg Flugaur‏@flugempire @theDudeofWV Yes. Fox wants to go East so bad...it's probably the #1 potential fly in the no expansion ointment. just last night heard...

Greg Flugaur @flugempire · 7h 7 hours ago
@theDudeofWV...from a contact...who you know...that discussed the possibility of FOX wanting eastern expansion in B1G negotiations in...

Greg Flugaur @flugempire · 7h 7 hours ago
@theDudeofWV ...the new Teir 1 TV contract happening for 2017. Contact says if there any Big Ten expansion before 2024..it will be led...

Greg Flugaur @flugempire · 7h 7 hours ago
@theDudeofWV ..by FOX. Now the perception of all my contacts say Big Ten Presidents will not interested in any expansion GOR foraseeable..

Greg Flugaur @flugempire · 7h 7 hours ago
@theDudeofWV ..for forseeable future. But FOX, who missed out on new NBA contract(got shutout) may agree to overpay for eastern product.

Greg Flugaur @flugempire · 7h 7 hours ago
@theDudeofWV But getting back to your point on Big 12 expansion....what FOX desperately wants may lead the charge in the future ofBig 12

Greg Flugaur @flugempire · 7h 7 hours ago
@theDudeofWV FOX wants more East Coast product. Will play major factor in next round of realignment/expansion. In 2017-19 of in 2024

Greg Flugaur @flugempire · 7h 7 hours ago
@Epfourteen Big Ten will be entering into negotiations with ESPN/ABC-CBS-NBC-FOX in the next couple of months for their new Tier TVpackage

Greg Flugaur @flugempire · 7h 7 hours ago
@Epfourteen Big Ten TV contract ends at the end of the 2016 calendar year. Delany has plenty of leverage going into negotiations. Delany...

Greg Flugaur @flugempire · 7h 7 hours ago
@Epfourteen ...has strong ratings...large and more diversed footprint...and BTN. What happens during these negotiations could have major..

Greg Flugaur @flugempire · 7h 7 hours ago
@Epfourteen ..impact on expansion. The worst kept secret is FOX wanting desperately to crack more into the East products. The question

Greg Flugaur @flugempire · 7h 7 hours ago
@Epfourteen ....does FOX push for expansion and pay through the nose for Big Ten expansion in new negotiations?...or do they wait 6-9 yrs...

Greg Flugaur @flugempire · 7h 7 hours ago
@Epfourteen ...and hope Big 12 ratings increase....hope big 12 increases TV value somehow and overpay for Big 12expansion years down road

Greg Flugaur @flugempire · 7h 7 hours ago
@Epfourteen FOX missed out on the NBA. ESPN & Turner flipped open the vaults to keep NBA. Will FOX open up their vaults for part of Big 10?

Greg Flugaur @flugempire · 7h 7 hours ago
@Epfourteen FOX wants to expand their sports content....where does it lead to? #1 question in all of expansion talk

Greg Flugaur @flugempire · 7h 7 hours ago
@Epfourteen I don't believe anyone in the Big Ten expects a raid on P5 schools protected by a GOR for at least another 6-8 yrs.

Greg Flugaur @flugempire · 6h 6 hours ago
@Epfourteen Candidates that the Big Ten Presidents would accept in 2017? .....Vanderbilt....Missouri....Maybe UCONN if CT makes promises.

Greg Flugaur @flugempire · 6h 6 hours ago
@Epfourteen But would Missouri or Vandy have interest? I don't think so....not now. But nothing can be ruled out until these negotiations...

Greg Flugaur @flugempire · 6h 6 hours ago
@Epfourteen ..have been completed and signed. College sports value has risen...content is now even in more demand. Delany montizes markets

Greg Flugaur @flugempire · 6h 6 hours ago
@Epfourteen But the main point, brought up by @theDudeofWV is FOX is not anywhere close to being happy with current portfolio.

 

[btstimpy]

The ACC is a southern conference. The Big Ten is a midwestern conference.

But the Big Ten did a far better job of moving east than the ACC did of moving north.

Penn State was a very fine addition that the Big Ten added in the East. I would love to have them in the ACC. The Big East made an error in not inviting them when it had the chance. The rest of what was added, they can have and keep. That's an interesting recent thread about one of them.

 

[Fishy]

Penn State was a very fine addition that the Big Ten added in the East. I would love to have them in the ACC. The Big East made an error in not inviting them when it had the chance. The rest of what was added, they can have and keep. That's an interesting recent thread about one of them.

I suspect they're happy with their additions.

Revenue was the name of the expansion game and they won it in a romp.

Strategic planning beats grasping at straws every day of the week.

 

[TruDomGopher]

Swofford made some shrewd moves? When exactly did that start?

When he picked parents not named Beebe...

 

[TruDomGopher]

I don't get all that twitter stuff. BTN for all practical purposes is Fox. Wouldn't it make more sense for Fox to push B1G expansion than push the Big 12 to add outliers in the eastern time zone?