New Playoff Format - ACC vs. Big East

[FAIRTIDES]

ACC has FSU, Miami, VT, and a commissioner who promotes the strength of the conference whether it's true or not.

No other reason.

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The door has not been slammed shut. It's up to the conference (which should change its name) and UCONN to force their way to national prominence. That being said, the conferences not named SEC, Big-10, Big-12, or PAC-12 better make damn sure that their vote counts the same as any of the a fore mentioned; especially as it relates to ranking, selection and scheduling.

If it were me, I'd want assurance that the selection committee is not stacked and that it has no media representation. I'd also want a detailed understanding of the power ranking methodology and assurance that any and all variables are based on the season in-process, not on tradition or predisposition.

Finally, I'd make damn sure that scheduling "agreements" between conferences perceived as "powerful" would not limit the ability of any conference to improve its SOS. I would have an anti-trust expert watching this closely. By the way, unless blatant with smoking guns, this would be hard to prove, but the fact that the "4" are being watched might act as a deterrent.

 

[mattp]

a 10-2 Miami in the ACC last year wouldn't have been invited either. everyone acts as though the top 4 conferences are going to get a team every year with the ACC occasionally taking a spot, but i think it's more realistic that in many, if not most years, one of those conferences will send 2. last year the SEC would have had two. if you look at the final top 4 standings, and consider that a guide, 2010 would have had 2 PAC10, '09 2 SEC, '08 2 PAC12 if you include Utah, '07 3 SEC if you include Missou, and so on. over the last decade the MWC has had more top 4 teams than the ACC or BE. 4 teams is just the start. there will be overwhelming demand to increase the number of teams once the big conferences realize they're not guaranteed a spot with 4. 2004 is the last time 4 different conferences were represented by the top 4 spots, and one of them was UTah who's not in the PAC10 with USC, who was in the top 4.

 

[UConnSportsGuy]

This announcment is neither a win nor a loss for both the ACC and the NBE. They are in the same boat. If either of them have an undefeated team, they are more than likely going to be in the Final Four (unless there are 4 other undefeated teams). However, if anyone outside of FSU, Miami, and VT lose 1 game, then they are eliminated from the Final Four possibilities.

The most imporant part of this decision hasn't been decided/announced yet. How the money is distributed is the key question that hasn't been answered yet. If the ACC gets a bigger share of the 'Final Four Money' pie than the NBE, then they have won. But otherwise, the NBE and ACC are in the same boat on this one.

 

[whaler11]

The door has not been slammed shut. It's up to the conference (which should change its name) and UCONN to force their way to national prominence. That being said, the conferences not named SEC, Big-10, Big-12, or PAC-12 better make damn sure that their vote counts the same as any of the a fore mentioned; especially as it relates to ranking, selection and scheduling.

If it were me, I'd want assurance that the selection committee is not stacked and that it has no media representation. I'd also want a detailed understanding of the power ranking methodology and assurance that any and all variables are based on the season in-process, not on tradition or predisposition.

Finally, I'd make damn sure that scheduling "agreements" between conferences perceived as "powerful" would not limit the ability of any conference to improve its SOS. I would have an anti-trust expert watching this closely. By the way, unless blatant with smoking guns, this would be hard to prove, but the fact that the "4" are being watched might act as a deterrent.

Personally I think the right media would be better than other options. Look at the Harris Poll - they are not paying attention to the whole country. Guys like Forde and Wentzel would be much more fair (and yes I'm aware how many of you hate them).

There isn't a human in the world that won't have biases - and that also means any computers will have biases programmed into them - so it's not like that option is any better.

 

[joey3$trike$]

The only chance a big east team has is going undefeated period. I still don't know why they can't have conference champions play in a playoff format 6-8 teams. I guess that would be too easy to do. Smh this 4 teams is bs but it's a start. A 12-1 VT, FSU, Miami, USC, ND, Texas, Oklahoma, Lsu,Alabama, Florida, etc.. get in over an undefeated big east team. It's still all about who can bring in the $$$.

 

[whaler11]

The only chance a big east team has is going undefeated period. I still don't know why they can't have conference champions play in a playoff format 6-8 teams. I guess that would be too easy to do. Smh this 4 teams is bs but it's a start. A 12-1 VT, FSU, Miami, USC, ND, Texas, Oklahoma, Lsu,Alabama, Florida, etc.. get in over an undefeated big east team. It's still all about who can bring in the $$$.

You'd need four 1 loss teams to keep an undefeated BE team out. Why doesn't the Big East have an undefeated team before anyone decides they get screwed.

 

[huskymedic]

The view from Joe Bailey...“@espn_bigeast: Q&A: Interim commissioner Joe Bailey http://post original url/bVFe90Tq”

Two of the points he makes:

1. Do you have any fears that a selection committee would pass over an undefeated Big East team over a one-loss team from one of the conferences with a better national perception, like the Big Ten, for example?

JB: No, I don't because at the end, the group is generally always smarter than the smartest person in the group. So normally speaking, a group ends up making the right decision. There's literally textbooks and everything based on that so consequently our feeling may be you might have a dissenter or two, but in the end the group has the best chance of making the right decision. I should also tell you the perception versus reality piece -- it is what it is. When I say that, I started my career as a player personnel scout, and I used to go around and evaluate players. But in the end, the people that actually are the most accurate graders of player performance were coaches that did nothing but look at film or tape, where all they did was concerned on exactly what happened during the course of a game. Sometimes they didn't even know what school the kid played for. At the end of the day, while they'll take into consideration strength of schedule, they'll look at performance on the field, and take all the noise out of the evaluation of a team's performance. That, I suspect, will ultimately be the way they operate. The other good thing about a committee -- they're concentrating on the teams and they're doing it over a long period of time over the course of a season. It's not as if there's some sort of randomness about it. They will see all the teams. So we think for a variety of reasons such as those, it will be a much more focused, concerted effort on the evaluation of teams and team performance. That's very good.

2. How do you respond to all the public comments from other commissioners that there is now a “Big 5” and the Big East is not a part of it?

JB: We see ourselves virtually the same as the ACC, and I would say to you that we haven't verbally expressed that perhaps as much as we should. But at the end, it's really about performance. The proof is in your ability to execute, and the notion of what other people say, that's the expectation market. The reality is how well you do, how well your teams perform, how well your coaches coach, how well your players play. That ultimately is the way the Big East is going to be judged going forward, and that's the way all conferences are going to be judged moving forward.

 

[Jimmy Serrano]

The view from Joe Bailey...“@espn_bigeast: Q&A: Interim commissioner Joe Bailey http://post original url/bVFe90Tq”

Two of the points he makes:

1. Do you have any fears that a selection committee would pass over an undefeated Big East team over a one-loss team from one of the conferences with a better national perception, like the Big Ten, for example?

JB: No, I don't because at the end, the group is generally always smarter than the smartest person in the group. So normally speaking, a group ends up making the right decision. There's literally textbooks and everything based on that so consequently our feeling may be you might have a dissenter or two, but in the end the group has the best chance of making the right decision. I should also tell you the perception versus reality piece -- it is what it is. When I say that, I started my career as a player personnel scout, and I used to go around and evaluate players. But in the end, the people that actually are the most accurate graders of player performance were coaches that did nothing but look at film or tape, where all they did was concerned on exactly what happened during the course of a game. Sometimes they didn't even know what school the kid played for. At the end of the day, while they'll take into consideration strength of schedule, they'll look at performance on the field, and take all the noise out of the evaluation of a team's performance. That, I suspect, will ultimately be the way they operate. The other good thing about a committee -- they're concentrating on the teams and they're doing it over a long period of time over the course of a season. It's not as if there's some sort of randomness about it. They will see all the teams. So we think for a variety of reasons such as those, it will be a much more focused, concerted effort on the evaluation of teams and team performance. That's very good.

2. How do you respond to all the public comments from other commissioners that there is now a “Big 5” and the Big East is not a part of it?

JB: We see ourselves virtually the same as the ACC, and I would say to you that we haven't verbally expressed that perhaps as much as we should. But at the end, it's really about performance. The proof is in your ability to execute, and the notion of what other people say, that's the expectation market. The reality is how well you do, how well your teams perform, how well your coaches coach, how well your players play. That ultimately is the way the Big East is going to be judged going forward, and that's the way all conferences are going to be judged moving forward.

A couple of problems that I see.

First, who cares what Joe Bailey thinks? He won't be the commissioner in a matter of months.

Second, the Big East is getting creamed by the ACC in the PR battle. I mean absolutely destroyed. While Swofford is out in front microphones making the case for his league, Marinate and the BE offices are hanging billboards in Times Square. My head still hurts from all those posters who think that made one freaking iota worth of difference in national perception.

 

[UConnSportsGuy]

2. How do you respond to all the public comments from other commissioners that there is now a “Big 5” and the Big East is not a part of it?

JB: We see ourselves virtually the same as the ACC, and I would say to you that we haven't verbally expressed that perhaps as much as we should. But at the end, it's really about performance. The proof is in your ability to execute, and the notion of what other people say, that's the expectation market. The reality is how well you do, how well your teams perform, how well your coaches coach, how well your players play. That ultimately is the way the Big East is going to be judged going forward, and that's the way all conferences are going to be judged moving forward.

Maybe I am nitpicking here, but I think that is the wrong answer. We shouldn't be trying to convince people that we are equal to the ACC, we should be making the case that we are better than the ACC. I know that is far from the public perception or the opinion of the 'experts' in college football...but we need to start laying some facts out on the table. Here is the scoreboard:

........................................................................................................................... BIG EAST .........................ACC.....................
Computer (unbiased) conference ranking over last 10 years .....................................X.............................................................
Bowl Performance over last 10 years.........................................................................X.............................................................
Historical BCS Performance......................................................................................X.............................................................
TV Markets Represented...........................................................................................X.............................................................
Public Relations...................................................................................................................................................X..................
Strenght of Commissioner....................................................................................................................................X..................
TV Alliances.........................................................................................................................................................X..................
Connections and Politics of College Football.........................................................................................................X..................
Public Perception.................................................................................................................................................X..................


In terms of actual performance and potential, the Big East is the superior conference. But interms of commisioner, PR, politics, hisotory and public perception, the ACC is the superior conference. We should shift the focus to the actual on-field performance and real facts.

 

[huskymedic]

A couple of problems that I see.

First, who cares what Joe Bailey thinks? He won't be the commissioner in a matter of months.

In the absence of others stepping up - I'll take what we can get right now

 

[businesslawyer]

Yup. And FWIW, I've been to the last 4 UConn bowl games and I had a better time at the 1st three. Loved Charlotte.

I'm hard pressed to believe that the head of the Charlotte Chamber of Commerce would prefer Charlotte to Scottsdale in late December.

but to each their own.

 

[huskypantz]

Here is the scoreboard that matters:

........................................................................................................................... BIG EAST .........................ACC.....................
Public Perception.................................................................................................................................................X..................

 

[pj]

Here is the scoreboard that matters:

........................................................................................................................... BIG EAST .........................ACC.....................
Public Perception.................................................................................................................................................X..................

Unfortunately, this is true. New games are played every year and the Big East's past success against the ACC does not predict future success. But TV contracts last ten years, and public perception and fan support lasts even longer. Those are lasting assets for the ACC.

 

[BlueMAB]

"JB: We see ourselves virtually the same as the ACC"

This is the wrong approach. We aren't virtually the same, top to bottom, we're better.

http://espn.go.com/blog/bigeast/post/_/id/32766/big-east-must-begin-to-sell-itself

"Going back to the first BCS game in 1999, the ACC is 2-13 all-time; The Big East is 8-6...
...The ACC has gotten two schools into the BCS just once, and that was this past season, when Clemson got embarrassed by a Big East school and Virginia Tech lost again."

"Since 2005, the Big East has had three teams finish the season with just one loss. Two of them -- Cincinnati and Louisville -- are remaining members. Let's add in future members, just for fun. That would give the Big East six more (Boise State 5, Houston 1). By comparison, the ACC has had zero teams finish with just one loss in the same time frame. "

He should be drilling this home in every interview he gives. Winning on the field isn't enough to change perceptions. You have to talk up the conference, especially when there are a couple key statistics as important as this.

It wouldn't hurt to mention that Saracuse/sPitt are a combined 45-65 against the Big East since 2004 (most recent alignment). On the field, our record vs. the ACC just improved by the those teams leaving.

 

[ConnHuskBask]

I'm hard pressed to believe that the head of the Charlotte Chamber of Commerce would prefer Charlotte to Scottsdale in late December.

but to each their own.

New year's eve in Arizona for the Fiesta Bowl was freezing! Didn't it even flurry when we were out there?

 

[NEforceUConn]

The most imporant part of this decision hasn't been decided/announced yet. How the money is distributed is the key question that hasn't been answered yet. If the ACC gets a bigger share of the 'Final Four Money' pie than the NBE, then they have won. But otherwise, the NBE and ACC are in the same boat on this one.

Amen brother. The lack of info makes me 99% sure that money wise the NBE is screwed, but probably so are the ACC and ND.

 

[whaler11]

Quoting a bunch of stats that include Miami, VPI and WVU are hardly an argument. There is not a single team in the the league going forward who has won a BCS game in the BCS era but Boise State and they haven't even left their old league yet.

 

[jrazz12]

Quoting a bunch of stats that include Miami, VPI and WVU are hardly an argument. There is not a single team in the the league going forward who has won a BCS game in the BCS era but Boise State and they haven't even left their old league yet.

Louisville in 07. But the general point still stands

 

[huskymedic]

New year's eve in Arizona for the Fiesta Bowl was freezing! Didn't it even flurry when we were out there?

yup... the cab driver taking us to old town thought something was on fire and ash was falling. He never saw flurries before. Hell - snowed when we were in Toronto too...

Outside of the posible warmer weather in Glendale (BL know you are a golfer) - I liked the hominess of Charlotte as well.

 

[whaler11]

Louisville in 07. But the general point still stands

Yeah I remember Louisville after I hit post. Wake Forest right? Yeah I guess that counts technically.

 

[Srqhusky]

I think its great you had a good time at the Fiesta Bowl. My opinion on what it did for our program is different than yours and i'll leave it at that. I didn't take a shot at Edsall at all. I think he would tell you that the Fiesta Bowl appearance helped a ton in getting him that job.

The Best thing the Fiesta bowl did for UCONN was get Edsall the Job at Maryland. (There's a shot at Edsall) No PP no Whitmer, No Cochran.

Edsall had already interviewed and was signed, sealed and delivered before the fiesta bowl

 

[Waquoit]

Edsall had already interviewed and was signed, sealed and delivered before the fiesta bowl

You mean HCRE lied and we had a Maryland man coaching our team?

 

[Waquoit]

I'm hard pressed to believe that the head of the Charlotte Chamber of Commerce would prefer Charlotte to Scottsdale in late December.

but to each their own.

The weather was lousy in Glendale that weekend. I guess you missed the game. Meanwhile, UConn fans took over downtown Charlotte the night before the Car Care Bowl. Bar owners were quoted in the paper that UConn fans spent money and were good tippers. It was a great time.

 

[businesslawyer]

The weather was lousy in Glendale that weekend. I guess you missed the game. Meanwhile, UConn fans took over downtown Charlotte the night before the Car Care Bowl. Bar owners were quoted in the paper that UConn fans spent money and were good tippers. It was a great time.

I thought Charlotte was o.k. Saw the NBA game the night before and then hit a bar where a hundred UConn fans, including Big Red, were watching the end of UConn hoops on TV. Had a perfectly good time. Was only in Toronto about 24 hours but enjoyed that too.

And wouldn't look at either if I had a chance to go to Scottsdale. But again, that's just me. Anyone who enjoys Charlotte or Toronto in Winter more -- more power to you.

 

[ConnHuskBask]

And wouldn't look at either if I had a chance to go to Scottsdale. But again, that's just me. Anyone who enjoys Charlotte or Toronto in Winter more -- more power to you.

Hey! Don't forget Birmingham in January, it's just lovely!